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  • Big Brother complaints hit 4,500 10,000(!)


    by Sunny
    16th January, 2007 at 2:40 pm    

    I’ve had to field so many media calls today that I almost wish I had watched Big Brother while on holiday and over the weekend. Almost. Anyway, just over an hour after the Media Guardian confirmed that complaints had topped 3,500, they changed it to 4,500. What do you think the final tally will be? And will people please stop sending me email forwards calling for more complaints! If you haven’t complained yet and feel left out then you can jump on the bandwagon through the Ofcom website.
    Update: Now at a whopping 10,000! Err…


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    1. Robert Sharp » Blog Archive » Celebrity Big Blunderbuss

      [...] It is a shame some of the comments flung in her direction were disparaging to India and its culture, prompting accusations of racism: apparently over 10,000 people have now complained. [...]




    1. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 2:45 pm  

      Well done for calling this what it is; a bandwagon.

    2. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 2:50 pm  

      Leon, why are you being so negative about this (I refer to your comment on another thread when you called the complainers clueless)

      The thing that gets me about this whole thing is that it gets me. I’m not one to play the race card and was actually looking forward to the princess getting knocked off her cloud

      But what’s going on is blatant racism

      I’m old enough to remember a time when television was a minefield – you never know when someone would take the piss out of Asians in a nasty way or employ Asians to make fools of themselves

      The times are meant to have changed

      It’s all well and good you don’t think it’s a big deal but a lot of people do

      Don’t be so smug in your idea of what is important that you feel the need to patronise them

    3. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 2:50 pm  

      What’s wrong with joining a bandwagon? You get a free ride.

      Endemol will enjoy this — more viewers = more money.

    4. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 2:58 pm  

      Endemol will enjoy this — more viewers = more money.

      Exactly, hence my comment about whether these complainers had a clue.

      Kismet, why am I being “negative”? There was no conclusive evidence he’d said anything racist yet here we have a shitstorm. I guess it’s good to not let facts get in the way of a good story for some people.

    5. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 2:58 pm  

      Fuck that. I’m boycotting Channel 4. I got hooked on it back in 86 thanks to saturday night live when I thought they were so progressive, so forward-thinking

      This just plunges it all back to the darky ages

      Fuck channel 4

    6. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:00 pm  

      Actually Leon, it’s blatant that there is an underlying racial element to the bullying of Shilpa.

    7. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:02 pm  

      Leon, are you still obsessing about whether he said Paki or not? The show is littered with examples of trollops picking on her not because she’s this spoilt princess, but because she’s foreign. The pig-ignorant comment about Asian girls being skinny because they eat shit food and be sick and that they all live in shacks is what’s making people angry

      That is racism

      Please extend your research a little bit further before you jump on the bandwagon of slating the complainers

    8. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:10 pm  

      Actually Leon, it’s blatant that there is an underlying racial element to the bullying of Shilpa.

      I wouldn’t disagree but that wasn’t the issue here was it? This started because of this stuff about the word paki, any actual evidence come out yet about that? And the less said about the underlying class prejudice at work against Jade etc the better I guess.

      There’s something about this that reminds me of community groups/posturing/false campaigning etc not sure how to articulate that yet…

    9. Anon+1 — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:14 pm  

      Think about the type of people that watch BB in the first place, now who cares.
      As for the complaints, I bet they have made the ratings soar!

    10. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:15 pm  

      Leon for fuck’s sake what he says ends with ee. Watch it. The Standard are demanding mastertapes to prove it really was cunt.

      But more importantly… so what?

      These people are complaining because of the racism that’s being aired against a person.

      You sound like a crap copper saying ‘I got called out here cos I heard a person got beaten up. It appears only his burnt down. So I was misleaded. No crime here.’

    11. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:16 pm  

      Ah bollocks to rage. House burnt down. Fuck it.

    12. rod — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:16 pm  

      thanks to bigbrother people in india can see what some of english people are like. They are not as goody goody they make out to be.Racism,what in england no you misunderstand us.

    13. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:16 pm  

      Oh come on Leon, underlying class hatred? What a load of bollocks. A gang of four people are bullying an Indian woman making snide remarks about her ethnic background. People are reacting to that.

    14. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:18 pm  

      rod

      English people are brilliant and they are not mostly racist, quite on the contrary. You don’t know what you’re chatting about. But people who want to fight prejudice with their own prejudice, like you, are really tacky.

    15. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:23 pm  

      Can I just say I find your intellectual superiority complex sickerning?

      When it’s a campaign you deem worthy (I’m loathed to say highbrow, but let’s face it, you’re pitching to the pistachio munching chomsky loving literatti there) like the New Generation Network manifesto, you want everyone to rally round and cry bravo

      But when it’s the common people, (the intellectual void as you no doubt see them that watch reality shows) getting their shit together to express a unified sense of outrage, you can’t help but belittle them

      And there you are Leon, banging on about class prejudice

      If there is ever a revolution, it’ll be these people that make it happen

      Have some fucking respect

    16. padraig reidy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:27 pm  

      “They are not as goody goody they make out to be”

      That’s some nice punnery there, son.

    17. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:29 pm  

      http://www.mirror.co.uk/tvandfilm/realitytv/tm_headline=shilpa%2Ds-bullying-is-shameful-%2D-what%2Ds-worse-is-the-show-has-not-stopped-it%26method=full%26objectid=18479454%26siteid=94762-name_page.html

    18. Sunny — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:30 pm  

      Easy now Mr Hardy, don’t get your thong in a twist too much. It’s only TV. And as Shilpa herself said, it will make her a stronger person. I bet she’s dealt with worse in Mumbai.

    19. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:32 pm  

      I don’t wear underwear sunny. I go commando. And I’m a gonna jerk off my gun

      Seriously, this isn’t just about a person or a show

      It’s about the level of racism that’s becoming acceptable on a grass roots level

    20. Chairwoman — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:39 pm  

      Yes Kismet, I agree wholeheartedly with that last statement. In the past eighteen months people have started saying things that would have been totally unacceptable two and a half years ago. I thought it was only Jews and Muslims that were on the receiving end of this amusing little novelty, but now I see it doesn’t matter what minority you are, you’re fair game.

      BTW someone said that Ms Goodey is mixed race. Human and what else?

    21. Sid Love — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:40 pm  

      If the tally hits 10,000 drinks are on me!!

    22. Sahil — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:41 pm  

      I think Ms Piggy, chairwoman, however she recieved none of her grace.

    23. Uncleji cathode ray tube — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:42 pm  

      “It’s only TV”
      If only that was the case.
      Having a form of behaviour on TV, makes it acceptable. So if racial abuse it allowed on a show it makes it “alright”.
      Jade & the other member of the shallow end of the gene pool, have done a service in shaking the media luvvies out of the complancy that their audience is non-racist and non-hophobic which allowed the use of ironic sterotyping in shows such as little britian and Little Miss Jocelyn.

    24. Uncleji we are not amused — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:45 pm  

      On a lighter note.
      Spare a thought for Sunny’s pain.
      A man who thinks “Today” is dumbed down descending into the cesspool of BB. :)
      I love it !
      A belated Lohri must get back to fiddling my tax return before 31st Jan

    25. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:49 pm  

      Rewind your remote control:

      Up the elephant & round the castle with Jim Davidson and his infamous Chalky character

      Mind your language

      It ain’t half hot mun

      Black junkies on the bill

      Cornershop owners in eastenders…

      It was only TV then too you know

    26. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:49 pm  

      Yes, happy Lohri to you too Uncleji.

      Shilpa has class though, she’s a really classy lady, elegant, poised, black belt in kung fu. I think she should just go in the garden and bust some kung fu moves to show them what she can do, like the scenes in the Karate Kid where he’s practising, expecially to that wretched little streak of piss boyfriend of Jade’s who called her a cunt or a paki.

    27. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 3:56 pm  

      Labour MP Keith Vaz has tabled an early day motion in the House of Commons about the treatment of Celebrity Big Brother contestant Shilpa Shetty.

      Mr Vaz said members of his Leicester East constituency had contacted him about alleged racism on the Channel 4 show.

      The early day motion (EDM) reads: “This House views with concern the
      comments made about Big Brother contestant Shilpa Shetty by other
      housemates; believes that Big Brother has a role to play in preventing
      racist behaviour in the Big Brother house; regrets that these comments have been made; and calls on the programme to take urgent action to remind housemates that racist behaviour is unacceptable.”
      EDMs are used by MPs to highlight an issue and appear on the Commons Order Paper each day.

      Mr Vaz said: “I have been contacted by constituents who have expressed concern that apparently racist comments in the Big Brother house have passed without any response from the Big Brother programme.

      “We would not tolerate this kind of racism on other types of television
      programme and we should not do so on a programme that is watched by millions of people.”

      It is not the first time Celebrity Big Brother has been mentioned in the
      Commons. Last January Labour MP Chris Bryant questioned how contestant George Galloway had managed to sign a series of Early Day Motions while locked up in the Big Brother house.

      Speaker Michael Martin later cleared him of any wrongdoing.

      c.Amar Singh, Evening Standard

    28. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:00 pm  

      Leon, are you still obsessing about whether he said Paki or not?

      Well, it’s good to know how this came about, you wrote a full article about it with no evidence. That contributed to the perceptions we have no (though obviously it’s a small part!).

      Please extend your research a little bit further before you jump on the bandwagon of slating the complainers

      Please, sling mud against someone else. Trying to turn those that question this mob mentality as a bandwagon is just as an underhanded debating tactic.

    29. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:01 pm  

      LoL I think that’s hilarious, Keith Vaz tabling a parliamentary question. This is getting out of proportion.

    30. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:02 pm  

      When it’s a campaign you deem worthy (I’m loathed to say highbrow, but let’s face it, you’re pitching to the pistachio munching chomsky loving literatti there) like the New Generation Network manifesto, you want everyone to rally round and cry bravo

      You’re on another fucking planet…

    31. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:03 pm  

      It’s an early day motion, which are the most meaningless, cheeky contrived kind of things, where an MP from Liverpool will congratulate Steven Gerrard for scoring a hat trick, or say ‘This House Praises Helen Mirren for winning an Oscar’, that type of thing.

    32. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:04 pm  

      Leon,

      That’s because I, like many others, believe he did say Paki. I defend what I believe in.

      You don’t. That’s no excuse not to look at the other cases put forward regarding the racism being aired.

      So explain to me. Why is your New Network Generation about people power and this is about mob mentality?

      Is it because the mob are actually getting their voices heard?

    33. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:04 pm  

      This is getting out of proportion.

      Getting? I think it was the minute people started propagating the myth about racist language with no facts, then conveniently forgetting that and moving.

      That said Sunny has hit the nail on the head with his post above, it is only TV and Shilpa will survive.

    34. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:05 pm  

      “You’re on another fucking planet…”

      And there’s me hoping for a levelled debate for once…

    35. Sahil — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:05 pm  

      MUWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, this is going mental, even the Sun’s resident BB Bitch is turing on Jade’s trio. This is going to be a trial by tabloid:

      http://www.thesun.co.uk/section/0,,11049,00.html

    36. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:06 pm  

      Leon, did you read the link to Jim Shelley in The Mirror? I’m sorry it’s not the Guardian but I’m sure they’ll get there soon enough

      Right. Who’s up for some pistachios?

    37. Sid Love — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:08 pm  

      Can’t we have a national (5+ million) voter campaign to get those racist scrubbers out, and bill it to Endemol’s account?

    38. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:09 pm  

      I don’t think so Leon, I dont think there’s anything wrong with calling people for racist bullying in the first place. In fact I applaud them for making a stand! As for Sunny, well, I think Channel 4 should parachute him in to give them all a lecture, as he is the messiah.

    39. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:09 pm  

      Kismet, I’m not going to bother, I actually like you a great deal and respect your serious contributions here for the most part but you’ve clearly got yourself bent out of shape over this.

    40. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:11 pm  

      Leon, I let this get personal. I love you. In every gay way possible.

      But I really, truly am angry about this.

      It may be an idea to see why

      Darling xX

    41. neo — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:12 pm  

      This started because of this stuff about the word paki, any actual evidence come out yet about that?

      Ch4 have today come out and said he said cunt, not paki.

      I know we’re gonna get asians saying “they’re lying” or “cover up!”. But common sense tells me they’d be rather silly to lie when they can be found out so easily cos all these groups like Ofcom will probably be viewing the footage soon to see for themselves.

      Its baffled me seeing sooo many people being so sure of what he said. NOW YOU’RE ALL WRONG (unless ch4 are lying through their teeth).

      This is a huge thing, publicly labelling someone a racist and somehow being so sure of it. Jack has shown no other behaviour to suggest he is racist. But cos of all these assumptions and guesses and putting across as definates, he may have one hell of a time when he comes out the house. Worse than the people who probably deserve it (Jo & Danielle).

    42. Kulvinder — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:13 pm  

      “You’re on another fucking planet…”

      And there’s me hoping for a levelled debate for once…

      Kismet and Shilpa sitting in a tree

      k-i-s-s-i-n-g

    43. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:15 pm  

      I don’t think so Leon, I dont think there’s anything wrong with calling people for racist bullying in the first place.

      Round and round we go. As I said I agree with the fact that the underlying tone is probably racist, but don’t see any evidence for actual racist language. I really don’t think it does anyone any good for us to fly off the handle screaming racism without a solid foundation to fight from. This aint how anti racist work is done if you want to have any credibility and positive impact in the long run.

      My thinking is Ch4 probably thought, given the way they’ve edited this (media in manipulation shocker!), they could bleep and stir a little controversy to reverse the sliding ratings.

      A little conspiratorial perhaps but there you go such is my cynicism toward them (remember me dismissing the Veiled Christmas message thing on similar grounds?), it really doesn’t have much restraint.

    44. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:17 pm  

      kulvinder, you know how I loathe derailing topics with nonsequeters. People like you make me sick

    45. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:17 pm  

      Well said neo.

    46. neo — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:17 pm  

      I’d go as far as to say some people should perhaps make an apology, or a retraction of their comments, to Jack :)

    47. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:18 pm  

      Neo, we’ll see if they release the mastertape as called upon by the standard et al

      Doesn’t change the racism though

    48. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:19 pm  

      I just saw it again. It ends in ee. Cuntee is just too stupid. Even for Jack

    49. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:19 pm  

      OK Leon, you seem quite bent out of shape yourself over viewers of a programme feel something’s up and complaining about it — nothing wrong with that at all.

    50. neo — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:22 pm  

      Yeah it doesn’t change the behaviour of Jo or Danielle. But this particular debate is about Jack.

      Kismet, can we have a show of your confidence that you’re willing to do a dare if you’re wrong? ;)

      If it is confirmed that cunt was said, by Ofcom or whatever other group, or release of the footage, you’ll make a public statement affirming your secret love for Jack? ;) Eh ;) :D :P

    51. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:23 pm  

      Jagdeep, no what I don’t like is some keyboard warrior being underhanded and twisting everything I say to suit his ill thought out views. It’s especially depressing that it’s coming from someone like Kismet as it would be if it came from you or any of the other regulars on here.

    52. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:26 pm  

      Neo, I’m used to being wrong (the ladies I approach keep reminding me in no uncertain terms) and have no problem with doing a dare (humiliation comes as second nature to me)

      But this isn’t about me, or Jack, or Shilpa, or some wanky television show

      It’s about allowing racism to be aired on national television

      I applaud those that find that unnacceptable. It’s shocking that a ‘progressive’ site as this thinks ‘it’s just TV’

      The revolution, my friends, WILL be televised

    53. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:27 pm  

      Leon, I’m not twisting what you say. You’re just not answering my questions and seem depressingly unwilling to bend from your stance that this is all just hokum

    54. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:29 pm  

      In case you’re wondering what question to answer, just this one:

      Why is your New Generation Network about power people and the complaints against Big Brother mob mentality?

      Why is the first an important issue and the latter just about people jumping on a bandwagon?

      Seriously. I’ll just listen

    55. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:30 pm  

      *people power

      PS. I’m not out to show you up Leon. I really do respect you

    56. Chairwoman — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:33 pm  

      Kismet # 48, perhaps it’s his name for Ms Goodey’s ladies bits :-)

    57. Leon — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:33 pm  

      Kismet 54, I don’t know ask Sunny, he set up the NGN.

      My quip about mob mentality was my own, perhaps unfair but certainly not representative of anyone but myself (as is all my contributions on here).

    58. Sahil — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:35 pm  

      There is definately bullying, and very likely xenophobia but Kismet, from the youtube clip that you’ve linked, the sound quality is so bad that I can’t tell what the muppet said one way or another. I wouldn’t make a call on this until Ofcom releases a statement, and I think that’s what Leon is simply saying. So what’s the beef?

    59. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:39 pm  

      Look Leon, let’s just hug. Seriously. If my anger at this translated as aggression towards you, then I apologise wholeheartedly

    60. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:40 pm  

      Chairy, thanks for that mental image…

    61. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:47 pm  

      From Meera Syal:

      “There is a very thin line between what is entertainment and a vile spectacle and I think we are in that area now. What this treatment of Shilpa has done is remind a lot of Asian people in Britain of the type of uncomfortable treatment they’ve received themselves over the
      years. This is bullying and we mustn’t forget the impressionable people
      that watch this show.

      I have great admiration for the way Shilpa’s handled herself. But Channel 4 have been obviously rubbing their hands at the audience figures because everybody is talking about it now.

      The producers need to be forthright in their condemnation of
      Shilpa’s treatment.”

    62. Kulvinder — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:49 pm  

      It’s about allowing racism to be aired on national television

      Why does it matter?

      Why is your New Generation Network about power people and the complaints against Big Brother mob mentality?

      Because in the relative scheme of things it doesn’t matter.

      To give you a tangential analogy (which i hope you appreciate :) ) i know people who don’t use the Opera web browser and insist on Firefox, this despite the fact Opera enhances the internet experience by entire orders of magnitude above Firefox. If asked why they give vague answers about (nonexistent) spyware and how open source is better since the corporations are trying to ‘get you’, those same people don’t complain much about ID cards, CCTV cameras, infringement of civil liberties, the fucking oyster card, or the fact you need to submit fingerprints and an iris scan everytime you enter the US, or that the US demands and retains information on travellers.

      Being able to prioritise is fairly important to me.

      A TV company that wants to make money put into a fairly confined area a group of people who would not normally meet, they did so because it would cause drama and because of that drama they’d get viewers who would pay to evict those they don’t like.

    63. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:49 pm  

      (above from tonight’s evening standard)

    64. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:54 pm  

      Kulvinder,

      I fully appreciate in the grand scheme of things a crap TV show can’t come high on the list, but if I may wank off about myself for a second.

      I’m not a highbrow man or particularly intellectual. I’ve never read chomsky and don’t know my Lenin from my Trotsky, and when I see two papers left on the train – I go for the one with the red top.

      Shall I tell you why? Because all your intellectuals and your thinkers are going to be useless come the revolution.

      It’ll be the mob that decides who gets lined up against that proverbial wall

      They’re the ones that read the sun and watch big brother

      I think it’s dangerous not to know what they actually believe in

    65. Kulvinder — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:56 pm  

      There hasn’t been a revolution in britain for 360 years.

    66. Kulvinder — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:57 pm  

      edit: that should say england

    67. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 4:58 pm  

      What about punk rock?

    68. Chairwoman — on 16th January, 2007 at 5:01 pm  

      Kismet - It’s why one of the papers I take is the Daily Mail.

      I feel very strongly about this. He said ‘Paki’, but he might as well say ‘Kike’ or ‘Nigger’.

      I’ll say it again. He should be publicly told to go, and told why. Shame on Channel 4.

    69. Chairwoman — on 16th January, 2007 at 5:02 pm  

      Jagdeep - That was a bit of a benign revolution. I think Kismet means bang, bang, blood on the streets.

    70. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 5:05 pm  

      Bang, bang, blood

      It’s rubbish wanking when you’ve got gonnorhea let me assure you

    71. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 5:45 pm  

      10,000 complaints is the latest - http://www.mediaguardian.co.uk

      Sid, you owe us a beer old fella :-)

    72. Jazz Singh — on 16th January, 2007 at 5:54 pm  

      Mediaguardian.co.uk has just said that almost 10,000 complaints have been made now… looks like the drinks are on you now, Sid Love!

      As for last night, I found it so uncomfortable watching the systematic bullying of Shilpa. Channel 4 have finally got a ratings winner, and a show that has got the nation talking, but for all the wrong reasons.

      The ‘bud-bud’ accents being used last night were reminiscent of shows from the ’70s such as Mind Your Language, and I’m sure that the impact of the accent wasn’t lost on many viewers last night. As for comments such as Indians being skinny because they don’t cook their food properly, that just smacks of outright racism and xenophobia.

      Next thing you know, the contestants who have ganged up on Shilpa will be saying “She’s come over her, she’s taken our jobs, what do you expect from an Indian!”

      Or perhaps it’s a plain issue of ignorance. Jade showed herself to know very little about Eskimo culture, asking Big Brother if they will become extinct in the future, why they don’t turn into ice-cubes because they live in such a cold place, why their eye-lids don’t freeze to their eyes. I can see the travelogue now - Jade in India, Jade with the Eskimos.

      Eureka - Jade is the new ‘Michael Palin’!

    73. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 5:57 pm  

      Every Asian celebrity except that twat Faroukh Dhondi has so far unanimously condemned this

    74. Don — on 16th January, 2007 at 6:02 pm  

      Damn. I’m going to have to watch the bloody thing now.

    75. Vikrant — on 16th January, 2007 at 6:32 pm  

      Faroukh Dhondy isnt a twat Kismet…. i guess hes got better things to do than watch CBB!

      FFS i just dont get it… why the fuck are you guys making such a fuss over Shilpa… the bitch (like most of the Bollywood) has got mafiosi links: http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/22076.cms . I daresay its a matter of time before she puts out a contract on Jack ‘n Jade…

      LoL I think that’s hilarious, Keith Vaz tabling a parliamentary question. This is getting out of proportion.

      Wait till this gets to Indian parliament… Doubtlessly Left Front would find it a convinient way to pass an anti-West resolution with words “Iraq, imperialism and Israel” crammed into it!

    76. William — on 16th January, 2007 at 6:46 pm  

      It’s just been aired on the BBC TV 6pm news.

    77. Sahil — on 16th January, 2007 at 7:02 pm  

      Shit its on CHannel 4 news!!!!!

    78. Sid Love — on 16th January, 2007 at 7:48 pm  

      10,000?!!!

      Right, who’s having what?

      oh and that guy Farrukh Dhondi? Arsehole. Complete.

    79. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 8:11 pm  

      Kronenberg please matey.

      And no and yes. Faroukh Dhonti is a bleep

      And that, channel 4, is a real cunt

    80. Nyrone — on 16th January, 2007 at 8:18 pm  

      Lord almighty, there is nothing to bind people together like a common enemy! It’s like a minor anti-war movement, except people are allowed to complain from their computers and phones rather than walk around in the cold chanting slogans and holding placards of dead children.

      I agree with a lot of what you’ve said Kismet, and your drive for the cause is cool, but I can’t understand why you would emphasise on the ‘revoloution’ being won by ‘the mass’. Doesn’t the Sun represent the very same people you are currently, rightly attacking? The Goody family, Danielle and Jo? Doesn’t the problem signal the normalisation of a Sun-Murdoch viewpoint? The dumbing down of all things?

      well, I must confess to being quite pleased about the uproar over this. I expect that it’s pay-off for all the people who sat there watching in horror as ‘Jackiey’ aggressively attacked Shipla as ‘the Indian’ for pretty much no reason. I also think that the ‘P***’ comment has got little to do with the current storm. It’s the underlying rascism displayed, the kind that Asians are just supposed to ‘deal with’ and it’s what Jermaine wisely pointed out, about her being the only ‘foreign’ girl in the house.

      For many people, this is akin to publicly getting revenge on every rascist that has said or expressed something to them. It’s a public battle being waged in the Tv-stratosphere against a particlar stereotype that people are sick off. Rascism is soooo 1970′s.

      Sid, I’ll have a glass of pomegranate juice please.

    81. Clairwil — on 16th January, 2007 at 8:26 pm  

      One can e-mail the Big Brother contestants questions here

      bigbrotherfax@channel4.com

      Something like this perhaps

      How long have you been a brain dead racist cunt?

      Doubt they’ll get passed on but enough e-mails might fuck their system up.

      A more sensible suggestion might be to contact the sponsors pressoffice@cpw.co.uk and ask

      Could you please tell me how long your company, Endemol and Channel 4 intend to continue profiting - without comment or interference - from a programme that is presenting casual, thoughtless racism and bullying as entertainment?

    82. Elusive — on 16th January, 2007 at 8:36 pm  

      This discussion is more entertaining than stuff posted on the chilling board on barficulture.com :)

    83. Vikrant — on 16th January, 2007 at 8:45 pm  

      heh Clairwil… since when did chavlims learned to use emails?

    84. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 8:56 pm  

      Thought for the evening:

      Big Brother is like a zoo in a jungle

    85. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:07 pm  

      Watch Jade get owned by Shilpa at 1:40

      ‘Your claim to fame is THIS?’

      Priceless….

    86. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:08 pm  

      Watch Jade get owned by Shilpa at 1 minute 40secs

      ‘Your claim to fame is THIS?’

      Priceless…

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NlaOlwqJ78

    87. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:15 pm  

      Go on girl!

      Jade calling Shilpa a fake. That’s the funniest thing I’ve ever heard. Did you see her cry after her mom got booted out? No girl ever cries like that. Only when they know they’re being watched…

      But Shilpa.

      I can’t say anything other than repeat:

      Priceless!

    88. Jagdeep — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:22 pm  

      The whole audience cheered that, so funny, totally owned.

    89. Vikrant — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:22 pm  

      pwned…

    90. Gibs — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:25 pm  

      Accept it for what it is - resentment from a bunch of uneducated scallies/chavs/hillbillies towards someone of a “higher class” - safe in the knowledge that the victim is not aware of the many insults/jokes that exist in the English language that can be directed back towards such lowlife.

    91. Vikrant — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:26 pm  

      piggy pwned (thats got a nice ring to it)

    92. Vikrant — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:28 pm  

      i second Gibs…

    93. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:29 pm  

      I third

    94. Kismet Hardy — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:31 pm  

      PS. Vik, apologies for earlier irritatability. I’m at peace with my narcosis again

    95. Sahil — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:37 pm  

      Jagdeep that was too good!!

    96. Bert Preast — on 16th January, 2007 at 9:39 pm  

      A comment from a rather anglocentric board I frequent:

      “It really makes me warm to those currently on jihad against the western world. Because if Jade’s rise to fame and fortune is right then damnit I want to be wrong”

      The general feeling seems to be sympathy for Shilpa and Sheringham on account of his bitch of a girlfriend. They’d also quite like to put Jack’s teeth on a kerb. It’s all emotional stuff, isn’t it? Maybe I should give it a try sometime, put some pep back into life.

    97. El Cid — on 16th January, 2007 at 10:15 pm  

      Still, some of those tabloid bulletin boards are encouraging, eh?

    98. William — on 16th January, 2007 at 10:16 pm  

      BB and some other programmes pander to the well known concept that when groups of people are put together under certain conditions sooner or later their negatives will emerge. Often this is with some kind of regular contact in a contained environment. It is well known in group pyschotherapy that often members will seek scapegoats and in group/outgroups get formed. Bullying can exist in such groups. Here though there is no safeguarding philosophy in the form of a common code among the group for members to be introspective and to own their own negatives, neither is there any experienced facilitator/therapist to act as mediator. Here it exists as mass entertainment in the form of a kind of psycho-gladiators. Put our feet up pass the nibbles while we peer into the ampitheatre goggle box.

    99. Bert Preast — on 16th January, 2007 at 10:21 pm  

      “BB and some other programmes pander to the well known concept that when groups of people are put together under certain conditions sooner or later their negatives will emerge”

      Except they’re not pandering to is so much as raking in fortunes from it.

    100. Sid Love — on 16th January, 2007 at 11:22 pm  

      hey kids

      i hope you’re all soaking up the enjoyment watching a quality (foreign) celebrity wipe the floor with 3 of Britain’s “most influential” no-talent mingers.

      is Britain ready for this?

      i ask you.

    101. Ravi Naik — on 16th January, 2007 at 11:41 pm  

      You know, as long as we give uneducated people the power to “hurt” us by simply spouting a 4-letter word, then we should not be surprised that it is abused.

      And Big Brother is a fucking joke of a show which needs this type of friction to get an audience: Jade knows it, and so do the producers. So, by putting a beautiful and intelligent actress with an Indian accent with an ugly uneducated yob, what did you expect?

    102. Anon+1 — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:18 am  

      You guys are so funny! Shes the only representation that ‘Asians’ have in there so look at you all defending her as intelligent and wonderful like its an attack on you all as a race personally.
      I’ll admit she is better looking than the other female contestants in there but now look at yourselves discriminating. Only difference to their remarks and yours is skin colour and skin shape/form. Both are uncontrolled and a result of the genetic lottery, you are just as stuck up and pathetic as all the other plastic people linked to CBB.

    103. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:20 am  

      Not all of us are Asian. So bugger off, see?

    104. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:45 am  

      Cheer up, Sunny:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkP8lVE2_0A&mode=related&search=

      Try not to grin.

    105. neo — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:08 am  

      haha @ shilpa’s comment at jade. and jade didn’t even get it!

      what’s been interesting is no real racist comments have come out even during the times they’ve been half drunk, which is when its most likely cos of the obvious inhibitions.

      And jade had a right argument with Shilpa tonight (will be shown on tmr’s show) about her “thinking she’s a princess, but she’s not one in the house”. Absurd thing to say as she’s not been acting like that.

      I think the truth came out there about why Jade doesn’t like her. this is about jealousy rather than racism for her.

    106. coruja — on 17th January, 2007 at 9:30 am  

      Power of Auntiji?

      I may be wrong but may go like this:

      Some marketing/PR genius at Endermol decides to lure the ‘brown pound’ viewers as a last ditch attempt to generate some decent viewing figures for CBB. So they bring in a Bollywood princess and Auntijis from all over UK decide to tear themselves away from B4U/Zee for a change to watch someone on British TV they recognise only to see her getting bullied, her accent made fun off, comments about the food - all very 80′s West Midlands school playground stuff.
      Stuff I’m sure most first generation immigrants recognise and they complain. And boy do they, because that is something Auntijis are very good at having dealt with numerous double glazing fitters, cable TV installers and builders all their suburban lives.

      The bigoted comments haven’t changed, it’s the same stuff I’ve heard 20 odd years ago, what has changed is that people are complaining, they may be overreacting but they are not keeping their head down on getting on with it - as they did before. Power to the Auntijis! And we also have another word to describe Asian Daddy’s Girls - “Cunt Bitch”. I’m waiting for the Cafe Press t-shirts.

      I would like to see the demographics of the complainers - it would be interesting. So is the comment by the demented Ms Greer in the Guardian this morning - she has a good point, but her insanity some through when comparing the words ‘Aussie’ and ‘Paki’ as equivalent terms.

    107. Neel81 — on 17th January, 2007 at 10:13 am  

      Forget first generation British Asians,even the second and third generation will have experienced some sort of racism, especially if they went to a school or workplace which they are an overwhelming minority.

      Shilpa has taken it all in her stride, I dare say that most British Asians certainly wouldn’t have becuase they would have come across characters like those 3 inthe lives.

    108. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 10:23 am  

      >>>…her insanity some through when comparing the words ‘Aussie’ and ‘Paki’ as equivalent terms.

      And why aren’t both words equivalent? Because we made it an offensive word at the same height as nigger, and thus gave racists and uneducated people a real easy way to offend us. It is not like the word ‘queer’, which is an offensive word by itself, except gays made sure it wasn’t.

      We have come past the time where we need protection from such abuse. We are not a weak minority anymore. We are well-represented in almost every field, and contribute enormously to science, economy and culture of Britain. The richest man in Britain is a self-made Indian billionaire. Why the fuck should we care if someone says ‘paki’, or make ignorant comments about a country they know little about?

      If Shilpa is taking care of herself despite the bullying, so can you.

    109. Neel81 — on 17th January, 2007 at 10:33 am  

      Because that person is looking to offend if they say ‘Paki’ or even an apparently inoffensive way of addressing someone such as referring to them as ‘the Indian’ instead of using their name would certainly be considered offensive in most walks of life. I wouldn’t do it to anyone and i dont expect anyone to refer to me in such a manner.

      Its precisely because we are not a weak minority that we are not tolerating this kind of patronising behavious which has racial undertones. In the past our elders would have accepted it as something they couldnt’ change.

    110. Chairwoman — on 17th January, 2007 at 10:41 am  

      Ravi - You have actually made an excellent point.

      My family have always referred to ourselves as ‘Yidden’, but these days it’s deemed offensive to call Jews ‘Yids’. I suppose it’s all about tone and context.

      I think what’s offensive about ‘Paki’, apart from the afore-mentioned tone and context, is that it is an ignorant blanket term for everyone from the sub-continent.

      On an almost lighter note, one of Katy’s best friends is a girl whose parents are Yemini Jews. She is brown, and found that the racial insults aimed at her were always of the ‘Paki’ variety. Though very small, she is also both brave and fierce, and one day, having put up with the usual racist slurs being hurled at her on the bus home from school, turned to her abusers and shouted, ‘I’m not a fucking dirty Paki, I’m a fucking dirty Yid, OK’.

    111. Chairwoman — on 17th January, 2007 at 10:43 am  

      Nee181 - Your elders felt that they were outsiders. You don’t. You are confident in your identity. There’s the difference.

    112. Andy — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:02 am  

      The whole argument is pathetic. If she were white, nobody would bat an eyelid at whatever comments were being made about her. But because she’s Indian people try to make a big deal of it. Anyone going into BB knows they’re going to get a hard time, so what is there to complain about? And as for the whole Paki thing, well “Paki” is just short for Pakistani, so get over it. And no, it’s not like “nigger”, because “nigger” is a completely different and made-up word and not short for anything. The fact that some housemate may have called her Paki just displays their ignorance of her nationality, and is in fact something to laugh at, not to get upset about. And why would anyone with half a brain care what someone as dense as Jade Goody thinks anyway?

    113. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:14 am  

      In India, Shilpa Shetty is precisely what the title of Celebrity Big Brother expects her to be – a celebrity. That’s why she signed up for the show. She thought she’d find other celebrities there.

      Sure she’s a spoilt little princess, but then what celebrity isn’t used to being pampered? That’s one of those givens, isn’t it?

      She didn’t expect, or deserve, to be in a house full of wannabes or, worse, bitter never-weres, and that’s why she’s facing their wrath.

      It doesn’t matter that there’s a diva in Shilpa. The important thing is she’s trying to connect with the pondlife despite all the odds and, to me, that makes her a star.

      There’s a picture in Metro today showing Danielle, Jo et al tucking into sandwiches. So it’s not just in India and China where they eat with their fingers, eh?

      And Andy, shut up. Paki is offensive to me because I’ve heard it as abuse many a times. Much the same as you must feel after repeatedly hearing the word tosser

    114. Chairwoman — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:31 am  

      Andy - Nigger is a corruption of Negro which is French for black. Geddit?

      Paki is offensive to me, because everybody knows that it’s a no-no, so to use it is to offend deliberately.

      BTW ‘Tosser’ is not a compliment.

    115. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:35 am  

      Chairwoman - I think you’ll find it comes from the Portuguese rather than the French. Then got corrupted by English speakers who anglicised it.

      As for Paki, it’s hard for a white man to say. I’ve been called Brit and felt offended, and I’ve been called Brit and not even noticed it. Comes down to who’s saying it and how.

    116. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:37 am  

      “As for Paki, it’s hard for a white man to say. I’ve been called Brit and felt offended, and I’ve been called Brit and not even noticed it. Comes down to who’s saying it and how.”

      Exactly!

    117. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:40 am  

      Hasn’t ‘Nigger’ got anything to do with the countries Niger or Nigeria?

      (genuinely don’t know)

    118. Leon — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:42 am  

      Apparently complaints are now numbering 14,500. Keith Vaz and a bunch of Asian celebs are condemning this, India is raising this with Britain (Gordon Brown is over there at the moment), BB sponsor Carphone Warehouse is considering pulling it’s money and I’ve noticed a deluge of reporting of race and racism stories.

      A lot of wealthy people are going to get more wealthy, a lot of famous people will become a bit more famous (no doubt Shilpa will return as a hero to India neatly sweeping aside allegations of her families links to organised crime) and at least one MP will make political capital out of this…

      What impact will this growing “campaign” have on race relations in this country? Will it change a thing, will the outraged actually pursue the aims of equality and social justice in future or is this just tribalistic self interest?

    119. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:42 am  

      Nah, it’s a corruption of negro, the Portuguese/Spanish word for black.

    120. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:43 am  

      Leon, HUG ME

    121. Chairwoman — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:48 am  

      Bert - Just checked with Websters. We are both right. Now there’s a happy conclusion.

    122. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 11:50 am  

      “What impact will this growing “campaign” have on race relations in this country? Will it change a thing, will the outraged actually pursue the aims of equality and social justice in future or is this just tribalistic self interest?”

      From my observations people seem to have found even deeper reserves of contempt for the Goodys and their ilk. But I doubt anything will change except minimally and in the short term. In the long term TV producers will see racist bullying as another string to their bow in the ratings war, so maybe even counter productive.

    123. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:05 pm  

      >> I think you’ll find it comes from the Portuguese rather than the French. Then got corrupted by English speakers who anglicised it.

      The portuguese word is ‘negro’, and is actually the least offensive way to refer a person with african ascentry.

    124. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:05 pm  

      I mean, ancestry

    125. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:06 pm  

      Um, I wouldn’t try it.

    126. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:34 pm  


      Actually, she reminds me slightly of one of my cousins. When Ken Russell was cold at night, she put an extra coverlet over him, just as any well-brought-up young person would do for an elder who was in discomfort. In India, the audience would have been wiping away a tear; Jackiey Goody abused her, thinking Shilpa was sucking up. That’s the cultural difference in a nutshell. Jackiey’s refusal to learn her name was straightforwardly racist - every British Asian will have had that conversation at least once, complete with self-righteous complaints about the “difficulty” of the task. It was a very ugly piece of TV and I’m glad people have felt uncomfortable enough to complain. Likewise about the accent-mimicking. But then, we’re only a generation from when It Ain’t Half Hot Mum was family entertainment. This is what Big Brother is for. It holds a mirror up to national attitudes. If we don’t like what we see, we ought to change.

      Hari Kunzru in the grauniad

    127. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:53 pm  

      >> What impact will this growing “campaign” have on race relations in this country?

      I think it will backfire. People are already embarrassed with those 3 women and impressed with how “the Indian” is handling things, so I am sure this campaign will definitely benefit a lot of people, including shameless politicians, TV producers and tabloid papers. I just don’t think we will benefit anything from it.

      Chairwoman’s story reminded me of my brother who was taunted by a bully, and solved the problem by saying he was very proud to be a paki.

    128. Nush — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:56 pm  

      For me personally all the comments made by Jade, Danielle and Jo struck a cord. They were familiar comments that I heard to myself in the playground.

      Is it any wonder I complained, they were the racist taunts myself and some of my peers had to deal with - to hear them 20 odd years later on CBB to another Asian young woman I am shocked.

      I dont care if considered borderline racism or not, to me it is. Its a concoction of those ignorant parents that fed their children with ignorant comments for however many years. Thus resulting in the ugly characters that have surfaced today on CBB.

      Bullying is wrong

      Jade was apparently on an anti bullying website - well she is no longer

      Nush

    129. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 12:57 pm  

      I used to retaliate to Paki by calling the person saying Porky. It’d confuse them enough for me to leg it, unless they really were fat in which case it’d be another lunchtime with my head down the loo

      God bless public schools

    130. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:05 pm  

      >> Um, I wouldn’t try it.

      Honestly Bert, I speak portuguese. The word ‘negro’ is not an ethnic slang, much to the contrary.

      Perhaps El Cid could tell us if that is the case in spanish.

    131. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:11 pm  

      There is a large segment of British society that thinks their race/colour trumps class/quality every time. Its an attitude which is as prevalent as chips and gravy. Three fifths of the BB sample household - if that’s representative.

      What we’re seeing is Shilpa dismantle that attitude live on Channel 4. This is public service TV.

    132. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:12 pm  

      Top story on the 1pm BBC1 News, folks.

    133. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:13 pm  

      I speak Spanish and an African here would take exception to being called a negro. The Spanish and Portuguese were massive players in the African slave trade, and the word still has connotations. They are Africanos.

      Is El Cid Spanish or in Spain then?

    134. coruja — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:14 pm  

      Ravi Naik - might be better to ask people of African ancestry how they would like to be referred to rather than fumbling around for the ‘least offensive’ term.

      Regardless of where these words originate from, through their use they both carry an enormous amount psychological weight. There are plenty of discussions on this elsewhere, but what matters here what the word ‘Paki’ means and all those other snide comments about food, accents &etc.

      It is something that we all understand and accept because it has been drummed in to us for a very long time – so forget about the lack of education or the ‘class’ of the people currently involved in this mess - what it means when someone is referred to as a ‘Paki’ or a ‘Nigger’ is that regardless of a persons ‘worth’, their celebrity, money, education or whatever standard - as a human being you are beneath the person abusing you. It doesn’t matter about the abusers ‘worth’, because whatever shortcoming they may have as human being, at least they are not a Paki and everything that entails.

      If this had been a French celebrity – if there had been comments about frogs, snails and hairy armpits – would the reaction be the same? Would so many have complained? I don’t think so, because experience of ‘black’people in their dealings with Europeans is different from the experience of Europeans in their dealings with each other. So this why words have the power to upset us Ravi Naik, and this is why calling someone an Aussie is not quite the same, Ms Greer. Shulpa may be dealing with things very well, but I think for the people who are complaining, all this is touching a raw nerve.

    135. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:22 pm  

      Speaking of Negros, it was Mohammaed Ali’s birthday yesterday. I observed it by drinking to his health.

    136. Leon — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:39 pm  

      And so it begins…wonder if this will get as bad as the Muslim/Cartoon protests?

      Celebrity Big Brother sparks Indian protests

      An effigy has been burnt by protesters in India over the treatment of Bollywood star Shilpa Shetty on Celebrity Big Brother.

      Demonstrators in the city of Patna took to the streets after the actress was the subject of bitchy comments from fellow contestants Jade Goody, Jo O’Meara and Danielle Lloyd.

      Leading Bollywood film-maker Mahesh Bhatt believes the attitudes of the housemates are commonplace.

      He said: “What is happening on Big Brother is just holding the mirror to the western society. This is the real, discriminating face of the West you can see on the streets of London or New York.”

      But Shilpa’s agent Jaz Barton isn’t convinced. She said: “I wouldn’t call it racism. I think it’s borderline. I think it’s ignorance and jealousy. I think they’re just envious. It is just bullying.”Full article

    137. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:42 pm  

      My two cents (tho it reiterates a lot of what others have said)…

      I’ve been trying to avoid this whole thing, but, undoubtedly to Endemol’s profound joy, it’s very hard to avoid on the news, in the papers, every fucker is talking about it. There are hints of a backlash from some quarters at what are seen as exaggerated charges of racism.

      But, being Asian, I can completely understand why it’s touched such a raw nerve amongst a lot of second and third generation Asians. It all hearkens back to the playground and to a few short years ago when Asian culture wasn’t as hip as it is now, when it stood for homeliness, backwardness. Back then, young Indians/Pakistanis/Bangladeshis weren’t as confident in their identities, and they saw how their parents took pains to be almost subservient in their attitudes to the rest of society in the face of racial abuse, intolerance, and bigotry. I remember being the only brown kid in my primary school and, although I wasn’t bullied — though there was racist taunting — I was left out of every group of kids and purposefully not included because of the colour of my skin. I don’t have very happy memories of that time, and feel extremely ashamed at all the attempts I tried to make to ingratiate myself with others. My mum told me later that many of the parents of the kids in the small town where I went to school resented the fact that my dad owned a shop in that town. God knows the kinds of things they were telling their children about our family.

      But now, it’s 2007 and this great Bollywood star arrives in CBB and — even if they aren’t exactly B’wood fans — she becomes a symbol for many young Asians of their pride in their culture. A pride that has developed far more in the past few years. What happens? people make fun of her accent, bully her, huddle up into groups and whisper things about her, and generally purposefully exclude her. The associations for a lot of young Asians watching that are invariably going to be painful. The anger will be visceral, and even if it turns out the word “paki” wasn’t used (although it always remains there seemingly hanging in the air), and people recognise that Shilpa might be exploiting the situation, the anger will remain.

    138. Chairwoman — on 17th January, 2007 at 1:53 pm  

      You don’t have to be Asian for it to touch a nerve, though obviously it’s closer to home.

      It’s 100 years since my mother’s parents came to this country, and 200 since my father’s family did, and we’re still being called names

      If you think that a history in this country is going to change things, forget it.

      And take my word for it, the same thing will not be happening to the new immigrants from Eastern Europe. Their descendants will fit in nicely, because they’ll ‘look right’.

    139. Karen Bruce — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:01 pm  

      I’ve seen and heard some of the racist bullying that’s been going on in the house. There are enough different instances to know that this is actually happening without having to wonder what was said on the instance you refered to. People have to know that this behaviour isn’t acceptable so some action has to be taken either against the responsible housemates by BB evicting them and/or Carphone Warhouse pulling out of their contract as BB sponsors.

    140. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:07 pm  

      I thought most of the Eastern European immigrants were only staying temporarily.

      Actually, I remember hearing about how Freud had been deeply affected by an incident — it’s fairly famous I think — when he was a child and he was walking along the pavement with his dad. His dad was wearing a distinctively Jewish piece of headware (I can’t remember what it’s called), and someone came up to him snatched it off his head and threw it to the ground. Freud’s dad’s response was to give no other reaction than to stoop down, pick his hat from off the ground, wipe it off and walk away with his son in hand. Freud said he always resented his father for that, for not standing up for himself and his identity, for not being a man. It’s conceivable that that incident was an important factor in Freud’s shaping of his theories of the Oedipal complex (though I’d be happy if any psychoanalysts could correct me on that).

    141. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:09 pm  

      Its the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oedipus_complex

    142. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:23 pm  

      “Well that was a day of events, wasn’t it?” understated Ian. “Have you ever heard anything like that before?”

      “No,” replied Jermaine in a slightly troubled manner. Then he went off to pray, explaining: “It keeps me sane.”

      Jermaine prides himself on his tolerance, but this would be the first hint of the day that this virtue was being tested.. severely.

      “I’m chuffed with what I’ve achieved here,” chirped Ian. “I’ve learned so much, have you?”

      “It’s just confirmed things,” Jermaine responded pessimistically.

    143. The Informer — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:26 pm  

      … and woe betide being a ‘goreh’ in the part of town where you’re a minority.

      There’s no monopoly on bigotry.

      Jade and her cronies clearly dislike Shilpa. Their treatment of her and the group bitching is childish and embarrassing. Jealousy is probably the reason. They being from the local council estate and Shilpa being fortunate enough to have a privileged upbringing.

      How this can translate to a damning indictment of the WWC or can invoke a righteous visceral reaction is straight out of the sixth form debating society.

    144. Chairwoman — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:28 pm  

      I think they mean to. An east european girl comes to help around my house twice a week. I am very fond indeed of her and her husband. They have been here 5 years, legally, by the way, they are hard working, educated (both graduates), and honest. They both do manual jobs here. They send money home to help their parents. They are the quintescentual immigrants.

      Their initial intention was to stay 3 years and go home. They have regularly gone back for visits, recently they went home and have now admitted that though they love their country, they no longer want to live in it. Soon they will start a family, here. They will be an asset to this country because of their personalities and philosophy, not because they are white.

    145. TottenhamLad — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:30 pm  

      A 15yr old schoolboy from Wiltshire Henry Webster is pinned down to the ground by a gang of asian men who then proceed to batter his head with a claw hammer and the BBC can’t even bring themselves to report the full story.

      Whereas the story over the alleged ‘racism’ faced by someone named Shilpa Shetty has been front page news with the BBC for three days now completet with it’s own Have You Say spot.

      Obviously being paid huge ammounts of money to appear on TV is so much more worse than being a schoolboy having your brains battered out by a pack of adult asian men on your way home from school.

      Rank hypocrisy or deliberate management of the news?

    146. Leon — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:32 pm  

      There’s no monopoly on bigotry.

      Yep, “he without sin cast the first stone” and all that… (fuck I’m quoting Jesus!!!).

    147. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:41 pm  

      TottenhamLad

      Sorry, I’m not clear on this. How was Shilpa Shetty involved with the beating of Henry Webster?

    148. TottenhamLad — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:47 pm  

      Search the BBC website for “Henry Webster”.

      Does it mention the racist attack on Henry Webster?

      No?

      Oh dear, can’t be important enough to the BBC then can it…

    149. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:48 pm  

      >> I speak Spanish and an African here would take exception to being called a negro. The Spanish and Portuguese were massive players in the African slave trade, and the word still has connotations. They are Africanos.

      Let me take you to the high-commission of immigration and ethnic minorities, which is a portuguese government entity that promotes diversity. Check this page. You can see that the word ‘negro’ is used interchangably with ‘africano.

      My point is that we give semantic and weight to words. To me, the best way to disarm a racist is to make sure that the word ‘paki’ is not offensive.

    150. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:49 pm  

      TL, as far as I can see, it’s probably better that the Harry Webster story isn’t overly sensationalised, and isn’t, at this stage at least, portrayed as a case of racism mainly because that kind of coverage might unnecessarily ramp up tensions and so have a negative impact on the community. The google site you linked to claims that the police are currently saying that this was personal and not racially motivated. Though, obviously the BNP are already on it. If you haven’t already, TL, you should think of joining, then you can join them on their leafleting activies.

    151. El Cid — on 17th January, 2007 at 2:54 pm  

      negro means black in spanish
      un negro means a black man
      1) una negra means a black lady
      un moreno (from moor) means a tanned white man or a black man (very common for indgiesnous south americans, mulattos, to call blacks that in cuba, etc)
      etc

      yes, no doubts negro and even nigger are bastardised english versions of the spanish word negro, and…?

      2) I hope you’ve all spotted the irony of a new irresistible mob mentality building up against those nasty BB bullies

    152. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:02 pm  

      Ravi - “Hoje, a palavra negro é considerada pejorativa em Portugal, onde se usa o termo “preto”, menos pejorativo. No Brasil ocorre o contrário: o uso do termo “preto” é considerado mais pejorativo do que “negro”, que em alguns lugares é usado até como forma de afetividade”

      So negro is derogatory in Portuguese, but not in Brazilian Portuguese. Where did you pick up the lingo?

    153. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:04 pm  

      Emmmmmmmmmm, TL, you’re being a little misleading here. Although the name “Harry Webster” isn’t featured, the attack has been featured several times on the BBC news website. So you’re wrong. Rank hypocrisy, TL, yes, but in this world, famous people tend to get their mugs in the news — sometimes on the basis of trivialities — more often than us ordinary mortals simply because, well, they’re famous.

    154. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:06 pm  

      This thing’s getting very silly now if it’s affecting the British image overseas. We don’t put Jade Goody on the telly as a role model, we put her there to point and laugh. Someone needs to explain this to India, and point out that the public are hardly behind the Goodys in this.

    155. Kulvinder — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:07 pm  

      This is all incredibly boring now, as far as i can tell there hasn’t been any racism. Bitchyness, bullying and ignorance perhaps, but no racism. Its interesting that some of the posters above cite their school days, I personally didn’t face constant racial abuse and can honestly only count the number of times it has occured on one hand.

      I’m dissapointed that Jade Goody, Daniella and their like are held up as examples of the white working class since i can’t really relate them to the people i know. Its as cringeworthy as putting up a ghetto speaking black or asian male as an example of black or asian males.

      As an englishman and a briton im unsure how to respond to people who ask if this is what britain is like, i can only reply in an exasperated sigh ‘its television’

      Whats far more interesting to me - and im going to touch a massive raw nerve here - is that its occuring mainly amongst the women. I don’t want this to come out as some sort of anti-feminist rant because its not, but in my experience ive mostly seen the ‘gang up’ type bullying occur amongst women. I generally tend to get on with almost all men i meet even if we have drastically different political beliefs. Given the choice id rather be in a BB type scenario as a male and with Nick Griffin and other supporters of the BNP as company than as a female with other females.

    156. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:08 pm  

      Anas - TL is pissed because the BBC is not reporting any racist connotations at all in their coverage of the incident. He is right in that were the races the other way around they would call it a racist attack and would have it on the front page.

    157. sabinaahmed — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:10 pm  

      Totenham Lad

      BBC`s Pointswest, their regional channel carried that story in full on their 6.30 news the day it happened. It was a long item and dominated the whole half hour. They interviewed the family and friends and the condemnation by other pupils and teachers. Since they have been carrying updates on his condition every evening.
      The BBC has regional broadcasts which carry the relevent issues. If every story was to make the national news then they will have to have a two hour news slot.
      It is easy to get paranoid without knowing the facts.

    158. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:11 pm  

      Can anyone translate the writing on the effigy they were burning? The effigy doesn’t seem to represent anything I can make out, so who’s got their goat?

    159. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:11 pm  

      We don’t put Jade Goody on the telly as a role model, we put her there to point and laugh.

      Wasn’t JG boasting about having been voted the 26th most influential person in some poll or other when she entered the house? Do we now live in a chavocracy?

    160. The Informer — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:13 pm  

      To Kulvinder @ 156

      Sense at last! (not being a regular here, I’m unsure if the above will be treated with hilarity)

      As to the last paragrpah - hope you’ve got your tin hat on!

    161. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:15 pm  

      Did Shilpa really flick our 26th most influential person her middle digit?

      **sharp intake of breat**

    162. Kulvinder — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:15 pm  

      Someone needs to explain this to India, and point out that the public are hardly behind the Goodys in this.

      Its really not worth bothering, the indians who want to believe in the imperialist racist briton aren’t going to be influenced by arguments along the lines of ‘its tv damnit’ as vikrant pointed out above, indian politics will probably influence how people react.

    163. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:16 pm  

      Anas - please say you’re shitting me. What was the poll?

    164. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:18 pm  

      Riots and demonstrations in India, Parliament involved, Gordon Brown makes a speech in India condemning this, Indian government involved.

      Bloody hell

    165. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:20 pm  

      If CBB sponsors Carphone Warehouse pull out, drinks are on me!

    166. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:20 pm  

      Heat magazine :)

    167. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:21 pm  

      #164

      Kismet, I think you’ve started an international incident. Remind me not to mock you ;)

    168. Leon — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:21 pm  

      Riots and demonstrations in India, Parliament involved, Gordon Brown makes a speech in India condemning this, Indian government involved.

      Bloody hell

      Yep the revolution has truly started…

    169. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:22 pm  

      Sahil - oh, thank god for that.

    170. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:23 pm  

      Um, I think it was Heat, or so I hope like you :(

    171. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:24 pm  

      Heat magazine is a highly regarded journal at my local hair salon.

    172. Kulvinder — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:24 pm  

      I wish i was an Endemol shareholder, bloody dutch; i hope the icecaps melt!

    173. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:25 pm  

      Heat magazine must be one of the most pernicious influences in contemporary society.

    174. Kulvinder — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:26 pm  

      Actually now theres an idea, lets just blame the dutch!

    175. El Cid — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:26 pm  

      where did you get your pert breasts?
      and why the obsession?

      so it’s used pejoratively by some, alright maybe it is. but let me start at the beginning, again: the word negro means black, in the same way that verde is green, and azul is blue, and blanco is white, and morado is purple, marron is brown, and rojo is red.

      i guess if you went up to a black man and said ‘oi black’ it would be perjorative, but if you said to that same black man, ‘did you see a black guy pass through here?’, he wouldn’t be bothered.

      sometimes when you bring things down to its most basic level, you get enlightenment. hummmmmmmmmmmmmmm

    176. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:27 pm  

      >> So negro is derogatory in Portuguese, but not in Brazilian Portuguese. Where did you pick up the lingo?

      Bert, are you joking? I think I’ve demonstrated that ‘negro’ is not derogatory. It simply means a black person. The paragraph you provided is dead-wrong, which is no wonder since it was written by a Brazilian.

    177. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:33 pm  

      >> Jade Goody on the telly as a role model, we put her there to point and laugh. Someone needs to explain this to India, and point out that the public are hardly behind the Goodys in this.

      Not sure this would help. I am quite sure that the demonstrators and rioters are not known for their sense of humour.

    178. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:34 pm  

      Ravi - I don’t speak Portuguese but speaking Spanish can usually read it. I’d translate ““Hoje, a palavra negro é considerada pejorativa em Portugal, onde se usa o termo “preto”, menos pejorativo.”

      as:

      “Today the word negro is considered derogatory in Portugal, where the use of the term preto is less derogatory”

      Where am I reading it wrong?

    179. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:36 pm  

      El Cid - that’s what I’m saying, as in English you can talk of a black man but would not address him as “hey black man”.

      The breasts are pert, but sadly aren’t mine. :(

      Are you in Spain/Spanish?

    180. El Cid — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:38 pm  

      i consider myself cockney spanish innit?

    181. El Cid — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:38 pm  

      maybe that should be ennit

    182. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:39 pm  

      You’re in London, I’m in Malaga?

      Bert 1 El Cid 0

    183. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:42 pm  

      >> Where am I reading it wrong?

      You read it correctly but it is dead-wrong. It was definitely written by a Brazillian who is completely clueless.

    184. El Cid — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:42 pm  

      that means that i am the one working!
      proceeds from your mercenary days? diamonds from sierra leone?

    185. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:43 pm  

      More a misunderstanding with HM customs. Ain’t life a bitch?

    186. Neel81 — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:47 pm  

      Post 138 put it very well,thisbehaviour has touched a raw nerve amongst 2nd and 3rd generation Asians here because it was precisely this sort of behaviour that I know i encountered (much worse in fact, extending to physical violence) in the school playground.

      Shilpa was very thick though in coming on this show,especially considering she hadn’t watched it ever before or knew the type of ‘celebrities’ that appear on it.

    187. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 3:51 pm  

      Ravi - looks like you got me there. Damn that wikipedia, you ought to go and correct it.

    188. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:05 pm  

      Leon, JUST HUG ME will ya?

    189. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:12 pm  

      >> Ravi - looks like you got me there. Damn that wikipedia, you ought to go and correct it.

      Thanks Bert. Do you also need a hug, or are we ok? :)

    190. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:16 pm  

      hugging > mugging. Lets save the world.

      Though I still suspect you doctored both wiki pages in an elaborate plan to catch me out. :D

    191. El Cid — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:17 pm  

      :(

    192. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:23 pm  

      All of you metrosexuals all hugging each other, BAH!!!

    193. Ravi Naik — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:25 pm  

      >> Though I still suspect you doctored both wiki pages in an elaborate plan to catch me out.

      You are overestimating me. I am too lazy to execute such elaborate schemes. ;)

    194. ZinZin — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:30 pm  

      “Whats far more interesting to me - and im going to touch a massive raw nerve here - is that its occuring mainly amongst the women. I don’t want this to come out as some sort of anti-feminist rant because its not, but in my experience ive mostly seen the ‘gang up’ type bullying occur amongst women. I generally tend to get on with almost all men i meet even if we have drastically different political beliefs. Given the choice id rather be in a BB type scenario as a male and with Nick Griffin and other supporters of the BNP as company than as a female with other females.”

      There was a seinfeld episode that brought up the differences between male and female bullying. Male bullying is wedgies. Female bullying is form a group, start bitching and make lots of snide remarks about victim until they develop an eating disorder. Men use there fists women use very sharp tongues. Thats why i hate women bosses.

      Anas
      Don’t feel down because of what some gobshites did ten years ago I like you even if no else here does.

    195. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:32 pm  

      Aww, thanks, ZZ :) I like you too.

    196. Anas — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:35 pm  

      I like that on Jade’s wiki page she’s listed as a humanitarian. That’s one of the first things you think when you hear the name Jade Goody: what a great humanitarian!

    197. ZinZin — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:43 pm  

      Maybe they could put some of those dispatches imams in the CBB house.

    198. Bert Preast — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:47 pm  

      Police are to investigate threatening emails sent to some contestants.

      Can C4 be charged with wasting police time?

    199. bananabrain — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:51 pm  

      ravi,

      se os lusofones buscam uma frase definativamente não-pejorativa podem utilisar “gente de cor” (“coloured people”) - embora que aquí na inglaterra “coloured” nao dá certo. é claro?

      vamo’ lá, negão!

      i agree the attack on this henry webster thing is indeed much more serious than someone insulting an actress, even via racial abuse. unfortunately these so-called “celebs” are more guaranteed to bring in the viewers.

      that jade goody…is this what we spent billions of years evolving opposable thumbs for? i mean, i know we share 66% of our dna with bananas, but sometimes…

      b’shalom

      bananabrain

    200. Sid Love — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:53 pm  

      One of the contestants looks like Myra Hindley. Can you blame the threatening emails?

    201. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 4:56 pm  

      “All of you metrosexuals all hugging each other, BAH!!!”

      He still hasn’t hugged me though :(

    202. Sahil — on 17th January, 2007 at 6:29 pm  

      Hug from me :D

    203. ZinZin — on 17th January, 2007 at 6:31 pm  

      This thread is turning into an episode of friends.

    204. Kismet Hardy — on 17th January, 2007 at 6:32 pm  

      Where no one knows your name

      Cheers!

    205. Ravi Naik — on 18th January, 2007 at 2:01 am  

      >>> se os lusofones buscam uma frase definativamente não-pejorativa podem utilisar “gente de cor” (”coloured people”) - embora que aquí na inglaterra “coloured” nao dá certo. é claro?

      If the term “coloured” is not appropriate in the UK, why would it be appropriate elsewhere?

    206. mags — on 18th January, 2007 at 1:27 pm  

      i think what jade, danelle and joe are doing to shilpa is wrong and those 3 girls should be kicked of the show compleatly. the 3 girls should be made to make a formal appology on the news to shilpa.i hope shilpa has got the willpower to stick in there, it would be great if shilpa or jamaine or ian (h ) to win .the other 3 dont deserve to win neither does jack as he is just as bad as the girls

    207. namitabh bachchan — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:39 am  

      I’m too lazy to read through all of the comments above (no offence!), but something that I found interesting was the reaction in India to CBB. Not to generalise too much, but it takes an awful lot for brown folks to rally to the point of burning effigies against our former white colonisers (anyone else seeing the symbolic colonisation of India through CBB?).

      I think it’s pretty awesome that the public can now see that the days of referring to Indians as “darkies,” “nautch girls,” “sammies,” etc are still with us. The racism has changed from being the direct, gender-neutral variety to gendered racism, which IMHO is even more insidious and invasive.

      The thing that separates Britain from most other parts of the world is that there has been no real civil rights movement. As a result, it turns out that British society hasn’t changed in the last 350 years. That’s the real shame.

    208. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 11:50 am  

      The thing that separates Britain from most other parts of the world is that there has been no real civil rights movement. As a result, it turns out that British society hasn’t changed in the last 350 years. That’s the real shame.

      In spite of which Britian remains the least racist Western European country. Stop talking out of your arse Bachchan.

    209. Leon — on 5th February, 2007 at 11:53 am  

      Shameless Shilpa:

      She has “ditched” two Asian agents who propelled her to fame, instead hiring two white British agents in their places: “publicist” Max Clifford and “libel law” firm Carter-Ruck. According to reports in India, Jazz (originally Jasveer) Barton, a UK-based scouting agent and Bobby Khan who is co-ordinator for Endemol in India, conducted tough negotiations to secure Shilpa Shetty a place on the show, but have not received a dime in commissions nor a word of thanks from the “Bollywood” star. Link

    210. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 11:55 am  

      Good for her.

    211. Chairwoman — on 5th February, 2007 at 12:13 pm  

      Good for her? MAX CLIFFORD?

    212. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 12:24 pm  

      She’s simply increasing her earnings potential. Whats wrong with that?

      And besides…

      Rule No 1: All agents in any industry are scum.

    213. Leon — on 5th February, 2007 at 1:13 pm  

      She’s simply increasing her earnings potential. Whats wrong with that?

      Oh don’t get me wrong I just like to see the myth of Saint Shilpa (and any sanctimonious celeb) ended. I knew she was little but a money grabber willing to exploit all who swooned over her from the outset…

    214. Sahil — on 5th February, 2007 at 1:20 pm  

      HOOOHOOO Leon ;)

    215. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 2:00 pm  

      One man’s idea of a good businesswoman is another man’s ‘little money grabber’, obviously.

    216. namitabh bachchan — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:15 pm  

      sid, out of curiosity, where are you living? try travelling up to yorkshire and existing as an integrated brown individual, and then tell me that britain is the least racist country in western europe.

      by the way, britain — its current politics, the businesses that are rooting themselves in its cities -are hardly western european. if nothing, britain is leaning toward an american slant in societal undertakings.

      just try to remember that your experiences in britain may not be what many, many people living outside of the south go through on a daily basis.

      i am writing this after living in britain AND in western europe AND in the united states.

    217. Leon — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:44 pm  

      One man’s idea of a good businesswoman is another man’s ‘little money grabber’, obviously.

      Hmmm little bit snidey but I take your point. I guess there’s nothing wrong with exploiting people’s sympathy and patriotism if it earns you a huge wad of cash…

      Anyway, I reckon we’ll hear more about Saint Shilpa in the coming months/years that will further dispell her (I’ve already heard feint rumours of her supposed racist remarks about Africans…) reputation.

      I welcome the deconstruction, as I do with all celebs who patently think to much of themselves.

    218. Jagdeep — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:48 pm  

      Really Leon, what are those feint rumours?

    219. Leon — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:51 pm  

      I’ll have to check it was a couple of weeks ago (and a great deal has happened in between) so I hold my hands up and say I could be remembering wrongly. I think it was an article somewhere…will dig about and get back to you.

    220. Jagdeep — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:52 pm  

      I knew she was little but a money grabber willing to exploit all who swooned over her from the outset…

      Wow Leon! She really gets on your tits. I think she’s quite charming and lovely. At the most she comes across as a rather sheltered and slightly pompous lady, in the way that some middle class Indians are very posh. But I can’t imagine why she agitates you so much. Weird.

      Good luck to her! Make your money and enjoy Shilpa.

    221. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 5:57 pm  

      Leon

      One of these days, you should come clean about your feelings towards Shilpa or what you feel she stands for for you. If memory serves, you seemed to have some antipathy towards her, as opposed to other celebs on CBB, way before the racism rows began.

      If she has managed to ameliorate her bank balance because of the rank stupidity of the other CBB celebs, then that shouldn’t be counted against her since thats exactly why they go on the show.

      This is the nature of celebrityhood in the modern world. Don’t be hatin’ the playa.

    222. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:00 pm  

      I think it’s pretty awesome that the public can now see that the days of referring to Indians as “darkies,” “nautch girls,” “sammies,” etc are still with us. The racism has changed from being the direct, gender-neutral variety to gendered racism, which IMHO is even more insidious and invasive.

      In all my years, I have never ever heard Brits refer to Indians as “nautch girls” or “sammies”. If anything, thats how upper class Indian toffs refer to their own underclass. Have you created a version of Britain from a reading of Rudyard Kipling alone?

      i am writing this after living in Yorkshire AND Liverpool and London AND western europe. And I can tell you, Holland, Denmark and Germany are still far more racist societies than exist in the UK.

    223. Jagdeep — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:04 pm  

      Sid, I’m sure that you will recognise people like Shilpa in your extended family. Educated Indian women from middle class families, very articulate and elegant, who can come across as slightly snobby because of the way they speak. I meet women like her when I go to India all the time, she reminds me of a couple of cousin-sisters of mine in Chandigarh, they speak, walk and think like her. When they come to visit England the first thing they do is go to Harrods and Kensington to buy the most fashionable items. I think people read them as being snobbish or malicious because they are not used to people being particular about manners and stuff. I can recognise why some people get rubbed up the wrong way because they are conditioned to despise posh people and privelige, no matter how down to earth that person may actually be.

    224. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:15 pm  

      Actually I don’t have to go very far in my family to recognise people like Shilpa. It was a British comprehensive school education that spared me from that fate. ;-)

    225. Jagdeep — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:18 pm  

      Sid, this guy is basically being nationalistic, England sucks! USA RULES MAN!

      That kind of thing. First of all, saying the UK has had no ‘civil rights movement’, when since the 1970′s a mass movement of anti-racists combined to decimate the far right and take the streets back from racists, and the British Parliament passed legislation outlawing racial discrimination and the general activism that has transformed British society and workplaces in the last 30 years shows he literally doesnt know what he is chatting about. But the other dice he throws is just as ridiculous — that there are no issues around race, no racist violence in America, as compared to the UK, which as we know, is pure bullshit. Maybe it’s got something to do with the model minority myth so many Indo-Americans are up their own arse about. But even then, saying that Asians don’t face discrimination, ignorance about their culture, and discrimination in America is equally fatuous.

    226. Jagdeep — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:22 pm  

      Yeah right, Indians are called ‘nautch girls’! That;s hilarious.

    227. Don — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:26 pm  

      Nautch girls? Well, Harry Flashman does mention them rather a lot, but I suspect you’ld get a blank look from 90% of the population.

    228. Sid Love — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:31 pm  

      Yes exactly. Straight out of Hobson-Jobson.

      “By jove, those nautch-girls look rather tasty. Fancy a dekko Pilkington?”

    229. Don — on 5th February, 2007 at 6:42 pm  

      ‘ British society hasn’t changed in the last 350 years.’

      Since the Protectorate?

      By the way, I see it’s 250 years since the Battle of Plassey. Anyone know if commemorative events are planned? A couple of years ago they really pushed the boat out on Trafalgar.

    230. El Cid — on 5th February, 2007 at 8:11 pm  

      350 years?
      he’s serious as well.
      sounds like one of dem care in the community cases

    231. El Cid — on 5th February, 2007 at 11:13 pm  

      Amazon are already jumping on the Shilpa bandwagon:
      http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=amb_link_38685465_2/203-7634013-5509516?ie=UTF8&search-alias=toys-uk&field-keywords=Bollywood

    232. Leon — on 6th February, 2007 at 10:17 am  

      you should come clean about your feelings towards Shilpa or what you feel she stands for for you.

      I thought I already did so I’m at a loss as to what you’re implying…

      I guess at it’s heart it’s the same view I take of the whole Diana worship thing (man, the heated arguments I got into over pointing out that she was no saint!).

      Seems to me when people lose their sensibilities over a celebrity reason has little use in the conversation.

      Anyone getting back to my original point about the substance of the ‘outrage’ over her treatment on CBB a question: Why over 40,000 complaints over that but little over 400 over Shipwrecked (when the racism there was far more explicit)?

    233. Sahil — on 6th February, 2007 at 10:31 am  

      “Anyone getting back to my original point about the substance of the ‘outrage’ over her treatment on CBB a question: Why over 40,000 complaints over that but little over 400 over Shipwrecked (when the racism there was far more explicit)?”

      I wondered about that as well. That girl is clearly out of her mind. Maybe she wasn’t chavy enough, or I think Channel 4 had said that she changed her views as she realised how ignorant she was. Or maybe people just didn’t care. I don’t know, take your pick.

    234. Sid Love — on 6th February, 2007 at 10:33 am  

      Well, I’m saying that if a celebrity shuffles her agents around and gets Max Clifford to represent her instead of some other schmoe in order to open more doors and make more money, why does that make him/her evil incarnate, irrespective of whether the celeb in question is Shilpa Shetty or not?

      Also, why do you presume that the all 40,000 of those complaints were to do with racism? I complained because I thought it was bullying and victimisation. Are you privy to the content of all those complaints?

      And finally, only 400 complained about the palpable racism on Shipwrecked as opposed to 40,000 for CBB. But why is that the fault of the complainants of CBB?

      Reason certainly has gone out the window.

    235. Leon — on 6th February, 2007 at 10:49 am  

      Sid, I’m not saying it is the fault of the complainers. Just asking a question. As for the reason, no, obviously I never saw all 40k complaints but would bet that a high proportion was related the racism. Isn’t the media shitstorm angle obvious in all this?

      Reason certainly has gone out the window.

      Right. Fine. Because I’ve actually got a great deal of respect for you, I don’t want to rise to cheap crap like this so I’ll leave it.

      Forget I mentioned it; this bollox really aint worth getting petty over.

    236. Sid Love — on 6th February, 2007 at 11:08 am  

      Hey big guy, you can offer me out and kick the crap out of me when we meet on Saturday for tea and cake, but in the meantime, here’s an olive branch.

    237. Leon — on 6th February, 2007 at 11:27 am  

      *takes olive branch*:)

    238. namitabh bachchan — on 6th February, 2007 at 4:16 pm  

      i’m not stating that there is no racial discrimination in the US — there is plenty of it especially where i live — but we don’t see the rhetoric of we need to hold hands and sing songs to combat multiculturism plaguing our national newspapers everyday.

      my points about civil rights is that despite the best intentions of parliament, institutional racism still exists. who has been the gandhi/mlk jr figure in britain? civil rights movements allow public spaces for historically marginalised folks to enter — for example, in America, hiring practises in the academy are less racist than in the UK (something that even white British scholars I have conversed with have confirmed. civil rights have put minorities into positions of political power, and have created opportunities for other changes -like in urban planning to combat racial segregation (again, not perfect)- to take place.

      and with all due respect, gentlemen, i am female, and therefore have experienced the nuance of gendered racism (thus the nautch girl reference i made), something i sincerely hope you don’t deal with on a regular basis.

      my personal interactions that inform my opinions have been primarily with middle-aged white British men; that possibly also has something to do with it.

      there is a flip side to this — in the asian community in the US, we still suffer from the identity politics of the past. hindu-muslim-sikh-geographic-linguistic relations in the US are tenuous among the middle-aged, whereas in the UK i found the same generation of asians to more readily associate and provide support for each other, particularly in yorkshire where asians are most definitely suffering from the repercussions of 7/7.

      this isn’t a matter of the uk being better or worse than the us — i appreciate many things about british society, like the comparatively more progressive attitude toward environmental issues, but in my humble opinion and given my own experiences, the racial and religious backlash in northern England specifically was enough to outweigh the green movement.

      i’m not looking for you to agree with me, but i believe it is difficult to argue against the fact that postcolonial sentiments do not contribute at least in part to the comments made to Shilpa Shetty.

      jagdeep, i don’t believe i ever mentioned anything remotely insinuating that ‘the american way’ is the way of the world — simply a comment supporting civil rights movements. britain and america have similar political trajectories currently, and they both suffer from the same social problems to different degrees. i think you would be surprised to live in a part of the US that isn’t NYC or DC, just as I was surprised/shocked/appalled to live in a part of England that isn’t London.

      that is my olive branch.

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