The BNP and the Killer Question


by Jai
9th April, 2010 at 12:47 pm    

During Nick Griffin’s appearance on the BBC’s “Question Time” in October 2009, he directly confirmed that one of the BNP’s main goals upon achieving power is still to reduce Britain’s non-white population from 10% to 1%. This is despite the fact that, a few months earlier, he had stated that he was abandoning the proposed repatriation policy because “nobody wants it or wants to pay for it”.

Griffin recently reiterated the BNP’s “voluntary repatriation” plans (apparently now expanded to include people originally from mainland Europe) in a lengthy interview with Iain Dale published online by Total Politics, as follows:

In your 2005 manifesto you said: “We will end immigration to the UK and reduce our land’s population burden by creating firm but voluntary incentives for immigrants and their descendants to return home.” What does “firm” mean and what does “home” mean, because they are quite difficult to define?

Firm would mean that certainly in the case of serious criminals and illegals and people whose right to work was removed. For instance, when we left the European Union, there wouldn’t be a choice about it. They would have to go.

Where?

If we are talking about the Eastern Europeans, who have got the right to come here, it is obvious where home is. With most people, it is clear where they have come from. If people have entered this country and torn their documents up, then even if they have been granted asylum, they shouldn’t have been, and we would reverse that.

But if you don’t know where they have come from, you can’t return them there.

If you want to, you can virtually find out which village they come from in Africa with DNA tests. Someone has got to take them. But their presence here isn’t fair. And it is not legal.

Just because you want to send them somewhere, doesn’t mean that the state you want to send them to has to accept them. What do you do if they say no?

Well… we’ll find some silly European liberal state which will happily take them. Someone will take them.

You reckon?

Yes, someone will take them.

“Firm but voluntary incentives for immigrants and their descendants to return home…” Is that policy still your policy now?

Yes, broadly so. Let’s reword the bit in the case of ones who have no right to be here. It would be firm. It wouldn’t be brutal, it would be firm. In the case of people who have come here legally, who are integrated into our society, we would say: “Look it is on the table. If you want to take it, you can take it.”

This is despite the fact that the proposed “voluntary repatriation” policy is actually financially inviable, even if cash was diverted from foreign aid budgets or there were attempts to raise it via taxation; for example, the amount of money potentially required to cover 6 million people (the number of non-white British citizens) is truly astronomical. Even a relatively modest £5000 per person would require a total budget of £30,000,000,000. A larger repatriation “incentive” such as £50,000 per person would require a total budget of £300,000,000,000. And, of course, the choice of people taking up the offer is allegedly “voluntary”.

Nevertheless, Griffin has directly confirmed that the intention is still to eliminate the presence of 90% of the non-white citizens of Britain. Therefore, this raises the question of exactly how a BNP government would achieve a population reduction on that scale.

In fact, this question was formally posed to the BNP’s Legal Director a few months ago here on Pickled Politics, after he had expressed a willingness to openly debate BNP policies :

have the guts to undertake a real debate with people in the BNP….then give me a call.

I will debate with you anytime, anywhere.

….muzzle free speech.

Fine. I’m removing all alleged “free speech restrictions”; therefore, providing a detailed and comprehensive answer in writing and on the record to the following straightforward question should not be an issue:

Exactly how would a BNP government reduce Britain’s non-white population from 10% to 1% — confirmed as one of the BNP’s continuing aims by Nick Griffin directly on the BBC’s “Question Time” in October 2009 — considering that Nick Griffin also confirmed during the latter half of 2009 that the BNP is now formally abandoning its proposed “voluntary repatriation” policy ?

Since “free speech muzzles” do not apply in this case, for the benefit of the public the maximum amount of detail possible should be provided in relation to the specific procedures and actions involved in the planned BNP population reduction programme.

The response should be restricted to the specific question asked and should also be accompanied by written confirmation that the contents have been formally authorised by the BNP’s senior leadership, are on the record, and are an accurate representation of the specific measures a BNP government would implement in order to achieve the aforementioned population reduction upon winning a national General Election in the United Kingdom.

Finally, the response should be copied in full & verbatim in an email from a verifiable BNP email account to this website’s editorial team via both of the contact forms displayed here: http://www.pickledpolitics.com/contact in order to provide an authenticated electronic record of the contents along with electronic confirmation that the author is indeed who they claim to be and has been formally authorised to speak for & represent the BNP in this matter.

Absolutely no details have been forthcoming. The silence is deafening.

This very simple question, focusing on one of the BNP’s major policies, and presented to a self-proclaimed legal & democratic political party which is campaigning in the General Election, is not posed solely to the BNP’s legal director but to any member of the BNP’s senior leadership.

Assuming that the BNP has nothing to hide about exactly how they plan to achieve a population reduction of that magnitude, of course.


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485 Comments below   |  

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  1. pickles

    Blog post:: The BNP and the Killer Question http://bit.ly/b7jePV


  2. Noxi

    RT @pickledpolitics: Blog post:: The BNP and the Killer Question http://bit.ly/b7jePV british national party nick griffin


  3. Owen Blacker

    RT @pickledpolitics The BNP and the Killer Question http://bit.ly/bEcHuW


  4. Adam Rutherford

    The BNP will have "firm" policies to return me to my homeland. http://bit.ly/bF5FYd
    I AM NEVER GOING BACK TO IPSWICH. HT @pickledpolitics


  5. Martin Firrell

    Genius @AdamRutherford

    The BNP to have "firm" policies to return me to my homeland. http://bit.ly/bF5FYd I AM NEVER GOING BACK TO IPSWICH


  6. Debs

    RT @AdamRutherford: The BNP will have "firm" policies to return me to my homeland. http://bit.ly/bF5FYd
    I AM NEVER GOING BACK TO IPSWICH. HT @pickledpolitics




  1. boyo — on 9th April, 2010 at 1:32 pm  

    Point taken, but it’s hardly a scoop the BNP is racist is it. They may be a convenient bogeyman but they won’t get one single seat at the next election, while for years it’s worth remembering that convicted terrorists and their supporters have been regularly returned (if not attended) Westminster.

    I don’t think I’ve read a serious post here or on HP discussing the general election. You’re both supposed to be progressive left-aligned sites but have you submerged so far into your own navel you can’t see out for the fluff?

    Or is the left now completely incapable of opining about anything other than the peripheral?

  2. douglas clark — on 9th April, 2010 at 1:39 pm  

    Jai,

    Well said.

    You should try to get this out to a wider audience.

  3. cjcjc — on 9th April, 2010 at 1:45 pm  

    How many people vote BNP because they want them to form the next government?

    I can’t believe that number is more than 1,000.

    They vote for the BNP not because they want anyone thrown out, they just don’t want more people coming in.

    The BNP are a lightning rod; nothing more, nothing less. “Exposing” their lunatic “policies” will have no effect on anything.

  4. Mr Eugenides — on 9th April, 2010 at 2:06 pm  

    Eh? Not sure about that, cjcjc. I’d be willing to bet there’s a whole lot more than a thousand people in the country who would like to see certain groups repatriated.

    The BNP’s policy comes close to the definition of ethnic cleansing, which the UN defines as “rendering an area ethnically homogeneous by using force or intimidation to remove from a given area persons of another ethnic or religious group”.

    There’s a case for arguing that it would be illegal under international law, depending on the degree of intimidation that might be used – but I slept through too many law lectures to be confident of making it myself.

  5. Mangles — on 9th April, 2010 at 3:13 pm  

    Jai good post, I’m-a-liking-da-figures.

    If we stay put do you think they’ll offer more? I mean lets say they offer upto £100,000 each and with the extended family an’all, (about 67 altogether- so far with last months addition, two more expected in the summer!?!) we could live like kings and queens back in Punjab!

    Mr Eugenides – can you please hold that thought, let us take the money and then sue the b******s -I have the number for Claim Time Solicitors if anybody wants it. Please don’t be a spoilsport till then Mr Eugenides, lol.

    Here’s the strategy peeps – when we come back we can vote em back in and take another lakh or two, you follow? Whos with me on this one? We’re all winners, we all go away happy, and the BNP and their supporters get their country back.

    Though Britian could be bankrupt, the BNP will ensure that there are plenty of jobs, cos the country won’t be able to afford imports, not even to pay for foreign electricity and gas. So there’ll be plenty of MANUAL labour to go around just the sort of jobs their supporters are best at. We could help, out of loyalty to the Queen (mainly to the Duke of Edinburgh really – cos he is one us immigrants too) by exporting the produce to Punjab, the Carribbean, Africa etc, after all who’s gonna want to work there with all that money?

    I know who I’m voting for next month. I’ve even got a moto:
    ‘Vote for BNP.
    If you’re black, there’s no going back …
    . . .to work’

    Happy days!

    Rab rakha!

  6. Lee John Barnes — on 9th April, 2010 at 5:20 pm  

    Hey Numbnuts,

    How about emailing the question to me first, you moron.

    I have NEVER been sent a copy of any questions, and if sent to my e mail I will answer them.

    Jeez lads, giving it large is one thing, but fuck me at least show a bit of integrity by sending me the e mails before you state that I didnt answer them !

    Send it – I will answer.

    Just dont put my e mail address online as I get enough spam from viagra companies and Nigerian fraudsters thanks,

    Lee

  7. Mangles — on 9th April, 2010 at 5:25 pm  

    LJR
    - viagra is that medicinal?
    - Nigerian fraudsters – are these official BNP networking arrangements?
    - Question – i think its posted above and on the last topic you commented on; you can read cant you, or are you blaming New Labour for your low education standards?

    Rab rakha! (God bless for those who dont speak the Queens Punjabi)

  8. Lee John Barnes — on 9th April, 2010 at 5:38 pm  

    Hey Numbnuts, and Mangles your bitch,

    I dont answer stupid questions on stupid websites like this one.

    You want an answer then e mail me.

    Now get typing or just shut the fuck up whining.

    If I get an e mail then I will answer it.

    Cyssan Min Ears

    ( Thats Anglo-Saxon for ‘Kiss My Arse’ you fuckwit )

  9. George — on 9th April, 2010 at 5:41 pm  

    Mangles & John Barnes are engaged in quite an illuminating exchange. Keep it going.

  10. Ravi Naik — on 9th April, 2010 at 5:42 pm  

    The BNP are a lightning rod; nothing more, nothing less. “Exposing” their lunatic “policies” will have no effect on anything.

    It should have an effect on British non-whites, to go out and vote rather than to stay at home.

  11. Abu Faris — on 9th April, 2010 at 5:43 pm  

    LJB

    Actually it isn’t the Anglo-Saxon for anything, you brain-dead illiterate twit. Apart from anything else, the wanted language is Old English, not Anglo-Saxon.

    Nazi moron.

  12. Mangles — on 9th April, 2010 at 6:04 pm  

    LJR your a bit touchy this morning, not had your dose since last night?

    Just answer the questions – like I said read them above.

    BTW is that what the Viagra is for – your Numbnuts?

    Cyssan Min Ears 2u2 (Don’t know where yours has been or had but mines been sanitised in the traditional Punjabi way!)

  13. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 6:07 pm  

    The legislative framework for voluntary repatriation has existed since the 1971 Immigration Act and is still in place today. This is what provides the legal underpinning for the ‘Assisted Voluntary Returns’ scheme under which failed asylum seekers and foreign criminals are bribed to go away.

    The only thing that the BNP would need to do is decide on the size of the bribe that will be necessary to entice others to leave.

    One other aspect of such a scheme is that it is at least partly financing. Considering how much it costs the state for an immigrant family with income support, housing benefit, family allowance as well as the cost of educating multiple children the BNP could be on to a winner.

  14. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 6:12 pm  

    Apart from anything else, the wanted language is Old English, not Anglo-Saxon.

    Shouldn’t that be ‘Ye olde English’?

    I’m not sure if it’s worth trying with Mr. LLB.

    From my prior experience, when confronted with slightly challenging questions he starts ranting, making quasi-veiled threats about what whites will do when they have shaken off the yolk of multiculturism, and then disappears for a bit.

    Suffice to say, he’s no fun at all.

  15. Mangles — on 9th April, 2010 at 6:17 pm  

    He’s no fun then Dalbir veera, damn I was quite looking forward to a burning cross being planted in my back garden tonight.

    Its just the right weather for that traditional English cuisine BBQ (spelt barbecue everywhere else in the world – bloody foreigners) but I have no lighter fuel or charcoal to get it going.

    Rab rakha!

  16. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 7:02 pm  

    Mangles

    Spring is upon us and everywhere peoples’ hearts and souls bloom and blossom like the flowers around them. Only the BNP types (and their equivalents) wallow in their dank misery, poor bastards.

    They blatantly bring home the importance of chardhi kala, even in the grimest of times. These twats have things that others in the world can only dream of and look at how depressed and upset they have made themselves……

    How weird is that??

  17. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 7:13 pm  

    Do others in the world dream of ethnic displacement from their ancestral homeland and become filled with the joys of spring at the prospect?

  18. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 7:22 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    As someone from a community who has experienced just that, I can say we generally take on the challenge a lot more stoically than the people you’re defending.

    No offence, but at times it seems like the English have turned into whining pussies. Your ancestors changed the world but some of you shit yourselves at the change on your own doorsteps. Get a grip.

  19. Roger — on 9th April, 2010 at 7:25 pm  

    “Exactly how would a BNP government reduce Britain’s non-white population from 10% to 1%?”

    Exactly how would a BNP government increase Britain’s non-white population to 10% in the first place?

  20. Ravi Naik — on 9th April, 2010 at 7:29 pm  

    Exactly how would a BNP government increase Britain’s non-white population to 10% in the first place?

    Simple: a BNP government would inevitably lead to massive migration of its (middle-class) white population out of the country.

  21. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 7:39 pm  

    The community that Dalbir refers to is no doubt the Punjabi. What happened in the aftermath of independence is of course deplorable but I fail to see what relevance it has for the deomographic transformation which is currently underway in Britain.

    The non-European population in Britain has exploded from effectively zero to 8 million in little more than two generations. Large sections of our major conurbations are, if not ‘no go’, then certainly ‘don’t want to go’ areas for most members of the indigenous population. 23% of children in primary school are of BME origin or ancestry and around 25% of births are to non-white mothers (rising to 50% in London). Assuming no change in migration policy in the next few years, the BME population will rise to around 22 million in less than two generations.

    Such a demographic transformation is unprecedented in this islands.

    Please explain why we should not be ‘whining’ about it? It is the equivalent of India taking in 400 plus million Africans or Chinese. It is hard to imagine them being as sanguine about that as you seem to think we should be. In fact, aren’t the Indians in the process of building an Israeli-style fence specifically to keep out unwanted migrants?

  22. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 8:13 pm  

    The community that Dalbir refers to is no doubt the Punjabi. What happened in the aftermath of independence is of course deplorable but I fail to see what relevance it has for the deomographic transformation which is currently underway in Britain.

    It has every relevance. It’s only when people push this bullshit notion of some sort of constant ‘ethnic continuum’ in nations that BNP type arguments start propping up. Change happens, face it!

    The non-European population in Britain has exploded from effectively zero to 8 million in little more than two generations. Large sections of our major conurbations are, if not ‘no go’, then certainly ‘don’t want to go’ areas for most members of the indigenous population.

    And there aren’t horrible white ‘no go’ areas for nonwhites in the UK where the chances of being attacked and racially abused are high? I live in a very nonwhite area (now), still a white person can safely walk around here, as many do. They won’t get attacked for their colour.

    23% of children in primary school are of BME origin or ancestry and around 25% of births are to non-white mothers (rising to 50% in London). Assuming no change in migration policy in the next few years, the BME population will rise to around 22 million in less than two generations.

    As an ex-teacher, and a ‘BME’ I’d say WWC society could actually learn a lesson or two from some ethnics in terms of education. The fact that certain ethnic groups perform much better than the indigenous pisses all over the argument that whites are held back by being educated with nonwhites. Some nonwhite students can actually be great role models (in terms of education), for whites believe it or not.

    Such a demographic transformation is unprecedented in this islands.

    That doesn’t mean it’s a cue to pebble dash your fucking pants. Your only real problem I think you probably have is a patent dislike of nonwhites. Give it enough time and I’m sure many differences between groups will decrease. But you’re probably shiteing your pants at this prospect also aren’t you?

    Please explain why we should not be ‘whining’ about it?

    You shouldn’t be whining about it because it is a normal occurrence! Populations have shifted and moved and integrated since time immemorial. Use your head and break down the components of the word Anglo-Saxon if you need further evidence.

    Nations have changed for better or worse, look at America, Australia, New Zealand, the West Indies, Mauritius, Surinam, Panjab, Canada…..the list is endless.

    What is most ironic about this is that this change has largely been brought about by white people. It’s too late to cry about it now. Face it like a man!

    A bit of mix up might even make this place a bit more interesting in future.

  23. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 8:31 pm  

    You shouldn’t be whining about it because it is a normal occurrence! Populations have shifted and moved and integrated since time immemorial. Use your head and break down the components of the word Anglo-Saxon if you need further evidence.

    I don’t need any primer on the population genetics or the history of the British Isles from you, thank you very motion.

    The mantra “We’re a nation of immigrants, so get over it – Come one, come all” is simple propaganda from the charlatans of the immigration industry, its unwitting accomplices and axe-grinders like yourself. You want it to be true because you feel it justifies your collective presence here.

    Well, it isn’t true, it is a complete fabrication. Prior to the current Afro-Asian tsunami the last significant wave of migration into the British Isles – and to last to have left any genetic imprint – was that from Scandinavia in the 8th and 9th centuries.

    That is why I say that what is happening now is unprecedented. we have not actually experienced demographic change on this scale since the Neolithic.

    And the weird thing is that nobody in authority can tell why it is happening, let alone what is so wicked about wanting to reverse it.

  24. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 8:43 pm  

    And the weird thing is that nobody in authority can tell why it is happening, let alone what is so wicked about wanting to reverse it.

    Before you jump on that wagon. How comes none of you whiteist types ever talks about what has happened to the natives of the West Indies, Canada, Australia, etc. etc. at the hands of your ‘own people’?

    If you want to reverse what has happened here, should not all descendants of Anglos in those places ‘fuck off home’ as well. Including those ‘British bastards’ recently shipped over there en masse?

    I don’t need any primer on the population genetics or the history of the British Isles from you, thank you very motion.

    The mantra “We’re a nation of immigrants, so get over it – Come one, come all” is simple propaganda from the charlatans of the immigration industry, its unwitting accomplices and axe-grinders like yourself. You want it to be true because you feel it justifies your collective presence here.

    I’m a conscious Sikh man. You’re going to have serious difficulties peddling that weak victim shite in my direction. I know what your people did last summer. We belong here more than the English.

  25. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 9:04 pm  

    The ‘You were there so now we’re here’ is a common refrain, one often deployed by neo-colonialists to justify their presence. But why not pursue it to its logical conclusion, and have everyone return to their starting points on some arbitrary date. Let’s say 1 AD.

    At that point we’d have most of the population of India packing its bags while most of the (native) British population stayed put. Just a silly analogy to demonstrate how brainless your notion really is.

    History is history and now is now.

    But talking about repatriation of Anglos, isn’t that what your countrymen insisted on on achieving independence? And I note you have refrained from comment on India’s current efforts to deter unwanted entrants along its eastern border. If it’s sauce for the goose, etc.

    We belong here more than the English …

    Ah, now we’re getting somewhere. How do you arrive at that particular conclusion Dalbir?

    PS please try to tone down the coprophilia if you wouldn’t mind, there’s a good chap.

  26. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 9:15 pm  

    Firstly, I don’t see myself as Indian so, you need to direct that question about the ‘Eastern border problem’ to someone else.

    But why not pursue it to its logical conclusion, and have everyone return to their starting points on some arbitrary date. Let’s say 1 AD.

    Or why not have like for like? Let us first drain this place of its wealth and then disarm its military. Then when it is teetering on the brink of a bloody civil war, based on stupid ideas we’ve planted here, scarper back home. Sounds about right, no?

    Anyway some of us have learnt to see through your forked tongue type propaganda Dan Dare. Frankly I’d give your opinions as much importance as you’d probably give those of a recently arrived African refugee.

  27. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 9:36 pm  

    Sounds about right, no?

    Actually, no. First thing is you have to introduce parliamentary democracy, train up a modern military, create a unified state with an independent judiciary and a functioning civil administration, create a western-style infrastructure with railways, roads, telegraph, radio, etc etc, and a secular educational system which promotes widespread use of English, outlaw barbaric medieval practices and superstitions such as suttee, then you scarper (or get asked to leave).

    And what have we received in exchange? According to Robin Cook, it’s a taste for chicken tikka masala, apart from of course the millions of incomers such as your goodself who have elected to favour us with their presence.

    Seems a bit asymmetrical to me.

    But, anyway, to return to the original theme, nobody seems to have questioned the proposition made earlier that the BNP’s ‘Homeward Bound’ scheme might be at least partially self-funding. Why the focus simply on the cost and not the benefits, one wonders.

  28. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 9:55 pm  

    Actually, no. First thing is you have to introduce parliamentary democracy,

    You mean introduce a governing system totally unsuitable for the people. Like people are doing in Iraq/Afghanistan as we speak?

    train up a modern military,

    Had one already, read up about the Anglo-Sikh wars, Maharajah Ranjit Singh.

    create a unified state with an independent judiciary and a functioning civil administration,

    That is totally unsuited to the people and don’t function.

    create a western-style infrastructure with railways

    Your lot only put these there so you could drain and transport the resources in a more efficient fashion.

    roads

    Yes, none existed before…….people never left their villages in fear of getting stuck in the mud.

    telegraph, radio, etc etc

    Have you seen a recent Bollywoood film? Your people should be slaughtered just for being the catalyst that led to creation of that shite.

    and a secular educational system which promotes widespread use of English

    Read this. The capital of Panjab had a better literacy rate than England.

    http://news.ukpha.org/2010/02/when-the-wild-proved-more-educated/

    outlaw barbaric medieval practices and superstitions such as suttee,

    Very uncommonly practised by Sikhs and then only by nonSikh wives. But then let’s not mention slavery, executions, indentured trading, sending young boys up chimneys and other barbaric practices of the Brits. Oh yes, and sending illegitimate children to Aus to be sexually abused and used as slaves.

    then you scarper (or get asked to leave).

    Basically, you have no point.

  29. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:09 pm  

    Does anyone else find the spectacle of an Indian immigrant to Britain decrying the British legacy in the Raj as even mildly ironic?

    It begs the obvious question, if what the British accomplished in India was so worthless what the fuck are you doing here where you’ll only experience more of the same with knobs on?

    And btw, your reference to ‘fork-tongued propaganda’ carries with it the implication that I am telling fibs. If that was your intention, then kindly point to an instance of such in this thread (or anywhere else, for that matter). If you are unable to do that, then at least behave British and withdraw the insinuation.

  30. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:18 pm  

    My forked tongue statement implied a predilection for distortion and lies from whiteist sources.

    I think you’ve proved it quite well.

    PS – I don’t really want to behave British, if you’re an example of what that means.

    Let’s give it a rest Mr. Dare. I imagine we’ll both soon tire of this.

  31. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:24 pm  

    My forked tongue statement implied a predilection for distortion and lies from whiteist sources.

    See, you’re at it again.

    Put up or shut up.

  32. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:24 pm  

    what the fuck are you doing here where you’ll only experience more of the same with knobs on?

    Some of us can give as good as we get. If you want to get cunty about it. Besides, we’re on to your shite like we haven’t been before.

    Just out of interest. Have you ever considered being nice or does that Bulldog spirit preclude that?

  33. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:26 pm  

    Put up or shut up.

    I choose….telling you to stick it up your Jacksy nazi boy.

    lol

  34. Shamit — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:39 pm  

    Dan –

    It would be foolish to say that there has not been any positive influence of British Raj on India. There has been plenty and some of them are still visible.

    And despite Dalbir’s point – I actually think a diverse nation such as India could only be governed by parliamentary democracy. And there are more areas where Brits have contributed to India. And India is probably the only real positive legacy of Britain Raj today.

    However, like positives there were many many negatives, which you fail to highlight and the unification of the country was partly due to the negative impact of the British rule. The torture, the killing, the raping and the looting and bankrupting an entire population and bringing famine just to highlight a few – the negative aspects of the British rule kind of forced the unification of the country. Unintended consequences old chap. But why are we discussing India.
    ***********************

    Like the author of this post, I was born and raised in Britain and this is my homeland too. And I also don’t like people living off the state – but before you go on ranting about how immigrant families need income support etc etc etc – let me educate you about Indian immigrants.

    Most Indian families who came here were professionals dude – they made more money most “indigenous” Brits and they contributed more than their fair share to the public purse. Further, many of them sent their kids to private schools and paid for their fees – so see your argument is a bit crap.

    Now, the question to you – do you think people who were born and raised here are immigrants or foreigners? Or are they only when they do not have white skin? Do you have a problem with Michael Howard or Michael Portillo – if not why should you have any problems with Britiah Asians or British Africans.

    I look forward to a response.

  35. Mangles — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:46 pm  

    Dan Dair v Dalbir Round 1: That was most entertaining, can we tune in again same time tomorrow?

    Dan you really dont understand how patronising you are when you suggest the British Raaj was some sort of Sunday afternoon charitable jaunt by the British do you? It was no more charitable than your illegal war in Iraq or refusal to intervene in preventing the holocaust until you had to wade into WW II.

    You fibbed your way in to India, and then Punjab and had no choice but to leave; as with Iraq and Afghanistan it was getting too costly and you really couldn’t afford to keep the troops thousands of miles away in case the Reds influenced an uprising at home.

    But… because you’d learned some etiquette through Punjabi hospitality, you had no choice but to invite us over for a cup of chaa. And you know what we enjoyed the hospitality so much, we thought we’d stay and rebuild your country for you as well as your economy. Looks like we’re gonna have to start all over again. Its a good job we’ve got all these Polish builders moving in isn’t it?

    Rab rakha!

  36. KJB — on 9th April, 2010 at 10:56 pm  

    The killer question I’d really like someone to tie Griffin up and make him answer is:

    ‘Mr. Griffin, why do you avow your racism and racist policies in one instance, and deny them the next?’

    Oh, and Dan Dare is a troll, people, who was recently banned from Liberal Conspiracy (aka Sunny’s full-time job ;-) ) for making a disgusting anti-Semitic comment. Engage away, but do be aware you are dealing with the merde de la merde (to coin a phrase) here.

  37. The Common Humanist — on 9th April, 2010 at 11:10 pm  

    Dalbir / Dan Dare

    Morons, only separated by skin colour. Like reading two sides of the same shit for brains coin. Still, keep thumping away Retards, all just theatre for us sane types.

    TCH

  38. Dalbir — on 9th April, 2010 at 11:19 pm  

    The Common Idiot

    Nope

    Your just incapable of taming your own dogs. Forcing some of us to do what you can’t.

  39. Dan Dare — on 9th April, 2010 at 11:31 pm  

    Yes it’s quite true that Sunny banned me from Liberal Conspiracy on the pretext of having made an anti-semitic remark.

    But the truth of the matter is that banning was because I ran rings round his Chief Immigration Enthusiast who has since declined to return to the debate he himself started.

    And yes, I’ve caught Sunny with his pants down on more than one occasion, for spouting nonsense like the bulk of UK migrants under NuLabor originated in the EU.

    I suspect I’ll get banned here too once he sees what’s going on.

  40. platinum786 — on 9th April, 2010 at 11:56 pm  

    Dan Dare, LJB, you both know us paki’s are only here to milk the system, get as much out of the free education and social benefits as we can. We earn all this money, send it back home, heck, even our charity ends up back home. We’re here to bleed you dry, reverse colonialism.

    The worst thing is there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. Your people are blind to the truth and don’t care about this so called identity. They’ll never vote you guys into power, not in time to stop it.

    In 20-30 years time, by the time you can even begin to dream of a few seats in parliament, there will be so many of us here, a third generation of yours will have grown up knowing us as common as muck, we’ll be part of the furniture, in your life times your cause will die it’s death.

    You know what the best bit is. When our own countries get better, like India is doing, when we have the skills and businesses and money and free education, the bright ones of us will move back, the asians who are an asset will be gone, we’ll simply replace them with other dumb village hicks, who’ll come in and sponge. 100 years time we’ll be gone, but by then we’ll have left you with a country without an identity, without talent etc. Whilst your kids go to uni to do art and drama, the asians are doing IT, medicine, pharmacy, engineering, accountacy, business studies, law, all the real subjects. What a shame eh.

    You know it, I know it, the silent majority don’t.

    So have I let the cat out of the bag, or am I just winding you up?

  41. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 12:27 am  

    The silent majority do know, that’s why they’ve stopped participating in elections.

    They know the BNP is correct, but they don’t see it as the answer. We could debate why, but that is the reality.

    The BNP is in truth a placeholder for something bigger yet to come, when things have got much, much worse.

    Cometh the hour, cometh the man. You’ll see. It’s happened before many times throughout history.

  42. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 12:30 am  

    @Shamit #40

    I don’t see it as a white vs non-white issue, but really a civilisational one. It’s the developed west, the Eurosphere if you like, versus the third world.

    It’s existential not racial.

  43. earwicga — on 10th April, 2010 at 12:32 am  

    Ha ha ha! So anyone who doesn’t vote is a secret BNP supporter. Very good, you’ve really amused me now with your analysis. Moron.

  44. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 12:42 am  

    It’s a ‘well known fact’ that the BNP’s policies are considerably more popular amongst the general public than the BNP itself. Surprised you didn’t know that Earwig.

  45. earwicga — on 10th April, 2010 at 12:48 am  

    Righto Donkey. Nice there in your head with the white rabbit and all?

  46. Don — on 10th April, 2010 at 1:10 am  

    something bigger yet to come, when things have got much, much worse.

    Cometh the hour, cometh the man. You’ll see. It’s happened before many times throughout history.

    Is there a sound track that goes with that?

  47. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 1:16 am  

    Land of Hope and Glory?

    Or maybe this one …

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uSGtRoEQYA

  48. Don — on 10th April, 2010 at 1:26 am  

    That was actually funny.

  49. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 2:49 am  

    I’m doing my bit for miscegenation – I’m White and my wife is Black and an Arab speaker.

    I wonder if Dan Dare (replete with his fantasies about the future reincarnation of Der Fuhrer – yes, sunbeam, some of us keep up with your twisted Black Sun Nazi mysticism) would like to say something offensive (whoever neatly packaged and veiled)?

    Oh go on, you fascist piece of excrement… I dare you, Dan.

  50. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 2:57 am  

    Check out:

    Black Sun: Aryan Cults, Esoteric Nazism and the Politics of Identity. New York: New York University Press, 2001

  51. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 4:25 am  

    Hey Abu, right on mate.

    It’s yer slippery slope innit.

    Look sideways at a Bosco and next thing we know the transports will be rolling again to the East.

    You fucking cretin. Was that veiled enough for you?

  52. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 4:39 am  

    Yep – I thought as much.

    Hello, Lee. How’s Odin?

  53. Dalbir — on 10th April, 2010 at 5:38 am  

    Abu

    Thanks for that! So that’s the bullshit behind their beliefs.

  54. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 6:01 am  

    I’m White and my wife is Black and an Arab speaker.

    Just another common or garden miscegenist then, and one so pussy-whipped that he has to affect a camel-jockey’s moniker rather than a real man’s Anglo-Saxon handle.

    But what else could be expected from such an axe-grinding special pleader? Wear a burka in sympathy do we?

    PS I am not LJB.

  55. Dalbir — on 10th April, 2010 at 6:22 am  

    I say Dan old boy. Is that Britishness you’re exibiting in the above post? Pray do tell. It’s rather splendid.

  56. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 6:54 am  

    No, Dalbir – it’s one of Lee John “I am Odin’s love-slave” Barnes’ sock-puppets (probably).

  57. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 7:01 am  

    In any case, he’s so dense (whoever he is) that he cannot even tell my kunya – nor presumably from it grasp that Faris is my son’s name. Yes, Lee – I have a BROWN BABY!!!!

    I am a RACE TRAITOR!!!!!

    And bloody proud of it too.

    See how easy it is to wind up the fash?

  58. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 7:04 am  

    Actually, the master plan is (and I’m whispering this to you conspiratorially, Dan, ‘cos I reckon you iz a genius who is already on to us camel jockeys) to outbreed you plucky Anglo-Saxons and convert your mighty soaring Gothic cathedrals into MOSQUES. Today Medina, tomorrow Bath and Wells…

    Muhahahahahahahaha!

  59. Dalbir — on 10th April, 2010 at 7:07 am  

    Is that Black Sun God stuff for real???

  60. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 7:17 am  

    Dalbir

    Worryingly, yes. The “New Order” – the follow-on organisation from Rockwell’s American Nazi Party are well into it. Esoteric, left-hand path magic was always a fixation of hardline Nazi fruitloops (along with genocide and war).

    Check out the ravings of Savitri Devi Mukherji (actually a French-Greek loony who thought Hitler was an avatar of Vishnu). Her ashes are stored by the above mentioned “New Order” in their New Berlin HQ. She was well into the whole “Black Sun” rubbish.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savitri_Devi

    I’m not going to link to her fan website. I don’t give the Nazis traffic.

  61. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 7:23 am  

    Personally, if I was a Hindu, I would be mortally offended by the idea that Vishnu should in any way be associated with an evil incarnate such as Hitler: how one could associate Lakshmi in consort with Hitler is beyond me, or Hitler in avatar as Rama, or Krishna, for that matter.

  62. Dalbir — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:01 am  

    Eye opening Abu, fucking eye opening.

  63. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:16 am  

    In any case, he’s so dense (whoever he is) that he cannot even tell my kunya – nor presumably from it grasp that Faris is my son’s name. Yes, Lee – I have a BROWN BABY!!!!

    I am a RACE TRAITOR!!!!!

    Well we all have our cross to bear.

    Chin up old son. There’s worse thing’s than being married to a wog.

    You could be an Arsenal supporter.

    But anyway, all joking aside, what about this voluntary repatriation, think it’ll resonate with the punters?

  64. Sarah AB — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:36 am  

    Just thought I’d see how on earth a thread on the BNP being racist had generated so many comments and I still think the best comment was actually the first.

  65. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:24 am  

    I support Bristol Rovers.

    Sarah AB – is that what this thread was about? I thought it was about the refusal of the BNP to answer simple questions about a core policy. Surely an interesting topic given the BNP are standing in the general elections. Yet, of course, I might be wrong.

    Desperate Dan – What exactly is voluntary about repatriation? And how do you “repatriate” people to countries that they may have only visited on holiday?

  66. Sarah AB — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:38 am  

    @Abu Faris – fair enough, and I wasn’t aiming to criticise this post – which I have no problem with at all. But Boyo’s comment struck a chord with me because I have often wished that sites like HP – and PP but it’s HP that I know better – would give a bit more space to analysing differences between mainstream parties that their core readers might actually vote for.

  67. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:23 am  

    Sarah AB,

    analysing differences between mainstream parties that their core readers might actually vote for.

    Or against?

    This, if my memory serves me well, and it doesn’t, is the first piece on here that deals directly with GE2010.

  68. Abu Faris — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:12 am  

    That’s OK, Sarah. I agree with you in your wish to see more blogging about the major players. Being out of UK I should certainly enjoy the same – things seen from outside make for quite a difference.

    As an aside, we have elections (tomorrow) here (Sudan). Well, I use the term “elections” in its loosest sense, as all the opposition parties are boycotting the same. None of us are sure what is going to happen (and that ranges from tanks on the streets to the usual resigned indifference to the sometimes sinister, sometimes lethal shenanigans of the state and its agencies).

    One thing is for certain, however: if ever there was a state where there is more than passing truth in that well-worn anarchist slogan, “Whoever you vote for, it’s the government that wins”, then that state is Sudan.

  69. boyo — on 10th April, 2010 at 4:17 pm  

    I agree with Sarah! ;-)

    And I’m still waiting.

    It’s as if they’ve really nothing to say as it’s not about racism, Israel or Islam.

    If anything articulates a crisis in the left, it’s surely that on the cusp of an election where, for once, the economy is the main issue, when a party of Old Etonians is the front runner and promising radical cuts to the public sector to pay for their pal’s bonuses, no one on two of the leading blogs of the “progressive” or “decent” left has anything to say.

    No wonder people are preparing to vote for the B’stards.

  70. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 4:50 pm  

    @65

    Voluntary repatration? It’s more common than you might think. Half the population of Israel consists of overseas Jews who’ve made Aliyah, and Germany’s repatriated millions of ethnic Germans from the East since the war. It’s to our shame that we haven’t automatically repatriated our own kith and kin from places like Rhodesia but made them apply for asylum like ordinary Africans.

    As for here and now, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis and others seem to spend a lot of time in their ancestral homelands and many Pakistanis have to dual citizenship. India is always pleading with its NRIs to come home, so repatriation will simply facilitate what many of them would want to do anyway.

  71. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 7:33 pm  

    Now, back to the assertion in the original post that a voluntary repatriation scheme would be financially inviable [sic], I made the (thus-far unchallenged) counter-proposition that such a scheme could be at least partially self-funding.

    This view is actually shared by the present government which rationalises its ‘Assisted Voltuntary Return’ scheme for failed asylum seekers and foreign criminal by highlighting the cost savings that result from avoiding future benefits and accommodation expenses in such cases. Here is Lyn Homer, Chief Executive of the UK Border Agency in written evidence to the Commons Select Committee on Home Affairs this past February:

    …The Ministry of Justice estimate that, as a result of this scheme, approximately 400 prison places in any given month are no longer taken by foreign nationals. Not having to accommodate an additional 400 prisoners in any given month represents a saving in the long term in excess of £1.2 million a month (approx £14.4 million over the course of a year) [Ev25; Twelfth Report of Session 2009–2010]

    This ‘profit’ is set against the costs of the scheme of £6.3 million, which include discharge grants of £500 and ‘reintegration’ grants of up to £5000 per repatriated prisoner. Similar amounts are available for asylum seekers and other illegal entrants who agree to go quietly.

    But how might the financial picture look for a ‘normal’ migrant, one wonders. The point is accepted that £5000 is not a large enough carrot to induce many of those who represent the largest drain on public funds to return home, but what might the magic number be?

    To scope this out I decided to indulge in a little role-play, and imagine myself as Mohammed, a relatively recent migrant employed as a pot-washer on minimum wage at one of the tens of thousands of “Indian” curry emporia up and down the country. Munira, like most Bangladeshi women is a stay-at-home Mum, in this case looking after little Fasil and his three other school-age siblings. There’s another on the way, but we won’t account for that in this present analysis.

    Now Mohammed of course is here to do one of those jobs that local people won’t do, at least for the kind of wages that he would (£5.80 per hour, the statutory minumum). Being a fiercely independent type, no way has Mohammed come to sponge off the rest of us, but the friendly folk at the local Citizens Advice Bureau and the JCWI have convinced him that he is entitled to it and offer to assist with making the application.

    And so we find ourselves on the very helpful online ‘Benefits Advisor’ thoughtfully provided on the Directgov website. Anyway, to cut a long story short, the system responds that Mohammed is entitled to claim a total £468 per week in benefits, including income support, child tax credit, housing benefit, council tax relief and child benefit. Other bits and pieces like free school meals, NHS ‘Healthy Start’ vouchers, and so on round it out to £500, or £26,000 p.a., the cash amount which is passed over to Mohammed and his family from public funds.

    So that’s the direct cash benefit, what about other benefits in kind? Of these the most significant will probably be the cost educating the four nippers. A quick browse of school budgets indicate an average cost of around £3500 per pupil per year, equating to around £38500 for the eleven years that most children will spend in school.

    For Mohammed’s brood then we have an educational cost of £154,000 to be borne by other taxpayers, since Mohammed himself will pay little if any income tax over the course of his working life.

    Totaling this all up, over a twenty-year period Mohammed’s presence amongst us will cost the taxpayer over £600,000. The big question then, how big an inducement would be needed to persuade him to return home to Sylhet where on even his present minimum wage he could like a king, in a sunny climate and not have to put up with the nasty, racist British. £50K, £100K? Even the latter represents an r.o.i. that financial speculators would kill for.

    Any further questions?

  72. Ravi Naik — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:03 pm  

    Any further questions?

    There is nothing wrong with voluntary repatriation. It’s the notion that you can reduce non-white population from 10% to 1% with £100K or any sort of realistic amount for that matter. Completely disingenuous.

  73. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:07 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    And, if we’d spent the money on his and her education they may very well have had better lives all round, right here. And done something useful, like wealth creation or science or medicine, etc, etc.

    It is the assumption of a static society that annoys me most about your so-called arguement. Can I assume that whatever position you are at in society is the one that you will always have? For it is only through that mind set that your analysis makes any sense whatsoever.

    Quite medieval for a future rocketman….

  74. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:14 pm  

    Generous ‘golden goodbyes’ would definitely have appeal for those with the lowest SES, who represent the largest drain on the public purse.

    But then any ‘Homeward Bound’ scheme would need to consist of a judicious blend of carrot and stick. There are are a variety of ways in which the ‘pull’ factor can be minimised, all non-violent.

    It’s often forgotten that Hitler managed to rid himself of a majority of his Reichsjuden without laying a finger on them (Kristallnacht being an aberration]. He could probably have exported the lot before the war even started had more countries been willing to accept them.

    I’m not of course suggesting a need anything as crude as the Nuremberg Laws but there is more than one way to skin a cat. Repealing the Race Relations Act – or its soon to be ugly stepchild the Equality Act – would make a good start.

  75. Ravi Naik — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:20 pm  

    It’s often forgotten that Hitler managed to rid himself of a majority of his Reichsjuden without laying a finger on them (Kristallnacht being an aberration].

    It never fails. It only takes a while for a bigot to show its true ugly colours.

    Repealing the Race Relations Act – or its soon to be ugly stepchild the Equality Act – would make a good start.

    Why would you need to repeal “race relations act” and “Equality Act” to enact voluntary repatriation in a more effective way?

  76. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:23 pm  

    Douglas – can you suggest a plausible rationale why we should be asked pay such a large amount of money to accommodate and acculturate Mohammed’s brood? What is the return on the investment?

    I’m sure both you and I could quite easily come up with far better uses for such financial resources.

    As for a static society, I’ve just finished rewatching Andrew Marr’s excellent ‘History of Modern Britain’. The almost complete lack any evidence of influence or any meaningful contribution from all the millions of Mohammeds, Sangeetas, Nkwamas etc etc who have arrived in their millions since 1948 is quite plainly obvious, although Marr doesn’t state it. Britain is any anything but static, and never has been, we don’t need the presence of tens of millions of Afro-Asians to make us a dynamic society. We never have. If they weren’t here, what would we miss. That’s the great unanswerable that liberals always refuse to jump.

  77. damon — on 10th April, 2010 at 8:58 pm  

    Having been called a troll and a racist and banned on another forum myself, I’m a bit reluctant to cast the same aspersion on anyone.
    But I don’t think that Dan Dare would mind being called a racist and a Jew hater.

    So I just wondered why anyone would bother debating him.
    It can go on forever, and will get exactly nowhere.

    (This is slightly sour grapes on my part, as people like Dan always seem to get more of a response than I ever do.)

  78. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:02 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    Because the society that you describe is not the one that we live in, on numerous measures. For the purposes of this discussion here are three of the more important ones:

    Firstly, Mohammed and his family are citizens of this country, who are as entitled as anyone else to proceed through hard work or education to whatever status or wealth they can achieve. That is the modern contract between the state and it’s citizens. The state invests equally in all it’s citizens. Some will be successful, others won’t. It is not a matter of skin colour or origin. It is a matter of application. You have been confronted by people on this thread that quite clearly do contribute to the society they live in and are just as concerned at the direction it may be taking. There are – huge – differences in terms of proposed solutions, but there is a great deal more intellectual rigour being applied to the anti-BNP case than there is to the pro-BNP case. In my view.

    Secondly, sex. You say miscegination as if it’s a bad thing. Over a slightly longer time scale, say 50 years or so, it will become impossible to send anyone back anywhere, unless you are willing to cut them up into pieces and post them.

    Lastly, for the moment, the overall impact of immigration has not been as negative as you portray. For every poor asian working as a dishwasher, I could point you to whites doing the same tasks. For every white surgeon, I could point you to an asian surgeon.

    Given that dishwashing is relatively unskilled, wheras surgery is not, getting rid of your asian dishwasher doesn’t really improve anyones lot whatsoever. Getting rid of the Asian surgeon is, of course, completely insane.

    This whole 1950′s idea ‘Dense Fog in English Channel – Continent Cut Off’ seems to me utterly and completely vacuous.

  79. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:03 pm  

    damon @ 77,

    That’s because, secretly, everyone likes you. :-)

  80. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:05 pm  

    It never fails. It only takes a while for a bigot to show its true ugly colours.

    I’m not making any endorsement of the Nazi’s methodology and tactics, merely drawing a historical parallel of a successful voluntary repatriation scheme. It’s hardly my fault that you are too dim to figure that out for yourself.

    Why would you need to repeal “race relations act” and “Equality Act” to enact voluntary repatriation in a more effective way?

    The repressively Orwellian race relations legislation is externally represented as a symbol of Britain as an open and tolerant society, welcoming to all who can make it onto its shores. Even the poor wretches queuing up in Calais grasp that, otherwise they’d be claiming asylum in France rather than here.

    Internally, the legislation has served to truncate our ancient rights and traditions of freedom of expression and association, and has engendered a ‘culture of complaint’ in which any ethnics who feel hard-done by can enlist the resources of the multicultural state to address any slight, real or perceived. The ready availability of financial compensation, often substantial, as well as the professional humiliation and economic damage meted out to transgressors, merely serve to heighten its appeal for the system’s clientele.

    Repealing the race relations legislation will send the loud and clear message that ethnic rent-seeking is a thing of the past.

    Another significant ‘stick’ would be the reservation of public sector employment and social housing for indigenous folk, a practice which, as I’m sure you’re aware, is the norm in most of the countries which supply the bulk of permanent migrants to this country.

  81. Dalbir — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:07 pm  

    Before I shoot off for a night out.

    If you open your eyes and read the undercurrents of Dan Dare’s earlier posts, you’ll see that what people of his ilk are really preparing for is quite nasty and most likley violent.

    A question worth pondering in this respect is whether BME and their supporters have enough muscle to repulse this ‘when the hour cometh’ (As Dan puts it). Is it worth having this contingent in place in the unlikely event of a growth of the uglier side of nationalism in the UK? That is what these guys are trying to foster and count on.

  82. IAE — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:14 pm  

    Aside from the obvious racist overtones, the comment by Dalbir @ # 24…

    “We belong here more than the English.”

    … pretty much underlines why this kind of non-mandated and enforced mass immigration is simply a fast route to ruinous balkanisation away from generations upon generations of homogenous harmony.

    And the disgusting abuse meted by Abu Faris @ # 49 demonstrates that those who perceive and claim to have some sort of moral high ground in these exchanges never actually do.

  83. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:15 pm  

    Damon, I think you’re rather missing the point in stating that such debates ‘don’t go anywhere’, that’s not really what they’re about. At least I don’t think they are.

    It’s not a matter of winning, or inducing a change of heart in the adversary – that’s effectively impossible in such emotionally-charged areas – but rather plugging away until all the relevant facts come out for public view, at which point the uncommited and non-partisan can draw their own conclusions based on the evidence presented, rather than the emotional force with which it is delivered.

    Of course on venues such as this one, the name-calling and appeals for bannings usually occur long before that point arises, since having their case exposed as the emotional and value-laden nonsense that it is is what lefties fear most. In fact it’s something of a mystery that this thread has been allowed to go on as long as it has.

  84. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:21 pm  

    Dalbir @ 81,

    I think I do understand the undercurrents.

    What he and his ilk are is indeed

    quite nasty and most likley violent.

    What they are, however, is not much more than a weak thread in a society that is far more complex than they understand.

    They are the old women of both sexes, chatting over the garden fence saying:

    “Well I never! It was never like that in my day!”

    Basing a political party on reclaiming a fairytale past?

    Nah!

    The Tories have got that ground covered.

    Have a good evening…

  85. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:29 pm  

    IAE,

    … pretty much underlines why this kind of non-mandated and enforced mass immigration is simply a fast route to ruinous balkanisation away from generations upon generations of homogenous harmony.

    generations upon generations of homogenous harmony?

    Well, locally, we lost Eire. Wonder why they wanted out?

    And you do always get to hear about the Prince marrying the pauper, don’t you?

    And it’s not as if England hasn’t had a Civil War or anything.

    Nor repression of, I dunno, Catholics or Jews or anything.

    It was all down to Windrush, wasn’t it?

    What a lot of shit.

  86. IAE — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:29 pm  

    I presented these two short MSM reports and asked these questions below on another site of a similar vein and received no answer to them, perhaps you gentlemen (and ladies) here could have a go:

    The first is a report on the implosion in swathes of Sweden that have been flooded with Third World immigration; watch the sheer contempt towards the police and ultimately the Swedish by the aliens in the clip matched only by the exasperation of the officers:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JBpVAj4ILM

    My question is: Given that it costs Sweden lots of money to have these people there and there is no economic benefit whatsoever (proof can be produced if you want but listen to the unemployment rate in the report to get a flavour) what possible reason could the Swedish government have as a supposed representative of Sweden’s interests for continuing this?

    What possible benefit can this be?

    Especially after not only the massive fiscal impact and massive impact on social cohesion but also the massive impact on the crime rate, most especially rape and the rape of children (again, plenty of proof for that if disputed)?

    The second is a short report from a Norwegian MSM about one poor little Norwegian boy growing up in an immigrant majority district of Oslo and the profound effect this had on him.

    This poor kid has been beaten, told he is going to hell for being Norwegian, ostracised and left sad and friendless all because his idiotic parents wanted to buy into the multicult myth and impose it upon their child.

    Eventually, even these soppy deluded fools realise the extreme unhappiness of their child, the unworkable situation of the multicult in reality and the damage they are inflicting on him and at last allowed him follow his nature and instinct and be amongst his own.

    Needless to say, within pretty much the first minute of being amongst his own he was visibly happy.

    http://vimeo.com/10210382

    My question is this: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

  87. Wibble — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:32 pm  

    “It never fails. It only takes a while for a bigot to show its true ugly colours.”

    Isn’t he from the (amongst other things) Holocaust-denying “majorityrights” site just like other sometime PP vistor “Guessedworker”?

    I’m guessing the other side of a so-called “voluntary” repatriation scheme is to take from immigrants and their descendants who aren’t on benefits.

  88. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:36 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    Of course on venues such as this one, the name-calling and appeals for bannings usually occur long before that point arises, since having their case exposed as the emotional and value-laden nonsense that it is is what lefties fear most. In fact it’s something of a mystery that this thread has been allowed to go on as long as it has.

    I don’t think there is anything ‘mysterious’ about it.

    If you look at the OP that started this thread, Jai made the point that Pickled Politics was willing to engage the BNP on equal terms.

    I am not a party to this site, but I am pretty well certain that your comments have not been censored.

    If you were to start saying stuff that might bring legal action against PP, then that would be a different matter, obviously.

    So, please continue….

  89. IAE — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:47 pm  

    Douglas Clark @ # 85

    I notice that you don’t actually address the point itself and instead indulge in an ignorant and angry rant as a distraction, this being the way you handle debate I assume.

    Presumably then you agree with Dalbir that some foreign group (Punjabis in his case) “belong here more than the English.”?

    And what happens when another foreign group feel the same way? And then lots of foreign groups? And then how should the people that really “belong” in England, the English, feel about this? Is it just possible we might have balkanisation, as I said?

    I think your glib analysis is a “lot of shit” along with the silly list of ‘points’ you reel out, of which only one had any relevance (or made any sense) at all: The civil war.

    You will notice this country is pretty much unique in only having had one civil and that ended 1651, so my statement that we have had “generations upon generations of homogenous harmony” is true nonetheless.

    And 10 years of the only civil war this country has seen produced only 84,000 casualties compared with ethnic conflicts of say, the 100 days of violence in Rwanda that killed 20% of the populace, around 1,000,000 people or shall we say the 97,000 killed in 3 years of civil war in Bosnia.

    You don’t really know what you are talking about, now do you? And you are so angry with it too.

  90. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:48 pm  

    So, please continue….

    I intend to Douglas, as long as the proprietors continue to tolerate my presence and there are points to counter (insults and ad hominem I tend to ignore).

    Actually I am pleased that you have joined in, since I perceive you to be one of the so-called silent majority, a native Briton who has perhaps accepted the inevitability of a multiracial Britain and is more or less relaxed about any eventual outcome that might ensue from that. You also seem not to be a spotty student type, but someone of more mature years.

    Am I correct in this assumption Douglas, are you indeed one of the many millions of The Unawakened?

    I tend to adopt a different approach with such people like that, as opposed to the common-or-garden axe grinders and members of self-styled oppressed groups who populate boards such as this one.

  91. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 9:51 pm  

    IAE @ 86,

    Before we get around to your comments there, pray tell us more about your reaction to my comment at 85.

    You really do need to know that discussion does not always proceed at the pace you set.

    ———————————–

    Answer the questions that have been put to you about homogeneity before you go off on, yet another, yawn, tangent.

    This is nearly as pathetic as discussing ‘stuff’ with decents….

  92. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:00 pm  

    IAE @ 89,

    I have no idea what you are talking about?

    What is this about being ‘English’ that excites you so?

    Were you to meet a foreign woman would you apply strict, racist criteria to her before you asked her out?

    Perhaps you would. Perhaps I wouldn’t.

    I think that that is the difference between you and me. If I liked her, and she liked me, stuff your racial purity. For it is your racial purity, not hers and not mine. So piss off you B&B freak.

    —————————–

    And give me a break on the Civil War front.

    If 1715 and 1745 weren’t ‘civil wars’ what were they?

    That makes three, and counting…..

  93. IAE — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:03 pm  

    Douglas Clark @ # 91

    I already have @ # 89 if you had bothered to look before you spouted, but exactly why have you now set yourself up as a spokesman for this site and as someone I should answer to? (Not that you asked any ‘questions’ anyway.)

    The questions were not addressed you and to be perfectly honest after your last rude and ignorant effort I am not really interested in hearing anymore from you in any case.

    As well anger issues, you seem to have delusions of grandeur too.

  94. IAE — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:31 pm  

    @ # 92

    Of course you don’t. You’re quite thick, as you have clearly demonstrated in your comments before and this equally angry and ignorant comment gives more dimensions to your lack of intelligence and comprehension.

    Clark, you are typical of the thuggish idiots who parade around thinking they have some sort of moral high ground but cannot prevent their real thuggish intolerance of dissent from being revealed through nasty and facile abuse in lieu of substance.

    You are quite clearly not very bright either, asking me to answer questions when you haven’t even asked any and confusing battles and rebellions with civil wars, and civil wars with ethnic conflicts and entirely misunderstanding what has been said altogether.

    Most likely your obvious lack of intelligence explains your over abundance of anger. The two usually go hand in hand.

    I make no apologies to any extreme leftist thug such as you for my very existence and legitimacy in my own country, a country to which I am indigenous and is my ancestral homeland thus making me a key stakeholder, nor will I make any apologies to a extreme leftist thug like you for my legitimate concerns, of which you have no answers, only ignorant abuse.

    As I said, I am not really interested in the slightest what a low intellect rude thug such as you thinks about anything and none of my questions were directed at you at all, you just choose to make yourself a self-appointed representative and make yourself feel a little important.

    Just to clarify, away from your hot air and abuse, these are just two points that you cannot grasp:

    1) Presumably then you agree with Dalbir that some foreign group (Punjabis in his case) “belong here more than the English.”?

    And what happens when another foreign group feels the same way? And then lots of foreign groups? And then how should the people that really “belong” in England, the English, feel about this? Is it just possible we might have balkanisation, as I said?

    2) You will notice this country is pretty much unique in only having had one civil war and that ended 1651, so my statement that we have had “generations upon generations of homogenous harmony” is true nonetheless.

    And 10 years of the only civil war this country has seen produced only 84,000 casualties compared with ethnic conflicts of say, the 100 days of violence in Rwanda that killed 20% of the populace, around 1,000,000 people or shall we say the 97,000 killed in 3 years of civil war in Bosnia.

  95. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:32 pm  

    Dan Dare @ 90,

    I am only half tolerating this discussion on the grounds that we have an audience. Pickled Politics is a quite well read site in the Asian community and it is important that the people you claim to speak for – me for instance – stand up and say, no you don’t

    Actually I am pleased that you have joined in, since I perceive you to be one of the so-called silent majority, a native Briton who has perhaps accepted the inevitability of a multiracial Britain and is more or less relaxed about any eventual outcome that might ensue from that. You also seem not to be a spotty student type, but someone of more mature years.

    You can perceive all you like.

    Shh!

    Tell you what?

    Most of these Asian folk are OK.

    __________________________

    I have hung around here for a long time and y’know, on balance they have been honest, fair and supportive.

    Perhaps if you toned down the aggression and actually listened, well, maybe you’d think the more of them.

    They are no more perfect than your Aryan super-race, they are no less worthwhile than an Inuit.

    For that is your problem Dan Dare, you assume race or religion or identity matters when it does not.

    What matters is concepts you can’t understand. Mutual respect, attempts at understanding across boundaries, wishy washy stuff like that.

    And I am quite happy to be on that side, so I am.

    I have been for a long time, and perhaps, rather more obviously, over the last four years or so.

    This has been a hard gig at times. But it is people like you with your assumptions about who I ought to be, just ’cause you can’ make me out to be some idiotic bastard. Well I am not. I am me, I know who my friends are? Do You?

    I have a completely different idea of what is right and what is wrong from you.

  96. Sarah AB — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:37 pm  

    “it’s something of a mystery that this thread has been allowed to go on as long as it has.” Well, at least there’s *something* Dan Dare and I can agree on.

  97. Sarah AB — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:38 pm  

    @Douglas “This is nearly as pathetic as discussing ’stuff’ with decents….” Now that’s harsh …

  98. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:48 pm  

    Sarah AB,

    But I am a ‘thuggish idiot’, remember?

    And anyway I’d like to have that discussion with you somewhere else.

    You may have noticed, I am busy?

  99. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 10:59 pm  

    For that is your problem Dan Dare, you assume race or religion or identity matters when it does not.

    This could almost have been lifted verbatim from the manifesto of any of the LibLabCon coalition. They don’t believe in such things either.

    Let me ask you a question Douglas. Do you have children?

    If yes, do you think that in a generation or so they will thank you for your acquiescence in the transformation of Britain into a polyglot transnational Jobcentre in which they will be forced to compete for work and resources with tens of millions of third-worlders and their descendants? That they might be forced to flee halfway across the world to experience the sort of society once found in Britain, but not any longer, not even in the history books which will have been re-written in the interest of ‘inclusiveness’. Or that they will be restricted more and more to living within gated compounds, protected by private security forces, as is now quite common in places like California and the norm in South Africa, Mexico and Brazil? If they’re lucky enough to be able to afford it that is, otherwise it will entail living somewhere that has come to resemble present-day Bombay, Lagos or Manila.

    And all this, in the name of tolerance and ‘fair play’.

    Well guess what Douglas old fruit, that’s a one way street. Your new-found Asian buddies are simply the advance guard of a rising tide of colour which will, unless people like you are aroused from your somnambulant state, engulf us all.

    It’s not racial, as I commented earlier, it’s existential. There are many times more of them than there are of us, and that ratio is only heading one way: worse. They want what we’ve got and they’re coming to get it.

    Mark my words brother, you ain’t seen nothing yet.

  100. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:00 pm  

    IAE,

    Perhaps I am thick.

    After all you said I was:

    You’re quite thick, as you have clearly demonstrated in your comments before and this equally angry and ignorant comment gives more dimensions to your lack of intelligence and comprehension.

    Wow!

    This is like WWF!

    I am supposed to treat Dan Dare as my friend? And you as the bad cop?

    Come on over to my place. Let’s see what you have to say. I doubt you’d dare.

    For information, click on the link in my name.

    What a complete utter pair of BNP wannabees.

    Frankly they are making complete utter fools of themselves.

    You gotta hate complete communities just so you could hold your arse that tight….

  101. Don — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:01 pm  

    Douglas,

    So you’re The Unawakened? Capitalised and everything. Cool.

    And, yes, you do have a different idea of right and wrong to Dan Dare. If you believed in a god, this would be a hat-tip moment.

  102. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:07 pm  

    Don.

    Err..

    I take it you are talking about the Great C’thulu or summat?

    Yes, my friend Dan Dare and I are apart at the moment.

    You chum,

    Digby.

  103. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:09 pm  

    Don and Dougie are talking in their sleep. They’ll wake up soon enough.

  104. douglas clark — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:14 pm  

    Dan Dare, pilot of the future,

    Don and Dougie are talking in their sleep. They’ll wake up soon enough.

    That was cheap so it was.

    The Mekon.

  105. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:18 pm  

    Er right, Dougie whatever you say.

    But you’re probably of an age to remember what became of the Mekon and the dusky-hued invaders that he commanded, thanks to Col. Dare and the other earthlings (who were all quite pale as I recall). A sticky end if memory serves.

    A parable for our times.

  106. Don — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:34 pm  

    Wide awake to you, Dan.

    And am I the only one getting only the last digit of the post numbers?

  107. Dan Dare — on 10th April, 2010 at 11:45 pm  

    Good show Don.

    So what are your thoughts about the BNP’s Homeward Bound scheme? Think it’ll fly? Like to book a Solidarity Passage to somewhere nice and warm where there’s no ebil waycists and all the darkies anyone could wish for?

    India maybe. Oh no scratch India, they’ve built that bloody fence.

  108. Don — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:08 am  

    £100K to go all tropicale? Give it a few years until the pension kicks in and I might think about it. I still have stuff to do in the meantime, including opposing those who think that the Nazi party is a model to follow and that Kristallnacht was an abberation. Also, what is Reichsjuden?

  109. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:15 am  

    @ # 100

    Clark, you are an abusive extreme leftist thug with nought but distractions and insults in lieu of debate and reason; it’s not just my opinion plucked out of thin air but purely based upon your own actions on this thread.

    You have been unable not only to address any of the points raised or questions asked but fail to even comprehend them and their true premise opting instead for that trusty mainstay of the dishonest left of Nazi allusions and emotive abuse as a way of masking your dialectical incompetence and lack of any explanations rooted in reality.

    For instance, you clearly support your Asian friends idea that he and his alien group “belong here more than the English” and the racist implications of that aside, you completely fail to understand that therein lies the roots of balkanisation and the conflicts that inevitably follow as a result; which is no surprise because you have no idea of the distinction between a civil war from an ethnic war, let alone the differences between battles, rebellions and wars or any conception of how long a generation lasts.

    This will now be the third time I will have told you that due to your behaviour and obvious low intellect I am not even remotely interested in what passes for thoughts in that dome of yours nor were any of these comments / points / questions directed at you in any way but no doubt you will persist with more abuse and no debate.

    As mentioned, you clearly suffer from delusions of grandeur as well impotent rage and low intelligence, arbitrarily setting yourself up as some sort of leader here and I think this ludicrously absurd statement of yours sums it up perfectly:

    “I am only half tolerating this discussion on the grounds that we have an audience.”

    Amazing hubris.

    Perhaps as this self-appointed leader you could possibly show some leadership and actually address the points and questions asked with debate and reason instead of emulating an enraged faeces throwing monkey.

    Are you even capable of attempting it, I wonder?

  110. Don — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:33 am  

    This will now be the third time I will have told you that due to your behaviour and obvious low intellect I am not even remotely interested in what passes for thoughts in that dome of yours

    Yet you continue to delight us.

  111. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 1:12 am  

    @Don

    Reichsjuden were Jews who were present in the territory of the German Reich proper up to the start of WWII, that is Germany, Austria and Bohemia.

    Btw I didn’t suggest that the Nazi party was a model to follow, as a more careful reading will confirm. And Kristallnacht was an aberration, but since you didn’t know what Reichsjuden were you could hardly be expected to have known that either.

  112. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 2:49 am  

    Don @ # 110

    Well now, well done Don, another fine piece of debating that will no doubt add profound meaning and insight into the thread.

    If you people don’t want, or more accurately are unable to debate, why not just say so?

    Why the grandiose claims of “removing all alleged “free speech restrictions” in pursuit of “detailed and comprehensive answers” only to use infantile abuse, distractions and one line chaff in its place?

    What on earth are you afraid of?

    That some truth and honesty will spill out and ruin the carpet of straw?

  113. douglas clark — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:33 am  

    IAE @ 109,

    Clark, you are an abusive extreme leftist thug with nought but distractions and insults in lieu of debate and reason; it’s not just my opinion plucked out of thin air but purely based upon your own actions on this thread.

    You have been unable not only to address any of the points raised or questions asked but fail to even comprehend them and their true premise opting instead for that trusty mainstay of the dishonest left of Nazi allusions and emotive abuse as a way of masking your dialectical incompetence and lack of any explanations rooted in reality.

    And I love you too.

    _________________________________

    Well. IAE, what reality are you grounded in exactly?

    Can I tell you about a personal experience and a consideration of Schrödinger’s cat?

    I had to go in for a minor operation a couple of years ago. The person who marked me up was Asian. I was then given anesthetic.

    I do not know whether the person that marked me up was the Asian that, correctly, identified what needed doing. And did it. Or whether it was a white surgeon that operated on me.

    Neither do I care.

    You do.

    I am rather grateful that the operation was a success.

    And that makes me an anti racist. If you give yourself up to unconciousness, and are operated on by ‘god knows’ who, what’s the issue? You care, if at all, about their competence, nothing else.

    To get back to Schrödinger’s cat. If we can see it as an intelligent being, rather than a pussy, perhaps it would be relieved to exit the box alive?

    I know I was.

    There were, as far as I know, a team of folk that operated on me, and, because I was unconcious, I do not know exactly who they were, nor who to thank.

    You should reflect on that you racist bastard.

  114. douglas clark — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:53 am  

    IAE @ 112,

    Don is completely capable of defending himself, however..

    Why the grandiose claims of “removing all alleged “free speech restrictions” in pursuit of “detailed and comprehensive answers” only to use infantile abuse, distractions and one line chaff in its place?

    Perhaps it is to allow you to rant and rave like a bad tempered baby?

    In general, there is much to be said for free speech. It allows us to see folk as they really are.

    It is you, sir, that cannot argue your way out of a wet paper bag.

  115. Sarah AB — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:17 am  

    @Dan Dare – you asked Douglas: “Let me ask you a question Douglas. Do you have children? If yes, do you think that in a generation or so they will thank you for your acquiescence in the transformation of Britain into a polyglot transnational Jobcentre in which they will be forced to compete for work and resources with tens of millions of third-worlders and their descendants?”

    I didn’t join in this thread much yesterday because I was at a very pleasant 70th birthday party. All our friend’s grandchildren, incidentally, are the products of what you’d probably call ‘miscegenation’ as are many of my own young relatives. It’s you and not the Mekons who seem to come from another planet. I am prepared to read arguments by people who have specific and objective concerns about individuals or groups from a particular immigrant – or any other – section of the community. But I don’t accept extrapolations from such examples – and the recent Dispatches programme might be one such example of a piece which had a very specific and local point to make – which aim to demonise all members of a religion or race or even all those who aren’t completely ‘indigenous’. I certainly wouldn’t like to judged by the standards set by some of my own fellow indigenous types.

  116. douglas clark — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:20 am  

    Dan Dare @ 99,

    Yes, I do have kids. And, absent you inventing an anti gravity drive and taking the UK off to Pluto or summat, they already compete in a global market.

    It’s not racial, as I commented earlier, it’s existential. There are many times more of them than there are of us, and that ratio is only heading one way: worse. They want what we’ve got and they’re coming to get it.

    “It’s not racial”

    Oh well, here was me thinking it was.

    There is only one race. It is us.

    And, so far, we can all interbreed and stuff. I couldn’t care less whether my kids found affection and love with people from a different background. Just as long as they did.

    Caveats coming up!

    Well, I’d need to be convinced about Republicans, right enough! Or authors on Harry’s Place, loveable as they might be. Or indeed, racist sentimentalists such as your good self. For that might be a train crash for them….

    And, anyway, it is their lives, not mine. I do not approve of parental interference, really. Let them get on with it.

    What may surprise you is that my kids think I am right wing!

    You really do need to get up to speed with what young folk, and I know a few more than just my immediate family, think. Your ideas are firmly fixed in the 1950′s.

    Consider that!

    The Mekon.

  117. douglas clark — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:32 am  

    Sarah AB @ 115,

    Well said.

  118. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:49 am  

    Dougie’s and Sarah AB’s pronouncements will seem quite astonishing to future anthropologists and historians as they sift through the ashes and remnants of western civilisation.

    How could such a once proud people, a folk who built an empire on which the sun never set, become so enfeebled that they were not just unable to resist our encroachments, but positively welcomed them?

    What is your assessment Dr. Gupta?

    Well frankly Professor Hsiao, I am as baffled as you are. There is simply no precedent in human history as far as I’m aware for a dominant culture to conspire in its own demise in such a fashion. We have no previous model on which to construct a theory. Perhaps they were so lacking in self-esteem, so enfeebled by decades of self-flagellation over their own perceived transgressions, so convinced that their guilt required the ultimate sacrifice, that they simply opened their doors to us and lay down and died. All we had to do was to walk in and accept their tribute, it was all just simply handed over, with a smile and a thanks for coming.

    Yes indeed, it was all really quite remarkable. But let’s be sure to learn from their mistakes and be ever vigilant not just against the enemies without but also those within. Now that we have the prize, we shall not let it go as lightly as they.

  119. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:25 am  

    It’s not racial, as I commented earlier, it’s existential. There are many times more of them than there are of us, and that ratio is only heading one way: worse. They want what we’ve got and they’re coming to get it. Mark my words brother, you ain’t seen nothing yet.

    It is always a delight to have visitors from Stormfront. And never ceases to amaze me how ashamed they are to admit that they are racists – now it seems they prefer to be called existentialists.

    Oh well, I guess you’ve got one thing right: you have every reason to panic and believe that things are getting worse – for your racist supremacist kind, that is. And things are getting worse: your party, the BNP, is capitulating in every front and that was even before the EHRC stepped in.

    Truth is, white supremacy only started in the 18th century when Europe started dominating the world. However, not long ago (as late 1700), India was the richest region of the world with wealth ahead of whole Western Europe and before being colonized by Britain.

    But that was then. Developing countries are becoming *again* more competitive and regaining what they lost. However, Britain will prevail as long as it keeps investing in its people regardless of race, and ensuring equality and justice. It is also inevitable that the concept of race will disappear in a few centuries.

    The point is that your racist supremacist breed is indeed dying. And I am glad you are not enjoying what you are seeing. It will indeed get worse.

  120. persephone — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:30 am  

    “Now that we have the prize, we shall not let it go as lightly as they.”

    Can you specify what is the prize?

  121. boyo — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:43 am  

    Dan, you mention the “aberration” of Kristallnacht and talk approvingly of Hitler’s success in getting rid of so many Jews…

    “I’m not making any endorsement of the Nazi’s methodology and tactics, merely drawing a historical parallel of a successful voluntary repatriation scheme.”

    I suppose by successful scheme you include the Racial ands Nuremberg Laws which by 1935 meant…

    “Jews were forbidden to join the Wehrmacht (the army), the “Law for the Protection of German Blood and Honor” was passed, preventing marriage between any Jew and non – Jews. The “Reich Citizenship Law” was passed stating that all Jews, even quarter- and half-Jews, were no longer citizens of their own country (their official title became “subjects of the state”). This meant that they were deprived of basic citizens’ rights, e.g., the right to vote. This removal of citizens’ rights was instrumental in the process of anti-semitic persecution: the process of denaturalization allowed the Nazis to exclude, de jure, Jewish people from the “national community” (“Volksgemeinschaft”), thus granting judicial legitimacy to their persecution and opening the way to harsher laws and, eventually, extermination of the Jews.

    In 1936, Jews were banned from all professional jobs, effectively preventing them from having any influence in education, politics, higher education, and industry. There was now nothing to stop the anti-Jewish actions that spread across the German economy.
    Between 1937 and 1938, new laws were implemented, and the segregation of Jews from the “German Aryan” population was completed. In particular, Jews were punished financially for being Jewish.

    On March 1, 1938, government contracts could not be awarded to Jewish businesses. On September 30 of the same year, “Aryan” doctors could only treat “Aryan” patients. Provision of medical care to Jews was already hampered by the fact that Jews were banned from being doctors.

    On August 17, Jews had to add “Israel”(males) or “Sara” (females) to their names, and a large letter “J” was to be printed on their passports on October 5. On November 15, Jewish children were banned from going to state-run schools.”

    In these circumstances Kristallnacht was simply the next logical step, as you must be well aware. The trouble is the historical ignorance of which you speak is your greatest ally – a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

    The irony is there is legitimate debate to be had about the consequences of mass immigration, but racist toe-rags like you are the greatest ally of those who wish to surpress it.

  122. boyo — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:44 am  
  123. George — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:23 am  

    Ravi Naik #119 says India was the richest region in the world until 1700 when the British came and in support he cites Wikipedia.
    Hold it, Ravi – what about the caveats?
    There was no properly demarcated territorial entity (leave alone state) called India until the Brits came. Second, it makes no sense to talk of GDP in the pre-market era. How on earth was this GDP calculated and who did it?
    Third, the Muslims began dominating the sub-continental region from 1000 CE and Wikipedia clearly states that the GDP for 1600 & 1700 refers to the Mughal era. The HINDUS were nowhere on the scene or at most peripheral actors in their own land.

  124. persephone — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:34 am  

    “There was no properly demarcated territorial entity”

    But is it a good thing to mark territories?

  125. Sarah AB — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:55 am  

    I’m just wondering whether anyone has ever decided either to vote BNP or to stop voting BNP after reading posts/comments either on this site or on Harry’s Place.

  126. Ros — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:23 am  

    Persepphone 124 seems to have Israel in mind with its undefined borders. How can a state be defined without properpy demarcated borders? And yet Israel insists on some vague right to exist.
    Let me quote Virginia Tilley, US Professor of International Relations (CounterPunch 12May2006]


    There is no “right to exist” for states under international law.

    The formula has arisen in international diplomacy uniquely regarding Israel. It does not mean simply diplomatic recognition, which is the “fact” of existence. It does not mean recognizing Israel’s “right to self-determination,” either, or we would be using that famous term.

    Diplomatic recognition of a state routinely requires one bit of vital information: “right to exist” where? Israel’s borders are not set. Even its plans for those borders are not known; Mr. Olmert has announced that we will not know until 2010.
    It is entirely legitimate for Hamas to require firm confirmation of Israel’s borders before recognizing it. The international community should demand that these borders be defined before insisting that Hamas recognize Israel’s “right” to them. Otherwise, Israel wouls have a “right to exist” whatever borders it chooses in coming years.
    So Hamas refusal is not unreasonable. Would Canadian, or Norwegian, or English, or French governments be called on to recognize the “right to exist” of a neighboring state that is, with military force, settling its own ethnically defined population within contiguous walled cities and enclaves in Canadian, Norwegian, English or French national territories, while promising to carve those nations into “cantons?”
    What Israel seeks the right to exist as a Jewish state. So Hamas is required to endorse a state within Palestine that is populated and run primarily by Jews, primarily for Jews and having laws and policies necessary to preserving its Jewish majority, even rejecting the return of Palestinian refugees mandated by international law.

  127. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:39 am  

    I suppose by successful scheme you include the Racial ands Nuremberg Laws which by 1935 meant…

    Exactly right. And that is why he wanted to repeal race equality laws to beef up his “voluntary” repatriation scheme (#75).

  128. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:40 am  

    I’m not racial, it’s existential…

    Now, that has got to be one of the most inadvertantly ridiculous comments so far.

    Well done, Desperate Dan.

  129. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:07 pm  

    Hold it, Ravi – what about the caveats?

    George, no caveats. Once again you show your spectacular ignorance about the Indian subcontinent, despite being from Pakistan. The Mughal Empire, by 1700, pretty much covered the Indian subcontinent. If you look in the same link since the 1st century, the Indian subcontinent has dominated the world’s wealth regardless of who ruled it – up to 1700. As for how the GDP is calculated, you can buy the book.

  130. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:19 pm  

    There is simply no precedent in human history as far as I’m aware for a dominant culture to conspire in its own demise in such a fashion.

    Wrong. There are several precedents of societies opening up to new ideas and cultures, and flourishing as a result of that. Bigotry and persecuting people for their beliefs tend to have the opposite effect.

  131. persephone — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:32 pm  

    ” Persepphone 124 seems to have Israel in mind with its undefined borders ”

    Let me speak for myself. Apart from observing that setting territories is the reason behind a lot of warring I’m not mentioning any one country in particular.

  132. persephone — on 11th April, 2010 at 12:41 pm  

    “If you want to, you can virtually find out which village they come from in Africa with DNA tests”

    Yes let us use the example of Africa which means that all of the human race can be backtracked to Africa. We are all immigrants therefore and on that same logic the whole of the world needs to return home to Africa. I would leave BNP supporters to wallow elsewhere as they so wish.

    If this is the level & logic of their policy making god help the bnp members who pay good money on membership for such ‘rationale’

  133. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 1:19 pm  

    Presumably then you agree with Dalbir that some foreign group (Punjabis in his case) “belong here more than the English.”?

    And what happens when another foreign group feel the same way? And then lots of foreign groups? And then how should the people that really “belong” in England, the English, feel about this?

    Is this your way of essentially highlighting your upset at the notion of nonwhite communities feeling at home in England?

  134. chairwoman — on 11th April, 2010 at 2:03 pm  

    Ros @ 126

    You’re on the wrong thread.

    And a crashing bore to boot.

  135. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 3:12 pm  

    @ # 113 & 114

    Clark, just more the same nonsense, distractions and abuse out of you as fully expected, even though you consider yourself to be a leader of the people here.

    You are the one totally unable to address any of the points or questions raised and you are the one who has lowered this supposed free debate to a personal slinging match, to suit your lack of intellect and lack of answers.

    You are completely dishonest and cannot even bring yourself to comment on a simple question: Do you agree with your Asian friend that he and his alien group “belong here more than the English.”

    So instead you duck and weave and shout and scream like a demented fool with your absurd claims that you have somehow ‘bested’ me in debate when you haven’t even engaged in any debate whatsoever along your absurd charges of racism when I have not uttered one single racist sentiment, but your Asian friend above clearly has.

    You are the one obsessed with superiority, not I, I haven’t mentioned or alluded to superiority once because it is not a concern or concept of mine; my concerns are clearly laid out above but you are totally unable to answer them. You seem totally incapable of even comprehending them and as such as far you are concerned they don’t exist for anyone in reality and those who dare raise it must be silenced through abuse and labels.

    How pathetic. How revealing. Not one of you has been able to do anything other then pull the same cheap stunts Clark has and not one of you has been able to give straight answers to straight question.

    What on earth are you afraid of?

    That some truth and honesty will spill out and ruin the carpet of straw?

    To paraphrase: ‘You should reflect on that you thick dishonest bastard.’

  136. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 3:16 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 133

    I love it.

    You make a completely gratuitous, aggressive and provocative racist statement and then seek to turn the focus back onto my spurious ‘racism’ for daring to raise it, and all the while your blatant racism is studiously ignored by your cohorts here and we even have your tame ‘uncle tom’ style poodle Clark attempting some pretty surreal internet hardman tactics to cover up the fact that you even said it at all.

    Pretty much sums up the insanity that this country has produced and allowed and the kind of enabling idiots it breeds.

    You, as a Punjabi say:

    “We belong here more than the English.”

    You made no mention of ‘feeling at home’ you made mention of superiority, so let’s stop the lies and cut straight to the chase.

    You quite boldly stated that in your opinion, by way of your ethnicity you have more right and legitimacy to be here then the indigenous people themselves which clearly means that you consider your ethnicity to be superior to the English people and that in your opinion, the English people don’t really belong or have any legitimacy to exist in their own country.

    If you are brazen enough to make such offensive racist statements then at least have the balls to stand by it instead of trying to spin out of it like some backstreet spiv or some duck house claiming politician.

    This is the real reason Clark the poodle was so keen to try project your qualities of notions of innate superiority upon me and Dan, a desperate attempt to distract away from the fact that the only real racist statement made in this thread was made by an Asian against the English.

    And aside from your racism, my point, for the third time, was perfectly valid. As you consider yourself to have more right and be more legitimate here then the indigenous populace it is quite obvious that your opinion of the other inhabitant’s right to be here is even more contemptuous; so what happens when other groups start to think the way you do, and how should the English be expected feel about this?

    That is, as I have said, the fast route to balkanisation.

    Why should I want that for my country and my children?

  137. Sarah AB — on 11th April, 2010 at 3:26 pm  

    Well I didn’t agree with Dalbir’s comment about belonging here more than the English – but that doesn’t mean I have to agree with IAE or Dan Dare either.

  138. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 4:19 pm  

    Sarah @ # 137

    And that is your absolute right, Sarah.

    But and Dalbir is far from alone in his sentiment of hate.

    And taking Dalbir’s extremely racist statement to its logical and very sinister conclusion:

    Just where does he think the English do belong exactly, if not in England? Where would he have the English people exist? And if he considers that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what possible opinion can he have on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

  139. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 4:36 pm  

    I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada.

    I noticed they’ve never seemed to care much about the indigenous feeling towards their presence there and ridden roughshod over it.

    Explain that one away.

  140. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 4:40 pm  

    If I am not very much mistaken, IAE is the commenter, “I am English” who is a close ally of Lee John Barnes. He was also, he himself claims, responsible for the recent spate of DoSS attacks on HP and the subsequent change of server by HP. You can read all about it on the thread called “I am the Phantom” on Barnes’ hate site, 21st Century Nationalism (no, I am not going to link to that Nazi filth). “I am English” is banned from “Harry’s Place” for his repeated racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks, which he claims led to his threats and consequent acts against HP.

    Tell us it ain’t so, IAE.

  141. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 4:41 pm  

    But and Dalbir is far from alone in his sentiment of hate. And taking Dalbir’s extremely racist statement to its logical and very sinister conclusion

    The only conclusion is that stupidity, hate and bigotry knows no boundaries.

  142. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 4:45 pm  

    IAE wrote on Barnes’ site:

    Hi lee,

    I am delighted to see I brought that blatantly fascist and freedom of speech suppressing site down and have cost them a considerable sum of money too, Lee.

    Here is the real story behind it:

    I had been posting reasoned and polite comments there a little while ago but the comments were just too intelligent and evidenced for them to handle so the usual tricks were resorted to, you know, deletions, malicious amendments, insults and the favoured one being accusing me of being you Lee, as if that somehow would negate the content anyway!

    I ran rings around the brain dead fanatics on there and started exposing them as bare faced liars one by one.

    From some muppet called Adrian Morgan who thought all of his previous extremely positive online musings about the “right” and the BNP had gone away (things are never really gone on the internet) and couldn’t bare being presented with the facts that pretty much all of what he claimed to believe in and support on Harry’s Place flies in the face of everything he had said and written over the years. He went into hysterical overdrive faking abusive comments and then bizarrely threatening ‘police action’ and Harry’s Place censorship.

    Of course by this time I had thoroughly exposed the resident troll ‘graham’ and his multiple sock puppets for the lying ignorant bitter fool he is (my favourite was his abysmal grasp of technology and the lie that even his own couldn’t defend!) as well as many as other such as the faux serviceman ‘sackcloth and ashes’, ‘josh’, ‘ana’ and ‘old sailor’ as well as the hater-in-chief Edmund Standing amongst many others of the usual HP cronies. I would provide links but they have buried the evidence! They know who they are and what happened though!

    So of course, after all of the underhanded games and posturing they ‘banned’ me (so they thought) and I actually warned them then what I intended to do in regards to having the site taken down if they continued to lie and censor. After all, registering fake details is in breach of the regulations so they only have themselves to blame and why would any honest decent person need to do so anyway? It is what criminals and terrorist do, not ordinary law-abiding citizens.

    As per usual they thought they were above it all, a law unto themselves and they scoffed at it. It wasn’t overnight, as bureaucratic processes never are, but around 2 months later my efforts came to fruition and my promise was realised.

    They weren’t laughing then.

    Expensive business all in all, this cheating, lying, corruption, censorship and underhanded game playing.

    Best stick to honesty and fairness really.

    Especially as the details they have used for their new hosting site are still fake and ICANN is international and cares not for content nor ‘US 1st amendment rights’ but the policing of domains and the registration of the correct details and so in has gone another complaint already in retaliation for the continued cheating, lying, corruption, censorship and underhanded game playing of this insidious vile site and down it will come again (sorry ‘Ana’, yet again you are the blind being led the ignorant and blind, the HP caveat doesn’t stand up in reality.)

    In fact the US authorities (ICANN aside) are even less tolerant then most about fake registration details and are extremely sensitive that such dishonesty is usually associated with crooks and terror groups.

    They can’t say they weren’t given fair chance, Lee, they can’t say they weren’t warned and they can’t say they didn’t bring it entirely upon themselves.

    Anyhow we have an election to get on with, and it’s just possible I might bring down this smear and lie site down once again before it, who knows? Either ways, it is going to cost them lots more money in the not too distant future.

    Happy days.

    Arrogant, self-regarding, deluded muppet.

  143. Sarah AB — on 11th April, 2010 at 4:57 pm  

    Thanks for that Abu Faris! Douglas – don’t you think you might learn to love HP? ;-)

  144. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 5:03 pm  

    I am delighted to see I brought that blatantly fascist and freedom of speech suppressing site down

    Beyond parody. So, this moron thinks that he is fighting in the name of freedom of speech by attempting to shut down a site he doesn’t like?

  145. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 5:34 pm  

    Abu Farris @ # 142

    What a laugh you are.

    The only ‘arrogant, self-regarding, deluded muppet’ here is you, trying desperately to distract away from the fact that the only racism that has manifested itself in this thread is Asian racism against the English and quite clearly you couldn’t give a toss about that one iota.

    Why doesn’t some racism bother you but some racism does?

    You are only an ‘anti-racist’ when racism is directed at certain races you favour, it would seem, which makes you a racist of the worst kind yourself.

    As for your inane Perry Mason style antics, I could have put any other moniker I wanted to these comments but quite obviously I didn’t, so I really don’t know why you think you are some kind of investigating hero and what you think you have ‘exposed’ here.

    Clearly I am not hiding anything or anywhere. Clearly I am very open and honest in my dealings.

    And perhaps you could link to this alleged “racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks” to substantiate your claims; I rather doubt it as it didn’t happen, as you well know it’s a lie.

    What did happen is exactly what you have been kind enough to reproduce for me:

    A surfeit of HP lies, games, censorship, abuse and law breaking and a deficit of HP debate, reason, honesty, and integrity.

    But the main reason I reported HP for its illegal domain registration and rank dishonesty was not even so much the underhanded games and censorship, malicious edits, selective deletions and general abuse in lieu of debate but because they spoofed abusive comments in which two of them they made threats of violence and worse against one of their own and then claimed that the police had been called in over it, merely to distract away from the fact that they had no answers to straightforward and reasonable questions, and more especially to silence someone who had consistently exposed them as liars and propagandists.

    To me that didn’t just cross the line, it pissed all over it and I so took legal remedies to ensure that this piece of surreal and nasty game playing would be met with the contempt and reciprocation it deserved.

    And you will notice that HP did indeed get pulled off-line, and that HP do indeed acknowledge that I did that, and not because of any underhanded game playing on my behalf but because of their own dishonesty and law breaking.

    So the end result was that their extreme dishonesty and extremely underhanded game playing cost them lots of inconvenience as well as lots of money.

    And I am very happy and open about that as you can see.

    So other then yet another convenient distraction away from your friends blatant racism, what do you think you have achieved?

  146. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 5:35 pm  

    It will indeed get worse.

    Are you still listening Dougie? Here you have it straight from the horse’s mouth.

    There are several precedents of societies opening up to new ideas and cultures, and flourishing as a result of that.

    In that case it should not be difficult for you to provide a list of the new ideas that post-war Afro-Asian migrants have brought with them that have contributed to the flourishing of Europe. Please do.

    And, of course, opening up to new ideas and cultures is not exactly congruent with admitting millions of essentially unwanted and unnecessary foreigners. Yes, we do have have a taste for chicken tikka masala but since we have the recipe, why do we still need you to stay around.

    I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada.

    Australia and Canada didn’t exist until Anglos created them. The third world invaders who have recently turned up more or less uninvited in the Eurosphere are essentially parasitic and collectively perform no useful function. Nobody has ever been able to define what if anything would be missed if they all were to be magically translevitated back to their ancestral homeland. Nobody here has even tried. The standard and only response is to screech that any posing such a question must be ‘racist’.

  147. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 5:36 pm  

    Ravi Naik @ # 141

    Precisely my point, and as more and more groups think this way and gather more and more numbers, we will arrive at a point of balkanisation and all it brings.

    Ravi Naik @ # 144

    Oh dear, you are another one with a complete lack of comprehension and honesty.

    I suggest you re-read the comment on why it happened and then perhaps attempt another pass.

    Sarah @ # 143

    Thanks for what exactly?

    See above; I am not hiding and he has achieved nothing.
    But yes, Clark would be more suited to a site that holds as dear the same twisted values as he clearly does.

    Oh yes, and they now openly practice censorship (but say it’s not censorship) whilst proclaiming as a banner motto that “Liberty, if it means anything, is the right to tell people what they don’t want to hear’ and claiming as a policy:

    “We do not delete comments simply because we do not agree with them. We want a vibrant marketplace of ideas, not an echo chamber. It should be kept in mind however that marketplaces can at times be loud and chaotic.

    It is our conviction that the best way to deal with contrary views – even objectionable ones – is to challenge them, to argue, to criticise them or, in some cases, to treat them with contempt by ignoring them. This is how a free society functions.”

    So yes, Clark the poodle and most of you would well in with that site of rank hypocrites, liars, law breakers and (self) abusers.

  148. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 5:39 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 139

    Despite more of your friends joining in with the desperate distractions in order to cover up your blatant racism I will press on undeterred:

    Again you are lying through your teeth in order to try and extricate yourself from your extremely racist statements.

    You didn’t say “I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada” you said “We belong here more than the English” no matter how much you now try and back peddle now, realising that you have exposed yourself as a racist extremist.

    That is you consider that Punjabis are so superior to the English that they have more right to be in England then the English.

    Let’s have no more of your lies, grow some balls and back up your racism and answer this away:

    Why do you think your ethnicity has more right to be in England then the English? Why are you superior to the English?

    Just where do you think the English do belong exactly, if not in England?

    Where would you have the English people exist?

    And if you consider that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what possible opinion can you have on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

  149. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 5:44 pm  

    I suppose by successful scheme you include the Racial ands Nuremberg Laws which by 1935 meant…

    Yes, that was of course a major part of it. And the scheme was successful, Hitler did succeed in inducing a majority of the Reichsjuden to emigrate. All that prevented the plan from being a total success was the reluctance of other countries to accept Hitler’s Jews (including the closing of Palestine in 1939), and the outbreak of war. Although Jewish emigration was still permitted until May 1941.

    Again, I am not proposing or endorsing the Nazi tactics, merely pointing out that there historical precedents for successful repatriation of unwanted minorities. East Africa represents a more recent instance; there are many others.

    Hitler’s approach was all stick; what the BNP proposes is mostly carrot with a little stick.

  150. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:00 pm  

    That is you consider that Punjabis are so superior to the English that they have more right to be in England then the English.

    My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference, you can’t moan about changes being made here. I guess the same would apply with other places your ‘Anglosphere’ has caused havoc and displacement, directly or indirectly.

    Plus you are aware that I don’t really think opinions from sources such as yourself have any validity don’t you? I think you represent a particularly gross section of white society that is only really concerned in their own narrow interests bypassing any level of greater humanity to others. i notice you talk about Canada and Aus as if no one existed there before. Down with you devil! Down!

  151. boyo — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:18 pm  

    “Again, I am not proposing or endorsing the Nazi tactics, merely pointing out that there historical precedents for successful repatriation of unwanted minorities.”

    Of course there was the original pogrom against the Jews of York, which more or less kicked it all off, so why look to Hitler for inspiration Dan when we have our own home-grown racial hate?

    I’m not sure about you being from Stormfront, Searchlight more like – you sure you’re not a fanatical multiculturalist in racist clothing? I would bet you were Platinum or Dalbir if I didn’t think it was impossible to type that fast.

  152. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:24 pm  

    Hitler’s approach was all stick; what the BNP proposes is mostly carrot with a little stick.

    But basically the same ideas.

    No thanks, Nazi boy.

  153. earwicga — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:26 pm  

    Hitler’s approach was all stick; what the BNP proposes is mostly carrot with a little stick.

    Let’s call a stick a stick – Hitler’s approach was all torture and murder. So you are planning a ‘little’ torture and murder.

  154. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:26 pm  

    So you think I’m a fanatical multiculturist Boyo? Interesting.

  155. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:27 pm  

    Well boyo, by the reference to York I assume you’re referring to the Expulsion Edict of 1290, which has never been repealed. This means that that Jews in Britain are technically illegal aliens and subject to deportation, but let’s draw a veil over that, nobody is supposed to know.

    And no, I’m not ‘from’ Stormfront, although I did post there a few years ago. These days I usually hang out at Majorityrights.com, when I’m not having fun at places like this. I’d say stop by sometime and say hello, but I don’t believe you have the balls to venture beyond your cosy comfort zone.

  156. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:30 pm  

    Hitler’s approach was all torture and murder. So you are planning a ‘little’ torture and murder.

    If you’re making this remark in the context of Nazi policy towards the Jews, Earwig, then I’m afraid you’re simply demonstrating your historical illiteracy. But ten I shouldn’t pick on you, that’s par for the course for the loony left.

  157. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:35 pm  

    No, Hitler’s policy towards the Jews also included more than a little genocide. It is useful, however, to read BNP members openly devoting time to defending the Third Reich. What will Fuhrer Griffin say about this?

  158. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:37 pm  

    Hitler’s approach was all stick; what the BNP proposes is mostly carrot with a little stick.

    What exactly is the “little” stick that the BNP is proposing?

  159. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:40 pm  

    My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference, you can’t moan about changes being made here.

    What a stupid thing to say.

  160. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:50 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 150

    Again you lie through your teeth in order to cover up your extreme racism.

    Despite the fact that you made no such spurious caveat during your utterance, and have modified your position at least twice now without foundation, there is no excuse whatsoever for your grossly offensive statement that “we belong here more then English” and its meaning is perfectly clear to all: You consider yourself ethnically superior to the English people and deny that they even have the right or legitimacy to exist in their own country.

    As for my “opinions” not having any “validity” with you, I am quite sure they don’t. You are a racist and I am English and quite clearly you despise me for it, in my own country too no less.

    If you hate the English so much, why come here at all? I presume you were directly from the Punjab as you referred to ‘we’ in defining yourself as a Punjabi (or maybe even more generic as an Asian?) rather then as a Briton.

    And even if you are not, why stay amongst people that you so clearly hate? What benefit is that to you, or more saliently, to my country and I?

    Do you really think that the contemporary English people are somehow responsible for your country today and that as a solution we should re-colonise you to rectify any past mistakes?

    I’ll ignore your appalling lack of comprehension (another one) and side step the fact that I haven’t actually mentioned Australia or Canada at all and just go straight to the meat of the issue and ask why you
    can’t answer these simple questions:

    Why do you think your ethnicity has more right to be in England then the English?

    Just where do you think the English do belong exactly, if not in England?

    Where would you have the English people exist?

    And if you consider that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what is your true opinion on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

  161. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 6:52 pm  

    No, Hitler’s policy towards the Jews also included more than a little genocide. It is useful, however, to read BNP members openly devoting time to defending the Third Reich. What will Fuhrer Griffin say about this?

    He’d probably say the same thing I would: who cares what a putative camel-jockey thinks, he’s a cretin anyway. Anyone who takes himself off to a pesthole like Sudan and fetches up with a negro must have a screw loose anyway. Better you pollute their gene pool than ours.

  162. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:00 pm  

    Ravi shouldn’t you be in church?

  163. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:00 pm  

    What exactly is the “little” stick that the BNP is proposing?

    Ravi you naughty boy, you haven’t been paying close enough attention. Please review posts passim and then feel free to pose any supplementaries.

    And if you are able to contain yourself until then, the exciting new Manifesto will be out in a day or two, at which point you will also be able pick out the bits that will apply to you. Which is probably all you’re really interested in anyway.

    Now, how about having a go at my earlier questions. Go on, make a name for yourself. If you can answer them it’ll be a world first.

  164. persephone — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:03 pm  

    ” the exciting new Manifesto will be out in a day or two”

    So this commenting is the pre launch PR for it

  165. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:06 pm  

    Anyone who takes himself off to a pesthole like Sudan and fetches up with a negro must have a screw loose anyway. Better you pollute their gene pool than ours.

    Gosh – and there we were all so ready to be fooled that the BNP was so reformed and had no connection whatsoever with its Nazi past.

    Not.

  166. Sarah AB — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:10 pm  

    @Abu – indeed.

  167. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:17 pm  

    Incidentally, the reason why these pond-life no longer admit to posting on “Stormfront” is because Herr Flick instructed the Party to avoid publicly associating with more openly Nazi scum.

  168. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:17 pm  

    @160

    Firstly, I don’t believe in the notion that any group is ethnically superior to another. So we can nip that one in the bud quite quickly.

    In any case your appalling hypocrisy in the face of ongoing attempts to colonise Canada and Aus by Anglos, speaks volumes. The fact is that you are perfectly happy with your own people settling abroad regardless of the feelings of the original inhabitants, but then you seem to lament about something (perceived as) analogous taking place in England?

    Either you are for the practice or against….make your mind up.

    You’re actually boring me now.

  169. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:22 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 162

    Shouldn’t you either be apologising and making amends for your blatant and aggressive racism and cease demanding that the English re-colonise your country and fix it, or be just as vocal and proud in your justification of your racism and enthusiasm for colonialism as you were when you first espoused it?

  170. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:28 pm  

    No I shouldn’t.

    Next question.

    Have a stab at #168, whilst you are at it. You for or against then?

  171. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:29 pm  
  172. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:29 pm  

    And if you are able to contain yourself until then, the exciting new Manifesto will be out in a day or two, at which point you will also be able pick out the bits that will apply to you.

    The new manifesto will be a capitulation of the BNP core ideals, and will not mention the “little sticks”, but simply offer imaginary carrots to solve all problems.

    And you do not need to feel shy all the sudden – please tell us exactly what the “little sticks” are, and why you had to bring up the Nazi regime and their treatment of Jews to make this point.

    Now, how about having a go at my earlier questions. Go on, make a name for yourself. If you can answer them it’ll be a world first.

    What questions are you referring?

  173. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:32 pm  

    Actually Dalbir, I have some sympathy with your call for the restoration of the Punjab (or is it called the Panjab now?)

    And I do agree that many blunders were made during the imperial period the after-effects of which continue to reverberate today. Kashmir being an obvious case in point.

    As a fellow ethno-nationalist I certainly do sympathise with the plight of your ancestral homeland and would support efforts for its reinstatement as the Sikh homeland. A place where Sikhs can govern themselves according to their traditions and wishes, without external interference.

    You see, we are not so far apart ideologically as it might appear at first sight.

  174. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:39 pm  

    You see, we are not so far apart ideologically as it might appear at first sight.

    Now here’s something I can agree with you. ;)

  175. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:40 pm  

    ethno-nationalist

    You mean Nazi scum.

    I don’t think Dalbir shares much in common with pond-life such as you.

  176. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:41 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 162

    Thank you for temporally putting your racist hatred of English people aside and lowering yourself to a reply to an Englishman. I feel so privalged.

    Unfortunately though your reply is just more transparent lies.

    What a rank coward you have turned out to be Dalbir, first so bold and assured in your racism and now so meek and contrite in the face of its implications.

    You say that you “don’t believe in the notion that any group is ethnically superior to another” but that is not even remotely true, now is it, because you quite openly and aggressively believe “we belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis.

    That is, you quite openly say that your ethnic group has more rights then another ethnic group.

    That is to say that you quite openly believe that your ethnic group has more right to exist in this country then another ethnic group. That is to say that you quite openly espouse that your ethnic group must therefore be superior to another ethnic group in order for these special privileges to apply.

    And that ethnic group that you deem as inferior, as illegitimate and as having less or no right to exist in England as Punjabis is the very English themselves.

    That very much makes you a racist, I am afraid my old china.

    And that very much make you a very sinister racist at that, given the implications of your statement.

    Now once again, I haven’t made any mention of Australia or Canada, that’s your strawman and consequently is no concern of mine.

    So Dalbir, are you going to find the same balls you had when you exposed yourself as a racist and tell us what you really think and why or are you just going to try and whimper your way out of it like a chiselling little coward?

    Do you really think that the contemporary English people are somehow responsible for your country today and that as a solution we should re-colonise you to rectify any past mistakes?

    Why do you think your ethnicity has more right to be in England then the English?

    Just where do you think the English do belong exactly, if not in England?

    Where would you have the English people exist?

    And if you consider that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what is your true opinion on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

    PS: If you actually answered the questions and showed some honesty perhaps you would’nt be so bored…

  177. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:46 pm  

    Abu Faris @ # 175

    I see you are working your way up into a self-righteous orgasm as a purported ‘anti-racist’ again but fail to condemn your Asian friend blatant racism on this thread.

    Rather odd. You really do have a rather strange and selective view of which racism is acceptable and which racism is not. Which is all rather racist in itself.

    Here is an easy one for you:

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

  178. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:51 pm  

    And you do not need to feel shy all the sudden – please tell us exactly what the “little sticks” are, and why you had to bring up the Nazi regime and their treatment of Jews to make this point.

    Not shy at all, that much at least should be obvious by now. Rather just a little weary at needing to recite the same thing over and over. So here we go again. Two sticks already cited: repeal of the RRA and reservation of public sector jobs and social housing for indigenous folk. There are many others which could be implemented to reduce the ‘pull’ factor, including basing citizenship on [i]jus sanguinis[/i], a prohibition on foreign ownership of real property, and so on.

    As for the Nazis, the reason for raising the matter was simply to note a historical precedent of a successful ‘repatriation’ scheme which was implemented on the basis of coercion rather than physical force. As stated, there are have been many others but that is the most prominent, and one of the few that did not actually entail violent means. In that I am referring to the period of Jewish expulsion from the Reich proper during 1933-39, and not to what occurred, a nuance which few here seem able to grasp.

    What questions are you referring?

    #146 refers. You can answer for Dalbir as well while you’re at it. He’s had three opportunities to do so already in this thread but has spurned them all. Go for it.

  179. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 7:59 pm  

    Actually IAE, Abu Thingy here is a classic example of a ‘fanatical multiculturalist’, a term which boyo introduced in an earlier post.

    In my experience, the most rabid form of that affliction occurs not amongst ethnics, whose support for multiculturalism rarely extends much beyond the sphere of their own self-interest, but amongst the most abjectly self-loathing members of the majority population such as friend Abu.

    In his case it wasn’t necessary to do much probing, since he volunteered the salient facts himself, but what I have usually found on deeper examination is that the animus that such specimens display towards the preservation of their own folk typically has its root in their having developed a taste for darker meat. As such, comments emanating from the likes of Abu can simply be dismissed as self-serving axe-grinding.

  180. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:04 pm  

    I think it is absolutely amazing how scientists can get chimps to do things like play ping-pong.

    “the preservation of his own folk typically has its root in their having developed a taste for darker meat”

    That’s off to the cattle-trucks for me, then. I wonder what badge they will make me wear – if I survive selection, that is.

  181. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:06 pm  

    I love the way that for these boneheads “multicultural” means “having-anything-to-do-with-not-White-people”. Their misapprehension and misunderstanding of a term speaks volumes.

    In a nutshell: Nazi, racist scum.

  182. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:10 pm  

    No cattle truck necessary for you Abu old boy, you’ve made your bed literally and figuratively, now you must lie in it. Just don’t bother coming back to Blighty though, there’s a good chap, you’ll be happier and better off where you are, amongst your chosen kinsfolk.

  183. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:12 pm  

    Of course you’re right Abu, for once. Multiculturalism is simply a polite euphemism for multiracial. Britain was a proudly multicultural society long before the Windrush arrived, although it didn’t need to characterise itself as such.

    ‘Multiculturalism’ is a concept invented by the therapeutic state, along with its ugly stepsister ‘racism’.

  184. Abu Faris — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:25 pm  

    A shame you don’t understand many polysyllabic words, Dan – else you would have realised that my comment caould not be read as equating multicultural with multiracial.

    On the other hand, as you want to make that equation, it simply confirms that you are – along with your chum, IAE, a Nazi.

    At least you are open about it – although what Herr Flick will make of your open flaunting of your Nazi credentials on this thread is anybody’s guess.

    As it happens, I come and go from the UK on a regular basis. And I shall continue to do so – despite the not very veiled threats of boneheads such as yourself.

    Now, isn’t there some worshipping of Odin or some other laughable deity you should be about?

  185. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:35 pm  

    Abu Faris @ # 181

    So it’s not just a misconception on my behalf then, you really just as dishonest and racist as your friend Dalbir and with all his qualities of an evasive chiselling coward too.

    You are only an ‘anti-racist’ when racism is directed at certain races you favour, and that makes you a racist of the worst kind yourself.

    It is most amusing and bizarre to witness how much you love and how hard you work at trying convey that you are some sort of indignant crusading ‘anti-racist’ when the truth and reality is that you are very much “racist scum” yourself.

    And it is very amusing and bizarre to witness you disparage and impugn other people who have no compunction whatsoever in giving very straight answers to any questions posed whilst you yourself cannot answer one very simple question, lest you expose your bigotry in the process:

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

  186. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:39 pm  

    Two sticks already cited: repeal of the RRA and reservation of public sector jobs and social housing for indigenous folk.

    And you are saying that this will be in the next BNP manifesto?

    As for the Nazis, the reason for raising the matter was simply to note a historical precedent of a successful ‘repatriation’ scheme

    Absolutely disgraceful.

    In that case it should not be difficult for you to provide a list of the new ideas that post-war Afro-Asian migrants have brought with them that have contributed to the flourishing of Europe. Please do.

    Do you think that the Allies would have succeeded if they had not relied on the men and women from their colonies? Perhaps there would not be an Europe flourishing today if the Nazis had won. As for the migrants themselves, they’ve contributed to British society after the war.

  187. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 8:46 pm  

    Well Abu, I feel quite certain That Herr Flick, whoever he may be, will have better things to do than to come here and bother with the demented maunderings of a common-or-garden Rassenschänder such as your good self.

    And as for Odin, I have no idea what you are blathering about. I am a lapsed Anglican and shall remain so until such time as the Church of England is rescued from the traitorous cultists who presently have within their clammy grasp.

    And just for the record, I am an ethno-nationalist which is quite distinct from national-socialist, although your ability to grasp such distinctions is clearly quite feeble.

  188. Termite — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:12 pm  

    I simply love the way that modern Nazis accuse everyone who disagrees with them of being racists.

    Utterly hilarious. Of course, no-one in their right mind would accuse supporters of Hitler’s race politics, overt anti-Semites, those with contempt for Black people, those who think in terms of “folk”, those who associate politically with convicted child-molesters, racist thugs, criminals and assorted nonces… no-one in their right minds would accuse such people of being Nazi scumbags who, quite frankly, forfeit the right to justice and should be hunted to the ends of the world like the filthy pigs they are.

  189. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:16 pm  

    And you are saying that this will be in the next BNP manifesto?

    In a muted form, yes.

    Absolutely disgraceful.

    How so? Is the recitation of historical fact that might offend delicate sensibilities proscribed where you come from?

    Do you think that the Allies would have succeeded if they had not relied on the men and women from their colonies?

    If by colonies you mean other than the white Dominions, the answer is yes.

    Perhaps there would not be an Europe flourishing today if the Nazis had won. As for the migrants themselves, they’ve contributed to British society after the war.

    I was rather hoping for specifics of the ‘new ideas’ which you indicated earlier had been brought by postwar Afro-Asian migrants and which have contributed to Europe’s ‘flourishing’. It is a given that millions of such migrants have arrived and have made an ‘economic contribution’ in the sense of taking up employment. But that is not the same as contributing ‘new ideas’, which was the original claim.

    And I notice that you have not attempted the ‘Dalbir question’, why is that?

    As a supplementary to you, and related to the economic contribution, can you name any commercial enterprises started by post-1948 migrants which have individually resulted in the creation of new jobs for, say, 500 or more indigenous Britons? Note the emphasis on ‘started’ which excludes the activities of asset-strippers like Lakshi Mittal and events such as the recent takeover of JLR by the Tata group.

    We understand that there are several hundred thousands employed in the curry industry, possibly the largest ethnic economic sector, but almost none of them are indigenous.

  190. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:24 pm  

    who associate politically with convicted child-molesters, racist thugs, criminals and assorted nonces

    Dear termite, I wish to protest in the strongest possible terms that I for one am not politically associated in any way with any faction in the LibLabCon coalition, whose shocking catalogue of disgusting peccadillos, which I assume you are referring to, may be viewed here:

    Liars, Buggers and Thieves

  191. IAE — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:43 pm  

    Termite @ # 188

    First time poster I see and yet oddly compelled to do so as a defender of Abu Faris replete with the bizarre distractions typical, it would seem, of this site. How strange.

    Perhaps Abu Faris will be so kind as to reappear himself and answer the simple question posed to him several times and clear it all up.

    But I wouldn’t hold your breath, Termite.

    And perhaps while he is at it he could explain why he lied through his teeth @ # 140 with his complete invention that I carried out illegal DoS (only one ‘S’ my old china) attacks on the HP site, a claim not even remotely made by HP themselves?

    And after he does that perhaps he could, as previously asked, substantiate his charge / lie that I had been banned from HP for “repeated racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks.”?

    Again, I wouldn’t hold your breath though Termite.

    You see Abu Faris is unfortunately, exactly as I have described him: A dishonest, racist, evasive chiselling coward.

    Not an ‘ad honimen’ opinion pulled out of thin air, you see friend, but an accurate assessment based upon his conduct here on this very thread and fully qualified as above.

    In fact, while you are at, would you care to substantiate your charge that I am indeed a “Nazi” with at least some semblance of proof, you know links and quotes? I very much doubt it.

    So in the (certain) eventuality that you find yourself unable to substantiate your allegation, can you then agree if you cannot prove the truth or merit of your charges they are in fact nothing other then hysterical ad honimen and smears and you should really apologise for your dishonest outburst in the name of decency, honesty and integrity?

    There’s a good chap.

    And perhaps in parting we might find agreement that when some racism bothers someone but other racism does not, that when someone is only an ‘anti-racist’ when racism is directed at certain races they favour that makes them a racist of the worst kind themselves.

    Excellent.

  192. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 9:51 pm  

    Dalbir and with all his qualities of an evasive chiselling coward too.

    No that’s your thing mate!

    I see my provocative prod regarding my right to be here has taken a life of its own. lol

    To the question of where English people belong, I’d ask for some explanation of why English people and their descendants are all over the globe – including, wait for it…..Canada and Aus. If the idea is that people should stick to their own ‘historical’ homes, how do you explain that? Pray do tell old chap?

    @173

    One of the many things that separates us is the emphasis on the ‘ethnological’ in our respective positions. If I run with the scenario presented in your post, what you are doing is the equivalent of me denying say white American Sikhs a place in a hypothetical Sikh country based on their ethnicity – which would be wrong. The same with Afghan Sikhs.

    Seriously though, for the IAE and Dan Dares out there. I get it. You don’t want us here. Until I get somewhere better to go, I’m not about to up and go, deal with it. The fact your own people are pretty well entrenched in – and not about to leave – other nations seems lost on you. But the truth is that consistency has nothing to do with your positions, which are blatantly whiteist. You think you are the only ones who have a right to push for your interests in the world. Wake up. Stop acting like a spoilt brat child, you can’t have everything you want! Now march off to bed without supper you naughty bascud.

  193. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:00 pm  

    In a muted form, yes.

    Just as I predicted.

    How so? Is the recitation of historical fact that might offend delicate sensibilities proscribed where you come from?

    It is not a recitation of a historical fact, it is historic revisionism.

    If by colonies you mean other than the white Dominions, the answer is yes.

    We will disagree then. And probably the people who recruited and used massive resources from the colonies for the war effort.

    I was rather hoping for specifics of the ‘new ideas’ which you indicated earlier had been brought by postwar Afro-Asian migrants and which have contributed to Europe’s ‘flourishing’

    Is this a difficult question? Think about the cultural (arts/music) and scientific contributions of ordinary British people who live in Britain, but also abroad and who influence this country. Isolating Britain or persecuting communities for their ethnicity is not a way for countries to flourish in those directions.

    And I notice that you have not attempted the ‘Dalbir question’, why is that?

    Because I have no clue what both of you are talking about.

    have individually resulted in the creation of new jobs for, say, 500 or more indigenous Britons?

    It is estimated that 4% of the Asian population generates 6% of British wealth. Is that good enough for your indigenous arse? :)

  194. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:07 pm  

    Canada and Aus. If the idea is that people should stick to their own ‘historical’ homes, how do you explain that?

    Good point – if Dan and IAE defend that each people should stick to their ancestral place, then why don’t they say it’s wrong for Europeans to live in the US, Canada, South Africa, Australia and NZ?

  195. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:38 pm  

    Because those countries were created by Europeans, they did not exist prior to their arrival. The indigenous population of each was both extremely sparse and extremely primitive. They made no contribution to the creation of the modern states that exist today. It was wrong to evict the existing population, where that happened, but I’d suggest that ample recompense has been made for that by now. I feel certain that the indigenous population in places like Australia and New Zealand would be unable to sustain a stable and propsperous modern society if the Europeans were to leave, which is why the subject never comes up except in discussions like this.

    On the other hand, I would agree that it was improper for Europeans to colonise already extant states or densely settled regions. Having said that, the number of white settlers in such places was relatively low, Latin America and Algeria being perhaps important exceptions.

  196. Ravi Naik — on 11th April, 2010 at 10:57 pm  

    Because those countries were created by Europeans, they did not exist prior to their arrival. The indigenous population of each was both extremely sparse and extremely primitive.

    But that seems to go against your ethno-nationalist existentialist credentials: that each people should stick with their own in their ancestral land. What you are defending is that people can actually emigrate to other places in search for a better life as long as the can conquer places and people by force deemed more primitive.

    Dan, I am afraid Dalbir got you there – it does sound hypocritical. From you and other ethno-nationalist existentialists.

  197. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:17 pm  

    No the point is eluding you. Australia, Canada, the United States and, to a large extent, Southern Africa were effectively Terra Nullius, large and extremely sparsely populated regions whose few inhabitants were at a Neolithic stage of development, being generous. No coherent civilisation existed in any of these areas, merely a collection of mutually antagonistic primitive tribes, which were spread extremely thinly across huge and largely empty land areas.

    It’s important to draw a clear distinction between the colonisation of such places and, say, India which was relatively developed and densely populated. European colonisation of places like India and Central Africa was, in my view wrong as well as ultimately counter-productive.

    I believe we can seriously claim that the European populations in North America and Australia *are* the real, de facto indigenous population, since they are the descendants of the settlers who first created the country as we know it today. The original indigenes are simply a historical footnote, rather like the ‘Ancient Britons’ who succumbed to the incursions from the continent in the Mesolithic and Neolithic. They also provide an object lesson for those today who deprecate the importance of defending a nation’s borders against unwelcome intruders.

  198. Dalbir — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:33 pm  

    They also provide an object lesson for those today who deprecate the importance of defending a nation’s borders against unwelcome intruders.

    So your admitting Europeans were essentially unwelcome intruders of Canada, Australia?

    Today you lament the (perceived) destruction of your own culture yet you seem to be pretty indifferent to the destruction of the way of life of the original inhabitants of the aforementioned countries. How do you square that?

    Saying that they were uncivilised is a bit… err… colonial don’t you think? Besides what authority sanctions this? Is it the authority of ‘opportunism’ or ‘supremacism’? Whatever your judgment values on them, they had their own way of life, held dear to them. Unless they were negatively interfering with life here, how does their mode of life exactly relate to the Anglo ‘right’ to conquer their lands and disempower them? Please explain?

  199. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:54 pm  

    It is not a recitation of a historical fact, it is historic revisionism.

    Kindly point out where in my remarks on the topic you find anything even mildly revisionist, that is, something which is not already regarded as established fact by normative historians.

    We will disagree then. And probably the people who recruited and used massive resources from the colonies for the war effort.

    Which resources and which colonies. Please try to support your assertions with verifiable facts otherwise they are worthless.

    Is this a difficult question? Think about the cultural (arts/music) and scientific contributions of ordinary British people who live in Britain, but also abroad and who influence this country. Isolating Britain or persecuting communities for their ethnicity is not a way for countries to flourish in those directions.

    I’m still waiting for an enumeration of these ‘new ideas’ which you claim have been introduced by post-war Afro-Asian migrants. Can’t you even cite just one?

    Because I have no clue what both of you are talking about.

    In that case I’ll repeat the question here again for you, even though it is quite plainly stated in post #146.

    …The third world invaders who have recently turned up more or less uninvited in the Eurosphere are essentially parasitic and collectively perform no useful function. Nobody has ever been able to define what if anything would be missed if they all were to be magically translevitated back to their ancestral homeland. Nobody here has even tried.

    It is estimated that 4% of the Asian population generates 6% of British wealth. Is that good enough for your indigenous arse?

    Not really, because it’s an entirely bogus claim that has already been torpedoed elsewhere. If you can produce the source for the claim, I will do it again. As I recall it originates from some blather spouted by Ken Livingstone when he was still mayor of London.

    And I still await your response to the query about job creation for indigenous Britons as a result of the post-1948 influx. Don’t worry if you can’t answer, I’ve been asking the question for years without getting a single response. I think we all understand why.

  200. Dan Dare — on 11th April, 2010 at 11:55 pm  

    I thought I’d bag the 200th post. Is this a record for PP?

  201. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:21 am  

    So what about Eugene Terre’blanche, Dan?

    A nation mourns?

    After all, let’s face it, the suspect list must be almost as large as the electoral register for the entire of SA.

  202. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:22 am  

    I find it amazing that you can count to 200, Dan.

  203. earwicga — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:26 am  

    Nazi camp Buchenwald marks 65 years since liberation

    BUCHENWALD, Germany — Survivors and dignitaries marked on Sunday 65 years since the US army liberated Buchenwald, one of the largest and most notorious Nazi concentration camps on German soil in World War II.

    “The majority of my comrades are dead, they are no longer with us,” said Guenther Pappenheim, 84, one of around 90 survivors from the camp near Weimar in central Germany who came to take part in a solemn ceremony.

    “But we have the great wish, the great request, that the memory of the victims of fascist terror, that the comrades who lost their lives in Buchenwald, live on our hearts … and are never forgotten.”

    Although technically not an extermination camp, all of which were in German-occupied Eastern Europe like Auschwitz in Poland, Buchenwald, high on a wooded hill called the Ettersberg, was still a place of immense suffering.

    An estimated 56,000 people from all over Europe died between 1937 and 1945, starved and worked to death in horrendous conditions, killed in medical experiments or summarily executed.

    They included some 8,000 Soviet prisoners of war killed by “Genickschuss” — a bullet in the back of the neck. Others prisoners were sent eastwards to the gas chambers or perished in “death marches” in the final weeks of the war.

    Around 250,000 people were imprisoned in Buchenwald between 1937 and 1945 and in its 136 nearby sub-camps where prisoners carried out forced labour in factories for the Nazi war effort.

    They included Jews, Roma, Sinti, gays, the disabled, Jehova’s Witnesses and real and imagined political opponents of Hitler from all over Nazi-occupied Europe including France, Ukraine, Poland and the Netherlands.

    When the horrified Sixth Tank Division of the Third US Army arrived at Buchenwald on April 11, 1945, they found 21,000 inmates, many dangerously emaciated. Also there were 900 adolescents and children, some as young as four.

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5ghp8jQHUFja37Z-mRn8Z1TETiYOA

  204. Ravi Naik — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:34 am  

    Kindly point out where in my remarks on the topic you find anything even mildly revisionist, that is, something which is not already regarded as established fact by normative historians.

    It’s your assertion that nazis provide an historical precedent of a successful ‘repatriation’ scheme of Jews.

    Which resources and which colonies. Please try to support your assertions with verifiable facts otherwise they are worthless.

    This is a good start.

    I’m still waiting for an enumeration of these ‘new ideas’ which you claim have been introduced by post-war Afro-Asian migrants. Can’t you even cite just one?

    Do you understand what ART and SCIENCE are? Are you telling me that you are unaware of any British scientist or artist who is not white? I mean, what planet do live in? I am really trying not to be treat you like a complete moron.

    In that case I’ll repeat the question here again for you, even though it is quite plainly stated in post #146.

    Well, I guess Nick Griffin would have to find a new scapegoat or he is out of his job, isn’t it? :) But let me ask you a similar question: would anything be missed if BNP members magically disappeared?

    Not really, because it’s an entirely bogus claim that has already been torpedoed elsewhere. If you can produce the source for the claim, I will do it again.

    Please do.

    And I still await your response to the query about job creation for indigenous Britons as a result of the post-1948 influx. Don’t worry if you can’t answer, I’ve been asking the question for years without getting a single response. I think we all understand why.

    Lornamead.

  205. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:38 am  

    So what about Eugene Terre’blanche, Dan?

    What about him? Apart from providing suggestible dupes like Dougie and Sarah with yet another exemplar of the type of savagery endemic in ‘multicultural’ societies, as if any were needed, I fail to see the relevance to the topic at hand.

    Anymore than Earwig’s risibly lame effort at spamming the board above.

    Where are the moderators when they are needed?

  206. Ravi Naik — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:46 am  

    Not really, because it’s an entirely bogus claim that has already been torpedoed elsewhere. If you can produce the source for the claim, I will do it again.

    Sorry, here is one source.

  207. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:48 am  

    Dalbir @ # 192

    Dear oh dear.

    Think your blatant and virulent racism will go unchallenged if you just pretend it never happened and enough space is put between it?

    It won’t.

    What a rank coward you have still turned out to be Dalbir, first so bold and assured in your racism and now so meek and contrite in the face of its implications.

    You say that you “don’t believe in the notion that any group is ethnically superior to another” but that is not even remotely true, now is it, because you quite openly and aggressively believe “we belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis.

    That is, you quite openly say that your ethnic group has more rights then another ethnic group.

    That is to say that you quite openly believe that your ethnic group has more right to exist in this country then another ethnic group. That is to say that you quite openly espouse that your ethnic group must therefore be superior to another ethnic group in order for these special privileges to apply.

    And that ethnic group that you deem as inferior, as illegitimate and as having less or no right to exist in England as Punjabis is the very English themselves.

    That very much makes you a racist, I am afraid my old china.

    And that very much make you a very sinister racist at that, given the implications of your statement.

    Now once again, I haven’t made any mention of Australia or Canada, that’s your strawman and consequently is no concern of mine.

    So Dalbir, are you going to find the same balls you had when you exposed yourself as a racist and tell us what you really think and why or are you just going to try and whimper your way out of it like a chiselling little coward?

    Do you really think that the contemporary English people are somehow responsible for your country today and that as a solution we should re-colonise you to rectify any past mistakes?

    Why do you think your ethnicity has more right to be in England then the English?

    Just where do you think the English do belong exactly, if not in England?

    Where would you have the English people exist?

    And if you consider that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what is your true opinion on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

    PS: If you actually answered the questions and showed some honesty perhaps you would’nt be so bored…

  208. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:48 am  

    Dan have a bash at #198

    I’m going bed now, look forward to reading your response on the morrow.

  209. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:03 am  

    Dalbir, I’ll be happy to, once you’ve attended to your outstanding business with IAE.

    He’s been more than patient with you and I’m sure I’m not only one finding your prevarication a little tiresome.

  210. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:03 am  

    Dalbir @ # 207

    Why don’t you have a bash @ # 206.

    “We belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis.

    You said it. You made that racist statement.

    You believe in it. It’s your philosophy.

    Now at least have the balls and integrity to explain why and answer the straight questions asked

  211. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:07 am  

    Abu Faris @ # 201

    And the same goes for you Abu Faris, it won’t go away, but everyone can see from your inability to defend yourself that you are indeed exactly as described: A dishonest, racist, evasive chiselling coward.

    As explained my old china, not an ‘ad honimen’ opinion pulled out of thin air in anyway but an accurate assessment based upon your conduct here on this very thread and fully qualified as above.

    In fact you haven’t stopped lying since you appeared on this thread.

    Or selectively ignoring blatant racist remarks. When some racism bothers someone but other racism does not, that when someone is only an ‘anti-racist’ when racism is directed at certain races they favour that makes them a racist of the worst kind themselves.

    You can’t even begin to redeem yourself by answering simple and straight questions because you know you have been caught out and so you just hope it will all go away or someone else will provide a distraction, any distraction.

    Here they are again for you:

    Care to explain why you lied through your teeth @ # 140 with your complete invention that I carried out illegal DoS (only one ‘S’ my old china) attacks on the HP site, a claim not even remotely made by HP themselves?

    And after you do that perhaps you could, as previously asked several times now, substantiate your charge / lie that I had been banned from HP for “repeated racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks.”?

    And maybe even clear up a substantial part of this and answer a very simple and very straightforward question:

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

  212. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:11 am  

    I fail to see the relevance [of the killing of Eugene Terre'blanche] to the topic at hand.

    Well, there’s fraternal for you!

    South African White Supremacist gets topped by his “boys” and his comrades in jackbootery in the UK run a mile to disassociate themselves from his Nazi views.

    Nazis incapable of standing up for each other, who would have thunk it?

    So cowardly and incapable of fraternity even amongst their own kind – what a species of lowlife is the Nazi.

  213. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:13 am  

    And for those of us who actually came here for a free and honest exchange, you know actual adult debate rather then the bizarre circus that most the commentators here have dragged it down to, I again present two short MSM reports and ask a few straightforward and genuine questions.

    Is it just possible someone here might be genuine enough, adult enough and honest enough to engage upon this?

    The first is a report on the implosion in swathes of Sweden that have been flooded with Third World immigration; watch the sheer contempt towards the police and ultimately the Swedish by the aliens in the clip matched only by the exasperation of the officers:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JBpVAj4ILM

    My question is: Given that it costs Sweden lots of money to have these people there and there is no economic benefit whatsoever (proof can be produced if you want but listen to the unemployment rate in the report to get a flavour) what possible reason could the Swedish government have as a supposed representative of Sweden’s interests for continuing this?

    What possible benefit can this be? For anyone?

    Especially after not only the massive fiscal impact and massive impact on social cohesion but also the massive impact on the crime rate, most especially rape and the rape of children (again, plenty of proof for that if disputed)?

    The second is a short report from a Norwegian MSM about one poor little Norwegian boy growing up in an immigrant majority district of Oslo and the profound effect this had on him.

    This poor kid has been beaten, told he is going to hell for being Norwegian, ostracised and left sad and friendless all because his idiotic parents wanted to buy into the multicult myth and impose it upon their child.

    Eventually, even these soppy deluded fools realise the extreme unhappiness of their child, the unworkable situation of the multicult in reality and the damage they are inflicting on him and at last allowed him follow his nature and instinct and be amongst his own.
    Needless to say, within pretty much the first minute of being amongst his own he was visibly happy.

    http://vimeo.com/10210382

    My question is this: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

  214. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:17 am  

    Anymore than Earwig’s risibly lame effort at spamming the board above.

    You have to remember, Earwicga, that for Dan and his gang of crooks, the death chambers were delousing rooms and the Holocaust has been greatly exaggerated.

    I’ve always been puzzled by Nazi Holocaust denial – one would have thought that in their twisted little minds, the genocide of the untermenschen would be celebrated as one of the great achievements of their vile heroes.

    Perhaps it is. After all, it was Dan, IAE or one of their equally deranged chums who left a comment on Gauleiter Lee’s blog approvingly quoting the words of one of the architects of the Nazi euthanasia programme, who later went on to despicable things involving children, lack of anaesthetic and truly insane “experiments”.

  215. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:32 am  

    Abu Faris – if you have real interest in my actual views on Nazism, rather than the juvenile and cartoonish ephemera that you appear to revel in, peruse this comment I posted on Majority Rights in just the last minutes.

    http://majorityrights.com/index.php/weblog/comments/death_of_a_patriot/#c91385

    Read, digest and desist from peddling your facile nonsense.

  216. earwicga — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:57 am  

    Yes Abu Faris, that is strange. Strange how Buchenwald can be described as spam, but then again considering the source of the comment it really isn’t.

  217. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:23 am  

    Read, digest and desist from peddling your facile nonsense.

    Read it, digested it and I cannot help noticing that your only condemnation of Nazism is that it is inappropriate to modern conditions.

    So my question would be – if conditions were those of the 1920s – 1940s would you be equally as disparaging of NS?

    I think you should have a word with your comrade, IAE – the mask is definitely slipping with that one.

    Incidentally, I don’t do what Nazis tell me to do as a matter of principle. It leads, history shows, to unfortunate consequences.

    You really do not want to get into a discussion about your dead South African comrade, Terre’blanche, do you?

    I wonder why?

    The overt Nazism of the AWB? Or the fact that it is emerging that he was (yet another) Nazi nonce?

  218. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 4:07 am  

    Abu Faris @ # 216

    You really are the most terrible liar are you not?!

    It’s quite shocking really! You and the truth part company the instant you touch a keyboard and most likely every time your lips move!

    What makes you so dishonest Abu Faris? What compels you to lie like a cheap NAAFI watch?

    Surely you do realise that although your cohorts here will make all of the fair weather internet faux solidarity noises towards you, in reality they can all now see just what a fantastic liar you really are and a selective racist with not a shred of integrity to boot?

    We can add this latest lunatic lie to the list of lies that you purvey as routine:

    “After all, it was Dan, IAE or one of their equally deranged chums who left a comment on Gauleiter Lee’s blog approvingly quoting the words of one of the architects of the Nazi euthanasia programme, who later went on to despicable things involving children, lack of anaesthetic and truly insane “experiments”

    So once again, how about some sort of proof for your latest allegation / lie / smear?

    And then perhaps you could also explain why you lied through your teeth @ # 140 with your complete invention that I carried out illegal DoS (only one ‘S’ my old china) attacks on the HP site, a claim not even remotely made by HP themselves?

    And after you do that perhaps you could, as previously asked several times now, substantiate your charge / lie / smear that I had been banned from HP for “repeated racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks.”?

    And maybe even clear up a substantial part of this and answer a very simple and very straightforward question:

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

    Then how about actually attempting something radical like the honest debating on a debating site of something of substance such the post @ # 212?

    And why not end with illuminating us all as to what this last piece of random and idiotic gibberish is supposed mean in to sane and decent people:

    “I think you should have a word with your comrade, IAE – the mask is definitely slipping with that one.”

    Oh dear oh dear.

    We have got a right one here, boys!

  219. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:08 am  

    Not interested in arguing with the Fash – especially as they are getting so very deranged:

    On a thread concerning the traitor, anti-Semite poet, Ezra Pound, one of your comrades made the following observation:

    One of the most interesting would be a movie on Karl Brandt the “Nazi doctor”. Hanged after the war by the good old US of A. He had wanted to work with Albert Schweizer in Africa as a missionary doctor but got swept up in the events of the 20 th century. Actually a thoroughly decent and kind man who only supported euthanasia for those who were pityfully suffering with such awful mental and physical deformities; he was actually an idealist.

    Karl Brandt (January 8, 1904 – June 2, 1948) headed the administration of the Nazi euthanasia program from 1939 and was selected the personal physician of Adolf Hitler in August 1944. As Major General Reich Commissioner for Health and Sanitation he was involved in criminal human experimentation, along with his deputy Werner Heyde and others. After World War II Brandt was convicted of crimes against humanity and executed by hanging.

    Brandt was tried along with twenty-two others at the Palace of Justice in Nuremberg, Germany. The trial was officially titled United States of America v. Karl Brandt et al., but is more commonly referred to as the “Doctors’ Trial”; it began on December 9, 1946. He was charged with four counts: 1) conspiracy to commit war crimes and crimes against humanity as described in counts 2 and 3; 2) War crimes: performing medical experiments, without the subjects’ consent, on prisoners of war and civilians of occupied countries, in the course of which experiments the defendants committed murders, brutalities, cruelties, tortures, atrocities, and other inhuman acts. Also planning and performing the mass murder of prisoners of war and civilians of occupied countries, stigmatized as aged, insane, incurably ill, deformed, and so on, by gas, lethal injections, and diverse other means in nursing homes, hospitals, and asylums during the Euthanasia Program and participating in the mass murder of concentration camp inmates; 3) Crimes against humanity: committing crimes described under count 2 also on German nationals; 4) Membership in a criminal organization, the SS. The charges against him included special responsibility for, and participation in, Freezing, Malaria, LOST Gas, Sulfanilamide, Bone, Muscle and Nerve Regeneration and Bone Transplantation, Sea-Water, Epidemic Jaundice, Sterilization, and Typhus Experiments.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Brandt_%28Nazi_physician%29

    NAAFI watch?

    Not another Nazi pretending he was in the armed forces!

  220. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:10 am  

    Now do fuck off back to your home made SS uniforms and wotan worship in the woods, you loony.

  221. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:11 am  

    On the other hand – how about telling us what you think about Terre’blanche?

    No – well I wonder why not.

  222. Ravi Naik — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:27 am  

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

    This is getting pathetic – at 4:00AM you are still whining about this. Why don’t you and Dalbir just agree to disagree on who is more entitled to live in this country? If you want to debate like an adult, act like one.

    The first is a report on the implosion in swathes of Sweden that have been flooded with Third World immigration; watch the sheer contempt towards the police and ultimately the Swedish by the aliens

    Why do you go to Sweden, where most people are unaware of its reality? Why not stick to Britain? You seem to want to extrapolate what happens in Sweden to this country, which is rather silly.

    the massive impact on the crime rate, most especially rape and the rape of children (again, plenty of proof for that if disputed)?

    Yes, I would like some proof of that, including pedophilia crimes. In fact, I want numbers not percentages, and I want the number of convicted people not arrested on suspicion.

    The second is a short report from a Norwegian MSM about one poor little Norwegian boy growing up in an immigrant majority district of Oslo and the profound effect this had on him. This poor kid has been beaten

    (a) Use children to evoke strong emotions – checked
    (b) Insinuate the non-whites are savages – checked
    (c) Evoke images of tribalism and being under sieged – checked

    So well done, Mr Griffin – your propaganda just passed quality control.

    Bullying is unfortunately a reality in several schools – it is something that nobody should be subject to, but you are certainly not immune to that by racial separation.

  223. Sarah AB — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:59 am  

    IAE – ok, I watched parts of your clips when you first posted them. As I said earlier I have no objection to engaging with particular problems and incidents whatever the religion or colour of the perpetrators. I mentioned the Dispatches programme as an example of what I felt was a (mostly) legitimate intervention into the kinds of debates you raise. Boyo earlier said he didn’t think that problems raised by mass immigrations were taboo and neither do I. But your whole world view makes me view your ‘evidence’ with some suspicion and I don’t have time to investigate it more fully. Even if I watched the videos fully and felt they had a fair point to make I would still want to place them within a fuller context and interpret them differently from you. I’m sure many, many non-white children have been made to feel upset and left out by white class mates – and my own (white) son has been hassled by some (white) Christian classmates for his atheism and told he would go to Hell. However his non-white Muslim class mate doesn’t pick these fights with him. Why should the violence or bigotry of non-white, non-Christian individuals or groups make me view my own non-white, non-Christian friends and relatives any differently? I hope they don’t judge me by the actions of EDL thugs etc.

  224. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 12:28 pm  

    “I hope they don’t judge me by the actions of EDL thugs etc.”

    Sorry to interject: most won’t- I say most because I dont doubt that there will be a small minority of idiotic haters in all cultures, religions (and non-religionists) and races, just as the BNP and EDL continue to only represent a small minority of the indigenous population. Even amongst them you see the odd BME hater has been adopted as a friendly face.

    Rab rakha!

  225. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 1:24 pm  

    Sarah @ # 221

    You appear much more polite and reasonable then most of the oddballs here so please don’t misinterpret this as an attack of any sort; it is merely a pointed observation.

    But the simple reality is that you don’t even have the first clue of who am I or any of my “world view” let alone my “whole world view”; the simple truth and reality is that you don’t know me from a bar of soap.

    And certainly in the couple of dozen comments I have posted you could not have gotten to know me anywhere that intimately even if I were able to engage in debate with mature people like you, rather then having to highlight falsehoods and anomalies in the main.

    So here is another irony: Your whole opinion of me, having sat in judgment over me, your whole attitude is shaped not by fact but by prejudice something that you quite erroneously allude to find in me.

    I mention but two concerns, very legitimate and very reasonable at that and provide evidence for them; however the absurd but deliberate process of polarization in this country demands that I become a de facto “Nazi” for raising such concerns in the first place.

    That is the situation we now have in this country, anyone who raises any such concerns ends up as “Nazi” if the marker isn’t placed there straight away and not only is it just not the case far more often then not and consequently deeply unjust, but it is outright dangerous; it not only destroys open debate (as was the intention behind the popular process) but it further alienates and angers people that are not even remotely “Nazis” and disenfranchises them further.

    (If I were to call you a communist for your position I am sure you would find it entirely false, and hopefully equally as offensive, given that they have murdered over 100 million people for their ideology.)

    And that is why these debates never work and that is why these issues are guaranteed to proceed like a pressure cooker.

    But to summarize your position on my comment and questions @ # 212, can you not see how the same prejudicial process is in play here as not only are you substantively commenting on the reports blind, not having watched them through, you are also proclaiming what your definite position on your ‘interpretation’ of them would be also, still not having even taken them in?

    If you had have taken them in you would see that the second report is far from the scenario you describe and this boy has been TOTALLY isolated PURELY because he is white, in fact indigenous, and that all of the actions against him, the beatings, insults etc are PURELY motivated by his ethnicity too; it is not religious as the child clearly states that he has followed his parents into atheism.

    You would have also have seen the extreme misery he was living in due to his immensely irresponsible parents who deliberately exposed him such misery in order to satisfy their own ideological illusions; and that when even they realized it wasn’t working and never would and took him to a majority indigenous school the boys happiness and spirits visibly soared literally within one minute of being amongst kin.

    I would highly recommend you watch them when you get a chance Sarah, and do so with an open mind rather then a preconceived idea of how you are going to ‘interpret’ them.

    My questions surrounding this and the other report are @ # 212 if anyone else here is really interested in debate.

  226. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:17 pm  

    Why don’t you have a bash @ # 206.

    “We belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis.

    You said it. You made that racist statement.

    You believe in it. It’s your philosophy.

    Now at least have the balls and integrity to explain why and answer the straight questions asked

    Okay darling. The truth is that knowing how those of your ilk are driven to borders of insanity at the thought of nonwhites here, I provocatively made that statement to purposefully rile you. It seems to have worked a treat! lol

    If you think that I genuinely believe that English people have no right here (as you keep banging on) then you must be some sort of professional moron. I guess you just don’t know how to take my cheek?

    To reexplain in more simple terms: I made the statement because I thought it would piss you (and other nazis) off…..do you understand?

    Incidentally, the way you are expecting other forum members to answer for my statements is stupid.

    For the record, I place more importance on my Sikh identity than the Panjabi one. Just so you know.

    There, now I’ve clarified that have a bash at #198.

    You teufel schwein.

  227. Jai — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:19 pm  

    Interesting that a simple question can generate more than 220 comments, a large proportion of which are from a couple of BNP supporters and whose comments are predominantly dedicated to actually avoiding answering the question, especially in the clear, comprehensive, officially-authorised and on-the-record manner stipulated in the main article.

    It is not necessary to separately email this question to Lee John Barnes; the query is being addressed to the BNP’s senior leadership directly, publicly and formally on a globally-visible website, and full contact details for the correspondence have already been provided in the main article.

    Mr Barnes himself is also not necessarily personally required to provide the response; a detailed answer in line with the requirements and conditions stipulated in the main article would be welcomed via the aforementioned contact forms from any member of the BNP’s senior leadership who is formally authorised to discuss this matter.

  228. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:21 pm  

    I’m real sorry Jai. I indulged in nazi baiting. It was too hard to resist.

  229. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:33 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 226

    This just possibly might have carried some weight and held some water had you not already had two other attempts at desperately backtracking on your overt and aggressive racism and finally arrived at this load of old crap 24 hours later.

    In fact your first attempt to spin your way out of the implications of your obvious racism from the original assertion:

    …“We belong here more than the English”…

    was to further render it to:

    …“I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada”…

    and when I pointed out that you were not placing your ethnicity on any ‘same’ or ‘equal’ right but far superior to others, the indigenous English at that, you then had another crack and amended your position to:

    “My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference…”…

    and so not only confirmed again that you meant every word of your original statement but further confirmed the ‘we’ was made in reference to Punjab and Punjabis, an ethnic group, and not as your latest backtracking lie would have it, a religious group.

    Why on earth don’t you just cut the crap, embrace you said what you said and tried some pathetic justifications of it, and now you have been caught outright lying about it finally find the same balls you had when you exposed yourself as a racist and tell us what you really think and why and stop trying to whimper your way out of it like a chiselling little coward.

    Do you really think that the contemporary English people are somehow responsible for your country today and that as a solution we should re-colonise you to rectify any past mistakes?

    Why do you think your ethnicity has more right to be in England then the English?

    Just where do you think the English do belong exactly, if not in England?

    Where would you have the English people exist?

    And if you consider that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what is your true opinion on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

  230. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:51 pm  

    Jai @ # 227

    I personally haven’t avoided any questions at all; I haven’t been asked any and I am not in a position to answer the queries in your main body as I do not meet your criteria.

    One person who does offered that you email the questions to him and promised he would answer them; you refuse to do even that but then complain that it remains unanswered.

    I have responded to comments here that have developed organically as a result of your post, one comment of which was of an aggressive and overtly racist nature yet attracted condemnation from only one person here, on this site purportedly full of anti-racists.

    Despite his now transparent and frantic attempts to write it off as ‘a joke’ (I’m sure any white posting of say, “we belong here more then the Jews etc’ would have been met with fury and ridiculed out of the room when later claming it to be a ‘joke’ in any case) I have fully exposed this for the cowardly spin it is, after his previous two attempts at justification failed miserably.

    And so it remains, only one person here condemns such blatant racism and you are not amongst them Jai.

  231. Jai — on 12th April, 2010 at 2:53 pm  

    I’m real sorry Jai. I indulged in nazi baiting. It was too hard to resist.

    No problem, Dalbir; it’s best not to give such people openings to divert the discussion onto irrelevant tangents and deliberately confuse the issue, especially as many of them are actively looking for ammunition to exploit in order to further their racist agendas. Remember that this website isn’t exactly a private conversation.

  232. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 3:38 pm  

    …“We belong here more than the English”…

    The original statement made to get on your ‘bristols’. It worked! lol

    “My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference…”…

    A counter to your fiction about the magnanimous nature of English interference abroad. Also a genuine point to contrast your own perception about the state of Britain compared to a nation that genuinely had it bad.

    …“I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada”…

    Deny Anglo rights there and you will have some consistency to your position. If not, shut up and put up with us here, like you expect the indigenous there to do with Anglos.

    And yes, I have the same right here as any white Anglo. Deal with it. By the way, when I went to the pub this weekend, I noticed white people didn’t seem to mind my presence – I would go as far as to say some of them seemed actually pleased to see me. What makes you so different – please explain? Is it something to do with the Black Sun God or similar bullshit.

    This is getting proper convoluted and boring fella. The fact that you have to clutch at straws like you are says a lot.

    Jai:Remember that this website isn’t exactly a private conversation.

    I’m not sure these twats represent the average Brit. None of the white guys I saw this weekend seemed remotely interested in this type of shite, they were more bothered about the football. Some of them had had a punch up between themselves the night before, so much for unity.

    At best they may represent some lumpen sections of backward northern, 3 generation council estate dwelling, semi-illiterate folks.

  233. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 4:14 pm  

    IAE – Another quick one.

    Who has a more rightful claim to belonging in Canada/Aus. The indigenous or the descendants of the Anglo invaders?

  234. Ravi Naik — on 12th April, 2010 at 4:32 pm  

    it’s best not to give such people openings to divert the discussion onto irrelevant tangents and deliberately confuse the issue, especially as many of them are actively looking for ammunition to exploit in order to further their racist agendas. Remember that this website isn’t exactly a private conversation.

    Jai, your question directed to the BNP is a check-mate, except that the BNP is playing the game with a different set of rules and they know how to spin it.
    You want to win with reason, logic and facts, but that’s not gonna “kill” it.

    I did find this thread very enlightening. Dan Dare has given us an insight of what “voluntary repatriation” means: by first repealing the Race Equality Act, so that they can make the life of non-whites as hard as possible, as the Nazis did to the Jews before they murdered them (#121).

  235. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 4:58 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 232

    You are digging a deeper hole for yourself and exposing more of your terrible lies with each cowardly attempt to chisel out of your publicly expressed racist belief.

    The latest piece of invention you have come up with in regard to your overt racism actually being a ‘joke after all 24 hours later’ is that:

    … “the original statement made to get on your ‘bristols’. It worked! Lol” …

    whilst once again the truth tells a completely different story in that you made your blatantly racist belief known in comment # 24 and I didn’t even enter the thread and begin commenting until comment # 82.

    So once again your attempts at a cover up are a failure, exposed for the lies that they are and you as the liar you are along with it.

    Not even people here presumably generally ‘on your side’ believe you as the comments by Ravi Naik @ # 130 and Sarah AB @ # 137 demonstrate.

    This latest piece of rank dishonesty is on top of your other blatant lies already exposed here; Dalbir you really are a deceitful and racist piece of work and a coward to boot.

    “these twats” as you now refer to Englishmen have every right to be in their own country and every right to hold up your racism to account.

    So instead of your straw man distractions, once more let’s get to the bottom of your real racist beliefs as originally expressed when you found balls enough to say:

    …“We belong here more than the English”…

    which upon challenge was eventually rendered to:

    …“I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada”…

    and when I pointed out that you were not placing your ethnicity on any ‘same’ or ‘equal’ right but far superior to others, the indigenous English at that, you then had another crack and amended your position to:

    “My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference…”…

    and so not only confirmed again that you meant every word of your original statement but further confirmed the ‘we’ was made in reference to Punjab and Punjabis, an ethnic group, and not as your latest backtracking lie would have it, a religious group.

    Why on earth don’t you just cut the crap, embrace you said what you said and tried some pathetic justifications of it, and now you have been caught outright lying about it finally find the same balls you had when you exposed yourself as a racist and tell us what you really think and why and stop trying to whimper your way out of it like a chiselling little coward.

    I will gladly address your straw man distraction just as soon as you have addressed my legitimate questions:

    Do you really think that the contemporary English people are somehow responsible for your country today and that as a solution we should re-colonise you to rectify any past mistakes?

    Why do you think your ethnicity has more right to be in England then the English?

    Just where do you think the English do belong exactly, if not in England?

    Where would you have the English people exist?

    And if you consider that the English have no legitimacy to exist in their own country then what is your true opinion on the English people’s legitimacy to exist anywhere else?

  236. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 5:00 pm  

    Jai @ # 231

    You too have a rather odd and quite blatantly superior way of referring to Englishmen as “such people” and confusing genuine and reasonably expressed concerns with “racist agendas” all with no basis in reality or even any attempt at substantiation whatsoever.

    I refer you to comment # 225 for a full breakdown of this erroneous, unjust and highly offensive tactic and prejudicial attitude.

    The simple fact is that not only have you have failed to condemn real racism here on this thread and on your site, but you have dismissed it as “no problem.”

  237. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 5:13 pm  

    IAE

    Now you’ve bored the fuck out of me with your convoluted theories.

    Lets make it simple. When English people leave other countries they are currently colonising, I’ll consider leaving here.

    Until then, shut the fuck up and put up.

  238. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 5:34 pm  

    The simple fact is that not only have you have failed to condemn real racism here on this thread and on your site, but you have dismissed it as “no problem.”

    I didn’t see you getting indignant and complaining about these classics, I wonder why?

    Just another common or garden miscegenist then, and one so pussy-whipped that he has to affect a camel-jockey’s moniker rather than a real man’s Anglo-Saxon handle.

    Chin up old son. There’s worse thing’s than being married to a wog.

  239. Shamit — on 12th April, 2010 at 5:56 pm  

    Jai’s article would be republished this evening on eGov monitor and as always we would be writing officially to BNP to offer any responses they might have –

    However, like before we are not going to publish any rantings or idiotic propaganda rather answers to the key question posed in this article.

    However, if BNP is interested, I am willing to offer Nick Griffin (and only Nick Griffin) an opportunity to do an email interview – 5 – 15 questions with us – where all responses would be directly attributed to him as he sends it. We would write to Mr. Griffin through his media office tomorrow.

    And PP readers and commentators are welcome to send their suggestions with regard to questions.

    *************************

  240. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 5:58 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 236 & 237

    And now your anger at being comprehensively exposed as a racist liar is coming to the fore with expletives.

    Not even people here presumably generally ‘on your side’ believe you. And how could they? It’s such a blatant lie. You are quite clearly a racist.

    As for convoluted?! Hardly, it is very simple logic picking apart your lies by using a liar’s worst enemies: Facts and the truth.

    If this was a court for liars, you’d been have sent down 100 comments back.

    Go on then, just for laughs, let’s see you lie way out of your last lie:

    … “the original statement made to get on your ‘bristols’. It worked! Lol” …

    when once again the truth and the facts are diametrically opposed to your latest story in that you made your blatantly racist belief known in comment # 24 and I didn’t even enter the thread and begin commenting until comment # 82.

    Go on, let’s hear you try and squirm and lie your racist way out of that whopper.

    Because you clearly are too much of a chiseling coward to admit that you meant every word of your racist belief and elaborate further after you had originally tried to justify it, then changed it to ‘it’s all a joke folks’ but got caught out in your lies.

    “These twats” as the racist parlance you now employ to refer to Englishmen have every right to be in their own country and every right to hold up your racism to account, just as you have every right to hold your racist belief, even if you only have the courage to let it slip out once (and only after you had came back from the pub with a Sunday drink inside you by the sounds of it) and then have to whimper around and try and lie your way out of it when faced with the full implications of your public racism.

    (And of the two examples you produce as your latest distraction away from your own virulent racist belief are the first time I have seen them and use at worst mild ethnic epitaphs which I myself do not use nor do I condone; whereas you expressed real racist beliefs that could only involve an ideology of racial superiority and an execution by violence and quite possibly even genocide and has been highlighted extensively all over this thread and already remarked upon by Jai as “no problem.”

    Massive, massive difference fella, and once again your pathetic distractions have failed to draw attention away from your virulent racism.)

    So go on, address the lies and then questions and then I will quite happily answer your straw men.

    To paraphrase you:

    “Until then, shut the fuck up and put up.”

    (Although I think you’ll find the English phrase is ‘put up or shut up’, you know, with it actually making sense in that order.)

  241. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 6:19 pm  

    Post a concise version if you want me to bother reading it.

    Your “He said, she said, he said, she said. Then he turnt round and goes, then he turnt around and goes….” account is ridiculous.

  242. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 6:32 pm  

    @Abu Faris #217

    So my question would be – if conditions were those of the 1920s – 1940s would you be equally as disparaging of NS?

    In order to answer I will need you to clarify the context. Are you asking about a future scenario in which economic and social conditions in Britain come to resemble those in Weimar Germany? Or are you asking for my opinion whether the Germans themselves made a rational choice in voting the NSDAP into power in 1932?

    You really do not want to get into a discussion about your dead South African comrade, Terre’blanche, do you?

    Not particularly, I fail to see the relevance. Southern Africa was lost years ago when the liberal managerial elites conspired to undermine the governments of Rhodesia and South Africa, while at the same time abandoning the European population in both countries to the tribal savagery which now endemic there. White farmers being hacked to death by gangs of feral blacks is no longer even newsworthy it is such a common occurrence these days. Any white person who continues to linger in that region a day longer than strictly necessary is simply signing their own death warrant.

  243. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 6:43 pm  

    Jai @ 227

    I think it’s rather unlikely given everything else on their plates at the moment that any of the BNP leadership will be responding to your enquiry in the very near future. It’s a little unrealistic to expect otherwise.

    As for my own participation in this thread, I was interested in making two separate but related points.

    1. The legal framework for a voluntary repatriation scheme already exists and has done so since since 1971. In fact, as already noted, the scheme is already in use in a limited way. All that the BNP would need to do is properly fund the scheme and make its existence more widely known.

    2. The proposition that such a scheme is not viable or unaffordable is flawed because it focuses only on the economic cost and does not take account of the likely fiscal and social benefits that would ensue.

    So far, despite the shitstorm of bile, insult and invective that has emanated from your side nobody here has been able to offer any coherent counter-argument to these two simple points.

    Can you?

  244. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 6:43 pm  

    IEA if you honestly believe that the following expletives:

    “Just another common or garden miscegenist then, and one so pussy-whipped that he has to affect a camel-jockey’s moniker rather than a real man’s Anglo-Saxon handle.

    Chin up old son. There’s worse thing’s than being married to a wog.”

    -are ‘at worst mild ethnic epitaphs’, then you need to hold the mirror you put up to Dalbir’s tongue in cheek remarks, and see yourself for the racist you really are. Oh the irony!

    He has explained his remarks clearly and coherently, but perhaps they weren’t racist enough for you to passover? Perhaps.

    You obviously want to use this as a diversionary tactic to help LJB and BNP avoid the real questions asked, and have made abismal excuses to avoid answering them yourself.

    Dalbir you know if you keep responding to this drivel, IAE will end up with a bloody thesis just on your responses; can you imagine how long the next post will be, lol. From your past posts we know you’re not a racist-IAE quite clearly has been stripped of all notions of understanding sarcasm, thats why blatant racist chatter is so mild to his/her palate.

    Come on IAE answer the questions in the opening thread, or are you afraid to be honest about your own views? not that the ‘mild’ analysis isn’t a giveaway.

    Rab rakha!

  245. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:01 pm  

    Mangles, you need to provide the whole exchange not just your edited highlights. This is the bit you keep missing out, where Père Abu sets out his stall, setting the tone for what is to follow …

    Oh go on, you fascist piece of excrement… I dare you, Dan.

    I’ll be happy to accept your approbation provided you are man enough to criticise Abu as well.

  246. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:08 pm  

    IAE,

    This thread was going along in a fairly civillised manner until you turned up. You are quite right to say that you have contributed nothing to it. In reply to Sarah @ 225

    But the simple reality is that you don’t even have the first clue of who am I or any of my “world view” let alone my “whole world view”; the simple truth and reality is that you don’t know me from a bar of soap.

    What is your world view, apart from spending quite a lot of time doing to me what you claim has been done to you?

    You don’t ‘know’ me either. Although I spelled out @ 73, 78, 84 and 88 what I consider noxious about the BNP. Rather than address that your first response @ 89 assumes all of that should be ignored, and that I should just jump to your tune.

    Frankly, no. That is not what debate consists of. You could try answering a few questions on your own account if anyone is to see you as anything much more than a one dimensional troll.

    Would it be reasonable to assume that you are a BNP member or at least fanboy? Tell us all a little about your overall ideas, and stop thumping on about one sentence in one reply.

  247. Jai — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:11 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    So far, despite the shitstorm of bile, insult and invective that has emanated from your side nobody here has been able to offer any coherent counter-argument to these two simple points.

    Can you?

    With all due respect, I’m not interested in debating scenarios on this comments thread with you. The only answer I am interested in is one forthcoming from any member of the BNP’s senior leadership, on the record and in writing via the contact facilities provided in the main article.

    Proxy statements from people sympathetic to them are irrelevant to me, regardless of how “unrealistic” the person concerned may believe it is to currently expect an answer from a democratic party campaigning for national election and focusing on one of their major policies which has significant ramifications for this entire country and its entire population.

  248. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:13 pm  

    Dalbir you know if you keep responding to this drivel, IAE will end up with a bloody thesis just on your responses; can you imagine how long the next post will be

    Mangles,

    In a crazy twisted way it is flattering, I’ve never had so much careful attention paid to my throw away comments.

    But the desperation with which they clutch at these and the way they hypocritically ignore points about the lack of consistency between the position they espouse here in England and what is going on globally in terms of Anglo migration/colonisation of other countries says a lot.

    What sort of imbecile would be blind to the fact that groups they clearly identify with are doing exactly what they accuses migrants here of doing. It is beyond belief.

    In the end, it doesn’t take a genius to figure out we are likely to have a tryst with these people in the old fashioned way. It isn’t worth banging on about it on the Internet. This is exactly what we are meant to be ‘tyaar bar tyaar’ for. That’s an important theme to push through the UK section of the panth now, especially the munday.

    I think these pillocks raise their heads every 2/3 decades when times are hard. What they don’t understand is that for many us settled here, it’s like a marriage – we are in it for better or worse. Until we decide to leave, if we ever do.

  249. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:30 pm  

    Dalbir,

    The point is that Dan Dare and IAE are vociferous. But they are a politically very weak brand of disaffected Tories. (Those that aren’t currently ex-pat.)

    It is part of the ‘one solution fits all’ approach that immature political parties take to solving problems / taking power. And never underestimate the degree to which taking power is a motivation for any politician. UKIP blames the EU for absolutely everything, Respect blames the USA, the BNP blames immigration. And so on, and so on…

    ————————-

    It is also of interest to note that the rise of the National Socialists in Germany during the 1920′s and ’30′s appears to be a specialist subject – well, the revisionist version anyway – on which topic they would all do extremely well on Mastermind. It is as though there was no other history worth knowing or discussing.

  250. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:37 pm  

    Jai @245.

    I understand that you want to hear it from the horse’s mouth and perhaps in due course you might.

    However you didn’t confine yourself to making a straightforward request, you chose to embellish it with personal commentary and supposition. That was what I was responding to. If you don’t wish to defend your assertions from attack in front of your home crowd that’s perfectly fine by me.

    Just as long as we’re clear on the matter.

  251. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:46 pm  

    Dan whereas:

    ‘Oh go on, you fascist piece of excrement… I dare you, Dan.’

    - is clearly baiting of an individual, in this case you, though using expletives which are both un-needed and I do not condone of, it challenged your political ideology to be bared.

    Your response:

    “Just another common or garden miscegenist then, and one so pussy-whipped that he has to affect a camel-jockey’s moniker rather than a real man’s Anglo-Saxon handle.

    Chin up old son. There’s worse thing’s than being married to a wog.”

    -is quite clearly a racist attack not on the person debating you, but on the race and ethnicity of a third party. Now that reply from you has clearly tainted the possibility of a balanced contribution from you in this debate, as your repulsion of non-whites or those in relationships with other races is quite abhorrent.

    There you go Dan, I have criticised Abu. What approbation do you think is suitable for your response, given that in this instance the censorship tab has been lifted and so I cannot suggest you are barred for the views you have expressed? But at least we know you are a racist.

    It will be helpful to move the debate on if you can speak to your friends at BNP and ask them ever so politely to provide a policy response to the questions raised it will be most helpful, until then perhaps your approbation should be that you go into self-imposed exile?

    Rab rakha!

  252. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:46 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    A series of questions have already been put to Lee John Barnes (LlB Hons). He responded at first and then he didn’t. As Jai said in the OP:

    Absolutely no details have been forthcoming. The silence is deafening.

    This very simple question, focusing on one of the BNP’s major policies, and presented to a self-proclaimed legal & democratic political party which is campaigning in the General Election, is not posed solely to the BNP’s legal director but to any member of the BNP’s senior leadership.

    He knows what the questions are, and as Jai rightly says, the BNP have plausible deniability over whatever you or IAE chose to say.

    Barnes knows what the questions are, he has commented here himself @ 6 and 8.

    I would assume that Jai will pursue this….

  253. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:50 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 239 & 246

    Ye another distraction from a comprehensively exposed liar and racist.

    Care to have crack at lying your way out of your latest lie and amusing us all:

    … “the original statement made to get on your ‘bristols’. It worked! Lol” …

    when once again the truth and the facts are diametrically opposed to your latest story in that you made your blatantly racist belief known in comment # 24 and I didn’t even enter the thread and begin commenting until comment # 82.

    Go on, let’s hear you try and squirm and lie your racist way out of that whopper.

  254. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:51 pm  

    @Dougie 247

    From a quick dekko at your blog I’d hazard a guess that you’re a supporter of the SNP. In the the context of ‘immature’ single-issue parties, which is how you characterise the BNP, does the SNP have any other string to its bow besides wishing to be rid of the hateful Sassenachs?

    And how do you account for the fact the SNP won two MEPs in the recent election, the same as the BNP, despite only receiving a third as many votes?

  255. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:56 pm  

    In all truth, Dougie, I’d recommend that if Jai is serious about wanting to learn official party policy he should not address such questions to Lee John Barnes, but rather directly to the party’s press officer.

    He (Jai) would hardly expect Chris Grayling, Phil Woolas or Chris Huhne to turn up here in an official capacity for inquisition so it’s a little baffling why he should expect senior BNP officials to do so.

  256. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:58 pm  

    Mangles @ # 242

    Keen to join in the distraction away from your racist friend and his racist comments I see?

    Lets play along for a while: Those remarks are not ‘expletives’ but as already explained ‘epitaphs’ so I assume your moniker describes what happens to my language when you use it; secondly I already I said I don’t use or condone such epitaphs, and thirdly the actual context it was used in has now been revealed i.e. in response to some pretty extreme abuse and epitaphs are not any statement of malign intent.

    Whereas Dalbir expressed real practical racist beliefs that could only involve an ideology of racial superiority and an execution by violence and quite possibly even genocide and has been highlighted extensively all over this thread and already remarked upon by Jai as “no problem.”

    And as for Dalbir, his backtracking and lies have been thoroughly exposed along with his racism; he could only come up with its ‘all a joke folks’ 24 hours and several attempts at justification later.

    Even people ‘on his side’ don’t believe him, and with good reason.

    And lastly, me old china, he hasn’t answered any of the questions, he has made up his own, lied in response to them and then been caught out.
    Distraction failure.

    And by the way, even if you really are gullible and / or dishonest enough to buy Dalbir’s ‘it was all a joke folks’ 24 hours and several different stories later, why did you not see fit to condemn it at the time for the overt and virulent racism it is?

  257. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 7:59 pm  

    Mangles, I consider myself suitably chastised for uttering naughty words and will not do so again in this thread (unless provoked).

  258. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:03 pm  

    Clark @ # 244

    “This thread was going along in a fairly civillised manner until you turned up.”

    Actually no it wasn’t; far from it.

    It had already included a vile and virulent statement of racism from Dalbir of which you passed no comment, let alone condemnation.

    In fact you didn’t even mention it until I involved myself in the thread someway down the line to highlight Dalbir’s racism and your only response was to attack and abuse me signing off with:

    … What a lot of shit …

    In your very first comment to me, quickly followed by:

    … piss off you B&B freak …

    And also

    … reflect on that you racist bastard …

    so don’t slither back onto this thread talking about civility you hypocritical snake.

    But I am sure that you and your friends would have loved to continue with your unchecked lying and
    racism, but I’m sorry I just can’t stand a liar and will expose him each and every time.

    Speaking of which care to substantiate your latest invention:

    … you are quite right to say that you have contributed nothing to it [this thread] …

    with an actual direct quote? I very much doubt it. The fact is that I have contributed plenty of substance to this thread but met in return surreal distractions and base abuse from hypocrites like you, who now bandies the word ‘troll’ and ‘debate’ around without any hint of shame or irony.

    You want to skulk back here and demand answers from me after your previous evasions and abuse, try answering my points first and prove that you can be genuine.

    Then we can talk.

  259. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:04 pm  

    Jai @ # 245

    But you haven’t even tried to communicate or address your queries directly to the BNP leadership and you admit as much; and then when a senior BNP member promises to answer your queries provided you simply email them to him you refuse to do even that and then cite your lack of response as some sort of failing on the behalf of that party!

    Can you really not see how ludicrous that is?

  260. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:05 pm  

    BTW Dan your suggestion that the policy will pay for itself is not plausible, as you do not account for:

    1. White flight of the middles classes and rich
    2. Sanctions from other countries and economic regions
    3. Increased criminal justice costs to keep law and order – due to the repeal of race and equality laws
    4. Increased Prison building and prison staff costs- thousands of BME people would have to be imprisoned for defending themselves with the repeal of race/equality laws
    5. Increased justice system costs – to process BME prisoners to at least make it look like there is some sort of justice system for non-whotes
    6. The exhorberant administration costs associated with pursuing a voluntary repatration policy; just look at the expenses of the current compulsory repatriation policy for illegal aliens
    7. Loss of millions of jobs as the financial houses leave the country (and taking with them so many jobs, mainly filled by white employees)
    8. People’s property prices would fall due to extra housing stock – and the vast proportion of the country would be negative equity, if not all.
    9. The social costs of ejecting some of the most skilled and educated non-white people- they’d leave before the election results were in and the country will be hit by a further vacuum of discontent as a result of implosion of services just as your your racist Government took office. Not more prisons I hope?

    And that took 10 minutes because I cant type any faster. Need I go on?

    Alas perhaps the nazi model is better and cheaper. Is that likely to be the final solution Dan?

    Rab rakha!

  261. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:11 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    Yup, I am a member of the SNP. And it has, shock horror, Asian candidates! I do not recognise this idea that the English are hateful. Indeed I like most of the folk that comment here, and most of them are English.

    But when it gets to the stage when neither party is getting much satisfaction out of the relationship it is probably a good idea to get divorced?

    As far as the policies are concerned, they may not appeal to you, but they do resonate with a substantial number of people of all races that are happy enough to see themselves as Scottish. Which, oddly enough, includes English immigrants.

    The SNP have been pushing this particular idea – Scottish Independence – since at least the 1930′s. Do you think it is easy breaking down the hegemony of the establishment?

  262. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:13 pm  

    IAE look up the word ‘distraction’ while you’re eating the dictionary in bed tonight, and when you have something to add to the threads actual debate I will see if I have anything to respond.

    Rab rakha!

  263. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:20 pm  

    IAE @ 258,

    The point is that you haven’t got an arguement here. All you have is invective.

    Don’t be surprised if people find your entire debating style a bit of a turn off.

  264. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:24 pm  

    Mangles, congratulations on your effort, you have certainly made a better fist of supporting your team than your fellow-ethnics or any of the resident Quislings have been able to do.

    I’ll be out for a couple of hours but will return later with a response. In the meantime, please feel free to add to your list and I shall attend to it in full in due course.

  265. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:28 pm  

    IAE @ 259,

    The questions have already been put to Barnes ages ago. Please try to keep up, or just read the OP.

  266. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:29 pm  

    As far as the policies are concerned, they may not appeal to you,

    I didn’t mean to imply disapproval of the SNP or the call for independence. If that’s what the Scottish people want and vote for then it certainly has my full support for what that’s worth.

    And if the Scottish collectively decide (after a full and proper public airing of the question) that they wish to become a fully multiracial society (which the SNP appears to favour) with an open door migration policy then that’s fine too.

    When England receives its own independence and we have have a real patriotic government rather than the present traitorous shower, we may well have a few ethnics who are surplus to requirements and will be happy to direct them over the border to you.

  267. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:31 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    ‘Resident Quislings’,

    Hmm..

    You might like to reconsider that….

  268. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:31 pm  

    #253

    I guess you’ll just keep your eyes open for when I start to actively push
    for the removal of the English in favour of Panjabis in England.

    Then you’ll be able to say:

    “Look I told you so! He wasn’t joking!”

    I’ve answered your questions now try answering mine.

    (1) “….will you admit to Anglos being unwanted intruders of Canada and Australia?”

    Regarding justifying the Anglo presence in Canada and Australia and the ‘uncivilised’ nature of the natives:

    (2) “what authority sanctions this? Is it the authority of ‘opportunism’ or ’supremacism’? Whatever your judgment values on them [the original inhabitants], they had their own way of life, held dear to them. Unless they were negatively interfering with life here, how does their mode of life exactly relate to the Anglo ‘right’ to conquer their lands and disempower them? Please explain?”

    (3) If you are all for repatriation to places of origin, does this include Anglos and their colonising descendants in foreign lands? If not, why?

    Simple relatively straight forward questions, Dan Dare and IAE, please try and provide straight answers instead of weaseling about like foxes. I’ve even numbered them to make it easier for you.

  269. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:34 pm  

    Douglas –

    I’ve noticed on my many visits to various parts of Scotland, that the SNP have done a remarkable job to make nationalism popular without firebranding it with racism or anti-Englishness.

    Its a farcry from the BNP’s hate agenda.

    For example, so many partake in St Patricks day parades in England, including many English people. Why is there not such enthusiasm for the ever so poorly attended and council funded St George’s Day’s? Many people don’t like the association with the BNP or NF that they just walk away.

    Thats what I admire about the English. They generally are a fair-minded people. That why even with the Empire etc, I don’t believe you can blame all English people, cos the benefits were only reeped by the establishment, the rich and the powerful, while the working classes worked their guts out to supply the raw materials to feed the excesses of the elite. The mass populace were living in squalour in poor housing, with even poorero welfare and health, even until the mass migration from the commonwealth.

    I believe in power to the people; as much as the BNP think they can take over the socialist mantle (which I do believe new Labour have neglected), they will never really allow the people of Britain to have real power. Thats why I hope the BNP will just fester in the garbage of hate politics. The SNP have on the other hand lived up to many of their socialist credentials.

    Rab rakha!

  270. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:35 pm  

    I am in awe of IAE’s use of the term “lie” – from a Nazi, dedicated to a range of revisionist views about the Third Reich that would be a bit rich; but given that I have repeatedly shown the sources of my comments to lie exactly within a pre-moderated blog to which he himself has repeatedly contributed… well, one must wonder whether the word “lie” in this imbecile’s mouth has any meaning whatsoever.

    I think that who has been “caught out” is a rather unbalanced Far Right individual, who thinks it is the acme of debating technique to repeat, endlessly, the same repeatedly foiled point over and again… as any troll must.

  271. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:39 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    If I thought that you had the slightest chance of ever forming a government I would be a tad concerned that you would assume to direct anyone here!

    Would you assume Eire would be so subservient? Although it would be a sad day for England if anyone had to come to an independent Scotland and be granted asylum.

  272. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:39 pm  

    Clark @ # 263

    I see Clark: No attempt to substantiate your latest lie. Not apology for your abuse. No apology for the false accusations and no attempt to debate, just more of the same.

    Why do you even bother connecting to this site and going to the trouble of posting this empty meaningless drivel?

    I posed some very reasonable questions about my genuine concerns long back when you were claiming to be a leader of the people on this site and pretending that the thread somehow rested on your ‘half tolerance’ of it, you responded with surreal distractions and abuse in lieu of debate.

    Perhaps you would care to go back to my second attempt at steering the course to some semblance of a meaningful exchange @ # 213?

    If you are genuine then what is the issue with that? What is the problem with my concerns?

    Let’s end this cycle of nonsense here.

    I am more then happy to debate and answer questions as long as it is reciprocated and not met with silly abuse, lies and distractions. I really don’t see the point in that. Do you?

    Incidentally why do you want independence? And other then that, what other nationalist polices and ideas do you and your party have?

  273. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:40 pm  

    @267 No Dougie, I use the term advisedly. It’s a perfectly appropriate and historically sound descriptor to characterise the treasonous activities of whose who would facilitate an invasion of unwanted foreigners and who would persecute any dissenters. That seems to summarise your own stance, does it not? If the cap fits, …

  274. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:45 pm  

    IAE @ 272,

    You what?

    I see Clark: No attempt to substantiate your latest lie. Not apology for your abuse. No apology for the false accusations and no attempt to debate, just more of the same.

    Why do you even bother connecting to this site and going to the trouble of posting this empty meaningless drivel?

    Believe me IAE, you are making a fool of yourself here.

    You have the opportunity to tell us all what your thoughts are, but you don’t appear to have any.

  275. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:48 pm  

    Abu Faris @ # 270

    Oh Abu Faris, you and your compulsive lying has been laid fully bare in countless posts above and like I said surely you do realise that although your cohorts here will make all of the fair weather internet faux solidarity noises towards you, in reality they can all now see just what a fantastic liar you really are and a selective racist with not a shred of integrity to boot?

    This is all you have though isn’t Abu Faris: Angry hate-filled comments, packed with unsubstantiated claims (lies) and idiotic meanderings; anything but actual debate.

    So once more, perhaps you would care to substantiate your latest lie / charge / smear that I am a “Nazi” with some actual proof? I very much doubt it. There is none.

    And while you are at it perhaps you could also explain why you lied through your teeth @ # 140 with your complete invention that I carried out illegal DoS (only one ‘S’ my old china) attacks on the HP site, a claim not even remotely made by HP themselves?

    And after you do that perhaps you could, as previously asked several times now, substantiate your charge / lie / smear that I had been banned from HP for “repeated racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks.”?

    And then clear up an ongoing evasion of yours and provide an answer to a very simple and very straightforward question:

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?
    Not likely.

  276. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:57 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    You are trying to say what? That someone who sells out their nation to fascists is in some way the same as me?

    Well, blow me.

    Y’know, I had never even thought of that.

    Naw!

    The cap doesn’t fit….

  277. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 8:58 pm  

    Clark @ # 274

    So you really want to continue the same cycle of nonsense instead of getting on with any debate?

    Why is that I wonder. I asked you before if you were even capable of attempting debate and I would guess this the answer to that one.

    You really cannot understand what has been said to you in the context of your actions even just a few comments back?

    Then believe me Clark you are the one making a fool of yourself here not I, along with the rest of your cronies that I have thoroughly exposed as liars and / or racists.

    Let’s reexamine your latest litany of lies and horse crap:

    “This thread was going along in a fairly civillised manner until you turned up.”

    Actually no it wasn’t; far from it.

    It had already included a vile and virulent statement of racism from Dalbir of which you passed no comment, let alone condemnation.

    In fact you didn’t even mention it until I involved myself in the thread someway down the line to highlight Dalbir’s racism and your only response was to attack and abuse me signing off with:

    … What a lot of shit …

    In your very first comment to me, quickly followed by:

    … piss off you B&B freak …

    And also

    … reflect on that you racist bastard …

    so don’t slither back onto this thread talking about civility you hypocritical snake.

    But I am sure that you and your friends would have loved to continue with your unchecked lying and racism, but I’m sorry I just can’t stand a liar and will expose him each and every time.

    Speaking of which care to substantiate your latest invention:

    … you are quite right to say that you have contributed nothing to it [this thread] …

    with an actual direct quote? I very much doubt it. The fact is that I have contributed plenty of substance to this thread but met in return surreal distractions and base abuse from hypocrites like you, who now bandies the word ‘troll’ and ‘debate’ around without any hint of shame or irony.”

    Get it now Clark?

    You have made claims that aren’t true, known in the real world as lies.

    So here we are again. Round and around we go, where will it end? No one knows!

    Not in debate though.

  278. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:00 pm  

    IAE @ 275,

    I see you are no longer even attempting to support your comments.

    C’mon. lets hear it. What have you got except wilder and wilder allegations?

  279. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:01 pm  

    IAE @ 277,

    You are like a stuck record.

  280. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:04 pm  

    IAE @ 277,

    You are like a stuck record.

    The direct quote is your own words:

    But the simple reality is that you don’t even have the first clue of who am I or any of my “world view” let alone my “whole world view”; the simple truth and reality is that you don’t know me from a bar of soap.

  281. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:05 pm  

    Sorry about the double post – don’t know how that happened.

  282. steve — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:28 pm  

    Given current demographic trends, we, the indigenous British people, will become an ethnic minority in our own country well within sixty years – and most likely sooner.

    The BNP’s policy is to:

    - Deport all the two million plus who are here illegally;

    - Deport all those who commit crimes and whose original nationality was not British;

    - Review all recent grants of residence or citizenship to ensure they are still appropriate;

    - Offer generous grants to those of foreign descent resident here who wish to leave permanently;

    - Stop all new immigration except for exceptional cases;

    - Reject all asylum seekers who passed safe countries on their way to Britain.

  283. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:28 pm  

    Dan no I wont be adding quite yet.

    However you can look up earlier threads on this site and look at so many holes in your ‘Parties’ policies which Jai has very astutely and tirelessly raised in a number of questions – last count 80 questions.

    Many of them are pertinent to this policy thread. So why dont you look em up.

    Btw you’re also an ethnic, just a shame you dont entirely know what your heritage is, except that you’re white. A real shame. Or have you worked out how much of you is Anglo and how much Saxon, or possibly Germanic, French, Irish, Welsh gosh even Scottish (Douglas will be so disapponited I am sure). Imagine if there is a bit of Romany thrown in as well

    The likelihood is that you are probably a component of many different ethnic genes, just like the rest of us. Have you thought about having a dna test done to find out if there is an African village you actually decend from or Indian? Don’t be afraid like your leader Heir Griffin.

    Rab rakha!

  284. steve — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:28 pm  
  285. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:31 pm  

    IAE

    The more you call people who call you out “liars”, the more you come across as utterly unbalanced.

    It is on record why you were banned from HP – as are your own vain threats and tantrums after the events. After all, you have – quite bizarrely – explained at length the depths to which you sank to prosecute your flame war against HP.

    I retract not a thing, IAE. You are a not very bright, petty thug and bully boy. I have more concern for the dirt under a fingernail than I do for you.

  286. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:34 pm  

    Thanks Steve for stating the obvious we’d never have worked out where to get BNP policies from.

    Do yu want to address the question raised at the start of this thread on behalf of teh BNP or can you not also speak on theor behalf, officially that is.

    Rab rakha!

  287. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:41 pm  

    Dougie @276

    I’m not trying to say anything, I am saying it.

    You’re a Quisling, a treasonous cultist who would squander the birthright of his own folk, including his children as well as mine, all in the name of a warped ideology of universalist egalitarianism and cultural relativism.

    You are and your ilk are, in short and not to put too fine a point on it, traitors to your own people, just as Quisling was. The term fits you perfectly.

    Y’know, I had never even thought of that.

    Well now’s your opportunity to reflect and to make the right decision for the sake of your descendants and their descendants. Don’t piss it all away, don’t be a MultiKultist.

  288. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:42 pm  

    steve,

    You say that there are two million plus here illegally. Could you substantiate that?

  289. Dalbir — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:44 pm  

    In fact you didn’t even mention it until I involved myself in the thread someway down the line to highlight Dalbir’s racism and your only response was to attack and abuse me signing off with:

    Try answering my questions pillock. I answered yours.

    To the rest of you, I’m signing off.

    It’s Vasakhi tommorow and I wish you ALL the best on this very important day. To the Singhs and Singhnis out there, remember its importance in relation to fighting oppressive, evil rakhshas as well as the notion of equality and meritocracy it embodies. With certain types of people about, we need to keep that extra close to our hearts.

    WJKK
    WJKF

  290. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 9:51 pm  

    Dan Dare,

    You’re a Quisling, a treasonous cultist who would squander the birthright of his own folk, including his children as well as mine, all in the name of a warped ideology of universalist egalitarianism and cultural relativism.

    You are and your ilk are, in short and not to put too fine a point on it, traitors to your own people, just as Quisling was. The term fits you perfectly.

    Ah!

    So the gloves come off Dan Dare, rocketman.

    So much for reasonable debate from the ‘good cop’ in the discussion. It now all comes down to a race war on your terms and I’m supposed to support you?

    Don’t think so.

    I refer you to a post I made earlier @ 78, I believe. Did you miss out completely on the whole idea of citizenship?

    I think you did. It would be hard to be a race traitor of the only race you believe exists is the human race. Else I really would be the Mekon and you really could be Dan Dare.

  291. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:02 pm  

    Dougie:

    Did you miss out completely on the whole idea of citizenship?

    No I didn’t, although you obviously missed on my characterising Mohammed as a ‘relatively recent migrant’ which would imply that he is not a citizen.

    I don’t have the figures to hand but if memory around half of the BME population are not citizens, in which case your idea is moot.

    And that of course refers only to the legal popuation. As for the illegal population, whether you take the BNP’s two million claim or the three-quarter million that the establishment admit to (the real number is probably somewhere in between), the number of citizens in that cohort is exactly zero.

    It is the illegals (and criminals) on which NuLabor is currently focusing its own version of the BNP’s ‘Homeward Scheme’ with its ‘grants’ (bribes to you and me). Under a BNP regime such bribes would not be made available to such, only to the legally present.

  292. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:12 pm  

    And Dougie, I meant to add to the above that I don’t label you a Quisling for treason to a race, human or otherwise, anymore than Quisling was a traitor to his race.

    He was a traitor to his people, his fellow Norwegians just as you are to your fellow Britons (I use the latter term in its ethnic sense).

    In mitigation it could be said I suppose that while Qusiling knew exactly what he was doing and why, you like most cult members appear not to. There might be perhaps be some hope of rehabilitation in your case but don’t leave it until it’s too late.

  293. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:22 pm  

    I like

    an ideology of universalist egalitarianism

    It makes me giggle – because I am trying very hard to imagine egalitarianism which is not universal in its scope.

    The problem is, of course, that the bonehead is not very secure in the long words he is using.

    Keep gripping the crayons, Dan.

  294. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:23 pm  

    Was not Quisling an ally of your NS heroes in “The Brothers’ War” as you Nazis like to call WWII?

    Funny that, too.

  295. Abu Faris — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:25 pm  

    There might be perhaps be some hope of rehabilitation in your case but don’t leave it until it’s too late.

    Oh, don’t you love it when the Nazis come over all threatening and Stormtrooper?

  296. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:28 pm  

    Dan Dare @ 291,

    Y’know, calling someone a Quisling is pretty insulting. Considering who and what he was. Play nice.

    ——————————-

    I know, because folk here have told me so, that becoming a British citizen is quite a lengthy process. But it has taken, what, something around 200 posts before you pulled that cat out of the bag. Mohammed and his family that you posit are illegal immigrants! Why didn’t you say so?

    If that is supposed to be a ‘gotcha’ moment it really, really isn’t.

    Frankly, on the statistics about illegal immigrants, I’d really like someone to talk me through how they are arrived at. Presumeably there is some method of arriving at a figure, but it eludes me how it is done. I suspect it is snake oil, but…

    ——————————–

    So, as I assume you are now admitting to being a BNP member, what are your prospects of electoral success? I see you have 14 candidates running up here. How many will save their deposits?

  297. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:33 pm  

    Clark @ # 278, 279, 280 & 281

    You really are making a fool of yourself, again.
    I observed a while back that you are not the sharpest pencil in the case, and so you are not.

    It is all laid out above but I fear it may be to complex for you so in a nutshell:

    You accuse me of bringing the thread to ‘incivility’ when long before I appeared a rather virulent racist remark was made that bothered you naught because of your selective take on racism; when I appeared on the thread to highlight that racism you attack me with abuse and an expletive as well as a laundry list of fantasy, you then go on to personally abuse me with more expletives in later comments, whereas I have not used one such uncivil expletive.

    Clearly you brought the civility down and clearly only same kinds of racism bother you.

    You then go on to attribute statements to me I haven’t made and fail to substantiate them with a quote when challenged.

    Understand it now or shall I draw some pictures for you?

    This really is your level isn’t it? You really are incapable of debate; coherent adult debate. Why are you bothering here at all?

    And why on earth are you asking # 288 to substantiate statements when you are unable to do so yourself?

  298. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:35 pm  

    Abu “the liar” Faris @ # 285

    Once again you are unable to substantiate any of your lies and so they remain out in the open for everyone to see for exactly what they are: Lies, and exactly what you are: A liar.

    Thanks for coming though.

  299. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:35 pm  

    @Père Abu

    No yet again in your zeal to Bash the Fash you’re going off half cocked.

    Universalism and egalitarianism are two entirely different concepts, let me see if I can spell it out in simple terms that you should be able to grasp.

    We could, for example, say that Sweden prior to the onset of the wonderful golden age of globalism and MultiKultism that we now inhabit was an extreme example of an egalitarian society. However, Swedish egalitarianism was a well-bounded concept. The Swedes had no expectation or even intention that it should be adopted by other societies. That it was, in one form or another, by most western European countries over time is neither here nor there.

    Now, however, the concept of universalism enters the picture. This maintains that not just the Swedes are all equal amongst themselves within their own sphere of influence, but that We’z awl Ekwal, everywhere. A classic instance of universalism in practice is the European Convention on Human Rights, which is now embedded in the British legal canon. The ECHR requires that each signatory applies its strictures to anyone who falls within the jurisdiction of that state, whether citizen, illegal alien or anyone who just happens be present in a war zone which falls within that state’s temporary jurisdiction. We all know the rest of the story, but if you don’t then Google on the Afghan Hijacker case.

    Get it now?

  300. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:40 pm  

    Dan @ # 287

    It is all starting to make sense now. I should have looked at it before:

    Clark despises the English and that is why he isn’t in the slightest bit bothered about Dalbir’s virulent racism which pretty much makes him just as racist as Dalbir himself.

    It is laughable really but that is the way with some I have met: Their hatred for the English trumps everything; reason, logic and decency and blinds them to everything.

    He can’t even explain why he wants independence (because it involves hating the English no doubt) let alone what other nationalist ideas he and his SNP entertain.

    Clearly he is a ‘mock jock’ anyway as he doesn’t even know the Scots are an indigenous ethnic group from an amalgamation of the Celtic peoples: The Picts, the Gaels, and the Brythons.

  301. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:41 pm  

    Dan Dare @ 292,

    Err..

    And Dougie, I meant to add to the above that I don’t label you a Quisling for treason to a race, human or otherwise, anymore than Quisling was a traitor to his race.

    Yes you did.

    Don’t want to make a big deal of this Dan Dare, but I have told you already that we see things through different prisms. You see a rainbow and call it hell. I don’t.

    As far as I am concerned, there is only the human race in a big cold Universe. This schismatic shit is a waste of everyone’s time.

    Pretendy policies about resettlement of a fairly significant part of our society begged Jai’s question.

    And you have never come close to answering it.

    You seemed to think Mangles had a point. Do you agree, tick tock, with Steve @ 282, that that is a satisfactory answer? If you do, I’ll see you a cultist and raise you one.

  302. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:46 pm  

    IAE @ 300,

    I don’t know how you square the idea that I ‘despise the English’ when I have categorically said that I don’t.

    No-one has asked me to explain why I think independence for Scotland would be a good thing. You on the other hand have been asked, by me, to justify your politics ad infinitum. You haven’t.

    Must be a secret gene you have there…

  303. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 10:58 pm  

    Clark @ # 296

    ““Y’know, calling someone a Quisling is pretty insulting. Considering who and what he was. Play nice.””

    Well if that’s how you want to be treated Clark, with niceness, then perhaps you should treat others in the same fashion instead of with your expletive laden abuse.

    Those who want respect, show respect.

    ““I don’t know how you square the idea that I ‘despise the English’ when I have categorically said that I don’t.””

    Well it could be because we have already firmly established that you are very dishonest, that you weren’t bothered in the slightest about virulent anti-English racism, attacked me with abuse for being bothered by said anti-English racism, cannot explain why you want independence and belong to party whose sole foundation seems to be an intense dislike of the English.

    But like I say, you are quite clearly a ‘mock jock’ anyway as you don’t even know the Scots are an indigenous ethnic group from an amalgamation of the Celtic peoples: The Picts, the Gaels, and the Brythons, now do you Clark?

  304. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:03 pm  

    Happy Vaisakhi to you too Dalbir.

    Happy Vaisakhi Dan, Steve and IEA -and the rest of the ethnics and non ethnics- a time to rejoice in the glory of God and His creation of the fraternity of mankind.

    Those of you who wish to reject this, reject it at your peril, but just remember that the indigenous religion of Bnp was founded by a middle eastern migrant, born as a Jew, who I respect for being a messenger of God, because ultimately that is the bit that matters, The God inside us, everything else is everchanging.

    ‘There is no enemy, there is no stranger, I have come to know one and all’ Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji

    Love & peace! Rab rakha!

    PS: Jai Ji -still lookin forward to your Vaisakhi article.

    Rab rakha

  305. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:04 pm  

    Clark @ # 302

    “”No-one has asked me to explain why I think independence for Scotland would be a good thing””

    Clark you are it again as I clearly asked you @ # 272.

    You haven’t answered any of my questions (and I already said I was prepared to leave your abuse behind and move on) so why should I answer any of yours?

    And let’s get one thing straight: I may answer questions if I choose but I need justify myself to no one.

  306. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:05 pm  

    http://www.lse.ac.uk/collections/LSELondon/pdf/irregular%20migrants%20full%20report.pdf

    Dougie @297

    I agree that Quisling might be a little harsh, but how else would you characterise someone who acquiesces in a foreign invasion of his own country and calls for dissenters who protest to be marginalised and persecuted? On reflection though I’m prepared to modify the charge to inadvertant Quislingism since you don’t yet appear to fully appreciate the long term effects of the process that you are promoting.

    Regarding Mohammed, it wasn’t my intention to present him as an illegal but rather an economic migrant who has received permission to reside and work in the UK and is not (yet) a citizen. None of which makes any difference to his economic inutility to the host society.

    As for illegal entrants, the last major official mainstream effort at sizing was performed by the LSE in 2006-7 with a report prepared in conjunction with Boris’s unsuccessful campaign for a general amnesty. This report concludes that the ‘most likely’ figure for the illegal population is 618,000, although my own view is that this is an undercount. The number of ‘overstayers’ included in the count appears suspiciously low, especially in view of the many recent revelations about student visa scams and the chaotic system that has precipitated them. But have a look for yourself.

    It can be downloaded here:

    Economic impact on the London and UK economy of an earned regularisation of irregular migrants to the UK

  307. Dan Dare — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:11 pm  

    Oops something happened to the link in #306.

    Just click on the url at the top of the post to access the LSE report.

  308. IAE — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:14 pm  

    Mangles @ # 304

    You really do live up your moniker and mangle my language.

    “”the indigenous religion of Bnp was founded by a middle eastern migrant””

    Is as absurd and erroneous a statement as it gets.

    First off the BNP do not have a religion anymore then LibLabCon do; they are a political party. They may learn towards a Christian tradition but being a Christian is not part of the parties’ political programme or any sort of requirement.

    Secondly you have already identified that the religion was founded in the middle east so how can it be ‘indigenous’ to these isles?

    And who was this “middle-eastern migrant” who founded Christianity exactly? Because Jesus didn’t found the religion.

    And one more thing, perhaps you could explain what this actually means in reality:

    “”and the rest of the ethnics and non ethnics””

    How can one be a “non ethnic” exactly?

    I wait in amazement for the next installment…

  309. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:15 pm  

    IAE @ 303,

    It could be that you are actually a complete utter idiot. As you said earlier:

    But the simple reality is that you don’t even have the first clue of who am I or any of my “world view” let alone my “whole world view”; the simple truth and reality is that you don’t know me from a bar of soap.

    Personally, I think my hypothesis that you are a one legged, lesbian saxaphone player from Uraguay has as much chance of being right as anything else. Without evidence to the contrary, why would anyone take you seriously?

    A word to the wise.

    They don’t.

    ————————————-

    Incidentally, Scottish folk would see more recent people like the Spanish and the Jews and Pakistanis and Poles and the English that have settled here as part of our nation. And this will fry your last, solitary brain cell: they see themselves as Scottish too.

    We are not, at our best, an exclusive culture. We are, at our best, an inclusive one. And, yes, we do have problems….

    Least your lot keep losing your deposits up here….

    And I am not ‘frit’ to say I am a member of the SNP. You have, as far as I remember, avoided admitting that you are a member of the BNP.

  310. douglas clark — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:42 pm  

    Contrary to popular opinion other bits of Britain were bombed during the Blitz. It was not just London that suffered.

    One town that was hit hard, because it was a shipbuilding town, was Clydebank. If you go there now there is not a lot of evidence about how important it was to the British war effort in 1940/41.

    The Germans thought otherwise and, at the height of the Blitz attempted to destroy John Browns shipyard:

    In 1940, the exiled Polish armed forces re-formed in exile under General Sikorski at Perth. Evacuated from France, they protected many of Scotland’s coastal defences. Around 50,000 servicemen were based here and, after the war, 10,000 decided to stay and settle.

    In March 1941, the Polish destroyer Piorun saved John Brown’s shipyard by putting up heavy anti-aircraft fire. Today, the Solidarity Plaza in Clydebank honours this achievement. You can find out more about the Polish Armed Forces in Scotland at http://www.ostrycharz.free-online.co.uk.

    ——————————

    The possible fall of India to the Japanese in the ‘Battle of Kohima’ was perhaps the turning point against Japanese expansion in the Far East. It has been described as the ‘Stalingrad of the East’.

    Huge numbers of Indian soldiers – a volunteer army – stood against the Japanese. Suffice to say, they won.

    ——————————

    It is events like these that give the lie to an English exceptionalism. a little bit of humility amongst our BNP chums would go a long way.

    Least, that’s what I think.

    And I am happy that the RAF won WW2, with a tiny little bit of help from others. These greasemonkeys don’t even know how existentialist it was, nor what the word means.

  311. Mangles — on 12th April, 2010 at 11:49 pm  

    IEA, oh and BNP don’t see Christianity as the religion of the indigenous peoples of these isles? That will suffice. I’m a Sikh & don’t believe in splitting hairs(lol :) ) i’d expect you to be more astute to Christianity, so well done for being so accurate and the free history lesson.

    Non-ethnics – your BNP lot keep referrin to ‘ethnics’ so that must leave people who are non-ethnic – you know other haters like you; I don’t like the term ‘white’ – its all-embracing and includes too many decent people who aren’t haters like you.

    I’m glad you’re so committed to looking at the finer points in life. Do you count the paperclips on your desk every day or only once a week?

    Just a gentle reminder ….you’ve not thought of a response to the thread yet, still looking for diversionary tactics instead? Keep trying luv.

    Rab rakha!

  312. persephone — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:03 am  

    @ 255 “directly to the party’s press officer.”

    But the press officer is probably too busy dealing with the PR disaster recovery of a member of his team – the BNP publicity manager who was detained for threatening griffin

  313. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:13 am  

    Mangles,

    Just joshing with you, but do you see me as a non ethnic?

    Just curious.

    Of course I’m going to argue with you if you say I am. We, Scots, were the very cusp of the whole idea of ethnicity. Well, maybe the Irish or the Welsh. Who wants to be first? It is a cultural trap.

    It is a game that a certain group of folk play, and it is not very nice. You could refer yourself back to IAE @ 303.

    I do worry about the BNP, if that is the best they can do.

    Well, not really.

    By the way, IAE sees himself as the secret assassin. He answers nothing that is put to him and assumes that you should answer his shit.

    He is a fool.

  314. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:15 am  

    persephone @ 312,

    Point!

  315. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:15 am  

    And so on to Mangles’s laundry list from #260, addressing each point in turn. In truth this is all veering wildly into the realm of the purely hypothetical, but I’ll enter into the spirit of the thing. It goes without saying that the following remarks are entirely my own and may or may not reflect official BNP policy.

    Dan your suggestion that the policy will pay for itself is not plausible, as you do not account for

    A closer reading will confirm that what I wrote was ‘at least partially self-funding”. I suspect that once we start a forensic examination of the true cost of maintaining multiracial Britain more areas of potential savings will present themselves in addition to those already mentioned. We have not yet even touched, for example, on the truly staggering cost of the Diversity Industry which is borne not just by private industry but also by the 47,000 public authorities who are bound by the RR Act of 2000.

    1. White flight of the middles classes and rich

    I’m unclear what is being claimed here. White flight is already an existing phenomenon, it’s due to white people fleeing from areas that have become ‘vibrantly enriched’ as a result of immigration. Many of those people have fled abroad, to the Costa Brava and elsewhere, and it is likely that some at least would like to return home if the conditions which drove them away in the first place were corrected.

    2. Sanctions from other countries and economic regions

    This is a more interesting point. It could actually go either way. A newly independent Britain (or England) setting its house in order might well embolden other western countries to follow suit. It’s obvious that many of their populations would wish for that to happen but their governments lack the political will. It seems to me more likely that once one country summons up the courage for action the rest will follow and the whole rotten system will collapse like a pack of cards.

    But let’s assume a worst case and assume that the countries whose former citizens, residents and their descendants take umbrage and decide to employ sanctions. If we look at the countries and regions which have supplied the most migrants to Britain in the last 15-20 years, starting with the Indian subcontinent, sub-Saharan Africa, Somalia, the Philippines , Turkey and Iraq, none of these are of crucial economic importance to Britain and any sanctions they could mount would be an economic flea-bite and will harm themselves more than us. There is no particular reason why Britain’s major trading partners should get excited either, after all countries like Malaysia and Singapore perform regular clear-outs of unwanted migrants, Japan and Korea operate highly restrictive immigration systems, as do of course both India and China, but they all seem to participate in the global economic system without too much difficulty.

    So no, this one is Much Ado About Nothing.

    3. Increased criminal justice costs to keep law and order – due to the repeal of race and equality laws

    I don’t see why this should be the case, all that will happen is that the BME population will be entitled to exactly the same protection under the law as the indigenous population, but with no special privileges or favours. Crimes such as libel, slander, assault etc will continue to be prosecuted just as they are now, and in a colour-blind fashion as was traditionally the case in English law until 1965.

    4. Increased Prison building and prison staff costs- thousands of BME people would have to be imprisoned for defending themselves with the repeal of race/equality laws

    Again, if somebody calls Dougie a dirty bloody Jock in the pub and he glasses them then Dougie will be done for GBH while his provoker will likely be charged with insulting and threatening behaviour. Substitute some other ethnic label and the result should be the same in the eyes of the law.

    If, say, somebody assaults a Pakistani resident and the latter defends himself, there is no reason to suppose that the Pakistani would go to jail for having done so, just because the RRA is no longer in force.

    This one is a complete red herring.

    5. Increased justice system costs – to process BME prisoners to at least make it look like there is some sort of justice system for non-whotes

    As is this one.

    I’ll pause here and post the rest in a little while.

  316. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:25 am  

    Douglas Clark I’m surprised you asked the question to be honest. I thought I was clear when saying:

    ‘Non-ethnics – your BNP lot keep referrin to ‘ethnics’ so that must leave people who are non-ethnic – you know other haters like you; I don’t like the term ‘white’ – its all-embracing and includes too many decent people who aren’t haters like you.”

    I see you nowhere near that, well not yet, Depends what I learn about you, lol. As you’re a Scot I see you in the ethnic category or you could clasify yourself in the ‘white’ group if you so desire.

    Oh yes I see IEA as the fool he is, someone who counts paperclips and hasn’t any friends because he likes to finish all their sentences, but is too think to answer any questions cos he hasn’t a clue about anything really.

    Rab rakha!

  317. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:33 am  

    Hmm..

    Here is a song, sung by Germans I think:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sav8xG2JY_k

    Mangles kiddo, I will never get near that!

    It is interesting that I can ‘classify’ myself?

    I am defo an ethnic minority. Whether I am an ethnic minority you’d want to have as a chum is a different matter entirely ;-)

    It is strange, is it not, that you and I can agree about IAE yet be so different?

    Me? I wouldn’t have it any other way.

  318. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:37 am  

    The more IAE raves, the more he comes across as someone released into the community against the better judgement of the mental health professionals’ community.

    He appears to be able to simply call people “liars”, make dubious threats and pontificate about “ethnics”.

    Meanwhile, his chum, Dan is unable to string a sentence together without including some hilarious self-contradiction.

    These people are not very bright and not very well… Oh look, they’re Nazis!

    Incidentally, Dan – Abu means “father” – yes, I do get the Pere Ubu pun – however, you probably think it relates to an American band.

  319. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:45 am  

    Are you intending to join in the actual discussion at some point Abu, or do you intend to remain lying in the weeds, chucking the occasional rusty and ineffectual spear?

  320. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:46 am  

    Abu Faris,

    I know nowt about you either, except what I have read on here.

    But your analysis of the dreck we have read is spot on.

    Respect and all that.

  321. persephone — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:46 am  

    “I’ll pause here and post the rest in a little while.”

    I got a picture here of Dan Dare shuffling away to pore over a well thumbed copy of ‘BNP messaging tips to use on blogs’. AS his pause gets longer – no doubt the poor soul is scratching his head as he has lost his place & looks bewildered at the PC not knowing where to recommence

  322. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:51 am  

    Oh ethnic minority or not we’re all chums mate. Can’t be having haters like dirty Dan and his ilk influence our thoughts and values.

    Interesting you can classify yourself? Why? We should all be free to classify ourselves, so long as it doesn’t detract from anyone elses human rights – self-determination all the way! Its a fundamental human right after all; thats why I don’t decry nationalism.

    I actually think nationalism is a healthy value to inculcate in all societies, i think its healthy that people should be nationalist and be proud of the country they live in or are born in, but when racism and hatred is fuelled by nationalism, you get a whole different kettle of fish, and that breeds all sorts of shite, and all of a sudden BNP, Nazis, RSS, or if your nation is the Ummah then Al Qaeda – they all resemble each other in their hatred.

    Rab rakha!

  323. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:59 am  

    Dan Dare,

    There isn’y a discussion going on here.

    There is your soft / hard games. There is your completely vacuous hard cop / soft cop shit between you and IEA, as if that was going to give you a breakthrough!

    You are BNP, you are, you are!

    Could you not get around to admitting that you are?

    Are you intending to join in the actual discussion at some point Abu, or do you intend to remain lying in the weeds and chucking the occasional spear?

    And you are not chucking in the occasional insult?

    It is obvious as fuck that you are attempting to rile folk into this becoming a BNP advert.

    Well, so far, you haven’t managed it.

    You are playing pathetic mind games with a group of folk that can see a bit beyond your stupid agenda. That are a bit better than you, a bit more connected than you. Hopefully not affronted by you. Because you do not speak on behalf of anything more than a few thousand morons.

    ——————————

    Jai, it is up to you, but I think you should call a day on this….

    There is enough evidence of mendacity and evil for you to call a halt.

  324. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:00 am  

    No no Mangles, you have it exactly wrong. I’m not a hater, I’m a lover. But my first love (beyond the family of course) is for my own folk. I love you too, and would love even more if you could see your way clear to casting your pearls of wisdom from within you own ancestral homeland rather than mine.

    What did you think of Part I btw, Part II will be along in just a little while. I hope Persephone doesn’t wet herself in the meantime, although I should have thought it was well past beddy-byes time anyway for little girls. I wonder if Mummy and Daddy know she’s talking to strange men on the Internet.

  325. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:03 am  

    Throwing in the towel eh Dougie.

    Well can’t say I blame you, the home team has had a miserable innings. Every single googly pitched up has been hit to the boundary, and you know it.

    And I don’t believe you have asked me about BNP membership have you?

  326. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:14 am  

    Nope, Dan Dare, rocketman.

    I think you are playing games here. I think you are a pretendy friend – the good cop – then you fuck up and are the bad cop too.

    I would refer you back to this comment:

    Dan Dare @ 292,

    Err..

    And Dougie, I meant to add to the above that I don’t label you a Quisling for treason to a race, human or otherwise, anymore than Quisling was a traitor to his race.

    Yes you did.

    Don’t want to make a big deal of this Dan Dare, but I have told you already that we see things through different prisms. You see a rainbow and call it hell. I don’t.

    As far as I am concerned, there is only the human race in a big cold Universe. This schismatic shit is a waste of everyone’s time.

    Pretendy policies about resettlement of a fairly significant part of our society begged Jai’s question.

    And you have never come close to answering it.

    You seemed to think Mangles had a point. Do you agree, tick tock, with Steve @ 282, that that is a satisfactory answer? If you do, I’ll see you a cultist and raise you one.

    And that is not the nastiest shit you have flung my way:

    Dougie @276

    I’m not trying to say anything, I am saying it.

    You’re a Quisling, a treasonous cultist who would squander the birthright of his own folk, including his children as well as mine, all in the name of a warped ideology of universalist egalitarianism and cultural relativism.

    You are and your ilk are, in short and not to put too fine a point on it, traitors to your own people, just as Quisling was. The term fits you perfectly.

    Y’know, I had never even thought of that.

    Well now’s your opportunity to reflect and to make the right decision for the sake of your descendants and their descendants. Don’t piss it all away, don’t be a MultiKultist.

    Mainly because you are so thick you see it as an insult.

    But, there you go.

  327. persephone — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:14 am  

    “she’s talking to strange men on the Internet.”

    Talking – no.
    Strange – yes
    Man – no

    I see after an hour’s pause that you await the next part of your (cough, cough) comment to be produced for you while you type meaningless comments to still show ‘presence’

  328. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:16 am  

    So Dan Dare, pilot of the future:

    What do you say? Are you a member of the BNP? Are you a complete utter idiot?

    The folk around here would like to know.

  329. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:18 am  

    Now that you ask, yes I am a BNP member.

    But so what?

  330. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:19 am  

    Just keep your legs crossed Persephone and don’t let it burst.

    Any moment now!

  331. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:27 am  

    Part I Dan was a poor effort in addressing some quite serious and pertinent situations.

    For example,

    1. Given that under the BNP the UK will be a frestanding economy and no longer part of the EU, are you suggesting that the BNP would join a reconstituted EU if all the other countries in Europe follow suit and kick out all the wogs. So you’re happy for a federal or US of Europe, as long you’re self reliant against the rest of the world? Do you really think that Europe would trade as a block without a set of rules? i.e. reconstituted EU? Is that official BNP policy then. Come on I dare you Dan!

    That will be the end of the open market, as with 90% of manufactured goods you would not be able to compete on price or quality. You fool.

    Eg. 2. You really think that people have left Uk because of inward immigration? Are you really suggesting that all your ex pat supporters are even bigger hypocrites than you?

    Eg. 3. How about the people who have left for tax purposes; taxes that would rapidly have to rise just to fulfil all your false socialist promises, let alone get the country going again after you piss it up the spout.

    Eg. 4. And they haven’t left because they have retired away in the sun. You want all those elderly white pensioners to return so that you can stretch out even more scarcely the resources of the NHS, which will be already so thinly stretched after the first phase of brain drain has taken effect, that you will only just about be able to meet acute and emergency services.

    Go love Hitler in Brazil, or your recently matryred leader in South Africa. Is that the sort of love you like with blacks too, so long as it is hidden and illicit?

    Rab rakha!

  332. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:28 am  

    Dan Dare,

    Well it is about time one of you confessed to being that daft. A BNP supporter. When is your chum going to ‘fess up?

    Y’know. The somewhat challenged IAE?

    Did you two expect to win on a ‘good cop’, ‘bad cop’ routine?

    The pair of you have been comprehensively annihilated.

    You do know that? Don’t you?

  333. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:30 am  

    Mangles 260 Part II

    6. The exhorberant administration costs associated with pursuing a voluntary repatration policy; just look at the expenses of the current compulsory repatriation policy for illegal aliens

    There will certainly be some administrative cost involved in implementing such a policy, but I don’t see why they should be any more exhorbitant than, say, administering the present asylum system which is running at around £1 billion annually. Another cost that will be eliminated as the flood of asylum seekers dwindles to zero.

    The exorbitant cost of administering the present system arise because of the Legal Aid system which pays for venal lawyers to lodge repeated obstructive appeals and the Human Rights Act which puts insuperable obstacles in the path of the UK Border Agency which is responsible for deporations and repatriations. The Legal Aid will be radically overhauled to eliminate these abuses and the HRA will be scrapped entirely.

    7. Loss of millions of jobs as the financial houses leave the country (and taking with them so many jobs, mainly filled by white employees)

    This seems a highly unlikely outcome. It might well be the case that returning London to its former status as the capital of Merrie Olde England will heighten its appeal as a posting for executives of just international financial institutions that you claim will depart. I’m sure that everyone of us (at least the natives) will have anecdotes to tell about visitors from the US and elsewhere who are stunned at the transformation of London in recent years into a giant multiracial souk and transnational Jobcentre. Reversing that trend will I’m sure resonate positively with tourists and business interests alike.

    8. People’s property prices would fall due to extra housing stock – and the vast proportion of the country would be negative equity, if not all.

    A lot of people might be pleased that one of the side-effects of the departure of several million ethnics (over some years) is likely to be a permanent puncturing of the house-price bubble. Property speculation has been a distorting and disruptive aspect of the British economy since the Thatcher days and has diverted an inordinate amount of financial resource from more productive sectors of the economy into what is in effect a giant Ponzi scheme, whose only real oucome has been an explosion of debt and an unsustainable consumer spending binge.

    No, the effect of lower property prices will be entirely beneficial, not least to those young couples would like to be come property owners but are priced out of the market. More reasonable housing costs will facilitate the re-emergence of the traditional nuclear family, since it will no longer be necessary for a family to earn two incomes to afford a roof over their head.

    In areas of the country abandoned by ethnics and which no natives want to repopulate, the empty properties can be pulled and converted to open green space for community use, or simply allowed to return to nature.

    9. The social costs of ejecting some of the most skilled and educated non-white people- they’d leave before the election results were in and the country will be hit by a further vacuum of discontent as a result of implosion of services just as your your racist Government took office. Not more prisons I hope?

    Of course I don’t have any special insight into the mechanics, but I would expect that any Homeward Bound scheme would stretch over a number of years perhaps as many as ten. The golden goodbye payments and other terms could be calibrated to appeal to the least desirable and least economically useful such as the Mohammed character depicted earlier and his growing brood. It might well be that certain occupations, such as medical doctors and surgeons might be ‘reserved’, meaning that such employees will not be eligible for grants at least until sufficient home-grown replacements have been recruited and trained. Come to think of it that, together with nurses. would perhaps be the only employment categories for which ready replacements would not available. Britain does have after all some 8 million ‘economically active’, a reserve labour Army just waiting in the wings for its call-up (here too a judicious blend of stick and carrot will be in order.

    No, I think it will all work out just splendidly.

    Alas perhaps the nazi model is better and cheaper. Is that likely to be the final solution Dan

    I don’t think the British public would go for that, do you. They didn’t last time.

    Any further questions, if not I’ll say cheerio until the next time.

  334. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:33 am  

    Oh for fucks sake Dan Dare, rocketman of the future!

    Why the heck shouldn’t we just accept these folk?

    You do talk some shite.

    What is your expected vote?

  335. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:46 am  

    It’s not a question of ‘confessing’ anything Dougie. As far as I’m aware you’ve never asked before. If you had I would have responded, I’m not ashamed about being a BNP supporter. Why on earth should I be?

    It’s you who should be ashamed not me.

  336. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:50 am  

    Thats the best the BNP can offer – rashly thought out and ill conceived responses.

    Come on give us your name and position in the hierarchy of the BNP, i’d hate to think I have wasted all this time with some pisshead who can just about get his doc martins on and off. At least have the guts to confirm these responses as official BNP blabberings- cos clearly none of the other eunuchs at BNP have had the guts to speak.

    Come on who are you at BNP, put your credentials on the table seeing as you have confirmed that you are BNP. Are you LJB or just his PA?

    “Of course I don’t have any special insight into the mechanics” why this sudden humility, when you have the ego of Dan Dare!

    BTW Dan if you are signing off I prefer the good old Churchill salute / . Victory to God and righteousness and you know what … with good measures … to your filth!

    Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

    Rab rakha!

  337. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:58 am  

    Dan Dare,

    I’m not ashamed about being a BNP supporter.

    Well, if you don’t know why, it is beyond me to tell you.

    Why on earth should I be?

    Perhaps because you attack the most vulnerable parts of our society?

    Or summat like that.

    You are, sir, a very aggressive person.

    And not in a nice way.

    You play the aggressive passive game very well, but it is just a game for you.

    You have been found out, miles back.

    Admit it. You love that whole game of trying to play one side off against the other.

    It is what you do.

    Isn’t it?

  338. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:04 am  

    Alright Mangles, one last final shot before logging off. I’ll just respond to the gist of your remarks and ignore the extraneous editorials and of course the silly jibes.

    1. The EU

    Yes, as a matter of fact I think the BNP is completely wrongheaded on the EU and that the correct policy would be to work with the other nationalist parties for radical reform of the EU as a free-trade and mutual defence organisation, the latter superseding NATO. Russia and Ukraine should be invited to join, thereby enhancing both energy and food security for Europe as a whole.

    Eg. 2. You really think that people have left Uk because of inward immigration??

    Yes I know for sure that’s happening, my own brother is one of them. Anecdotal reportage in the media indicate that it is a widely held if often unspoken (certainly officially unacknowledged) reason for emigration of native Britons.

    Eg. 3. How about the people who have left for tax purposes

    Good riddance to them I say.

    Eg. 4. And they haven’t left because they have retired away in the sun. You want all those elderly white pensioners to return …

    I don’t want them to return, that’s up to them. All I am saying is that native Britons should not have to flee abroad because of an unwanted demographic transformation going on at home, and it is the responsibility of the government to make whatever changes are necessary to reverse that transformation.

    OK Persephone you can go now. And put the stopwatch away. I didn’t know that PP had an official thread timekeeper, is it new?

  339. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:07 am  

    Dan Dare, pilot of the future.

    Just asking Dan, can I call you that?.

    Is IAE, which some people think means I am an Englishman, entirely sane? You’d know him better than us, so your opinion would matter.

    Just asking for your opinion, ’cause it is not really obvious.

    Just saying…..

  340. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:07 am  

    Actually Dougie it’s not a game.

    It’s deadly serious. It’s existential. Do you know what that means?

  341. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:13 am  

    Re IAE, I don’t know the bloke Dougie, only came across him a few days ago on Oranjepan’s blog. He seems perfectly sane to me, and his heart is certainly in the right place which is more than I can say for yours.

    He does have his own style for sure, but then we all do don’t we. Even you do, believe it or not.

    It should be obvious by now that this good cop/bad cop thing you keep rabbiting on about is simply a bee buzzing around inside your own tammie. There is no plan afoot, and never has been.

  342. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:18 am  

    Yup,

    I know what existential means. And I doubt it means what you think it does.

    But we’ll leave that sticking to the wall.

    I think your friend has, err, issues, y’know what I mean?

    Perhaps you’d like to vouch for him?

    Is he sane or not?

    I am quite worried that he might be taken into care. How about you?

  343. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:19 am  

    #333 Dan Dare: “Any further questions”

    Oh yes loads – start with confirming that this is official BNP policy, who you speak for and confirming your authority to do so, other than yourself, see #336.

    I have started by blowingn apart some of your ramblings in 331. A number of follow up questions have been raised by your incomplete and passive responses. The BNP can then have a go at these before there are retorts to your other sad excuses of considered responses to the quick thoughts posted earlier, and they too are shredded.

    But as stressed innumerably by other bloggers, its only worth continuing with this thread if the BNP responds to the opening gambit, and the responses are officially from the BNP, otherwise its all a bit of hot air really and not worth the while; there’s no point wasting time in hypothesis land or wannabe-leader coup-plotters, whatever self-importance individuals may attach to themselves.

    Sweet dreams Heir Dan!

    Rab rakha!

  344. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:26 am  

    Official BNP policy?

    Can you read English Mangles. I already said that the remarks were entirely my own and to shut you up I have no official function within the BNP, have never claimed to have such a function so why you should suddenly to the leap to the conclusion that I have is completely mystifying.

    If you want to persist with your inane and half-baked questioning feel free, but it’s a matter of total indifference to me whether you do or not.

    You seem to be a little unsure about how this debating thing actually works, perhaps it’s not common mode of discourse were you come from, where it’s probably everybody shouting at once until somebody gets shot. But it’s what we do here, and it runs something along these lines:

    Party A states his case
    Party B states his case
    Party B responds to A’s case
    Party A responds to B’s case

    And that’s about it. quite simple eh? What are you finding so hard to grasp?

  345. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:28 am  

    Dan Dare @ 341,

    Hmm…

    Re IAE, I don’t know the bloke Dougie, only came across him a few days ago on Oranjepan’s blog. He seems perfectly sane to me, and his heart is certainly in the right place which is more than I can say for yours.

    So you say.

    Well, my new friendly cop, Dan Dare, why should I believe a word of that?

    You have played the ‘good cop’, ‘bad cop’ line on me since you appeared on this thread.

    He is possibly in need of psychiatric help, as you might be..

    At least, that is my opinion.

    Mileage may vary.

    But you have denied everything I have said, and that makes you just a mutt as him.

  346. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:38 am  

    Suit yourself Dougie, feel free to believe whatever you wish.

    To be honest, there hasn’t been much to deny though has there, it’s been like a prose version of Kumbaya without the musical backing. Very thin gruel.

    Face it, your team is intellectually bankrupt. It offers nothing except the prospect of hanging on in quiet desperation, hoping and praying she’ll be alright on the night, that our new lords and masters will be as magnanimous towards us when they take over as we were towards them. Don’t count on it Dougie.

  347. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:42 am  

    It’s deadly serious. It’s existential. Do you know what that means?

    Do you?

    You keep using the term “existential” without any real grasp of any of its senses (tip: there is more than one).

    I think it is utterly hilarious; and very revealing.

    To be frank, I cannot help thinking of you as a rather sad and poorly educated individual, armed with a dictionary, a Party prompt sheet, but rapidly running out of crayons.

    Poor you.

  348. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:47 am  

    Probably running out of crayons because IAE has eaten them, mind.

    Douglas – up thread (and miles of print away), IAE confirms that he is the bonkers “I am English”, so recently banned from HP for his incessant racist trolling and serial anti-Semitism.

  349. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:49 am  

    Yes, I was aware of that thanks Abu.

    I am using the word in its adjectival sense of ‘pertaining to existence’.

    Do you have some reason to believe otherwise? if yes, then why not out with it instead of tittering like a silly schoolgirl in the wings.

  350. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:50 am  

    Dan Dare @ 346,

    There has been an enormous amount to deny.

    Most of what you say and more of what you write.

    I happen to think that we win through getting together, rather than being apart.

    I gave a couple of examples upthread @ 326.

    Perhaps you would like to respond?

    Thought not.

  351. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:53 am  

    Abu Faris @ 348,

    It is not that he should be banned, exactly, it is that he should be sectioned.

    Expect this to cause a thousand mile thread….

  352. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:55 am  

    ANd, personally speaking, I find the repeated and not very sly racist remarks aimed in my direction by Dan and his deranged side-kick rather amusing.

    Is beyond me how they think they improve their electoral chances and social appeal by publicly revealing themselves so as a gang of unreconstructed Nazi thugs.

    I put it down to some unfortunate side-effect of the anti-psychotics some of them most clearly have been prescribed. Then, I always try to maintain a charitable stance to those most in need of care in the community.

  353. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:55 am  

    #344 Oh I know how debates work Heir Dan as well as parties. Here some make death threats (allegedly) and plot against each other and get arrested.

    #338 So you dont want them golden oldies to return, you say good ridance to the rich and those that you want to return are simply hypocrites who love their country so much they have left to live in their country – because they resent immigration.

    Ok that says a lot about how you arrive at your ill thoughtout conclusions and policies. So you won’t be having millions of people returning with lots of money to reinvest to counter the brain and wealth drain will you Daring Dan. You dont want the elderly to return, but because that grouping is some of the most patriotic, they’ll probably be some of the first to return, putting a burden on your health and care sevices and pushing up taxes. Not good economics hey Dan?

    And what you think should happen with EU is totally opposite to the party that you’re a member of, well that shows the signs of a well gelled and cohesive homogenous party.

    So much for having policies and being part of a political party Dan, cos you clearly dont agree with yours, and there is no point in talking cloud cuckoo land policies. Cos that’s not how policies work in real parties in this country, but that maybe how fascists function. What are you finding so hard to grasp?

    If all you’re gonna keep throwing into the discussion is your personal hopes, wishes and desires without an inkling of reality, you’d better save them for another party hey Dan…..
    YOUR BIRTHDAY PARTY LOL.

    Rab Rakha!

  354. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:58 am  

    Erm, Dan – “existential” is the adjective.

    D’oh

  355. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 2:59 am  

    Sorry Dougie not getting it. What is it exactly I am supposed to have denied? As far as I can see 326 is you getting hot under the collar about being called a Quisling (a charge subsequently downgraded to inadvertant Quisling) and quoting a couple of my own comments as evidence.

    I’ve never denied calling you a Quisling and can do so again if you wish.

    But please indulge me which of your important utterances is it that you feel I have denied?

    Simply repeat them here and I will respond. (I might deny them as lies or rubbish but let’s have a look eh?)

  356. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:00 am  

    Dan’s views about the EU are a desperate attempt to chime with Mosley’s ludicrous rubbish about a Europe of European races.

    Of course, Dan will not want to admit that Mosley was Britain’s very own Quisling. Oh deary me, no.

  357. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:00 am  

    Abu Faris,

    I have no idea of your ethnicity, but if any bugger called me ‘fella’, I’d be a tad annoyed.

  358. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:02 am  

    As is racial, in ‘It isn’t racial, it’s existential’, the earlier expression that you took exception have have been inanely tittering about ever since.

    Isn’t there any telly to watch in Sudan that you need to be silly all the time?

    What’s your point, if any?

  359. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:02 am  

    One for Douglas:

    Quite recently a Scottish pensioner, an ex Black Watch soldier from WWII, was passing some BNP Nazis in Perthshire. Reportedly, he wandered across to the nearest bonehead and said:

    “I used to get paid to shoot the likes of you, wee laddie.”

    Lest we forget.

  360. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:04 am  

    I think I am making rather a large number of points, Dan. Not that you appear to be able to recognise any of them – which is chief amongst my points.

  361. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:09 am  

    As far as I can tell your incoherent yammerings revolve principally around Nazis and crayons, how old are you? Twelve?

    A little on the young side for a self-confessed active Rassenschänder isn’t it?

  362. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:11 am  

    Dan Dare @ 355,

    Of course you don’t get it! You are not allowed to ‘get it’

    Is the example of what you don’t get, Poles and folk helping us? Indian dying to protect their country?

    I think it is. I think you are wrong.

    I happen to think that the Russians won WW2, too.

    But there you go.

  363. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:15 am  

    I mean, let’s be honest here, not even the Nazis have ever taken themselves seriously on an intellectual level. Rosenberg’s rambling plagiarisms were regarded by the leadership as useful fodder with which to blind the bonehead followers with pseudo-intellectual claptrap. Those Nazis who did take themselves seriously were utterly off their heads. In the main, they were a gang of utterly corrupt, thieving scumbag crooks, vagrants and assorted headcases who saw the main chance politically and took it.

    So it is a bit rich for dear old Dan, who has been systematically dropping one racist insult into his (dare I call it?) discourse from the off to now come over all aggrieved because I refuse to take his garbage seriously. Dan likes to throw words around the meaning of which he is deeply insecure. What else would an adjective be, but an adjective – what a dunce! But we must, simply must take him seriously, for he is of the ubermenschen, amongst the Supermen, an intellectual giant. Not.

    So I laugh at you, Dan; repeatedly – because it annoys you and you can do sweet fanny adams about it. Mocking bullies enrages them so and is such sweet revenge to see them blindly floundering about, swinging hay-makers to no effect other than to confirm to one and all watching on what a fucking bitch it is to be you and so stupid and so ugly and so, so very, very wrong.

  364. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:15 am  

    Dougie, where have I ever denied Poles helped us during the war, or that Indians died protecting their country?

    It would be daft to do either and I don’t do daft. But more the point, so what?

    You need to come up with something better than that or you’ll be needing to withdraw the aspersions like a Scottish gentleman.

  365. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:19 am  

    As far as I can tell your incoherent yammerings revolve principally around Nazis and crayons

    Clearly, I have hit a nerve.

  366. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:22 am  

    I wonder if Dan might explain why it is that the vast majority of Nazis are (and were) all such under-achieving thickos?

  367. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:24 am  

    Clearly, I have hit a nerve

    Not one of mine mate, it’s you that’s got the Nazi fetish not me.

    You might want to look into getting it seen to.

  368. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:30 am  

    I would always use the green crayon, Dan – but the choice is yours.

  369. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:32 am  

    Now grasp it firmly in your fist and scrawl ” My name is Dan and I’m a Nazi clown”.

    Don’t worry if you make a mistake, we’ve got plenty of sugar paper for you to have another go.

  370. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:33 am  

    Dan Dare,

    I think I see through you, you are daft, and you are BNP. It is pretty obvious that fighting against fascists, such as you, is a bloody good thing!

    I can not figure how an English patriot can align themselves with a shower of bastards that my father fought against. As far as I am concerned you are scum.

    He fought the Nazis. He nearly died because of these bastards. It is an insult to his memory for arseholes like you to argue otherwise.

    At least, I think, the BNP have no idea of the past, and Dan Dare is a complete utter traitor.

  371. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:38 am  

    So no denying then eh Dougie, doesn’t that call for an apology?

    Just say you got a little confused as you often do, and nobody’ll mind.

    By the way my Dad fought against the Nazis too, and he hated what became of the country he fought for and in whose armed forces he served for over 30 years.

    It’s like David Irving said “If the troops who landed at Normandy had known what was to become of their country, they wouldn’t have advanced forty yards up the beach”

    So if we’re grasping war heroes to our cause it’s as well to be aware that there’s more that think like my Dad did than yours.

    And just imagine what all those squaddies being cycled through the middle east will be thinking about what’s happening back home.

    I wouldn’t want to be a raggedy-arsed Paki caught up to mischief if those lads were ever given their head.

  372. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:48 am  

    Dan Dare @ 371,

    Oh for goodness sake, David Irving? Is that the best you can do?

    Go away, and come back with substance you marshmallow!

  373. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:55 am  

    Anyway, time for bed!

    No doubt you and your pals will try to infect this site in my absence. Best of luck…

  374. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:02 am  

    @372

    haha knew that would get you going. Nighty-night!

    Abu’s probably already tucked up snugly with his camel.

  375. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:20 am  

    Bloody hell. Have you been on the old Red Bull Dan?

  376. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:28 am  

    By the way my Dad fought against the Nazis too, and he hated what became of the country he fought for and in whose armed forces he served for over 30 years.

    He might as well have joined the nazis if you ask me. Hang on, you’ve done that for him haven’t you?

  377. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:34 am  

    Nah, not asleep, Dan – rather, sitting in a gay bar run by illegal Nigerian Muslim immigrants, sipping a rather fine Indian beer, whilst idly flicking through my copy of the Jewish Chronicle.

    “waits for Nazi to implode*

  378. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:53 am  

    Clark (& et al)

    Fella, you need a check up from the head up my friend.
    Your entire style is comes straight the playground and of course that is par for the course on these threads. You really haven’t got an honest or decent bone in you by your conduct here.

    As we can all see, you started off by ignoring virulent racism from your friend Dalbir but abusing me for raising objections to it.

    Then you set yourself as a leader of the comments box and ignore any cogent questions; then continue with abuse, add in some lies, over look your friends lies and racism, demand I justify myself without once addressing any point raised long before that arrogance and then claim victory when I tell you that I don’t bow down to such ignorant and obvious machinations.
    You and your friends fully expected, though somewhat pathetic, self-affirmation and mutual masturbation does nothing to detract from the fact that you have been consistently caught out lying.

    Putting lots of comments in front of the deed by way of more self-affirmation would not distract any normal open minded person from seeing that you and your playmates have been thoroughly childish and outright dishonest in your entire conduct.

    You personally have been thoroughly exposed as a base liar and so the natural projection is turn it onto me. It’s the way these things go. So very predicable. So very boring.

    You are at all the way through and still at @ # 339 “Is IAE, which some people think means I am an Englishman, entirely sane?”

    As if, a) being mentally deranged entails pointing the lies and racism of you and your cronies and b) I didn’t already acknowledge @ # 145 I was indeed one and the same, confirmed once again by your other lying playmate Abu Faris @ 348 replete with the same unsubstantiated lies he has been challenged to prove time over.

    You lying, game playing weirdo’s.

  379. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:59 am  

    The simple fact is that these threads always go the same way with people like you Clark, Abu Faris and Dalbir lying through teeth and then denying you said what you said, or you didn’t really mean what you said or it didn’t happen at all.

    And of course the dissenter is mental / criminal / pederast / subnormal / Nazi or the entire lot.

    Then of course after reams of nonsense and evasions you claim victory contrary to reality and think something has been achieved.

  380. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 5:07 am  

    And so to turn the full circle back to my original unaddressed points:

    And for those of us who actually came here for a free and honest exchange, you know actual adult debate rather then the bizarre circus that most the commentators here have dragged it down to, I again present two short MSM reports and ask a few straightforward and genuine questions.

    Is it just possible someone here might be genuine enough, adult enough and honest enough to engage upon this?

    The first is a report on the implosion in swathes of Sweden that have been flooded with Third World immigration; watch the sheer contempt towards the police and ultimately the Swedish by the aliens in the clip matched only by the exasperation of the officers:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JBpVAj4ILM

    My question is: Given that it costs Sweden lots of money to have these people there and there is no economic benefit whatsoever (proof can be produced if you want but listen to the unemployment rate in the report to get a flavour) what possible reason could the Swedish government have as a supposed representative of Sweden’s interests for continuing this?

    What possible benefit can this be? For anyone?

    Especially after not only the massive fiscal impact and massive impact on social cohesion but also the massive impact on the crime rate, most especially rape and the rape of children (again, plenty of proof for that if disputed)?

    The second is a short report from a Norwegian MSM about one poor little Norwegian boy growing up in an immigrant majority district of Oslo and the profound effect this had on him.

    This poor kid has been beaten, told he is going to hell for being Norwegian, ostracised and left sad and friendless all because his idiotic parents wanted to buy into the multicult myth and impose it upon their child.

    Eventually, even these soppy deluded fools realise the extreme unhappiness of their child, the unworkable situation of the multicult in reality and the damage they are inflicting on him and at last allowed him follow his nature and instinct and be amongst his own.
    Needless to say, within pretty much the first minute of being amongst his own he was visibly happy.

    http://vimeo.com/10210382

    My question is this: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

  381. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 5:24 am  

    Nurse, Nurse!!!!

    Quick, the screens!

    IAE has come around from his meds and that bloody orderly has not strapped him down to his gurney like he should!

    Now he’s wandering the ward, upsetting the “ethnics” with his chattering teeth. bulging eyes and foam-flecked screams.

  382. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 5:25 am  

    No-one gives a flying feck about your bloody dodgy videos from Sweden, you lunatic. Give us a rest.

  383. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 5:44 am  

    Père Abu sez

    I’m sitting in a gay bar idly flicking through my copy of the Jewish Chronicle

    Hmmm I had wondered, that explains a lot. You’re not Daniel Hoffman-Gill having us on are you? I know Dougie and him are best mates which could explain the midget-wrestler tag team act that you two have been putting on here.

  384. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:51 am  

    Dan Dare @ 373,

    Good morning you Mekon fighting man, you.

    Continuing on from last night we have IAE @ 378 et al, being a condescending person.

    Apparently my entire style comes out of the playground. I’d have thought his entire style came out of a graveyard somewhere. He has this ghoulish fascination with coloured people, although I note that he considers his questions ‘cogent’.

    I doubt he even knows what cogent means, for he does not practice it.

    He says:

    As if, a) being mentally deranged entails pointing the lies and racism of you and your cronies and b) I didn’t already acknowledge @ # 145 I was indeed one and the same, confirmed once again by your other lying playmate Abu Faris @ 348 replete with the same unsubstantiated lies he has been challenged to prove time over.

    Which helps us only a little. It is pretty obvious that IAE at that post (145) admits he is mentally unstable, which will come as no surprise to anyone, and sees himself as a wee terror.

    So what?

    This is Mr Secret, the soul that cannot speak for what he believes, far less admit that he is BNP. This is the person that can’t actually put a thought together, unless it is to attack others. He is a wee, sensitive soul, dressed up in a Nazi uniform. Or, alternatively a one legged, lesbian saxaphone player from Uraguay. Who knows?

    For someone that has commented on here a considerable amount, we are none the wiser.

    He has been asked to express himself freely, by me, and has chosen not to do so. Tells you all you need to know really.

    379 is an example of farting against thunder. We have the brain challenged IAE saying that Abu Faris, Dalbir and I are lying through our teeth, and only his mad and sad philosophy should be accepted.

    Y’know what?

    I don’t think so.

    So IAE canny help himself and goes on to say @ 380, the most egregious load of shit he has managed to assemble in what passes for a brain in his head. He takes a Fox News commentary as definitive, and then he follows it up with a withdrawn video from Norwegian TV.

    The second is a short report from a Norwegian MSM about one poor little Norwegian boy growing up in an immigrant majority district of Oslo and the profound effect this had on him.

    Bullying is always wrong. Perhaps IAE could take that sentiment out of the video.

    Perhaps not.

    Interesting that you, Dan Dare, know who DHG is. That cannot be common knowledge, I’d have thought….

    Quite surprising that he, and I, have been attacked by morons, ain’t it?

  385. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:08 am  

    By the way Dan Dare, who are you?

    What age are you, where do you come from? Are you married? Do you have kids? Do you have an investment in the UK or are you living in Malaga?

    We know you hate Arsenal, so I assume you are a Chelsea supporter?

    What drove you to join an outfit like the BNP?

    Do tell…..

  386. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:25 am  

    Dan Dare @ 344

    The general procedure for a discussion, or a debate if you will, is not as you outline at 344.

    It is this:

    Party A proposes.

    Party B speaks to the contrary.

    party A supports and answers the points Party B makes.

    Party B gets to answer and conclude.

    Or, on other hand:

    Party A proposes.

    The BNP opposes.

    Party A knocks spots off the BNP.

    The BNP cry a lot….ad infinitum, even.

    Seems that this thread is the proof of that.

  387. persephone — on 13th April, 2010 at 9:29 am  

    This use of the argument of ‘my dad fought in the war’ is a bit Griffinesque. Must be part of the bnp guide to creating quick credibility. It all comes across as very formulaic and quite childlike. But then that helps those who cannot form their own arguments.

    I especially love the hypocrisy and the lack of veracity where bnp ‘policy’ is based on the ‘hidden’ concern regarding immigration by brits moving to Spain.

  388. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 9:51 am  

    I am Abu Faris, not Daniel.

    Amazing how quickly the BNP-ers reveal the dark heart of their chauvinism as anti-Semitism if poked in the right way.

    No surprises from the Nazi pond-life there, then!

  389. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:00 am  

    Abu Faris,

    Or Daniel Hoffman Gill as you are otherwise known to right wing lunatics. ;-)

    Well said!

  390. Abu Faris — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:38 am  

    This incredibly brave and righteous man should upset Dan Dare and his anti-Semite twitching Gestapo no end:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham_Reuel

  391. Ravi Naik — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:55 am  

    self-confessed active Rassenschänder isn’t it?

    Does using third reich terms make you feel like a member of the master race? You seem to be overcompensating for being a pathetic loser.

    You need to go back to Stormfront, where you and other people who suffer from supremacism (a chronic and incurable disease) can feel cuddled and protected. Where your mediocre existence can be explained by the fact that all non-whites are social parasites who contribute nothing to society, and that Jews are conspiring to destroy the master race.

  392. Ravi Naik — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:56 am  

    Is it just possible someone here might be genuine enough, adult enough and honest enough to engage upon this?

    Check #222. And read carefully.

  393. Ravi Naik — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:58 am  

    The first is a report on the implosion in swathes of Sweden that have been flooded with Third World immigration; watch the sheer contempt towards the police and ultimately the Swedish by the aliens

    Why do you go to Sweden, where most people are unaware of its reality? Why not stick to Britain? You seem to want to extrapolate what happens in Sweden to this country, which is rather silly.

    the massive impact on the crime rate, most especially rape and the rape of children (again, plenty of proof for that if disputed)?

    Yes, I would like some proof of that, including pedophilia crimes. In fact, I want numbers not percentages, and I want the number of convicted people not arrested on suspicion.

    The second is a short report from a Norwegian MSM about one poor little Norwegian boy growing up in an immigrant majority district of Oslo and the profound effect this had on him. This poor kid has been beaten

    (a) Use children to evoke strong emotions – checked
    (b) Insinuate that non-whites are racists and savages
    and will attack whites when given the chance (projection) – checked
    (c) Evoke images of tribalism and being under sieged – checked

    So well done, Mr Griffin – your propaganda just passed quality control.

    Bullying is unfortunately a reality in several schools – it is something that nobody should be subject to, but you are certainly not immune to that by racial separation.

  394. Arif — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:35 am  

    Ravi Naik – I don’t think you should underplay the racism or religious supremacism aspects of the bullying in the video.

    The point for me is that racist bullying, if it isn’t challenged, destroys lives and can get more virulent and self-confident until you end up with the equivalent of a BNP which openly campaigns and develops policies to victimise and exclude people on a large scale.

    Here a white boy was being bullied primarily based on religion and the school seemed to do nothing about it. The parents did not seem to know how to discuss this with other parents. They went to another school for a quiet life, but did not (apparently) become racist themselves.

    The propaganda it is being used for is not vastly different from the kind used by some minority would-be gangsters who think they are superior to white people.

    In Britain, I think anti-racist campaigns may have had more impact in raising awareness of school responsibilities, but it sure isn’t perfect. Such campaigns need to ensure that they challenge bullying by minorities who are local majorities as much as by any other group.

  395. Ravi Naik — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:57 am  

    Ravi Naik – I don’t think you should underplay the racism or religious supremacism aspects of the bullying in the video.

    Arif – I believe we should not focus on just one point of bullying. It is not just racist and religious bullying that destroys self-confidence and the feelings of exclusion. Kids who are fat, disabled, who can be more effeminate, who are smarter or dumber, who are ugly, can be targets of equal cruel taunting. Bullying is something schools must tackle heads-on (something that the school in the video failed miserably), as kids must learn to respect difference and diversity. Somehow, I do not think that’s what IAE had in mind.

  396. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:10 pm  

    Mangles,

    PS: Jai Ji -still lookin forward to your Vaisakhi article.

    It was already completed several days ago, and should be published on PP sometime later today.

    ***********************************

    Douglas,

    Jai, it is up to you, but I think you should call a day on this….

    There is enough evidence of mendacity and evil for you to call a halt.

    It’s actually proving to be very constructive indeed, although probably not quite in the way that our visitors from the BNP intended. In fact, many of the key criticisms of the BNP are being confirmed directly by the views and actions of those commenters themselves, with comparatively little prompting required from anyone else.

    It’s also worth remembering that engaging with such individuals is as problematic and potentially as pointless as attempting to constructively engage with brainwashed members of Al-Muhajiroun/Islam4UK, the Taliban and Al-Qaeda, given the deep-rooted psychological conditioning and heavily distorted worldview involved, and the fact that Britain’s far-Right refugees from the 19th century are themselves a similar extremist legacy of the extensive religious & racial radicalisation which occurred in that era. This is the scale of severe cognitive dissonance and conditioned behavioural disorders involved.

    As for the various references by BNP members to the BNP’s alleged policies, regarding both the material displayed on the party’s public website and the series of assertions posted by a BNP member on this thread, it’s worth bearing in mind that Pickled Politics has several dozen detailed answers (to policy-related questions) directly from the BNP’s senior leadership, and the contents were fully authorised, on the record, and in writing, all supplemented with electronic correspondence formally confirming the matter. Therefore, in areas which overlap with some of the issues raised on this comments thread, anyone wishing to gain a greater understanding is advised to read the information supplied directly by the BNP’s leadership and which is available elsewhere on this website. As I said earlier, statements and assertions by proxy BNP mouthpieces have comparatively little merit and diminished credibility, along with the unspoken caveat of ‘plausible deniability’.

    Regarding anything whatsoever to do with BNP policies and agendas, the only information of real interest is that which comes directly from the leadership; if it is provided verbally then its source is self-evident, and if it is provided in writing then the identity of the author needs to be supported by formal written confirmation of the matter, ideally coupled with written confirmation that they are formally authorised to speak for & represent the BNP. Anything else from anyone else claiming to be associated with the BNP is immaterial, and therefore constitutes a wasted effort on the part of the individuals posting such information along with a waste of time on the part of the people reading it, apart from highlighting the true nature of the BNP’s core supporters and the type of behaviour such allegedly civilised individuals see fit to engage in.

  397. Ravi Naik — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:30 pm  

    Anything else from anyone else claiming to be associated with the BNP is immaterial, and therefore constitutes a wasted effort on the part of the individuals posting such information along with a waste of time on the part of the people reading it, apart from highlighting the true nature of the BNP’s core supporters

    Jai, I think you will be very disappointed if you think that the BNP cannot spin the OP question. For the majority of us, your question is a check-mate. But they will not concede that they have no idea what they are talking about. For BNP supporters and would-be supporters, any unrealistic answer given by the BNP (like increasing the amount of money to get rid of 9% of the population) is good enough. In the end, it will not move numbers either way.

    I do think it is important to understand the techniques in which the BNP (either to their leadership or their supporters) spread their ideas and not dismiss them as a waste of time. Do remember that BNP supporters are trained with a book called “BNP manual of language and discipline”. I think Dan Dare and IAE have served this purpose quite well in this thread.

  398. douglas clark — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:31 pm  

    Jai,

    Point. I was probably just getting tired!

    Do you intend to pursue Lee John Barnes on this very important issue? The one in your OP, obviously.

  399. Arif — on 13th April, 2010 at 12:43 pm  

    I understand what you are saying Ravi, and I think I didn’t read you carefully enough, and started considering how the kid would feel if someone said that there is no need to make a big deal about it, because they got bullied for being fat or a swot…

    I know you are saying almost the opposite – the point you are making is that it IS a big deal also to be bullied in other ways which are less group-based and perhaps less central to your sense of identity and which don’t end up in political programmes.

    But in a context where many people try to normalise bullying and play down its personal and social implications, we should ensure we don’t do the same by not taking seriously a story from Oslo because of what we presume to be the intentions of people who promote it.

  400. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:23 pm  

    Ravi,

    Jai, I think you will be very disappointed if you think that the BNP cannot spin the OP question. For the majority of us, your question is a check-mate. But they will not concede that they have no idea what they are talking about…..I do think it is important to understand the techniques in which the BNP (either to their leadership or their supporters) spread their ideas and not dismiss them as a waste of time. Do remember that BNP supporters are trained with a book called “BNP manual of language and discipline”. I think Dan Dare and IAE have served this purpose quite well in this thread.

    I agree completely and am well aware of the propaganda techniques that BNP activists are encouraged to adhere to. The behaviour of Dan Dare and IAE was exactly as expected; when the main article as published, I expected either complete silence from BNP members or actions exactly along the lines of the comments posted by BNP members throughout this thread. In fact, the individuals associated with the BNP leadership (who are known to read this website) and the party’s members who have posted numerous comments here have all reacted exactly as I predicted. Therefore, they’ve served their purpose perfectly in that regard too, although (again) not necessarily in the way that they may have originally intended.

  401. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 1:31 pm  

    Douglas,

    Do you intend to pursue Lee John Barnes on this very important issue? The one in your OP, obviously.

    We’ll see. In any case, as I said earlier, the question is publicly addressed to any member of the BNP’s leadership, and the facility to easily provide a response has been provided via the ‘contact forms’ link. Presumably the BNP leadership already possesses a comprehensive roadmap detailing exactly how they plan to achieve a nationwide population reduction targetting 6 million non-white citizens, so it is a straightforward matter of copying the entire second blockquoted section (verbatim and in full) in red font in the main article, from here:

    Fine. I’m removing all alleged “free speech restrictions” — therefore, providing a detailed and comprehensive answer in writing and on the record to the following straightforward question should not be an issue:

    ….to the end of the section here:

    Finally, the response should be copied in full & verbatim in an email from a verifiable BNP email account to this website’s editorial team via both of the contact forms displayed here: http://www.pickledpolitics.com/contact in order to provide an authenticated electronic record of the contents along with electronic confirmation that the author is indeed who they claim to be and has been formally authorised to speak for & represent the BNP in this matter.

    …..pasting it all into the two contact forms, followed by the maximum amount of detail involving the aforementioned population reduction roadmap, along with formal written confirmation of the areas requested in the quoted section.

    The response will automatically be distributed to this website’s editorial team via email, and this will also provide an authenticated electronic record of the correspondence along with electronic confirmation of the author’s own identity & email address. So, it is a very straightforward and easy way for any member of the BNP leadership to provide the information requested, especially as it involves a matter which the entire population of the United Kingdom deserves to know about. Particularly if the BNP really are serious about their claims of being a legitimate democratic political party, which therefore renders them answerable to this country’s general electorate.

  402. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 3:39 pm  

    Clark et al

    Yip.

    More of the standard the dissenter is mental / criminal / pederast / subnormal / Nazi or the entire lot, and no debate.

    Most of you are afraid of debate clearly, as most on the so-called left are and that is why you have to resort to these tricks.

    Oh and you are liars and demonstrably so, here is just a small selection:

    Faris:

    Care to explain why you lied through your teeth @ # 140 with your complete invention that I carried out illegal DoS (only one ‘S’ my old china) attacks on the HP site, a claim not even remotely made by HP themselves?

    And after you do that perhaps you could, as previously asked several times now, substantiate your charge / lie that I had been banned from HP for “repeated racist trolling and anti-Semitic remarks.”?

    Care to substantiate your “Nazi” smear / lie / charge with any actual proof or just leave it open that it is another of your lies?

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

    Clark:

    You accuse me of bringing the thread to ‘incivility’ when long before I appeared a rather virulent racist remark was made that bothered you naught because of your selective take on racism; when I appeared on the thread to highlight that racism you attack me with abuse and an expletive as well as a laundry list of fantasy, you then go on to personally abuse me with more expletives in later comments, whereas I have not used one such uncivil expletive.

    Care to admit you were wrong and apologies?

    Care to explain why some racism bothers you but other racism doesn’t, yet you describe yourself as ‘anti-racist’?

    What about the statements you have attributed to me I haven’t made and fail to substantiate them with a quote when challenged. Care to do so now or leave it open as the lie it is?

    Dalbir:

    Care to stop your cowardly back tracking out of you blatantly racist statement:

    …“We belong here more than the English”…

    and if not, at least try and account for the last lie you were caught out on:

    … “the original statement made to get on your ‘bristols’. It worked! Lol” …

    when once again the truth and the facts are diametrically opposed to your latest story in that you made your blatantly racist belief known in comment # 24 and I didn’t even enter the thread and begin commenting until comment # 82.

    And then perhaps some of the others;

    when upon challenged about your racism you eventually rendered it to:

    …“I’ve the same right here as Anglos have in Australia or Canada”…

    and when I pointed out that you were not placing your ethnicity on any ‘same’ or ‘equal’ right but far superior to others, the indigenous English at that, you then had another crack and amended your position to:

    … “My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference…”…

    and so not only confirmed again that you meant every word of your original statement but further confirmed the ‘we’ was made in reference to Punjab and Punjabis, an ethnic group, and not as your latest backtracking lie would have it, a religious group.

  403. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:37 pm  

    IAE

    Do you agree with your racist friend “we belong here more then English” with the “we” being Punjabis?

    IAE, you need to rewrite your arguments to encompass the fact that my primary identity is Sikh, not Panjabi. Deal with it and amend your nonsense accordingly please.

    I don’t think it is neccesary for anyone to respond to his questions as I’ve clarified my position to him ad nauseum on the matter. It is worth noticing is that this has been totally ignored by nazi boy, just so he can continue to bang on with his contrived thesis. It’s like an adult version of when a child sticks his/her fingers in their ears and closes their eyes loudly repeating the same thing again and again to someone trying to talk to them. This constitutes debate for them I imagine.

    Some of you will know, I’m not too sensitive about labels as are being bandied around by DD, IAE, but what I do insist on is an accurate portrayal of my views, even if they aren’t PC. This is something the currently resident nazis seem incapable of, I wonder why?

    Also IAE, try and direct your questions about my comments to me, not others. It is I who is responsible for them, no one else.

    The zombies have consistently weaseled away from answering questions regarding their wider views on immigration and repatriation in relation to Anglos moving and settling in certain foreign lands whilst at the same time demanding answers vehemently themselves.

    The reason they have deflected from answering these questions is that they will be in danger of exposing their true vile nature in the attempt. Rather than me genuinely believing in the right of Panjabis to inhabit England over the English, it is actually these people that believe ‘their own’ have more of a right in foreign nonwhite lands than those already there, based on an assumed superiority that totally negates any opinion of the original inhabitants. This ironically is what they claim to be victims of themselves.

    DD: Australia and Canada didn’t exist until Anglos created them. The third world invaders who have recently turned up more or less uninvited in the Eurosphere are essentially parasitic and collectively perform no useful function.

    I believe we can seriously claim that the European populations in North America and Australia *are* the real, de facto indigenous population, since they are the descendants of the settlers who first created the country as we know it today. The original indigenes are simply a historical footnote

    No the point is eluding you. Australia, Canada, the United States and, to a large extent, Southern Africa were effectively Terra Nullius, large and extremely sparsely populated regions whose few inhabitants were at a Neolithic stage of development, being generous. No coherent civilisation existed in any of these areas, merely a collection of mutually antagonistic primitive tribes, which were spread extremely thinly across huge and largely empty land areas.

    Soak it in folks. Real civilised.

  404. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:49 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 403

    The questions were directed at you and once again you have failed to account for either your racism or your lies, or even ideally both.

    Why can you account the glaring untruths you have told above

  405. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:50 pm  

    Arif @ # 393

    At last, someone honest on here willing to debate and I can assure you my ‘intentions’ are exactly as expressed in the question I asked after the report and at the bottom of this comment.

    Although of course, Clark et al (and I suspect Ravi as well) are not in the remotest bit genuine here, as their repeated lies and baseless slurs have shown.
    They are only interested, indeed desperate, to smear me as a Nazi and mentally ill (in need no doubt of some Soviet style political rehabilitation in an asylum) and distract away from any real debate.

    Anyhow, I agree with a fair proportion of what you have to say but quibble that the primary motivation behind the bullying is religious as the child and his parents are atheist (even though the child felt forced to make gestures as Islam views atheism as a capital offence.)

    My question is this: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

  406. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 4:54 pm  

    Ravi @ # 392

    I am afraid to say on past experience here, you don’t really strike me as genuinely seeking honest debate but I will go along with it in the hope that you are; first off though, you haven’t watched the reports have you?

    Please do if you are really interested in debate.

    “Why do you go to Sweden”

    Because the visual aid was available and because 20 years ago it had virtually no immigration and now it has levels at around just 5% of its populace (in line with the rest of Scandinavia) with devastating effects, as I will show.

    “why not stick to Britain?”

    I will return to the UK on this, but the figures, visual aids and credible reports are more readily available in Scandinavia, which is why many nationalists start with that area.

    “why not stick to Britain?”

    “You seem to want to extrapolate what happens in Sweden to this country, which is rather silly.”

    Not at all. It is exactly the same story all over Scandinavia as I will show at the same current 5% levels; it is the story in Europe, especially France, and it is emerging now in Australia too as well.

    “including pedophilia crimes”

    This report says the rape of children (under 15) had increased six times in 20 years since mass immigration in Sweden began:

    http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/article326023.ab

    This report says the rape of children has now doubled in the last 10 years:

    http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=890&date=20050125

    “Yes, I would like some proof of that…In fact, I want numbers not percentages, and I want the number of convicted people not arrested on suspicion.”

    It doesn’t really matter what you want, it only matters what the governments will let you have.

    The fact is that these government that preside over such a wholesale failed social experiment are not really too keen on exposing just what a failure it is by their own hand.

    But these are some of the figures and reports that are available and although this piece presented has been touted around the internet a fair bit now, I have checked each link and they are genuine (non-white in practice means Muslims in most of the bits below I found.)

    In Denmark non-whites committed 68% of all rapes, and it was revealed that non-whites were over-represented in all crime by an average of 46% and in Copenhagen 47.5% of prisoners on remand for serious crimes were non-white. In Norway it was found that two out of three charged with rape in Oslo were non-white and that every case of aggravated sexual assault ending in rape over the past three years was committed by non-white immigrants, whilst in Sweden it was found that a rapist was four times more likely to have been born abroad – with Algeria, Libya, Morocco and Tunisia dominating the group of rape suspects and that non-whites were responsible for 25% of all crime in Sweden A survey in Australia found that in Melbourne magistrate’s courts, offenders from the horn of Africa and the Middle East were 20 times the representative proportion of their population…

    http://www.cphpost.dk/news/1-latest-news/27877.html

    http://www.cphpost.dk/news/1-latest-news/28210.html

    http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article190268.ece

    http://www.norwaypost.no/content/view/21900/26/

    http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/article327666.ab

    http://www.thelocal.se/2683/20051214/

    http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,,21166482-661,00.html

    Cached copy Norway Post:

    http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:http://www.norwaypost.no/content/view/21900/26/

    “So well done, Mr Griffin – your propaganda just passed quality control.”

    Facile. It is what it is, and it is from an independent source.

    “Bullying is unfortunately a reality in several schools – it is something that nobody should be subject to, but you are certainly not immune to that by racial separation.”

    You haven’t watched the report and my question is this: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

  407. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 5:12 pm  

    IAE: The questions were directed at you

    I explained, why are you doing this?

    an adult version of when a child sticks his/her fingers in their ears and closes their eyes loudly repeating the same thing again and again to someone trying to talk to them

  408. Arif — on 13th April, 2010 at 5:28 pm  

    My answer is this – religious bullying, like racial and other kinds of bullying, should not be tolerated.

    Whether this is in a “majority alien area” as you call it or not, it is right to be concerned about it as bullying.

    In addition, as the motivation for the bullying seem to be religious difference, religious discrimination and intolerance are the the key political issues to address and campaign against in this context.

    That is what would make the difference in that area or any other area. If religious discrimination and bullying are allowed, then everyone of every community should be concerned, and try to prevent it by setting strict standards for mutual respect.

  409. Sarah AB — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:03 pm  

    IAE – my main (though not only) reservations about you stem from the assertion that you are I Am English. If you are, then you would seem to be a supporter of a BNP. If you were really just concerned about some of the effects of multiculturalism and immigration in a more or less tolerable and tolerant sort of way then you wouldn’t dislike Harry’s Place so much – assuming you are I Am English . But if you are not I Am English – then do tell us – and sorry if this has been cleared up already but it’s been a long thread!

    I did watch the whole Norwegian video in the end and my views about it were pretty much what they were after just seeing the first few minutes. It would seem that the little boy had had a bad experience through being in a minority – white and non-Muslim. But as I said earlier I don’t see this as radically different from any other kind of bullying – it needs to be addressed but doesn’t in any way translate into feeling the need to support the BNP! I would feel the same if the situation were reversed and it was a non-white Muslim child being bullied – and I know someone whose son has been in just that situation in the UK. As I said earlier my son has been hassled about being an atheist by some white Christians but never by Muslim classmates. The school the Norwegian boy ended up in actually contained a number of non-white children – some of the mothers wore hijab I think I noticed. And that all seemed fine.

    In some ways your views *seem* similar to some of the more right wing types on HP. But those people – mostly! – are anxious to distance their views from those of the BNP. You don’t seem to care to do that.

  410. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:07 pm  

    Memo to Jai @396.

    Lee John Barnes is not the BNP leadership. If it doesn’t carry the Chairman’s thumbprint it means nowt.

    Just a word to the wise.

    And Dougie everybody knows who DHG is. He’s the all-purpose Antifa cyber-sockpuppet who whenever the BNP gets a mention pops up through the trapdoor screeching “Nazis! Never Forget! Slippery slope!”. I can’t think what made me confuse him and Abu.

  411. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:09 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 406

    I explained

    No you haven’t. You have lied consitantly . And everyone can see it. They wont say here because if doesn’t suit their agenda, but nonetheless everyone can see it.

    You said what you said, and then you tried to justify your position twice; I exposed that as erroneous and just as racist and at least two others (the rest didn’t care about this particular piece of racism) here challenged you for it too one condemning your extremely racist comment and by extension, you as “stupidity, hate and bigotry.”

    24 hours and two stories later you then claimed it was all really a ‘joke’ and you only said to wind me up but the truth and the fact is that I didn’t even appear on the thread until 68 comments after you made your racist belief public, so once again you lied; your racist utterance had nothing to do with me whatsoever.

    And the ‘we’ in your comment was confirmed as ‘Punjabi’ by this second attempt at justification of your overt racism:

    “My point was that until ‘the English’ reverse the mess they caused in Panjab to the state it was immediately prior to their annexation/interference…”

    why are you doing this?

    You have done it to yourself. You revealed yourself as a racist, and then as a liar.
    And you have enormous front trying to play the victim when you abused me without basis non-stop, the latest smear being “Nazi boy.”

    I get why you wish you hadn’t said what you and why you want to take it back and why you want it to go away; and if you were a better liar perhaps you just might have gotten away with it.

    But you are not, and you are a racist.

  412. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:24 pm  

    #409

    You talk about the notion of the ‘slippery slope’ with the air of the incredulous, as if to imply it is a flight of fancy, yet by your own admission:

    I believe we can seriously claim that the European populations in North America and Australia *are* the real, de facto indigenous population, since they are the descendants of the settlers who first created the country as we know it today. The original indigenes are simply a historical footnote

    Is your real problem the fact that the current batch of ‘aliens’ you are encountering seem to be infinitely more adept at avoiding becoming ‘historical footnotes’ to the chagrin of your ilk?

    Another important thing that needs to be grasped by those on the left here is that these types aren’t really against the type of behaviour seen in that video. They aren’t really against using violence/intimidation. What they don’t like is being on the receiving end of it – but they generally do believe they are perfectly entitled to dish it out.

  413. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:29 pm  

    This comment has been removed (automatically and not through censorship I trust) for having too many links so I will split it into two or three parts:

    Ravi @ # 392

    I am afraid to say on past experience here, you don’t really strike me as genuinely seeking honest debate but I will go along with it in the hope that you are; first off though, you haven’t watched the reports have you?

    Please do if you are really interested in debate.
    “Why do you go to Sweden”

    Because the visual aid was available and because 20 years ago it had virtually no immigration and now it has levels at around just 5% of its populace (in line with the rest of Scandinavia) with devastating effects, as I will show.

    “why not stick to Britain?”

    I will return to the UK on this, but the figures, visual aids and credible reports are more readily available in Scandinavia, which is why many nationalists start with that area.

    “why not stick to Britain?”

    “You seem to want to extrapolate what happens in Sweden to this country, which is rather silly.”

    Not at all. It is exactly the same story all over Scandinavia as I will show at the same current 5% levels; it is the story in Europe, especially France, and it is emerging now in Australia too as well.

    “including pedophilia crimes”
    This report says the rape of children (under 15) had increased six times in 20 years since mass immigration in Sweden began:

    http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/article326023.ab

    This report says the rape of children has now doubled in the last 10 years:

    http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=890&date=20050125

  414. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:31 pm  

    Cont’d

    “Yes, I would like some proof of that…In fact, I want numbers not percentages, and I want the number of convicted people not arrested on suspicion.”

    It doesn’t really matter what you want, it only matters what the governments will let you have.

    The fact is that these government that preside over such a wholesale failed social experiment are not really too keen on exposing just what a failure it is by their own hand.

    But these are some of the figures and reports that are available and although this piece presented has been touted around the internet a fair bit now, I have checked each link and they are genuine (non-white in practice means Muslims in most of the bits below I found.)

    In Denmark non-whites committed 68% of all rapes, and it was revealed that non-whites were over-represented in all crime by an average of 46% and in Copenhagen 47.5% of prisoners on remand for serious crimes were non-white. In Norway it was found that two out of three charged with rape in Oslo were non-white and that every case of aggravated sexual assault ending in rape over the past three years was committed by non-white immigrants, whilst in Sweden it was found that a rapist was four times more likely to have been born abroad – with Algeria, Libya, Morocco and Tunisia dominating the group of rape suspects and that non-whites were responsible for 25% of all crime in Sweden A survey in Australia found that in Melbourne magistrate’s courts, offenders from the horn of Africa and the Middle East were 20 times the representative proportion of their population…

    http://www.cphpost.dk/news/1-latest-news/27877.html

    http://www.cphpost.dk/news/1-latest-news/28210.html

    http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article190268.ece

    http://www.norwaypost.no/content/view/21900/26/

  415. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:32 pm  

    Cont’d

    http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/article327666.ab

    http://www.thelocal.se/2683/20051214/

    http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,,21166482-661,00.html

    Cached copy Norway Post:

    http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:http://www.norwaypost.no/content/view/21900/26/

    “So well done, Mr Griffin – your propaganda just passed quality control.”

    Facile. It is what it is, and it is from an independent source.

    “Bullying is unfortunately a reality in several schools – it is something that nobody should be subject to, but you are certainly not immune to that by racial separation.”

    You haven’t watched the report and my question is this: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

  416. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:42 pm  

    IAE

    Keep clutching nazi boy.

    “Then you said, then I said, then she said….then..then…err…you…”

    Crafty sod, answer the damn questions instead of making a pillock of yourself.

    For the umpteenth time! Please shed light on your attitude towards the migration of Anglos to nonAnglo countries, where they are colonising the place to the detriment of those there before them? I’ve asked you repeatedly! If you truly believe in your repatriation position with conviction, should you not also call for them to be repatriated back here also? If not, why are you espousing one rule for them and another for migrants here? Let me take a wild stab at the answer; is it because you are a horrible nazi who considers nonwhites to be lesser beings to be treated like cattle? If that isn’t true, what is your position then?

    Also whilst you are at it what do feel about your pal Dan Dare’s comments below:

    Australia and Canada didn’t exist until Anglos created them. The third world invaders who have recently turned up more or less uninvited in the Eurosphere are essentially parasitic and collectively perform no useful function.

    I believe we can seriously claim that the European populations in North America and Australia *are* the real, de facto indigenous population, since they are the descendants of the settlers who first created the country as we know it today. The original indigenes are simply a historical footnote

    No the point is eluding you. Australia, Canada, the United States and, to a large extent, Southern Africa were effectively Terra Nullius, large and extremely sparsely populated regions whose few inhabitants were at a Neolithic stage of development, being generous. No coherent civilisation existed in any of these areas, merely a collection of mutually antagonistic primitive tribes, which were spread extremely thinly across huge and largely empty land areas.

    Do you or do you not share these views? If not, how do your views differ from those above exactly?

    Answer please and don’t try and deflect as per norm from you.

  417. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:45 pm  

    Lee John Barnes is not the BNP leadership.

    Correct, but Mr Barnes also provided formal written confirmation via email in his formal capacity as the BNP’s Legal Director (from the associated BNP email account) that he had indeed been fully authorised to speak for & represent the BNP in that matter. The detailed responses he passed on to eGov Monitor (and which were subsequently forwarded to Pickled Politics) were provided on behalf of the BNP senior leadership.

  418. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:51 pm  

    Jai @417

    Can you point to a document which verifies that what you claim was attested to by anyone else in the BNP besides Lee John Barnes?

  419. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:55 pm  

    Arif @ # 407

    As I say I would contend that the bullying was racially motivated rather then religious but either ways considering he was apparently the only white child in the school exactly how could his bullying have been prevented by any action other then removing him from that school?

    Were the teachers supposed to isolate him? Or perhaps provide around the clock protection for him? Were they supposed to force other children to be his friend?
    And as you will have seen, the bullying was not just at school but when he left his house, indeed in the very courtyard he lived in.

    Who was supposed to prevent this? And how? Again, surely the only way to stop it was to move away.

    So again, given this, why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

    And given that Norway has absolutely no need to take in this mass alien immigration (it has no labor shortage nor is there any fiscal gain whatsoever, again that is easily proven) and it has brought with it this type of balkanization as well as the massive and hugely disproportionate increase in crimes such as rape (see reports @ #413) what possible benefit can this be to Norway or the indigenous Norwegian people?

    And if this is what happens at just 5% of alien populace (yes alien is correct as an antonym of indigenous) what will happen at 10%, 20% or when a majority is formed?

  420. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:58 pm  

    Sarah AB @ # 408

    I have been very open about “who I am”, that is the moniker I use, starting way back @ # 145 but it is a complete irrelevance as I am asking you to comment on the facts, not on what your prejudices are of “my whole world” or what party I support.

    It would make no difference if I claimed to be Jedi Knight or a Mooney, it is not about me, it is about the facts I am presenting.

    Regarding HP, within the second comment addressed to me on the first thread I commented on someone declared:” Look at his name: I am English, clearly he is a Nazi! Clearly he is BNP scum! F**k off Nazi scum!” and that set the tone for everyone else. As for the rest of what happened there, it is detailed @ # 145 if you really feel is it is of any relevence.

    As for your explanation, you arrived at exactly as the conclusion you said you would before you even watched it through, which does seem me to be rather blinkered but each to their own.

    You still haven’t answered my question in any way either: Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

    There a lot of points I make in regard to your observations and I posed them to Arif @ # so have a look there if you are interested as there is no point in reproducing them here too.

    My last point would be that the only action possible to stop this child being beaten, abused and isolated on racial grounds was to remove him and put him into a school where the indigenous children were a majority (and you will have seen just how visibly happy he was to be with, and how instantly accepted he was, by his kin literally within one minute of being at that school) and that point ties me straight back to my question above.

  421. Ravi Naik — on 13th April, 2010 at 6:58 pm  

    This report says the rape of children has now doubled in the last 10 years:
    http://www.thelocal.se/article.php?ID=890&date=20050125

    I see no mention of “immigration” in that article. I will ask again: what evidence do you have that immigrants are increasing pedophilia levels in Sweden?

    Of the 111 charged with rape in Oslo last year, 72 were of non-western ethnic origin, 25 are classified as Norwegian or western and 14 are listed as unknown.

    In Oslo last year, 72 non-whites committed rape. Now, how many non-whites live in Oslo?

    Why would this be different in any other majority alien area? And given the ingress and birth rate of the alien populations in the UK and Europe why do we not have every right to be extremely concerned about it and try to prevent it happening to our children?

    IAE – you are aware that non-whites are a minority in the majority of schools in the UK and the rest of Europe. Are you saying that it’s impossible to fight bullying in a situation where there is a majority-minority? Or only when the majority is non-white?

    And are you worried about racism in general or only when non-whites are racist? Clearly if you believe in the former, we are all in it together.

  422. persephone — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:00 pm  

    “If it doesn’t carry the Chairman’s thumbprint it means nowt.”

    Knuckledragging comes to mind here

  423. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:01 pm  

    Dalbir:

    Concerning the European settler countries in the New World.

    I don’t know what sort of storybook fantasy world you inhabit, but where the rest of us live it’s called Realpolitik.

    As many here are often keen to point in justification of their own uninvited presence in these islands, the human urge to seek greener pastures and access to more and better physical resources is eternal.

    If we (the British) do not act to preserve the integrity of our ancient homeland then we deserve the same fate as the native Americans and the aborigines. We will have demonstrated our inability or our unwillingness to hold what we have, and for that we too will deserve to become like they just another historical footnote.

    If we don’t choose to be winners then we will be losers, it’s as simply darwinian as that.

  424. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:05 pm  

    Can you point to a document which verifies that what you claim was attested to by anyone else in the BNP besides Lee John Barnes?

    Ask Mr Barnes. Formal electronic written correspondence between eGov Monitor and the BNP confirms the matter.

  425. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:09 pm  

    Dalbir @ # 415

    Your racist statement:

    “we belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis

    I know you are keen to again put as many comments as possible between your expressed blatantly racist belief as well as your fully exposed lies about it and to use as many racist descriptions and abuse for an Englishmen that you can without any proof whatsoever, but I can assure you that it won’t go away until you come clean and address your dishonesty.

    You do that and I will happily debate your straw man distraction with you.

    Start here:

    24 hours and two stories later you then claimed it was all really a ‘joke’ and you only said it to wind me up but the truth and the fact is that I didn’t even appear on the thread until 68 comments after you made your racist belief public, so once again you lied; your racist utterance had nothing to do with me whatsoever, your claim:

    … “the original statement made to get on your ‘bristols’. It worked! Lol”…

    when once again the truth and the facts are diametrically opposed to your latest story in that you made your blatantly racist belief known in comment # 24 and I didn’t even enter the thread and begin commenting until comment # 82.

    Start there with some honesty and then we can build on it.

    Until then, I am not going to debate with a racist who doesn’t think I even have the right to exist in my own country.

  426. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:12 pm  

    “Until then, I am not going to debate with a racist who doesn’t think I even have the right to exist in my own country.”

    yeah my sentiments exactly

  427. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:18 pm  

    Ask Mr Barnes.

    No I’m asking you to verify your own claims. If you can’t or don’t want to then that’s fine too. Having made the necessary point, I don’t care either way.

    You seem to have a habit of making reckless assertions and then declining to support them when challenged.

  428. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:24 pm  

    Persephone @ #

    Thank you for condemning the extreme and virulent racism of Dalbir.

    Now we just need the so-called other anti-racists here to do so too and we can make a fresh start.

    (A little confused as to why you are including my moniker with yours now, I do hope you are not heading down the spoofing route…)

  429. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:24 pm  

    As many here are often keen to point in justification of their own uninvited presence in these islands, the human urge to seek greener pastures and access to more and better physical resources is eternal.

    Okay, now we are getting somewhere.

    Quit crying about other people doing exactly what your own are. By your own admission above, seeking “greener pastures and access to more and better physical resources” is a characteristic shared by all humans. Stop trying to deny others the right to do this.

    On that note, I’m popping off to the Gurdwara.

    One love people. One love.

  430. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 7:30 pm  

    I’m not crying Dalmir, I’m issuing a call to arms.

    An anti-Jihad Jihad.

    As for seeking greener pastures, I don’t disdain anyone for doing so but on the other hand you should not then complain when unwelcome intruders are asked to go away.

    If you can find somewhere else that’s more accommodating then good luck to you, although if I were you my first priority would be to want to fix my own homeland so I didn’t have to move elsewhere.

  431. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:27 pm  

    IAE @ 428
    “ Thank you for condemning the extreme and virulent racism of Dalbir.

    Now we just need the so-called other anti-racists here to do so too and we can make a fresh start.

    (A little confused as to why you are including my moniker with yours now, I do hope you are not heading down the spoofing route…) “

    Yes confusion indeed.

    I was saying that I too felt affronted at the racists with the bnp mentality on this thread telling me there was no place for me in my country. And the abbrev of IAE after my name was used to remind those racists that I Am English.

    I am not white nor a bnp sympathiser. I hope that resolves the confusion.

  432. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:32 pm  

    Sorry Persephone (IAE) if you are not white it is not possible for you to claim Englishness, since it is an ethnicity not a nationality.

    At least not until we escape from the clammy clutches of McBroon and the rest of Tartan Mafia, and then we’ll see.

    Can’t promise, but we’ll see. But if Hitler was able to decree that the Japanese people be considered honorary Aryans it might be possible to stretch a point and declare you an honorary Englishwoman (Overseas Division) when the time comes. It would need to be for services rendered though we’re not going to be bestowing such honours willy-nilly.

  433. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:46 pm  

    @ 432

    No one can truly claim to be English. We are all Africans.

  434. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:53 pm  

    Speak for yourself, duckie.

    But then why stop at Africa. Why not emulate Pooh-Bar and claim that we can all trace our ancestry back to a protoplasmal primordial atomic globule.

    That makes just as much sense as claiming we’re all African.

  435. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 8:56 pm  

    Persephone @ # 431

    So you are indeed condemning the virulent racism of Dalbir when he stated his racist belief that:

    “we belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis

    Thank you the confirmation that you stand shoulder to shoulder with me on this.

    I do still find it rather odd that you have adopted my moniker but seeing as you say that you are indigenous to these isles then I am quite happy for it to be duplicated. You are indigenous are you not?

    And yes Dan, you are quite right and I made the same point to Clark about the Scots back @ # 300.

    His reply @ # 309 was a real treat into the insight of the so-called Scottish Nationalists:

    “… people like the Spanish and the Jews and Pakistanis and Poles and the English…see themselves as Scottish too…”

    How utterly absurd!

    But of course they are not even remotely Scots or Scottish; and rather unfortunately for Clark, reality once again snatches away the legs of this ideological PC (cultural Marxist) nonsense as it does with all such folly.

    They could equally see themselves as the Kings of Timbuktu or brain surgeons as well but it still wouldn’t make it true.

    You see Clark, the Scots are an indigenous ethnic group from an amalgamation of the Celtic peoples: The Picts, the Gaels, and the Brythons.

    That who the Scots are and no amount of history rewriting, false documenting or cultural dialectics will change that reality.

    In summary: You can have jam written on a jar, but it doesn’t mean there is jam inside.

    Scottish nationalists my eye! They should be taken under the Trade Descriptions Act!

    PS: Dan, now we have at last managed to get some semblance of debate going (much to the chagrin of Clark et al no doubt and their efforts to derail and provoke through non-stop expletive laden abuse and smears) and some rather ‘awkward’ facts have emerged, it is echoing in here!

  436. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 9:31 pm  

    IAE

    “So you are indeed condemning the virulent racism of Dalbir when he stated his racist belief that: “we belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis

    Thank you the confirmation that you stand shoulder to shoulder with me on this.

    I do still find it rather odd that you have adopted my moniker but seeing as you say that you are indigenous to these isles then I am quite happy for it to be duplicated. ”

    Thats a desperate attempt to falsely curry support.

    “You are indigenous are you not?”

    What is your test for this?

  437. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 9:45 pm  

    As for seeking greener pastures, I don’t disdain anyone for doing so but on the other hand you should not then complain when unwelcome intruders are asked to go away.

    I think I should take the example given by Anglos in New Zealand, Australia and Canada etc. etc. and blatantly ignore such calls to leave by the ‘natives’ and view the people who make them as vicious, deranged beings of inferior stock. In the meanwhile I will get on with what I want to. For what is good for the goose is etc. etc.

    Write an essay about that you moron (and I’m talking figuratively here in case it inspires you to produce another long wacky thesis). If you actually engage your brain you’ll see the above is actually a parody of what you believe.

    Awaits for the long “Den he was like….and he said…then I sez…..den he turnt around…..den I turnt around and goes…” response.

    PS – ‘Persephone IAE’ are you the same as ‘Persephone’?

  438. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 9:58 pm  

    Persephone YANE @ # 436

    Thats a desperate attempt to falsely curry support.

    Not at all.

    Unless you are now joining the ranks of the other selective ‘anti-racists’ here who remain either silent or claim that Dalbir’s statement:

    “we belong here more then English” with “we” being Punjabis

    Is not racist? In which your whole comment @ # 426 makes no sense.

    So do you condemn that racist statement above as racism or not?

    Or you really only an ‘anti-racist’ when is suits you?

    What is your test for this?

    Oh come now, surely you are not in all reality attempting to claim you are actually indigenous to these isles?!

    If you really are then I shall just science and the worlds leading expert on genetics answer it below.

    The scientific truth about the homogeneity of the British people is as far removed from the usual ignorant and deliberately undermining PC nonsense as it could possibly be with it being traced all the way back to the Neolithic period and therefore the indigenous status of the British people is perfectly sound; especially when you consider the undisputed indigenous status of the Māori who have only been in NZ for around 700 years.

    Even the EHRC concedes that the British people are indigenous and recently used it as an argument that the proposed BNP constitution amendments indirectly discriminated against non-indigenous civic Britons.

    Professor of Human Genetics at the University of Oxford (and a Fellow of Wolfson College) Bryan Sykes, a world eminent scientist and expert proved through a systematic, ten-year DNA survey of more than 10,000 volunteers:

    * The genetic makeup of Britain and Ireland is overwhelmingly what it has been since the Neolithic period, and to a very considerable extent since the Mesolithic period, especially in the female line.

    * The contribution of the Celts of continental Europe to the genetic makeup of Britain and Ireland was minimal.

    * The Picts were not a separate people: the genetic makeup of the formerly Pictish areas of Scotland shows no significant differences from the general profile of the rest of Britain.

    * The Anglo-Saxons made a substantial contribution to the genetic makeup of England, but in Sykes’s opinion it was under 20 percent of the total, even in southern England.

    * The Vikings (Danes and Norwegians) also made a substantial contribution, which is concentrated in central, northern, and eastern England – the territories of the ancient Danelaw. There is a very heavy Viking contribution in the Orkney and Shetland Islands, in the vicinity of 40 percent. Women as well as men contributed substantially in all these areas, showing that the Vikings engaged in large-scale settlement.

    * The Norman contribution was extremely small, on the order of 2 percent.

    * There are only sparse traces of the Roman occupation, almost all in southern England.

    * In spite of all these later contributions, the genetic makeup of the British Isles remains overwhelmingly what it was in the Neolithic…

    Source

    Source

  439. Don — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:03 pm  

    Damn. Is this thing still going on? I’d have dropped in more only the weather has been so lovely.

    One thing I have noticed, scanning the thread, is that a lot of time has been wasted on one dumb thing Dalbir said, eliciting much hand-bag clutching about vile racism from Dan and IAE. Who presumably think it non-vile to address a fellow commenter thus;

    Chin up old son. There’s worse thing’s than being married to a wog.

    Just another common or garden miscegenist then, and one so pussy-whipped that he has to affect a camel-jockey’s moniker rather than a real man’s Anglo-Saxon handle.

    I think you lost your right to get huffy about racism round about there.

  440. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:13 pm  

    Persephone YANE @ # 433

    ”We are all Africans”

    We are not “all Africans” at all; that is just another unproven theory taken by many as fact because it pushed by the establishment and it relies solely upon the bones they have being the definitive oldest, which given the size of this planet is most unlikely. Evidence to counter the theory emerges all the time, this was just the latest:

    “The conventional view of human evolution and how early man colonised the world has been thrown into doubt by a series of stunning palaeontological discoveries suggesting that Africa was not the sole cradle of humankind. Scientists have found a handful of ancient human skulls at an archaeological site two hours from the Georgian capital, Tbilisi, that suggest a Eurasian chapter in the long evolutionary story of man…”

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/a-skull-that-rewrites-the-history-of-man-1783861.html
    No one knows where Homo Sapiens actually evolved; people just theorise. The main theory to rival OOA is the MR theory which has much evidence to support it; an extremely important piece you have seen already above

    Here is some more:

    “The discovery of an early human fossil in southern China may challenge the commonly held idea that modern humans originated out of Africa…”

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn18093-chinese-challenge-to-out-of-africa-theory.html

    The whole of the OOA theory itself rests on just on one Skelton named Lucy! And in that that the theory has already been proven wrong when its premise is that Homo erectus marched out of Africa around a million years ago and that Georgian skull is 1.8 million years old!

    Many extreme leftists also claim that out of Africa theory is ‘easily the best explanation for the lack of diversity within the modern human genome’ but the reality is that the human genome is in fact extremely diverse:

    “12 % of the DNA Differs Amongst Human Races and Populations: Till now, humans of different races were thought almost identical

    The Human Genome Project found all humans to have a 99.9 % similar genetic content and identity, but this is challenged by a new more detailed research suggesting a higher genetic diversity, with further medical and evolutionary implications…”

    http://news.softpedia.com/news/12-of-the-DNA-Differs-Amongst-Human-Races-and-Populations-40872.shtml

    “The genetic makeup of the human race is much more varied than previously believed, new research shows.

    Scientists say that surprisingly many large chunks of human DNA differ among individuals and ethnic groups…”

    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/11/061122-human-genetics.html

    “Geneticists are uncovering another level of human ethnic diversity: It may not be which genes we have so much as the way they behave that accounts for our differences. Using the International HapMap Project, which catalogs human gene variants across populations, University of Pennsylvania researchers Vivian Cheung and Richard Spielman first collected the gene sequences of a particular white blood cell from 82 Asians and 60 people of European descent. Then, using microarray chips, they measured expression levels of those genes.

    What they found was surprising: Although which genes were present didn’t differ dramatically between the Asians and the Europeans, their expression did. And that expression was governed by single nucleotide polymorphisms (SNPs)—one-letter changes in DNA¬—in nearby regulator regions that determine how much of a gene’s product is made. Overall, 25 percent of the genes seem to show different levels of expression in Asians versus Europeans, and SNPs in regulatory regions probably account for much of the difference. In the case of one gene, researchers found that Caucasians expressed it at 22 times the strength that Asians did.”

    http://discovermagazine.com/2007/may/is-there-a-genetic-basis-to-race-after-all

  441. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:19 pm  

    Don @ # 439

    Well Don I didn’t make that comment and so I am fully justified in highlighting Dalbir’s virulent racism and his attempts to lie his way out of it afterwards.

    In fact the person who did make that comment apologized for it some way back in any case.

    So that being cleared up now Don, presumably you consider yourself to be an ‘anti-racist’ so here is your chance to condemn Dalbir’s racism and show us all you really stand by your principles and truly detest all forms of racism…

  442. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:23 pm  

    Persephone YANE @ # 433

    ”We are all Africans”

    We are not “all Africans” at all; that is just another unproven theory taken by many as fact because it pushed by the establishment and it relies solely upon the bones they have being the definitive oldest, which given the size of this planet is most unlikely. Evidence to counter the theory emerges all the time, this was just the latest.
    “The conventional view of human evolution and how early man colonised the world has been thrown into doubt by a series of stunning palaeontological discoveries suggesting that Africa was not the sole cradle of humankind. Scientists have found a handful of ancient human skulls at an archaeological site two hours from the Georgian capital, Tbilisi, that suggest a Eurasian chapter in the long evolutionary story of man…”
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/a-skull-that-rewrites-the-history-of-man-1783861.html
    No one knows where Homo Sapiens actually evolved; people just theorise. The main theory to rival OOA is the MR theory which has much evidence to support it; an extremely important piece you have seen already above

    Here is some more:

    “The discovery of an early human fossil in southern China may challenge the commonly held idea that modern humans originated out of Africa…”

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn18093-chinese-challenge-to-out-of-africa-theory.html

    The whole of the OOA theory itself rests on just on one Skelton named Lucy! And in that that the theory has already been proven wrong when its premise is that Homo erectus marched out of Africa around a million years ago and that Georgian skull is 1.8 million years old!

  443. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:26 pm  

    Cont’d

    Many extreme leftists also claim that out of Africa theory is ‘easily the best explanation for the lack of diversity within the modern human genome’ but the reality is that the human genome is in fact extremely diverse:

    “12 % of the DNA Differs Amongst Human Races and Populations: Till now, humans of different races were thought almost identical

    The Human Genome Project found all humans to have a 99.9 % similar genetic content and identity, but this is challenged by a new more detailed research suggesting a higher genetic diversity, with further medical and evolutionary implications…”

    http://news.softpedia.com/news/12-of-the-DNA-Differs-Amongst-Human-Races-and-Populations-40872.shtml

    “The genetic makeup of the human race is much more varied than previously believed, new research shows.

    Scientists say that surprisingly many large chunks of human DNA differ among individuals and ethnic groups…”

    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/11/061122-human-genetics.html

    “Geneticists are uncovering another level of human ethnic diversity: It may not be which genes we have so much as the way they behave that accounts for our differences. Using the International HapMap Project, which catalogs human gene variants across populations, University of Pennsylvania researchers Vivian Cheung and Richard Spielman first collected the gene sequences of a particular white blood cell from 82 Asians and 60 people of European descent. Then, using microarray chips, they measured expression levels of those genes.

    What they found was surprising: Although which genes were present didn’t differ dramatically between the Asians and the Europeans, their expression did. And that expression was governed by single nucleotide polymorphisms (SNPs)—one-letter changes in DNA¬—in nearby regulator regions that determine how much of a gene’s product is made. Overall, 25 percent of the genes seem to show different levels of expression in Asians versus Europeans, and SNPs in regulatory regions probably account for much of the difference. In the case of one gene, researchers found that Caucasians expressed it at 22 times the strength that Asians did.”

    http://discovermagazine.com/2007/may/is-there-a-genetic-basis-to-race-after-all

  444. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:33 pm  

    Presumably Don you’d have no difficulty then with one your number referring to a fellow-commenter as ‘a fascist piece of excrement’, and would consider that a non-vile remark?

  445. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:36 pm  

    Dalbir, Don’s rather unkind remark about dumb things that have been said reminded me that I’d neglected to return to something you stated earlier.

    You may recall that we were having a friendly chinwag earlier about the restoration of a hypothetical Sikh homeland in the Punjab, in the course of which I extended my (spiritual) support for such an enterpreise (#173).

    You responded (in #192) partly as follows:

    One of the many things that separates us is the emphasis on the ‘ethnological’ in our respective positions. If I run with the scenario presented in your post, what you are doing is the equivalent of me denying say white American Sikhs a place in a hypothetical Sikh country based on their ethnicity – which would be wrong. The same with Afghan Sikhs.

    I meant to ask what you felt this hypothetical homeland might consist of. Should it be the area of the Punjab as it was during the time of Sikh Empire, or would you be content with the state of Punjab as it currently exists within India? And if the former (or indeed the latter) what would your intentions be as to the residence and citizenship status of the existing population who, in the former at least are very predominantly non-Sikh.

    And you mention that your new homeland would be open to ‘overseas’ Sikhs regardless of ethnicity. That sounds rather like Israel’s Law of Return, which promotes the ‘return’ of, say, Ethiopian Jews but not other black Africans, would that sort of thing be the intention? You mention Afghan Sikhs, would Afghan Muslims be welcome also? And what about other Muslims? Would there need to be a cap placed on the numbers of such Muslim entrants? It would seem rational to want to do so, since there are many, many more Muslims than Sikhs and unless a firm stance were taken there might no longer be a Sikh homeland left in due course. And, finally, supposing that over a period of time successive corrupt and complacent governments had allowed many more Muslims (or Anglicans) to enter the homeland than Sikhs in general felt was desirable, what would you do to correct that situation?

    Of course we’re dealing with pure hypotheticals here but your thoughts on these matters would be much appreciated.

  446. Mangles — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:36 pm  

    IAE this is getting so boring. What you still haven’t plucked up the courage to actually answer a question?

    “So that being cleared up now Don, presumably you consider yourself to be an ‘anti-racist’ so here is your chance to condemn Dalbir’s racism and show us all you really stand by your principles and truly detest all forms of racism…”

    Why don’t you condemn racism or will that level of hypocricy be too much even for you to stomach?

    You’re still spouting rubbish and spoiling this thread, and despite several hundred responses from Nazis like you, none of you, except Dan actually has the balls to answer any questions. And even he hasn’t mentioned his lame hypothesis again.

    You BNP types actually believe people dont realise you’re nazis, even though you’re afraid to stand up by your final solution policy because – as Dan said – the public wont buy into it – so you’d rather keep talking nonsense.

    Anyways, no more time to waste. Unlike BNP benefit scroungers who have nowhere to go, some of us have to work for a living so that there are enough taxes paid into the coffers to keep you in doc martins and pay for your medicines and mental care.

    Rab rakha!

  447. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:44 pm  

    Lame hypothesis Mangles, to what do you refer?

  448. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:48 pm  

    IAE 438 & 441

    You didn’t like my African remark – so much so you had to make it bold. I wonder why? So that it would show up on your bnp report card as a job well done?

    You are so sure of all this I assume you have had a DNA test?

  449. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:51 pm  

    Mangles @ # 445

    Well that was nothing but pure ad honimen and more baseless insults / smears and there is a popular term for that kind of internet behavior.

    I have condemned racism here quite clearly and consistently and nailed the lying racist Dalbir to a cross with his own lies for all to see so what are you really blathering on about this time?

    You want to call me a “Nazi” then prove it or I will call you a liar and an anti-white racist for smearing me with such offensive labels purely because I am English and concerned at where all of this is leading.

    I think you’ll find it is your racist friend Dalbir who has been unable to account for either his racism or his lies and quite frankly if you are bored then stay away; no one is forcing you to come back here just to post groundless abuse.

    In fact Dan has no problem answering all of your questions and seems to quite enjoy doing so ask away instead of abusing away and the only persons I will not engage with are those who are racist towards me and deny my right to exist in my ancestral homeland, and those like you and Clark who make up stories / lies / smears that you cannot substantiate when challenged and won’t apologies for nonetheless.

    As you will see above, I provide plenty of proof in my answers to those others who attempt debate here.

    So really either stick to debate and the facts or don’t bother at all.

  450. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:52 pm  

    Ask Mr Barnes.

    No I’m asking you to verify your own claims. If you can’t or don’t want to then that’s fine too. Having made the necessary point, I don’t care either way.

    You seem to have a habit of making reckless assertions and then declining to support them when challenged.

    I am verifying the claims. Full electronic records exist of formal emailed correspondence between eGov Monitor and the BNP in relation to the matters discussed earlier. If you really are a member of the BNP as you claim to be then presumably it should not be a problem for you to simply contact Mr Barnes directly and request that he confirms the matter.

    If you can’t or won’t then it makes no difference to me, although it does raise questions about the veracity of your own claims to be a member of the BNP if you are so reluctant to contact your own party’s Legal Director in order to request the information concerned.

  451. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:56 pm  

    … it should not be a problem for you to simply contact Mr Barnes directly and request that he confirms the matter.

    What makes you think I haven’t already done so.

    The question arising is not whether Mr. Barnes responded to your questionnaire, that much is a given, but whether he did so in a private or an official capacity. When I asked him he declined to answer.

  452. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 10:57 pm  

    Dalbir @ 437

    Yes the same. IAE is intentionally mis-interpreting my comment at 426 even after I clarifed it.

    His flailing around to pretend support is quite painful to watch.

  453. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:04 pm  

    @434

    So you call yourself a ‘globule’. Yes I can verily see how, as a descriptor, it is quite accurate

  454. Don — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:06 pm  

    Presumably Don you’d have no difficulty then with one your number …

    No, that’s just common or garden abuse. Not an abusive reference to family. Do you see the difference?

    And what is one of my number? I’m no bloody saint.

  455. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:06 pm  

    No it wasn’t me, it was Pooh-Bar. You do know who he was don’t you, you being English and that, right?

  456. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:08 pm  

    444

    Dan, not really worth talking about. If I were to rank issues that need addressing within the Sikh community, I’d rank the homeland thing below many others.

    Besides, of late I’ve increasingly been of the mind to support the growth and establishment of strong, robust communities outside of the Panjab. Preferrably in harmony with the neighbours. Seeing as Sikhs in Panjab are essentially stuck between two constantly bickering nuclear states, seems like the best idea. Just in case the worse happens. Plus the natural outgoing nature of Sikhs means we were never going to be penned into one place anyone. We’ll be touring the world bumping into each other. Live with it. Might even be fun misery guts! lol

    PS – Those of you rejecting Persephones overtures to be accepted as English – don’t be so mean, you may mess up her self-esteem with your rejection!

    Pers!! Never beg for acceptance, learn the hard way then.

  457. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:10 pm  

    Don it was still very hurtful. How would you respond to being called a steaming pile of neo-marxist ordure in the middle of an otherwise polite and relatively sensible conversation by someone you’d never had any communication with before? Not that I’d ever dream of referring to your good-self in such a manner of course.

  458. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:12 pm  

    Persephone YANE @ # 447

    “You didn’t like my African remark – so much so you had to make it bold. I wonder why?”

    Oh dear, not another who likes dishonest distractions, surely.

    It is in bold because, if you scan up, it is the way I have been presenting quotes that I am responding to. I forgot to put the speech marks in but then I also forgot to fully format the whole comment.

    And it is not a case of like or dislike but one that it is completely erroneous.

    Now that fluff aside, what say you on the facts presented? What say you on the reality that your OOA theory is, well, just a theory and one that has already been proven to have a false premise so far?

    Could you keep to the facts rather then making it all personal as many have to do here to hide their dialectical incompetence?

    “You are so sure of all this I assume you have had a DNA test?”

    Again not that this has anything to with the facts or the scientific realities above nor would it change them on iota if I hadn’t, but actually, yes I have; a gift from a relative.

    Stick to the facts please.

    “Yes the same. IAE is intentionally mis-interpreting my comment at 426 even after I clarifed it.”

    So you do not condemn the racism of Dalbir then? And as such are not really an ‘anti-racist’ at all as only some racism bothers you.

    At least we know where you really stand now.
    And so your comment @ # 426 was a load of meaningless waffle as you don’t condemn racism at all, at least not racism that is directed at the indigenous peoples of this country.

    Very interesting indeed.

  459. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:15 pm  

    Not dodging the column are we Dalbir. Your many fans won’t be pleased about that.

    So come on, why not give it a whack, it’s only hypotheticals like almost everything else we’ve been chatting about for 450-odd posts.

    If I’m man enough to grasp the nettle it’s the least we we’re entitled to expect from a member of a world-admired martial race of warriors whose courage knows no bounds.

  460. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:16 pm  

    Dalbir @455

    Kee?

  461. Don — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:20 pm  

    Don it was still very hurtful.

    Bullshit. This is the internet. I didn’t see the apology for the actual vile stuff, but I’ll take your word for it. Did it strike you as sincere?

  462. persephone IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:22 pm  

    “ Again not that this has anything to with the facts or the scientific realities above nor would it change them on iota if I hadn’t, but actually, yes I have; a gift from a relative. Stick to the facts please.”

    So asking for DNA test is not scientific or dealing with facts. What a tangled web you (try) to weave.

    What were the results? Which agency did them?

    And I’m sure Dalbir can & has spoken for himself.

  463. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:22 pm  

    It being what, Don?

  464. Jai — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:27 pm  

    The question arising is not whether Mr. Barnes responded to your questionnaire, that much is a given, but whether he did so in a private or an official capacity.

    He did so in his official capacity as the BNP’s Legal Director, as confirmed in the aforementioned electronic correspondence.

    When I asked him he declined to answer.

    That’s an issue between you and Mr Barnes and therefore an internal problem within the BNP.

    Perhaps you should also ask him for a full transcript of the correspondence involved. I’m assuming that the BNP’s legal team maintains full records of such matters, given that it involved formal correspondence between the BNP and an external organisation requesting detailed information from them.

  465. Don — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:29 pm  

    The apology you referred to.

  466. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:38 pm  

    Which apology when? Got a post #?

  467. Dalbir — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:39 pm  

    #458

    Stratagem old chap, stratagem. Mustn’t leave all the eggs in one basket. Plus have you seen what our neighbours are up to? Of course you have, you sent your own boys over there to keep in with the Yanks! How’s that going for you?

  468. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:40 pm  

    @Persephone (IAE Hon.)

    Have you had yours done duckie? Being English I bet you’re an H, a V or a U1. Can’t be owt else can you?

  469. IAE — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:43 pm  

    Persephone YANE @ # 461

    So asking for DNA test is not scientific or dealing with facts. What a tangled web you (try) to weave

    Of course it is not.

    It wouldn’t have mattered whether I had had a test or not, the scientific facts would remain the same that the British people are indigenous and are overwhelmingly homogenous and have been since the Stone Age.

    ”What were the results? Which agency did them?”

    You are still asking personal questions rather then deal with the scientific facts above, and you are asking like the Old Bill would, you know, as if you have some sort of authority over me and I have to justify myself to you, which I can assure you is not the case remotely

    I will humor you on this occasion to get this distraction fluff out of the way, and although I don’t have the documents here but yes they confirmed that I was of indigenous descent, from memory and a bit of help, I believe the technical gist was Y- R1b-L?1 / Mt-DNA hg H.

    Now let’s move away from this distraction fluff and back to the scientific realities.

    Surely you must accept now, in the face of such scientific evidence, that there is indeed an indigenous populace in these isles and they have enjoyed remarkable homogeneity since the stone age?

    And what say you now on your OOA and your contention that we are “all Africans”?

    “And I’m sure Dalbir can & has spoken for himself.”

    Yes he has.

    He has lied through his teeth.

    Now would you like to speak for yourself and condemn his racist remarks or declare a non interest in that piece of racism?

    Its entirely up to you, but in your comment @ # 426 you came out quite strongly against Dalbir’s racism so I am now wondering why you are back peddling on that?

  470. Dan Dare — on 13th April, 2010 at 11:44 pm  

    Hadn’t you heard Dalbir, all our boys are coming home the day after we win the election. Chairman Griffin has solemnly promised it’s going to happen so it will.

    Ever though of joining up yourself, like your bloke Rajinder? He seems to know which side of his chapatti’s got the ghee on it.

    Vote for us and you’ll have your homeland back toot sweet. We promise.

  471. Dalbir — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:05 am  

    Hadn’t you Dalbir, all our boys are coming home the day after we win the election. Chairman Griffin has solemnly promised it’s going to happen so it will.

    And when do you expect to win the election?

    Ever though of joining up yourself, like your bloke Rajinder. He seems to know what side his chapatti’s gee’d on. makes sense dunnit.

    Well good luck with the old mutton if the shite ever hits the fan. The lambs don’t seem to be buying much though huh Dan?

    Do you know about freedom Dan? Seriously.

    A little bit of that with just basic necessities is thousand times more desirable than the world on a plate and a leash on your neck. Man to man, do you understand me?

    You’re the same as the hardcore ‘kafur haters’ to me, just a tad bit paler and probably a bit more eloquent.

    Vote for us and you’ll have your homeland back toot sweet.

    I know we were fooled quite easily in the past but times have changed sunny boy.

    Regarding the homeland, we’ll get it when we deserve it. That isn’t now.

  472. persephone IAE — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:13 am  

    “Surely you must accept now, in the face of such scientific evidence, that there is indeed an indigenous populace in these isles and they have enjoyed remarkable homogeneity since the stone age?”

    Surely you had an ancestry test? One dna agency states: “ the ancient world also had its own share of migrations—modern humans originated in East Africa roughly 200,000 years ago, and moved through the Fertile Crescent in the Middle East to populate Europe, Asia, and the rest of the world. You are the product of both ancient and recent migrations—and you can discover these influences through our DNA test. How much of 4 founding populations can be found in your DNA today: European, East Asian, Sub-Saharan African, and Native American. “

    I asked for how you test it since the time frames as to when ‘indigenous’ is judged seems to differ. You say stone age, nick griffin says ice age and another bnp ‘stalwart’ claimed that the populace of GB should be the mix prior to the 1950’s. Confusion reigns amongst those who talk about being indigenous.

    And the dna agencies say we originate from Africa. I’m surprised you took the test given that

    See my comment at 431 with reference to 426. You sound ever desperate to falsify – lacking support? Or is it you are in overdrive to employ griffins propaganda ploy of message repetition – even where it is blatant lies

  473. Dalbir — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:22 am  

    IAE:Its entirely up to you, but in your comment @ # 426 you came out quite strongly against Dalbir’s racism so I am now wondering why you are back peddling on that?

    Maybe she twigged on the the fact you were a complete fucking nutjob? Who knows?

    Persephone: Does your mummy-daddy know you are speaking to strange neo-nazi men on the Internet?

    You’re never going to be English in these people’s eyes. Trying to get them to accept you only makes it look like you have self esteem issues. Batchke.

  474. Dan Dare — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:26 am  

    And when do you expect to win the election?

    The day before the boys come home.

  475. persephone IAE — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:32 am  

    “You’re never going to be English in these people’s eyes. Trying to get them to accept you only makes it look like you have self esteem issues. Batchke.”

    Pulling a few chains. it seems to have gone over your head.

  476. Don — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:54 am  

    Dalbir,

    I am lost for words.

  477. Dalbir — on 14th April, 2010 at 12:54 am  

    Dan

    Just for you.

    An alternative approach to inter community relations for you to ponder upon.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEoQeEvnmDU&feature=player_embedded

    Goodnight.

  478. Don — on 14th April, 2010 at 1:00 am  

    Dalbir.

    OK, I found some. You’re a dolt.

  479. Ravi Naik — on 14th April, 2010 at 2:11 am  

    It wouldn’t have mattered whether I had had a test or not, the scientific facts would remain the same that the British people are indigenous and are overwhelmingly homogenous and have been since the Stone Age.

    You are now pretending to be dumb.

    The genetic test actually matter because it tells you how “indigenous” you really are.

    Despite what you, Dalbir, Dan and other racists say, non-whites who feel England is their homeland, are English. And their descendants will be indigenous by the same measure as you are considered indigenous – if indeed you are indigenous. You are obvious lying about having done genetic tests. And Dan, have you done yours?

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