These times will also go by, if enough of us are willing to accept the possibility of being friends and work towards it.

Its all so simple to burn effigy of other religious leaders. Imagine, christians burning effigy of MD for burning down their churches. Pathetic, if you react to every comment made by others, you are only playing right in the hands of your critiques.

When the British ruled India, they criticised Hinduism, idol worshippers, Karma Sutra, the science of Yoga etc…. if all Hindus reacted violently, Hinduism would not be where it is today.

Remember, the wrath Hinduism went through over centuries of invasions and other influences. Every religion has its feat & fury. A noble idea or movement/religion will inevitable go through transition of change due to socio-political and ecomomic accord of the era.

If Muslims want the respect from the rest of the world they must unite in one voice, condemn and take punitive actions against extremists no matter who they attack, even fellow muslims as is seen in Darfur. Its not enough to just say “we condemn” or “Islam is a peaceful religion” action is requied. It is the silence of moderate muslims that create such rift and conflict, thus, promoting prejudism against the religion.

I know my muslim friends (all moderates) will not ever report another muslim if they committed a crime or involved in illegal activities as it will be seen as betrayal of brotherhood, and fear of being isolated from the community. Although, I can sympathise with the isolation bit, but we have move away from this kind akin relationship, if we are to live in a peaceful and tolerant society.

Fair point. I note with interest that the Pope is calling for a Muslim/Christian dialogue. Dealt back into the game it seems…

=>”Plus: no comparative concept of blasphemy in Sikhism? What excuse did the violent Bezhti protestors give then?”

The topic has already been extensively discussed here on PP, so I recommend you do a ‘search’ for it. You can do the same on the Discussion Forum at the Sikhnet website (www.sikhnet.com).

Plus: no comparative concept of blasphemy in Sikhism? What excuse did the violent Bezhti protestors give then?

=>”As you may be aware, Mr. Choudary is a Muslim cleric”

Anjem Choudary is not a cleric. He is a spokesman for certain banned community-based organisations, and has no formal religious authority as far as I know.

Neither does Osama bin Laden for that matter, despite his pretentions to the contrary.

=>”Is there a concept of blasmemy in Sikhism?

Yes, but not in the same way as the Abrahamic faiths. There are certain fundamental theological concepts in the religion which are regarded as universal (ie. not “relative”), so it could be said that some proclamations by members of other faiths which contradict these tenets are “blasphemous” from the Sikh religious perspective.

I was just drawing an analogy for our friend’s benefit, as per the examples I previously listed.

=>”about other non-monotheistic faiths either.”

Sikhism is a monotheistic faith.

Yesterday Choudary said: “The Muslims take their religion very seriously and non-Muslims must appreciate that and that must also understand that there may be serious consequences if you insult Islam and the prophet.” Well Mr. Choudary, many Christians take their religion very seriously as well and revile the obnoxious and provocative display made by one of the leading British Muslim leaders. This defamation cannot go unpunished, and therefore as an example to others who would say bad things about the west or Christianity, I say that Mr. Choudary be publicly beheaded in Hyde Park as a statement by the west that we will not tolerate the implication made by Mr. Choudary and others that Christianity is a religion of violence or that the west is on a crusade against Islam. This kind of rhetoric is deeply insulting to Christians and demands Mr. Choudary’s head. This will also serve to avenge the death of Fabianus Tibo, Dominggus da Silva and Marianus Riwu, three Christians who were executed in Indonesia and charged with inciting violence against Muslims. Mr. Choudary, has similarly incited violence against Christians in the west and therefore must be beheaded as a warning to those with similar aspirations in Britain.
Sheik Abu Saqer, leader of Gaza’s Jihadia Salafiya Islamic outreach movement, called for holy war against the pope and stated that Christian leaders such as Benedict are “afraid” because they realize Islam is Allah’s favorite religion and they are going to hell unless they convert. The Gaza preacher further declared the “green flag of Muhammad” would soon be raised over the Vatican. This type of inflammatory statement shows an ignorance and wrongful view of Christianity and must be avenged by the immediate death of Sheik Abu Saqer. Christians worldwide are enraged by Sheik Abu Saqer’s statements and demand that the Palestinians turn him over to an ecumenical council headed by Pat Robertson for decapitation with a skill saw.

This will not be done in a spirit of anger but to promote greater Christian/Muslim understanding.

I thought she was more a Brownite these days?

Let me give you another perspective on this. Islam’s teaching that only Islam is the “true” faith and that Muslims are essentially “God’s elect” are blasphemous concepts from the perspective of both Sikhism and Hinduism. So is the idea that Mohammad was the “last” prophet.

Corresponding Sikh Blasphemy Laws and Hindu Blasphemy Laws would, in theory, give their adherents the right to prosecute Muslims making such statements because they are “offensive” to both of these faiths and their followers.

I’m speaking purely hypothetically but you can see what I’m getting at here. Exactly how far do you want to go with this ?

Ann, a fundamentalist Catholic and fervent supporter of war crimes in Lebanon, made the same point that J mentioned about the effect a transposition of the slogan on the placards would have, and how we should be treating everyone equally under the law(I’m pretty sure you’re talking about the same program J).

Now, correct me if I’m wrong here, but don’t the British blasphemy laws ONLY apply to Christianity and to no other religion? How’s that equal?

re: #245

=>” always wonder what would happen if the situation was reversed? How would these 1000 clerics and religious scholars react if it was their leaders Catholics demanded removal of?”

Someone on Newsnight yesterday evening made the same basic analogy; about 100 protestors, led by Anjem Choudary, were in front of Westminster Cathedral earlier this week and holding placards saying things like (I can’t remember the exact words but it was pretty close to this:) “Islam will take over Rome”. The guest said that one should imagine the reaction (social and legal) if she stood outside a mosque with a placard saying “Rome will take over Islam”.

She was making a point about how there should be one law for everyone, but it’s an interesting & highly relevant comment about double-standards and how respect needs to be a two-way thing.

What you have here are two proselytising/evangelical faiths who believe that they alone are the “right path” and that everyone else should think the same way. So, paraphrasing & translating an Indian proverb, you basically have two obstinate, opposed worldviews who think they they alone are right and are stubbornly bashing their heads together.