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    David Cameron on India


    by Sunny on 5th September, 2006 at 11:01 am    

    To show he is down with the kids, David Cameron is documenting his trip to India on a newly launched blog. It is even has video clips. As Steve Irwin (r.i.p.) would say - crikey! This is accompanied by an article in the Guardian today on why he wants to forge a new relationship with India. I have some points to make briefly.

    1) Watching the second video, it is good to hear DC talk sensible economics on why it’s good for Britain (and India) if companies here invest there, rather go along with the traditional Tory protectionist narrative about jobs going abroad.

    2) He seems to have come around to accepting this is in Britain’s interests . In the article he writes:

    For too long, politics in this country has been obsessed with Europe and America. Of course these relationships are, and will continue to be, vital. But serious and responsible leadership in the 21st century means engaging with far greater energy in the parts of the world where Britain’s strategic interests will increasingly lie.

    I hanker for the days when ‘world community’ does not just refer to the US and UK.

    3) Some of the commenters underneath DC’s article say he is only doing it for Britain’s sake and he is ignoring the poor people in India. These are silly claims. For a start, the Indian government will also engage only to serve their own interests. Extending trade relations serves not only India’s interests, but those of the poor people who benefit from job creation.

    In fact India’s trade liberalisation since 1991 has empowered India’s poorest with cheaper access to technology, less corruption (doing away with the ‘license raj’) and more foreign investment. That is not to say poverty is not a problem; it’s just that relying solely on the Indian govt to deal with it is naive. International trade also helps.



    Print this page and comments   |     |   Add to del.icio.us   |   Share on Facebook   |   Filed in: Party politics, South Asia, Economics, India




    92 Comments below   |  

    1. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:06 am  

      Cameron minibus ‘injures woman’
      David Cameron in central Mumbai on 5 September, 2006
      Mr Cameron is on a four-day tour of India
      A woman was seriously injured after she was in collision with a minibus carrying Conservative aides on David Cameron’s four-day trip to India.

      The minibus was travelling on the Great Eastern Expressway in Mumbai when it struck the young woman at around noon local time (0800 BST).

      Journalists in the bus and Deputy High Commissioner Vicki Treadell reportedly asked the driver to slow downhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5315386.stm

      Interesting that this story makes the BBC but there’s no real context on what it’s like driving in parts of India…

    2. Kismet Hardy — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:08 am  

      I want to hear David Cameron try to impress the Asian kids here by brushing up on his Bollywood knowledge. I’d pay good money to hear him utter the words: ‘I particularly enjoyed your Jism…’

    3. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:14 am  

      Interesting that this story makes the BBC but there’s no real context on what it’s like driving in parts of India…

      Imagine driving around Paris… multiply it by ten times wrose…. that meboy is what driving in India is…

    4. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:17 am  

      Sunny, I must say your point about “job creation” benifiting the poor seems a little optmistic. What jobs are we talking about? Sweatshops and call centres?

    5. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:19 am  

      Imagine driving around Paris… multiply it by ten times wrose…. that meboy is what driving in India is…

      Exactly my point (and yep Paris was a little hairy trying to cross the road). I know this from talking to people about the place; why doesn’t the BBC piece have that context? The piece implies that Camerons minibus was acting wrecklessly…

    6. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:21 am  

      In fact India’s trade liberalisation since 1991 has empowered India’s poorest with cheaper access to technology, less corruption (doing away with the ‘license raj’)

      If this is what liberalisation is like… i shudder to think what Socialist India of Soviet-style license Raj must have been like… Congress is actually being pressurised to undo the economic reforms by powerful communist block in parliament.

      With bizzare reservation policy Congress is going to get wiped off in it traditional hinterlands like Maharashtra… The OBC votes will stay with OBC parties… the likelyhood is that in 2009 we will have a fractured mandate.. with a three way split between BJP, Congress and Left Front. The Left Front might actually form a govenment by banding together with anti-Congress regionalist parties like NCP,SP,RJD… And that would be the end of the Indian dream.

    7. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:24 am  

      Actually Western Expressway one of the better roads in India 8 laned.. supposedly built upto international standards.

    8. AsifB — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:39 am  

      Vikratn no. 6- ‘If this is what liberalisation is like… i shudder to think what Socialist India of Soviet-style license Raj must have been like…’

      Its the Indian education system wot done it - not its politicians. By churning out millions of english speaking graduates, India can attract foreign investment, almost regardless of what its many political parties say.

      You make an important point - there is still a long way to go even within India. Anyone hoping for a free trade area within South Asia akin to the EU, shouldn’t hold their breath.

    9. Jagdeep — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:54 am  

      One startling statistic - India is the THIRD largest investor in Britain.

      Sunny, regarding those people who criticise Cameron because he ‘doesnt do anything for the poor of India’ - these are the professional class of white middle class western socialist tossers who want Indians to stay poor and oppressed so they can pat them on the head and patronise them and fit them into their Marxist ‘international-globalisation-is-Nazism- and-genocidal-oppression’ theology. They are real slippery eels and very selfish, the most selfish people I have ever met.

    10. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 12:04 pm  

      Jagdeep, who is this “professional class of white middle class western socialist tossers”? Name and shame matey!

    11. Chairwoman — on 5th September, 2006 at 12:06 pm  

      Jagdeep -Indeed!

    12. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 5th September, 2006 at 12:11 pm  

      By churning out millions of english speaking graduates, India can attract foreign investment, almost regardless of what its many political parties say.

      Well current Indian govt. is busy fucking up the education system. This May Indian Human Resources minister Arjun Singh dropped a Bombshell by announcing 27% reservation in all educational institutions for OBCs (Othe Backward Castes). While India already has 22.5% reservation in place for Dalits (SC/ST), OBC is an government created distinction, OBCs were pretty much a part of the social structure that oppressed the Dalits.

      A government which doesnt even know percentage of OBCs in Indian poplcation nor their represntation in educational institutions enforces a quota of 27.5% for them in ALL educational institutions across the country. ( See http://www.sandeepweb.com/2006/05/23/karan-thapar-rips-arjun-singh-apart/ )

      Affirmative action can be implemented in a thousand different ways. The govt. isnt interested in affirmative action, it only descends into cheap populism to consolidate its votebanks. The end-result artificially high percentages are expected from general category students while “reserved students” get in at much lower percentages. Moreover these reservations are hooged by the middle classes amongst these historically backward communities… thus reservations dont even benifit those who need them, India’s rural poor.

      Lefties are seriously mulling enforcing a caste quota in private sector jobs… its as if a conspiracy is afoot to stiffle India’s middle classes and undo its progress.

    13. Jagdeep — on 5th September, 2006 at 12:13 pm  

      Well I was being slightly facetious, but only slightly. I mean these anti-globalisation sorts with whom I have discussions about the need for India to open up her economy even more, compete at every level, integrate into the world economy, and with whom I sing the praises of globalisation for the potential it has to improve the lives of the poor in India, to which they reply unthinking and shrill point blank dogma about how globalisation is a ‘fascistic’ conspiracy to keep down the poor, all fired with a great big healthy dose of anti Americanism. I find them to be the most arrogant and patronising of people, because they argue against a process that can potentially improve the life of the poor in India, and substitute guarded criticism of the process and watchfulness of how that works, with point-blank wholesale dismissal of the idea of India’s current economic policies. They are so pathetic.

    14. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 5th September, 2006 at 12:14 pm  

      Sunny, regarding those people who criticise Cameron because he ‘doesnt do anything for the poor of India’

      As if it is Cameron’s job in the first place. Infact even India’s govenment doesnt care for its people. India’s economy remains on autopilot while its MPs are busy condemning Israel and showing morally supporting Lebanese people in their “resistance” against Israel.

    15. Uncleji Singh — on 5th September, 2006 at 1:43 pm  

      ‘world community’ = euphuism for what used to be called the great powers.

      I always thought that Mrs T would go down well in India victorian morality encased in the free market.

    16. Bert Preast — on 5th September, 2006 at 1:43 pm  

      I’ve always felt it was rather a shame that in going into Europe the UK turned it’s back on the Commonwealth. Europe would still have traded with us anyway. It’s not like the EU taxes the granny out of Swiss watches, or that nobody in Europe wants one, is it?

    17. Amit — on 5th September, 2006 at 2:34 pm  

      LOL - Sunny, I see you’ve already got yourself linked on there!

    18. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 2:41 pm  

      Yep, I asked for it in the comments yesterday, seems it took em 24 hours to make sure we aint a bunch of nutters over here (well mainly not a bunch of nutters).

    19. Amit — on 5th September, 2006 at 3:30 pm  

      Well he’s getting quite a lot of hits, do you think if he put adsense on his blog he’d be able to use that as contributions to the his campaign? :p

    20. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 3:31 pm  

      Hehe! Good point, not sure why they haven’t got ads on there, I thought Tories were all about the dough?!

    21. Nav — on 5th September, 2006 at 3:49 pm  

      I thought Tories were all about the dough?!

      ‘Compassionate Conservatism’

      ;D

    22. Leon — on 5th September, 2006 at 3:52 pm  

      The Tory party has kindly posted up the speech he’s going to deliver later today to business people in India:

      http://www.conservatives.com/tile.do?def=news.press.release.page&obj_id=131809

    23. bikhair aka taqiyyah — on 5th September, 2006 at 4:12 pm  

      Sunny,

      Is it me or are Europes conservatives more Buchananite (Pat Buchanan) in their politics? They seem so.

    24. Nyrone — on 5th September, 2006 at 8:20 pm  

      There must be something wrong with me!
      I really enjoyed the small video blogs on DC’s website! They were refreshing and they portrayed him as a rather sensible and humanistic kind of guy. I sort of got the feeling that he might be genuine and (shock horror) real person!

      I feel like this is an quite interesting development today, it seems like DC would really like a proper ‘global community’ instead of the same old players. I just hope that this is not all an attention-grabbbing uncommital honeymoon period move just for a brief few moments.

      and all this on a day when Blair got a bloody nose from the various letters, attacks and that idiotic-yet-hilarious leaked memo about him going out on a “blaze of glory” Pleezzzz, Iraq burns while Tony does Blue peter?? He should leave no 10 in handcuffs and shackles…

    25. Amir — on 5th September, 2006 at 9:26 pm  

      Nyrone,

      ‘Iraq burns while Tony does Blue peter?? He should leave no 10 in handcuffs and shackles…’

      Isn’t it funny how al-Qaeda, the Mahdi Army, and a hotchpotch of other gangsters and nihilists and terrorists are denied any agency of their own, and by a none-too-clever elision, their baleful crimes gradually become attributable to the very force that is fighting against them!?

      Whatever your disagreements about the initial invasion, the international community has a moral and legal obligation, expressed in a major U.N. resolution, to assist in the reconstruction of Iraq and to support its elected government.

      Your allusion to ‘handcuffs’ and ‘shackles’ is also funny when one considers that the initial invasion was/is supported by a vast majority of Iraq’s populace. If anyone is deserving of handcuffs and shackles then it is Donald Rumsfeld and Saddam Hussein’s co-conspirators (Chirac-Putin-Kim Jong Il-AQ Khan).

      Amir

    26. Rakhee — on 5th September, 2006 at 9:34 pm  

      Nyrone, you’ve been PR’d.

    27. Amir — on 5th September, 2006 at 9:41 pm  

      Rakhee,

      What does that mean? You see: I’m not down with the Punjabi slang. :-)

    28. Jagdeep — on 5th September, 2006 at 9:58 pm  

      Amir, what is your background, if you don’t mind me asking. I mean in terms of ethnic background and religion. You don’t have to answer, I am just curious, because your posts are so interesting, even when I dont agree with them, and your name sounds of Muslim origin.

      As I said, you can tell me to mind my own business, but I’m just fascinated by it, especially with your name being Muslim and you taking quite an against the grain stance on things.

      Cheers!

    29. sunray — on 5th September, 2006 at 10:17 pm  

      “Interesting that this story makes the BBC but there’s no real context on what it’s like driving in parts of India…”

      It’s BBCs bloody biased useless reporters. They walk round with blinkers.

      Im also surprised to see this article on here!!!!

    30. Sunny — on 5th September, 2006 at 10:34 pm  

      expressed in a major U.N. resolution, to assist in the reconstruction of Iraq and to support its elected government.

      Of course, it woud be nice if they ‘re-constructed’ Iraq after “shock and awe”-ing the place…. and failing to maintain proper security afterwards.

      And what about the reconstruction of Lebanon? While the EU and USA flounder, and Israel continues with its military blockades, Iran and Syria and rushing in to rebuild the country. That’s great tactics!

      If this was a movie we could all watch and laugh at people’s stupidity. Except it’s real life and it’s tragic.

    31. Katy Newton — on 5th September, 2006 at 10:49 pm  

      Jeepers. Are we ever going to manage to finish a thread on this site without dragging Israel into it again, I ask myself.

    32. Don — on 5th September, 2006 at 10:55 pm  

      Nyrone,

      ‘they portrayed him as a rather sensible and humanistic kind of guy.’

      And I wonder how many hours of consultation and editing, and how many thousands in fees it took to construct that persona. Cameron is hoping to do it on slick.

    33. Chris Stiles — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:03 pm  

      I can’t see the point of this - from Cameron or the Tory’s perspective - it’s a oen off event that isn’t widely reported.

    34. Nyrone — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:08 pm  

      Anyone watching ‘guide to Islam’ by Peaches Geldolf???
      Train wreck alert!

    35. Rakhee — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:22 pm  

      Amir, PR means Public Relations. Nyrone’s opinion of Cameron is changing as Cameron is making every correct move through his PR campaign to do just that. It’s all about changing and controlling perceptions and influencing thoughts to make people believe what you want them to.

      This blog of his is a classic example.

    36. Rakhee — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:22 pm  

      Nyrone, yeah, watching it now. How random..!

    37. Refresh — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:32 pm  

      Sunny, what is PP doing on a Tory blog?

    38. Sunny — on 5th September, 2006 at 11:51 pm  

      *cough* sorry. But miss, he started it!

      Refresh - I guess they’re progressive… we’re progressive…

    39. Refresh — on 6th September, 2006 at 12:02 am  

      Don’t be fooled!

    40. Nyrone — on 6th September, 2006 at 12:15 am  

      Random? It’s utterly idiotic…

      What a piece of crap, this programme runs like a ‘How NOT to make a beginners guide to Islam’:)
      Bored teenager ‘does’ Islam by going back in time and reporting disposable ignorant garbage!!!
      Peaches Geldolf is doing a serious dis-service to Islam. This is about one of the worst attempts at understanding the religion I ever come across. Lord almighty, what a piece of unadulterated Trash C4 let loose on us.

      It felt like this programme portrayed some ridiculous ‘traditional’ Islam of 100 years ago, it’s totally absurd!!!
      What about Intellectual Islam? What about progressive Islam? Visit Malaysia or Dubai recently?
      and she wants to do it because it’s “the hottest topic in the world right now” well, I can’t fault her Brilliant reasoning!

      Choice cuts:

      “So many jibabs, so little time”: This isn’t a fashion show you fool and cut the ‘ya Allah’ techno-dance soundtrack, it’s not modern, it’s corny!!
      “Islamic women say that they all feel guilty not wearing a scarf” Nice use of generalising and grossly misrepresenting the entire religion Peaches, so that’s all Muslim women in the world ever in history, is it?

      She says (with a straight face) “I can’t see myself converting to Islam, but I can see it’s not all mentalist, fundamentalist, psychotic extreme things and stuff like the media says” She says this like she’s just discovered ‘Oh, I guess they are not ALL terrorists” Bloody hell! If you start with the wrong question, your never gonna make great progress! How could she begin from a position that implied all Muslims are extremists? What about the 98% that are just normal ‘non-extreme’ practising Muslims? Surprise Peaches! Some of them don’t fit your conception of them…

      Cringeworthy moments include her modelling the hijab, acting like spoilt brat when being told to leave the wedding and ’singing’ verses from the Quran, that was ok because it was sorta “happy and stuff”.
      and especially noteworthy was the interview with the guy who wanted to become an Imam because he had “visions of Islam” could that be any more crass and sensationalist?? Subtext = nutter follows his dreams to become Imam, he could follow his dreams to blow you up for no reason!

      The worst bit in the entire show was the bit in the end when Peaches tried to be smart and started pulling up her socks to quote 4th grade amateur philosophy, with ref to the design and ontological theories.
      She looked so arrogant, like this was her ‘moment’ to prove she had an education and was better than the Muslim girl.

      Why did you include that Peaches? and especially the nervous cut-in of the girl you were talking to? What was the goddamn point?? were you trying to show through this cut that the Muslim girl couldn’t grasp philosophy? That she was ignorant of theories of existence outside of the Quran? If I am right on that, it has got to be one of the most self-indulgent pieces of cutting in a documentary I have ever seen.
      and who could forget: “I’ve just seen where I’m going to be staying” Grow up, there are a lot of worse places you could be staying, and was there any need for that panning shot of a hooded ancient man looking like he came out of Lord of the Rings? That was a blatantly falsely constructed shot, what was the intention here?

      I hope people were not actually drawing conclusions about Islam from this piece of garbage!
      She wanted to simplify everything to “oh, so you get more Allah points for doing this stuff?” It’s almost as if she approached the whole program with an ignorant ‘lonely planet’ style perspective, like it’s a literal document to be followed slavishly!…

      *falls into sleep*

    41. Nyrone — on 6th September, 2006 at 12:29 am  

      hi Amir!

      I just noted that you wrote something in response to something I said earlier. I tried to read your post but it made by head hurt bad so I decided to have a lie down and forget I read it (which didn’t work). Personally, it sounds like a lot of hot air and verbal gymnastics from you (right on schedule:)as usual.

      I still have issues with your position on Lebanon, Hugo Chavez and global security from the last post which don’t seem to dissipate on my side, regardless of your talent for putting forward strongly-worded arguments that only half-make sense (are you sure your not using a random word generator??). Would you care to meet-up and discuss this at some point in the next few weeks? I’m kind of tied up with work at the moment, and can’t find the time to properly answer your barrage of points from the last post, relevant and important though they were. but would like to meet, if only to find out whether we can agree on any practical soloutions to this most difficult of intrinsic differences? nyrone@gmail.com

    42. Sunny — on 6th September, 2006 at 12:57 am  

      Refresh - As a voter I’m being perfectly rational. David Cameron is wooing the left of centre vote with his policies on environmentalism, approach to India and other issues. I’m paying attention because they matter to me.

      If Labour or the LibDems want my vote and my attention they have to show they are also committed and actually do something about it, rather than waxing lyrically about erasing third world debt and then doing nothing much.

      I want them to compete for my vote and my attention (as a writer), in other words.

      If I totally ignored them then I may pass up what could be a genuine move to centre ground politics. I prefer that over them both competing to go to the right.

      Not only that, if I ignore the Conservatives and remain committed to my traditional party, then I make that traditional party complacent on the issues that matter to me…. and I don’t give others the chance to compete for them. That is silly voter behaviour.

    43. Refresh — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:21 am  

      Sunny I don’t think its you he needs other than as a conduit to the rest of us.

      As Rakhee mentions above - its PR. And have we not suffered enough from the masters of spin? Has not the country seen its standing plummet? All because they could spin us in any way they want.

      We need a critical eye on all these politicians. Your personal voting preference is just that your preference.

      Now I would urge caution - adding PP to the DC blog may be seen as an endorsement.

      If its a simple matter of tactice to drive through more traffic - then perhaps we ought to say.

    44. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:57 am  

      Jagdeep,

      I’ll answer your questions when I get a chance to set-up my own blog… [next question: how do I set-up my own a “blog”? I fancy Wordpress].

      The mysteries (and conspiracy theories) surrounding my identity will be revealed in due course.

      I should warn you however… flattery will get you everywhere with me. Keep it up! :-)

    45. Sunny — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:01 am  

      But surely Refresh, you can see through spin when it is there, and make up your own mind? It is PR but it is no difference to how Labour or LibDems conduct themselves. But you cannot honestly suggest I then cut myself off from the political engagement entirely because we are fed spin.

      We are not that stupid. If politicians lie then we point that out. If they engage us badly then we complain. But I prefer that to not engaging at all. Sure we need a critical eye - which is what I’m doing in my article above. Let’s see how DC progresses.

      Should I be more sympathetic if its a Labour or LibDem politician? Maybe. But I don’t see that as a politically rational response.

    46. Refresh — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:24 am  

      Sunny, any tie-in for PP with a politician is not good. I’ve not forgotten the Tories and their determined effort to scapegoat minorities right up to Michael Howard. DC needs a coalitions - interestingly the same coalitions New Labour mustered…

      As for engaging, that can be done at an arms length.

    47. Refresh — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:27 am  

      Amir, think carefully how you launch your blog. Don’t be hasty. I feel you are ready for a transition to left politics - it would be shame for that to happen once you’ve gone public.

    48. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 3:02 am  

      Nyrone,

      You come across as a thoroughly decent chap. I shall take note of your email and contact you at a later date. Are you a Londoner by any chance? I ask, since you failed to enquire on my own whereabouts. Londoners, in my experience, instinctively assume that the rest of the UK is situated somewhere in ‘their’ city. Which, I can assure you, is not true. :-)

      I am hopeful, nevertheless, of moving down to London in the forthcoming weeks/months. All I need now is a job. Heh, heh!

    49. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 3:06 am  

      Refresh,

      You tease me no end…! Conversion to the ‘Left’? I’d rather drink battery acid.

      No, seriously,… I would.

    50. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 3:12 am  

      Sunny,

      ‘Sure we need a critical eye’

      Now you don’t. What you need is a Queer Eye for the Straight Guy!

      ‘We are not that stupid.’

      *Straw man alert* Beep beep. *Straw man alert* Beep beep. *Straw man alert* Beep beep.

      Amir

    51. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 3:17 am  

      Katy Newton,

      Could I just say (before I tuck in for the night)…

      I have so much respect for your boobs. It’s like, erm, errr,…unbelievable. I totally dig your boobs.

      Thank you for your time and patience,

      Cordially,

      Amir

    52. nyrone — on 6th September, 2006 at 8:09 am  

      London Indeed:)

      Job? what kind of work would you like to do?

    53. Katy Newton — on 6th September, 2006 at 8:40 am  

      Why thank you, Amir, that is very sweet of you. You have renewed my faith in mankind!

    54. Leon — on 6th September, 2006 at 9:56 am  

      I’ll answer your questions when I get a chance to set-up my own blog… [next question: how do I set-up my own a “blog”? I fancy Wordpress].

      I say go for it! Wordpress.com, sign up and get writing. The good thing about blogging is you can express yourself and evolve your ideas. Don’t hesitate, the best time is now.:)

    55. Refresh — on 6th September, 2006 at 9:58 am  

      Let me get the battery acid.

    56. Leon — on 6th September, 2006 at 10:14 am  

      E?

    57. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 6th September, 2006 at 12:33 pm  

      Londoners, in my experience, instinctively assume that the rest of the UK is situated somewhere in ‘their’ city. Which, I can assure you, is not true. :-)

      Lol yeah… dudio… Its like we are the only non-Londoners here…

    58. Leon — on 6th September, 2006 at 12:42 pm  

      There’s life outside London? My word!

    59. Jai — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:05 pm  

      =>”There’s life outside London?”

      Life, Leon, but not as we know it.

      ;)

    60. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:10 pm  

      You London snobs.. do you guys ever realise theres more to world than your shitty tube, your ethnic ghettos, your city has stagnated… moreover certain areas of London look as if Scousers run it.

    61. Jai — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:28 pm  

      Don’t overreact Vikrant; everyone’s just been joking.

      I answered your questions about Sikhism on the other thread, by the way.

    62. Leon — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:39 pm  

      Spot on Jai. Vikrant, untwist yo’ knickers mofo, I is jus fuckin wit yew!:D

    63. Kismet Hardy — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:45 pm  

      I think vikrant must be from one of those poor areas where they don’t have fridges or postcards. Leamington spa I bet

    64. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 6th September, 2006 at 1:50 pm  

      :p … naah Kismet though i’m originally from Leicester, the last place in England which I called home was an uber-posh home county borough on the Surrey-Bershire border.

    65. Kismet Hardy — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:02 pm  

      Oh good, then you’ve had experience of butlers. Good. Although I did prefer the maid servants back home. They were more thorough in their duties and frequently naked

    66. Rakhee — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:10 pm  

      Not wishing to labour the point but there are an incredible amount of snobs in Leicester too ya know.

    67. Kismet Hardy — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:39 pm  

      Slobs. They’re slobs. Cheesy slobs that speak funny and don’t have fridges or postcards

    68. Jai — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:50 pm  

      It’s pronounced “Leester” or (if you’re in India) “Leesesster”, goddammit. At least get the pronunciation right.

      Bit quieter than London, but a nice place to live if you want a fairly quiet life surrounded by millions of Indians. Quite a cosy environment in some ways, if that’s what you’re looking for. Different strokes for different folks.

    69. Rakhee — on 6th September, 2006 at 2:55 pm  

      => but a nice place to live if you want a fairly quiet life surrounded by millions of Indians

      That’s a complete contradiction in terms.

    70. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 6th September, 2006 at 6:05 pm  

      That’s a complete contradiction in terms.

      Quite..a contradiction! Hmm… during Navratri Leicester resembles… Ahmedabad… Gujju girls in backless cholis… hmm… good ole days…

      I miss “Ei up my duck” (no Kismet it isnt Eat up my dick) too..

    71. Jai — on 6th September, 2006 at 6:38 pm  

      Rakhee,

      =>”That’s a complete contradiction in terms.”

      Yes, like the term “good Gujarati girl”. Oxymorons everywhere ;)

      Okay, jokes aside, my point was regarding the general lifestyle. Desi life in places like Leicester, nearby Oadby etc is a little slower-paced than hectic, stress-inducing London. In many ways anyway. This is not to detract from the fact that Indians can be very noisy people indeed, along with all the non-stop social antics and politics which add so much headache-inducing hassle spice to one’s life as an Indian in 21st century Britain.

      I’m assuming you’ve been to Leicester and/or know people living there, so hopefully you understand what I’m trying to say.

    72. Rakhee — on 6th September, 2006 at 8:15 pm  

      Jai, I know Leicester very well and do know what you’re saying but still not sure I agree.

      I mean central London is similar to central Leicester as far as I’m concerned, Lots of people, hustle and bustle and in smaller communities within the city, very interested in other peoples business.

      The outskirts of London, say for example Pinner, still has a fairly high concentration of asian people but it’s a lot more relaxed, in a similar way to Oadby. You can effectively compare like for like,

      As for the comment on Good Gujarati Girls, I will let it slide coz I’m kind, considerate and understanding, as us GGGs are ;)

    73. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 6th September, 2006 at 8:54 pm  

      Have to agree with Rakhee Jai. Still the contempt with which Londoners view other cities IS annoying. Much like yanks…

    74. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 9:18 pm  

      Leicester…?!

      LOL :-)

      Rakhee, you amuse me, you feisty Gujarati.

    75. Amir — on 6th September, 2006 at 9:25 pm  

      No, honestly, I love Leicester…

      But not as much as I love Manchester.

    76. sunray — on 6th September, 2006 at 9:47 pm  

      Talking about Navratri.

      I am ashamed to say — but have to post this -that it was reported somewhere, the abortion rate went up three months after Navratri, in India.
      Its shameful how kids and the money making media have twisted this religious festival into something disgusting.
      I wonder if its the same in the UK?
      I guess we wont know. More Kids here probably use safe sex.
      However I have also read how the sale of condoms goes up before navratri.

      My advice to Parents lock up your kids!! :)

    77. Rakhee — on 6th September, 2006 at 10:07 pm  

      have never thought about it but now you’ve said it, is it really that surprising?

      men and women dancing close, wearing sexy outfits and working up a sweat for one week…hmm.

      contraception is poor in India. combined that with the taboo of having babies before marriage and bingo, abortions galore.

      sounds like a ‘freakonomic’.

    78. Vikrant a.k.a Amey — on 7th September, 2006 at 12:52 pm  

      pardon me Rakhee & Sunray, Though Navratri is a big thing in cosmopolitan cities like Bombay and Bnagalore.. outside Gujarat, it isnt THAT popular. Gujarati or Punjabi kids growing in UK seem to assume that every desi back home dances to the tune of “dandiya” and “bhangra”!

    79. Rakhee — on 7th September, 2006 at 1:46 pm  

      Take your point V but a depends how you’re defining ‘popular’. Let’s say it is only celebrate it in the cities you suggest, it’s still a huge amount of people:

      Mumbai’s population = 12.7 million
      Bangalore’s population = 6.2 million
      Gujarat’s population = 5.1 million

      Totalling 24 million.

      Comparatively that’s may not be a huge amount against the total population of India, but it’s still enough to have the social consequences that Sunray suggests above, even if they don’t all partake in the festival.

    80. Jai — on 7th September, 2006 at 2:20 pm  

      I may be wrong, but I’m pretty sure that Gujarat’s total population is not less than Mumbai’s or Bangalore’s. Especially when you include largish cities such as Ahmedabad…..

      Either way, that’s still a lot of dandiya action. And with regards to all the “midnight activities” taking place during Navratri, some of my relatives who live in Mumbai/Bombay confirmed that this sort of thing does go on. Especially considering the fact that it involves very large numbers of young people out late at night, mostly unescorted (which they may not normally be under other circumstances).

    81. Rakhee — on 7th September, 2006 at 2:33 pm  

      Doh!

      Apols Jai, I meant to say Ahmedabad’s population is 5.1mil. Gujarat’s total population is far greater than that of course, at exactly 50,596,992.

    82. Jai — on 7th September, 2006 at 2:39 pm  

      I believe they do garbas in Gujarati villages too Rakheeben, which should significantly increase the figures even further…..

    83. Rakhee — on 7th September, 2006 at 2:48 pm  

      Tank-chu Jayubhai, I kinda thought I’d be repeating the point if I said that, so I didn’t.

      Regardless of the numbers, you catch my drift, loads people must go out and have unprotected sex at Navratri in India.

      Velly velly bad.

    84. Badmash Vikrant — on 7th September, 2006 at 6:17 pm  

      loads people must go out and have unprotected sex at Navratri in India.

      Hmm… young people in India are quite shy about buying condoms… i guess its coz of sermonising pharmacists!

    85. Rakhee — on 7th September, 2006 at 10:30 pm  

      …and in some areas, lack of education about sex itself…

    86. Jai — on 8th September, 2006 at 11:29 am  

      =>”…and in some areas, lack of education about sex itself.”

      Bah, education schmeducation. All an Indian man needs to know is that when he take off his bride’s gunghat on his wedding night and sees her lovely (hopefully moustache-less) face for the very first time, everything he would ever need to know about male-female romantic relationships and nocturnal canoodling techniques will somehow miraculously pop into his head.

      A bit of ooohing, a bit of aaahing, and three seconds later his blushing dulhan will appreciate the full force of his magnificent prowess. Worth waiting for. And all the lucky lady has to do is just lie back and think of Ludhiana.

    87. Rakhee — on 8th September, 2006 at 1:51 pm  

      Jai, I believe that people talk about things like this from experience and I am now gravely concerned for you.

      Are you trying to tell us that all it takes to satisfy an Indian woman is 3 seconds? If so, yes I agree she’d probably go red….but in anger!

      I can’t think about a greasy indian man poking his inevitably beautiful bride, I’m eating my lunch..:(

      Besides, the thread is all about David Cameron in India. Oh no, let’s not even go there…

    88. justforfun — on 8th September, 2006 at 2:30 pm  

      “David does Delhi” LOL - I am sure I have that on VHs somewhere - or at least Kismet must have it somewhere for loan.

      Justforfun

    89. Jai — on 8th September, 2006 at 2:47 pm  

      Rakhee,

      I was just being ironic. Many desi parents expect their (adult) children to have no nookie — indeed, no dating whatsoever — before marriage and yet somehow expect them to have a wildly successful marriage both in the bedroom and out of it.

      My “3 second” estimate referred to the time it would take for the guy to go from “starting his engine” to “crossing the finishing line”. While his confused new bride is just getting comfortable and looking at her watch thinking “Is that it ?”.

      Just jokes ;)

      Anyway, back to the topic of David Cameron and his suggestion of strengthening trade ties between Europe and India. The East India Company apparently still exists, you know; I stumbled across their building about four years ago somewhere in the City when I was on my way to a meeting nearby.

      Quite a shock seeing it.

    90. Rakhee — on 8th September, 2006 at 3:05 pm  

      Jayubhai, I was just kidding too :)

      See what you’re saying though. To be honest, I’ve only ever really see it from a girl’s perspective. It’s good to be reminded that many of the problems here are experienced by men too.

      East India Company? Gd point, found this on Wikipedia:

      On the eve of the demise of the East India Company, the East India Club in London was formed for current and former employees of the East India Company. The Club still exists today and its club house is situated at 16 St. James’s Square, London.

    91. Badmash Vikrant — on 9th September, 2006 at 11:04 am  

      Anyways i’ve serious questions on how do i approach a pahrmacist for a condom…

    92. Don — on 9th September, 2006 at 11:11 am  

      Look him in they eye and place an order for two dozen a week.

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