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  • Shehzad Tanweer on TV


    by Sunny
    6th July, 2006 at 4:13 pm    

    A video showing London tube bomber Shehzad Tanweer has been aired on al-Jazeera television. Tanweer, from Leeds, killed seven people on a train at Aldgate during the attacks on 7 July 2005.

    He says on the video: “What you have witnessed now is only the beginning of a string of attacks that will continue and become stronger.” [BBC News, hat tip: Cisoux]

    This is what will happen now. The likes of the MCB and MPAC will claim this is another example of government foreign policy driving young men into the open arms of suicide bombers. Pro-war types will say this shows govt. foreign policy has no impact and they are just cold blooded killers. Islamophobes will say this is another example to show Muslims can never be part of British society. Male rabbits will say they continue to run out of female rabbits to hump. Dr Naseem Mohammed from Birmingham Mosque will say the video is fake because even cows can be made to dance. Cows will continue to complain silently about being used as political footballs when all they yearn to do is wander around a field and chew on some grass. Mooo! It is all a pre-prepared script.


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    1. Leon — on 6th July, 2006 at 4:19 pm  

      …Sunny will write a piece on PP, lots of idiots will comment, the picklers will sigh a resigned sigh. Leon will go get a beer because he can’t be arsed with it today. jOnz will come on asking who the Prime Minister is. Rohin will say something very clever, I’ll choke on my beer because I’ll be agreeing with him again. Some bastard will tell to sod off for writing this very unfunny extension to Sunny’s piece…

    2. Cisoux — on 6th July, 2006 at 4:20 pm  

      Good co-ordination by the motherfuckers, right on the eve of the anniversary. At least the MPAC boys and Azzam Tammimi will have something to make them horny tonight.

    3. j0nz — on 6th July, 2006 at 4:22 pm  

      Sunny, what will you claim? What do you think of this?

    4. j0nz — on 6th July, 2006 at 4:26 pm  

      pro-war types will say this shows govt. foreign policy has no impact and they are just cold blooded killers.

      Are you saying these bombers aren’t just cold blooded killers? Wtf?

      And if it was all about the Iraq war like you lefty-no-nads bleat on about, then why did he say

      continues to oppress our mothers, children, brothers and sisters in Palestine, Afghanistan, Iraq and Chechnya”, they deserve to be attacked

      “They” would be the kaffir, there really is no distinction.

      Anyway care to challenge these “presumptions”?

    5. Kismet Hardy — on 6th July, 2006 at 4:28 pm  

      Sunny you terrible bastard. You used up all the ‘animals to explain politics’ examples. It’s all I can do dammit

    6. anj — on 6th July, 2006 at 4:52 pm  

      ‘rabbits’ and ‘cows’. It may well be a pre prepared script of nonsense to you but there’s little point in fatuously condemning from outside the ‘circus’ ring. If its all so banal and unworthy of any challenge why d’you bother posting it. What DO you think?

    7. Sunny — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:00 pm  

      What DO I think? That it is tragic political theatre. It is the modern version of comparing dick sizes through the media.

    8. Arif — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:05 pm  

      The point I take from Sunny is that the video is just a film of a terrorist expressing his anger and giving his reasons for being angry. It does not prove Muslims are good, bad or indifferent people. it does not prove that UK foreign policy is enlightened, wicked or run-of-the-mill.

      If it has any significance, it probably is just in terms of giving an insight into his particular mentality and the ideology of those who groomed him. Given previous videos, I doubt there will be much there that is new. Beyond that people are just using it to project their own preoccupations.

      On the other hand, it could just be Sunny saying that he is tired of the Muslim v West arguments he’s jumped and been dragged into for the last few years.

    9. Cisoux — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:10 pm  

      Yes it is great political theatre and great timing by them. Kudos for their motherfuckery.

    10. zahed — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:17 pm  

      motherfuckery

      that is obscenely brilliant

      or brilliantly obscene

      um… one of those

    11. Don — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:43 pm  

      I tend to agree with a comment Shuggy made a while back and elsewhere; the opinion of a mass murderer on British foreign policy is about as worth hearing as that of a grave-robber on animal rights.

      He took himself out of the debate. Let him peddle his poison in Hell.

      Apropos the comment on the previous thread about the need to educate young muslims on how to change foreign policy peacefully and democratically, which someone (Refresh?) found so cogent; easily done.

      Just do it the same way as the rest of us. Engage with the political process, marshall your facts, join a party or form one, seek to persuade. Write. Speak. Stuff leaflets through letter boxes. Hone your arguments, build a concensus and slowly develop credibility with your fellow citizens. After about twenty years of hard work you will probably be in a position to have a degree of influence, but there is no guarantee that the majority of the population will come round to your way of thinking.

      The concept is not difficult to grasp, but the actual process is hard, slow and uncertain. Which is as it should be. I doubt that the bombers and their supporters/apologists were unaware of how the political process works, they just rejected it in favour of self-aggrandising violence.

    12. anj — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:48 pm  

      ‘That it is tragic political theatre. It is the modern version of comparing dick sizes through the media.’

      Well there is precious little being done to slapdown the big swinging dicks. Dismiss the video. Or challenge extremism. So all this propaganda gets a good airing and as someone mentioned certain people will get horny off it. Its great you can predict how this will all play out though interjected with a bit of humour at this time of year.

    13. anj — on 6th July, 2006 at 5:49 pm  

      “Anyway care to challenge these “presumptions”?”

      Nope. Apparently not.

    14. Tanvir — on 6th July, 2006 at 6:02 pm  

      On the other hand, it could just be Sunny saying that he is tired of the
      Muslim v West arguments he’s jumped and been dragged into for the last few
      years.

      dragged into? i dont think he is complaining, it provides him with a job! I’d guess he types the word Muslim at least 10 times a day?

      So everybody’s making efforts to stop the terrorism, lots of funding out there from the government for different projects, and lots of community leaders able to make a living. But everyone just pretends these political issues the bombers are talking about will just go away. I think the whole reason it is happening is that there is a kind of stalemate, and as much as you try to convince people that attacking the Western countries is not the way to react, and as well as these strategies will work, there is always going to be those few people who disagree. I think realisticly, terrorism is here to stay.

    15. Refresh — on 6th July, 2006 at 8:07 pm  

      Don,

      I think it would have been fairer (and more in context) if you had responded to my comments on democratic participation in the original thread.

      Participation in general is being part of society, and its a laudable objective.

    16. Bikhair aka Taqiyyah — on 6th July, 2006 at 8:31 pm  

      Don,

      Muslims involving themselves in the political process? Ask jOnz how terribling that is when he become so alarmed by Dr. Bari’s advice on how British soceity can become more upright and dignified. Muslims are supposed to be politically active because then it is seen as some nefarious plan toward domination. I guess they can be like the Amish. They have the clothing and that desire to be as undeveloped as possible.

    17. Don — on 6th July, 2006 at 8:43 pm  

      Refresh,

      I assure you I had no sinister motive in commenting on the more current thread, as it is on a related topic. The previous thread has, after all, moved on considerably.

      Bikkhair,

      I have nothing against J0nz and sometimes agree with him, but I don’t feel the need to ask his advice.

      Am I right in assuming you meant to include a ‘not’ in ‘ Muslims are supposed to be politically active because then it is seen as some nefarious plan toward domination.’?

      If so, (not) supposed by whom?

      ‘I guess they can be like the Amish. They have the clothing and that desire to be as undeveloped as possible.’

      Is that your opinion, or are you asserting that it represents mine? I think I was fairly clear on how I think people who want political change in a democracy should go about it. Would you care to do the same?

    18. Sunny — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:54 am  

      Bikhair is right on that point. If Muslims express themselves by involving themselves in the political process peacefully, he will complain about England being turned into a Shariah state. I think he would rather they just keep quiet and keep to themselves. Heh.

      Tanvir says:
      dragged into? i dont think he is complaining, it provides him with a job! I’d guess he types the word Muslim at least 10 times a day?

      Heh, I always get that thrown at me. But let me humour you. How do you think I make money by talking about Muslim issues Tanvir? Do you think PP makes money? Do you think I get paid for writing about terrorism? For appearing on TV to talk about it? Or maybe I’m selling myself short here and I should charge money for all this writing I do.

      Surely the question would be more applicable to the MCB types. Who gave Inayat Bunglawala to respresent Muslims and get paid grants by the govt for projects? I wish I could get the govt to give me some cash, but Arif knows I’m far too lazy to fill out those forms.

      So the truth is a bit more inane than that unfortunately (for both of us). If I tried to survive by writing about Muslim issues then I’d die of starvation right now.

    19. Sunny — on 7th July, 2006 at 1:08 am  

      And just to be equal on this, because no doubt some will construe this as an attack only on the MCB, I’m also interested in why the Network of Sikh Organisations, Sikh Federation, Hindu Forum, Hindu Council etc get to be elected as “community leaders” and get grants.

      Sure, Muslim issues are important right now. But this goes to the heart of the community - people who take charge without a mandate and then try and represent me. Taking them on is a side project for me, not the ultimate project. But it is still an important one.

    20. Zak — on 7th July, 2006 at 1:11 am  

      holy moly sunny is psychic!!

    21. Leon — on 7th July, 2006 at 1:14 am  

      @Bikhair, very true but Dr Bari also talked about not drinking being a “value” that Britains could learn from the Muslim community!

      To ape the head of the NRA; they’ll have to prise a bottle of Jack Daniels out of my cold dead hands.

    22. Sunny — on 7th July, 2006 at 1:29 am  

      Zak - eh?

    23. Chris Stiles — on 7th July, 2006 at 1:41 am  


      Network of Sikh Organisations, Sikh Federation, Hindu Forum, Hindu Council etc get to be elected as “community leaders” and get grants.


      How do you think I make money by talking about Muslim issues Tanvir? Do you think PP makes money? Do you think I get paid for writing about terrorism?

      So your entire beef is that you aren’t the one getting the grant ? :)

      Seriously, these groups are just doing what other people have suggested here regarding use of the democratic process - part of which involves organising into groups.

      Make an equal noise and they’ll talk to you too - there is really nothing stopping you - and as a bonus the history of the Labour party in the 80s are a case book example of a small well motivated bunch of individuals can cripple a larger organisation - if you wish to follow that tactic instead.

      Otherwise, it’s a little like asking why they always interview Digby Jones whenever there is a businesss story in the news.

    24. Sunny — on 7th July, 2006 at 2:11 am  

      Heh. No I don’t want to replace that structure, I want to question why it even has to exist. As I’ve said on previous occasions, we don’t be Britons unless we stop being treated as “a community”.

      Why would I want to follow that grant-led life. Boring. There are bigger things to do.

    25. Bikhair aka Taqiyyah — on 7th July, 2006 at 4:10 am  

      Leon,

      I have seven words for you: liver, pancreas, and waking up to ugly chicks.

      LOL….

    26. FalseFlag — on 7th July, 2006 at 8:29 am  

      this tape is yet another hoax from the REAL PERPS.

      “I don’t believe Hasib did it,” Hasib Hussain’s father said. “No one has shown me any evidence that he did it. I haven’t seen nothing, no DNA, no evidence. When there is a crime you have to have evidence. I have seen no evidence. There should be a public inquiry, then everyone can come and give evidence everyone can come and say what they know. They could do this if there was a public inquiry.”

      He was in denial. His mind could not accept it and in the background other family members nodded and agreed with the father. Gently I said to him: “But why was Hasib on the bus?” He replied: “Because he was going to London to see friends.

      “The other three boys he went with, I know them, they were good boys. I think it must have been someone else on the bus, not Hasib. Hasib was a good boy. How can I, how can I lose my son? No way. There is no way.

      “I mean, if I had to break his legs, right, I could do that if I knew there’s something. But not a shred of evidence or anything that he was involved in it. ”

      http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=17337812%26method=full%26site id=94762%26headline=7%2d7%2dvictim%2ds%2dboyfriend%2dconfronts%2dbombe r%2ds%2dfather-name_page.html

    27. TheFriendlyInfidel — on 7th July, 2006 at 11:01 am  

      “I don’t believe Hasib did it,” Hasib Hussain’s father said. “No one has shown me any evidence that he did it.

      What do you think that the odds are that the father does believe that jooos run the world and that the Americans did 9/11 to themselves? Those ideas apparently don’t need any evidence, just belief.

      I’m interested to see how the family is handled by the TV programme this evening. If the father is taking the “show me the evidence” line, they are part of the problem and shouldn’t be treated with any respect.

      Cheers,

      TFI

      I’d put down

    28. TheFriendlyInfidel — on 7th July, 2006 at 11:04 am  

      Bikhair,

      I have seven words for you: liver, pancreas, and waking up to ugly chicks.

      Wow, your nights out drink must have been a blast!

      TFI

    29. TheFriendlyInfidel — on 7th July, 2006 at 11:08 am  

      The sheep on all sides will countinue to “baa” and believe anything they are told by the group of people that they aligned themselves with. No hard questions will be asked of any of the sheep, because that might make the flock restless.

      Baaa! Baaa!

      *joins the field of dancing cows*

      Baaa! Baaa! Boom! Chakka Boom! Moo!

    30. sonia — on 7th July, 2006 at 11:22 am  

      show me the evidence is all about the right to innocence until proven guilty - where have i heard that before? there’s no reason why people shouldn’t be treated with respect for voicing that. I don’t think we need to add to the mad witch hunting hysteria which seems to be gripping this world.

    31. Cisoux — on 7th July, 2006 at 11:33 am  

      sonia

      Do you believe that the four motherfuckers were the motherfuckers who carried out their mass murder or do you think it may all be a big conspiracy? Do you really think that it is hysteria to describe people who claim that the four motherfuckers from hell did not do it as a witch-hunt? Or just stupid idiots in denial over the murderous motherfuckery of those evil men?

      What do you think? I think those in denial should be screamed at and metaphorically slapped in order to wake them up. If you’re in denial, you’re part of the problem.

    32. Roger — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:14 pm  

      There is a simple reason why full details and confirmatory evidence of the bombings a year ago have not been released. A police investigation, which may lead to more charges being laid, is still going on. Until then details which may be used in trials aren’t released.
      There are actually two different kinds of ppublic inquiry being asked for. One is to find out how the bombers were able to conspire to commit their crimes without being caught and whether anything can be learned from that failure. The other- see above- is a general conviction that an undefined They are conspiring in an undefined way for undefined but nefarious purposes. Their methods are a curious mixture of sophisticated and brilliantly co-ordinated and needlessly complicated operations and incompetence that the Crazy Gang wouldn’t achieve. For some reason or other the conspiracy nutters think that an independent inquiry, constituted in an unspecified way, will somehow be free of the influence of these all-pervasive plotters and will find out The Truth. However, if it reached comnclusions that the conspiracy hunters did agree with they would immediately decide that it was part of another yet-more-cunningly-concealed conspiracy.

    33. Lopakhin — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:16 pm  


      Among extraordinary coincidences here are the location of the blast, just outside the offices of The BMA and The Lancet, which had ruffled feathers with its research that 100,000 civilians had died in Iraq, and also the location of a van from a company which among other things offers specialist controlled explosions - which appears to have been level with the back of the bus, though doubtless is entirely innocent.

      L.o.l., first time I’ve heard that one. But as a visit to their website confirms, their offices are actually in Camden Town, about a mile away from Tavistock Square.

      http://www.thelancet.com/about/contact

      The Lancet Offices:

      London
      32 Jamestown Road, London NW1 7BY, UK
      Tel: +44 (0) 20 7424 4910

    34. Don — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:30 pm  

      I don’t doubt that the bombers were the bombers and I can’t be bothered to read any more rambling conspiracy melanges, but I don’t find it suprising that a father can’t come to terms with his son being a mass murderer and is clutching at straws. That’s nothing to get all worked up about, surely.

    35. Roger — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:32 pm  

      BMA House is in Tavistock Square, actually. I don’t see what its presence is meant to prove to the people who believe it’s Them What Done It. They carefully murder or maim a few people but mercifully make sure the explosion takes place just outside the BMA’s HQ so plenty of doctors would be on hand.

    36. Lopakhin — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:44 pm  

      I am aware of that, but the point about the Lancet, relating to its comments on Iraq, still seems to be wrong - its offices are separate.

    37. sonia — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:48 pm  

      yeah don’s right about post no. 35

    38. TheFriendlyInfidel — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:50 pm  

      #31 here, here

      #32 False here is a riddle for you: you are neither in the river, nor out of the river. Where are you? You in De Nile. Boom Boom (both puns intended)

      #35 It would help greatly if his father wasn’t in a state of denial, it would help Muppets like FalseFlag come to terms with the reality the rest of us occupy.

      To believe that these kids are Martyrs requires a belief that these kids did it. Therefore the “13% of Muslims” think that these lads are Martyrs must belief that this kids did it. We ought add to this figure to the number of idiots that don’t think that these kids did it.

      If someone believes that they didn’t do it AND they are martyrs means that they are pathologically stupid and shouldn’t be trusted with sharp objects.

      So FalseFlag, do you consider these kids both Martyrs AND innocent? Should you be trusted with pointy things?

      Cheers,

      TFI

    39. sonia — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:51 pm  

      ha cisoux im on in denial i think you are. obviously the bombs happened and there are bombers are out there. its hardly suprising the father of one of the people accused as -don puts it- is having difficulty dealing with that. what i said whas about the general principle of innocent until proven guilty - and that certainly is the hallmark of a free and unrepressive society, i don’t see why emphasizing that means anyone is in denial. Really!

    40. sonia — on 7th July, 2006 at 12:52 pm  

      heh heh typo - i’m not in denial. ‘you are part of the problem’ - people love throwing that around don’t they.

      if you want to know what i think cisoux - you can read this - http://sonia.pickledpolitics.com/2006/07/06/seventh-of-july-one-year-on/

      i’m sure we differ - you sound like a hate-filled person.

    41. Roger — on 7th July, 2006 at 1:11 pm  

      Sorry, Lopakhin, I thought that you- like our paranoid pal- thought the BMA and The Lancet shared the same offices.

    42. Lopakhin — on 7th July, 2006 at 2:05 pm  

      Neither of those links work for me.

    43. Zak — on 7th July, 2006 at 2:33 pm  

      Sunny: I meant about the rabbits..

    44. Sunny — on 7th July, 2006 at 2:46 pm  

      FalseFlag - please kindly fuck off. We welcome debates here not stupid conspiracy theories. Most of the “points” that you pose have already been dealt with if people look hard enough (the train timings thing for example). I’m gonna keep deleting your bullshit unless you go away.

    45. Sunny — on 7th July, 2006 at 2:47 pm  

      Zak - heh. That’s all rabbits think about though isn’t it? I wish I was a rabbit…. :(

    46. Leon — on 7th July, 2006 at 3:13 pm  

      “Leon,

      I have seven words for you: liver, pancreas, and waking up to ugly chicks.

      LOL….

      Hah hah, don’t we all have the right though to choose the manner in which we go to hell?:P

    47. Ravi Naik — on 7th July, 2006 at 6:30 pm  

      “what i said whas about the general principle of innocent until proven guilty - and that certainly is the hallmark of a free and unrepressive society, i don’t see why emphasizing that means anyone is in denial. Really!”

      You raise a good point, Sonia. But in this case, what form of evidence would you need to convince you that those four individuals commited that crime? Two of them have already confessed on video, and then you have Al Qaeda confirming it.

      If there is something good coming out of this tragic affair is that it give us the resolve to erradicate the problem. But if people deny it, then it makes it all the more frustrating.

      Yesterday on More4 News, someone who had been investigating one of the bombers and had been talking with the family since the bombings, came out saying that this guy was ambitious, hardworking, went to university, who cared about his community. And then said… we need people like him in Britain!

      What the fuck is wrong with our media?

    48. waxon — on 8th July, 2006 at 11:28 am  

      whats your arguement?
      fact is tanweer was known to the m15.
      a public inquiry will hopefully settle a few of the disrepencies…the cancelled “7.40 train” the ‘bombers’ had taken from luton and the conflicting eye-witness reports :)

    49. Cisoux — on 8th July, 2006 at 12:37 pm  

      Sonia - you are wrong. I am a LOVE filled person. I love life, freedom, art, music, literature, joy and summer evenings. I hate motherfucker terrorists, apologists for Islamist fascism, and testicle cancers who abound conspiracy theories like the smelly one above called sickoflies - because they are against all the things I love. I am a man of deep and abiding LOVE for the world and humanity, and that is why I despise dunces.

    50. SickOfLies — on 8th July, 2006 at 12:43 pm  

      “I hate motherfucker terrorists, apologists for Islamist fascism, and testicle cancers who abound conspiracy theories like the smelly one above called sickoflies - because they are against all the things I love. ”

      And what may that be? Being a lying lacky for the government?
      Christ, I’d love you to say that to my face.

    51. BollywoodScum — on 9th July, 2006 at 6:33 pm  

      Tanweer *didn’t* mention Kashmir in his rollcall Of Reasons Why London Commuters Must Be Punished did he?
      Wonder why that was? Has it fallen off the map now in Jihadi terms? His family being from there as well.

    52. Tanvir — on 10th July, 2006 at 2:43 pm  

      How do you think I make money by talking about Muslim
      issues Tanvir? Do you think PP makes money?

      Its not about money . . . . more a vocation? I don’t have qualms with you investing time making your voice heard, quite the opposite actually, also assuming you find it fulfilling.

      With regards to the conspiracy theories, I think with history telling us that false flag operations have occurred, by western nations more than others, people have every right to question what they are told. It is up to the individual to decide what happened, and a sensible person would make or change opinions on the evidence as it arrives.

      Questioning how genuine the claim that the London bombers carried out the attacks on the current evidence, would mean having to believe they were being watched and were identified as ones sympathetic to terrorist measures and were allowed and even indirectly helped by the intelligence services to forward political targets i.e. to keep the public on their toes so they accept further major action by government or b) the bombers were actually commissioned by the intelligence services and all these videos including the ones of the bombers statements were orchestrated by the intelligence agencies!

      Both of which I think are unlikely and the more evidence that came out after the London bombings the more of an imagination you would require to still believe the conspiracy theories.

      As much as there are people doing good work to tackle the rise of extremism, I just cant see how such atrocities can be stopped, even if 99.9recurring% of people understand it’s a bad idea, there still could be just one or two people, and that’s all it takes.

      I think moving to the most neutral country possible is the way forward!

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