The BNP on Question Time


by Rumbold
27th September, 2009 at 5:46 pm    

It has been confirmed that Nick Griffin will appear on Question Time on October 22, along with Jack Straw. Good. This will give the other panelists a chance to expose the BNP’s contradictions and flawed policies, rather than just yelling ‘racist’ at them and expecting everyone to be impressed.

With the other panelists yet to be named, who do you think should appear on Question Time? I would like to see Vince Cable (because he has an engaging manner, is well liked and has a child from a mixed-race relationship) and David Davis, a right-wing politician from a council estate who has (rightly) established a reputation for being a principled politician. For the non-politico slot, I am not sure. Shami Chakrabarti of Liberty would be excellent.

(Questions here, responses here)


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  1. chairwoman — on 27th September, 2009 at 5:49 pm  

    I wish they’d put our very own Lee Barnes up there :)

  2. Leon — on 27th September, 2009 at 5:50 pm  

    I’d like to see Bob Crow from the RMT on there, agreed about Vince Cable, for the Tories I’d like Eric Pickles. And for fun how about adding George Galloway and airing it at 9pm?

  3. Amrit — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:09 pm  

    You mean, ‘for being a principled politician’?

    /pedantry

    Leon:

    Yeah, but he’ll need a bib for when the frothing spins (quickly and inevitably) out of control.

  4. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:11 pm  

    I just blogged on this here.

    The stench of your fear is palpable.

    The BIG LIE about the BNP is about to be exposed, and all your censorship blown away, the lies of the false media exposed, and the political pygmys of the establishment parties revealed for what they are.

    No wonder your all crapping yourself.

    Its time now to get in the boxing ring with the big boys, instead of shouting rude names in the playground.

    You are our bitch now.

    http://leejohnbarnes.blogspot.com/2009/09/question-time-and-fear.html

  5. Sajn — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:18 pm  

    I’d like to see Ian Hislop on there. I think David Davis would be good but not sure about Straw. I think Mandelson would be better for Labour.

  6. chairwoman — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:19 pm  

    Oh dear, I think a cold shower is called for.

  7. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:22 pm  

    I would go on Question Time anytime, I have met many of the ‘professional’ politicians over the years, and not one has earnt my respect.

    There are a few non-politicians who would be able to give me a good debate, but not many.

    Any time you want to organise a debate – let me know.

    But you wont as most of you are a bunch of simpering keyboard warrior pussys who give it large online and then run away when the time comes to walk the walk instead of just talking the talk.

  8. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:26 pm  

    How about a panel of Jesus, Mohammed, Einstein, Gandhi and Marx.

    We can clone them and then get them on the panel.

    I reckon with a panel like that, you may just win the debate.

    You really are a bunch of Wankers arent you.

    I thought you were jesting.

    Boy oh boy, how wrong I was.

  9. Don — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:33 pm  

    I think Rumbold’s line up sounds about right.

    Its time now to get in the boxing ring with the big boys, instead of shouting rude names in the playground.

    You are our bitch now.

    Big boys?

    Do you really think that someone who thinks like that and expresses themselves (very publicly) in those terms can expect to be taken seriously as a (senior?) member of a political party trying for legitimacy?

  10. Andy Gilmour — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:34 pm  

    Dear Lee John Barnes (what a talented footballer that nice John Barnes was – were you named after him, perhaps? Just wondering)

    >”The stench of your fear is palpable”

    Hmmm..doubt it. My feet, maybe, because I’ve been out tramping up hills and stuff, but that’d be very tricky to send over the internet.

    >”The BIG LIE about the BNP is about to be exposed, and all your censorship blown away, the lies of the false media exposed, and the political pygmys of the establishment parties revealed for what they are.”

    Oh, I see. Well, I look forward to all of that, should be quite a show. Doubt it’s actually going to happen, but then, hey, there’s an outside chance I’ll win the lottery, or be struck by lightning, so I suppose almost anything’s possible. Maybe the BNP have hired Derren Brown, he might just be able to pull it off…
    By the way, which one’s the “BIG LIE”…as opposed to all the tiny ones?

    >”No wonder your all crapping yourself.”

    Nope, no “adult nappies” in *this* house, no continence issues here, I can assure you, although I appreciate your concern.

    >”Its time now to get in the boxing ring with the big boys, instead of shouting rude names in the playground.”

    My, my, what dreadfully violent imagery. And I’m afraid I’ll have to decline your offer of pugilism, I’ve got a bit of a knackered shoulder at the moment. Perhaps we could play football instead? And rude names never achieve much, now do they – evidence-based argument always welcome, however…

    >”You are our bitch now.”

    Rude names in the playground, Mr. LJB? Tut, tut. Such hypocrisy. Ah, well.

  11. Leon — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:37 pm  

    The stench of your fear is palpable.

    Senior BNP member admits to being a dog.

  12. Don — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:38 pm  

    I would go on Question Time anytime,

    Please do. Pretty please.

    not one has earnt my respect.

    I’ll bet they’re all broken up about that.

  13. Sajn — on 27th September, 2009 at 6:55 pm  

    Thinking about it, Nigel Farage might be good for this debate as well.

  14. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 7:07 pm  

    I think Rumbold’s line up sounds about right.

    Its time now to get in the boxing ring with the big boys, instead of shouting rude names in the playground.

    You are our bitch now.

    Big boys?

    Do you really think that someone who thinks like that and expresses themselves (very publicly) in those terms can expect to be taken seriously as a (senior?) member of a political party trying for legitimacy?

    #### Perhaps I should sell a dictator a chemical weapons plant or invade a couple of nations in an illegal war, perjure myself over a prostitute, employ a Tongan slave and lie about it in order to be one of those ‘proper’ politicians eh.

    Your right.

    I am just not bent enough, corrupt enough, insane enough, dont bullshit enough, dont whore enough and am not enough of a hypocrite, self serving money grabbing whore to be a real politician.

    I will not retire from politics and take up banking, let rent boys piss on me and declare war on a few countries until I am trained enough to be a real politician.

  15. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 7:08 pm  

    Thinking about it, Nigel Farage might be good for this debate as well.

    The only thing Farage is good for is being a stand in for Kermit The Frog on the Muppet Show.

  16. Wyrdtimes — on 27th September, 2009 at 7:42 pm  

    This of course assumes that the boot boys of “Unite Against Fascism” don’t have a riot outside the studio – they appear to not appreciate the concept of free speech.

  17. Leon — on 27th September, 2009 at 8:39 pm  

    Lee is clearly suffering from a severe case of testosterone intoxication.

  18. chairwoman — on 27th September, 2009 at 9:24 pm  

    Does that cause lack of basic language skills, Leon?

  19. KB Player — on 27th September, 2009 at 9:28 pm  

    Barmy Barnes can’t hold any kind of conversation without shouting abuse and calling people morons, maggots etc. I wonder how he manages with his fellow BNP comrades. Some of them are pretty much awestruck and worship Griffin, so will take anything that’s dished out to them, but others must be tougher nuts and you think he must have had his head kicked in a few times by now.

  20. Rumbold — on 27th September, 2009 at 9:47 pm  

    Hehehe (to most of this thread). Mr. Barnes, LLB (Hons.) would make a wonderful panelist. Shall we get a petition going to have him on the show?

  21. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 9:48 pm  

    I am surprised by just how few posts there on this thread, whats up people are you worried – you dont seem so happy now the BIG LIE about the BNP being ‘thick, ignorant and stupid’ is about to be toppled do you.

    It appears that without No Platform and censorship to back you up, you seem to have shut up.

    Oh well you can always try terrorism – such as screaming at Nick from the audience or trying to attack him during the programme, which will merely make him look a victim and you lot the thugs, and the British people dont like bullies and they are frankly sick of the UAF and the idiot leftys.

    So its a bit of a dillema isnt it – now the public are going to hear what we have to say without interruption or hostile journalists trying to interrupt us.

    Now onder your worried, seeing as your power is built on lies.

  22. Lee Barnes — on 27th September, 2009 at 9:50 pm  

    Hehehe (to most of this thread). Mr. Barnes, LLB (Hons.) would make a wonderful panelist. Shall we get a petition going to have him on the show?

    I tell you what Rumbold, how about me and you having a debate, we film it and put it up on this site for PP readers to comment on.

    I dare you.

  23. douglas clark — on 27th September, 2009 at 10:09 pm  

    Lee Barnes @ 22,

    Can’t see how that debate could possibly work, to be honest. It requires goodwill on both sides, a neutral venue and someone to hold the jackets. I would have thought it could, err, degenerate quite quickly. It could not, for instance be played out under Fox News rules.

    Still, an interesting idea.

    Off the top of my head it would have to have a long format, would have to have pre-agreed topics for discussion, a host that was both neutral and not subject to challenge, who was also able to call time outs if needed, and no audience whatsoever. It sounds about as boring as C-Span, although that has had it’s moments.

  24. douglas clark — on 27th September, 2009 at 10:37 pm  

    Obviously the ideal place to put it, apart from the home sites of the participants, would be U-Tube. Lee Barnes, you might yet be a media sensation! I’d expect it’d get a lot of ‘views’.

    If anyone wanted to go ahead with this then perhaps we could use the rest of the thread to identify, say four questions from each side, y’know, along the lines of:

    “Why are we allowing Sharia Law in the UK?”

    or

    “Why aren’t we encouraging Sharia Law in the UK?”

    Then each participant would have a few minutes to discuss the question, uninteruppted and then perhaps answering a few questions from the host.

    …And then a little cross questioning, or perhaps not. Dunno…

    I see quite a lot of merit in exploring this, does anyone else agree?

  25. persephone — on 27th September, 2009 at 11:21 pm  

    “the BIG LIE about the BNP being ‘thick, ignorant and stupid’ is about to be toppled do you.”

    Actually this perception is being endorsed by your ‘contributions’ on this post

  26. douglas clark — on 27th September, 2009 at 11:45 pm  

    persephone,

    And elsewhere.

  27. Leon — on 28th September, 2009 at 12:24 am  

    Does that cause lack of basic language skills, Leon?

    Yep it affects all the higher functions of the brain. Right now his brain is functioning at such a low level I’m actually surprised he’s still remembering to breath.

  28. fugstar — on 28th September, 2009 at 12:42 am  

    ian duncan smith from the tories please

    queen shami is amazing, but not this one, benjamine zephaniah has poetic mojo.

    it shouldn’t be solely about nick griffin being there. hope the questions are stretching.

  29. Reza — on 28th September, 2009 at 8:49 am  

    Frank Field and Phil Woolas have both been remarkably frank and outspoken about our insane and out of control immigration policy. Their inclusion would be good if they were allowed to bring some honesty to the table and reassure the public that they recognize that the majority of British people want something drastic to be done, and quickly.

    However, I suspect that the Labour ‘Politburo’ will do everything to gag any debate on immigration and we’ll simply have the likes of Straw pretending everything is hunky dory and anyone who says otherwise is a racist.

    This will ensure that the BNP maintain a monopoly on the inconvenient truths; that the British public oppose uncontrolled mass immigration, dislike moral equivalence and multiculturalism and are worried by what they see as a rapid Islamification of their society.

    No doubt the BBC will ensure that the audience will be ‘representative’ comprising of middle-class liberals, public sector workers and plenty of ‘ethnic minorities’ who will boo appropriately.

    However, my fear is that many ordinary British people who watch will be left feeling that the only way their overwhelming desire to change the staggering and unsettling demographic change in this country is to vote BNP.

  30. Binky — on 28th September, 2009 at 9:04 am  

    Reza is right, whether we like it or not.

    I hope the various indulgences showered on his immigrant constituents by Straw are duly spelled out in detail by Griffin.

    I worry about JLB. Is he taking his meds properly?

  31. Rumbold — on 28th September, 2009 at 9:11 am  

    Lee Barnes:

    “I tell you what Rumbold, how about me and you having a debate, we film it and put it up on this site for PP readers to comment on.

    I dare you.”

    I don’t regard myself as a good debator, compared to many others. Therefore I wouldn’t want to let the side down by appearing in such a debate. This isn’t false modesty, I am just recognising my weaknesses. I have never claimed to be an excellent debator.

  32. dave bones — on 28th September, 2009 at 10:24 am  

    I’ve never understood no platform anyway. The concept is stupid. What is wrong with debating people? Why ban people from talking? I can’t see free speech as a fragile thing. I thought it was supposed to be a corner stone here.

  33. platinum786 — on 28th September, 2009 at 10:33 am  

    I think Griffin should be asked to define what is “white culture”. It screwed that American bigot.

  34. sarah — on 28th September, 2009 at 10:54 am  

    David Cameron would be good, though would probably be in pain being near Nick Griffin after the rubbish he talked about his son,

    I’d like to see a disability rights campaigner or a disabled person who would also have a lot to say about those crazy policies.

  35. Reza — on 28th September, 2009 at 11:06 am  

    I’m not aware that Griffin has ever claimed for there to be a ‘white’ culture.

    He speaks of the “indigenous English, Welsh, Scottish and Irish peoples and cultures of these Islands.”

    That’s a significant difference.

  36. sarah — on 28th September, 2009 at 11:10 am  

    I think David Cameron would be good. He deserves a chance to come face to face with Nick Griffin after the rubbish the BNP talked about his son. Also a disability rights campaigner… maybe a disabled person for the non political slot as we all deserve the chance to ask him why he doesn’t see the point in keeping us alive.

  37. persephone — on 28th September, 2009 at 11:11 am  

    @ 34 Does not the term indigenous mean white in the context of his quote. The difference is in the language used.

  38. dave bones — on 28th September, 2009 at 11:18 am  

    Yeah ask him about white culture. Who is Lee Barnes? Why not debate with him? I don’t get it at all. Is debate a competitive sport? Like a pissing contest with words? Talk to people for fucks sake.

  39. persephone — on 28th September, 2009 at 11:22 am  

    “my fear is that many ordinary British people who watch will be left feeling that the only way their overwhelming desire to change the staggering and unsettling demographic change in this country is to vote BNP”

    Perhaps some thought that would also be the effect before Glenn Beck was interviewed. Though I do not think that the many ordinary american folk were driven to change the ‘staggering and unsettling’ demographic in the states.

  40. persephone — on 28th September, 2009 at 11:24 am  

    “many ordinary British people”

    Can you clarify whom you mean. Am asking, since Like Nick Griffin, am sure you are not claiming it to mean white people

  41. Shatterface — on 28th September, 2009 at 1:37 pm  

    Let’s start a petition to get Lee John Barnes on.

    The quotes above alone are enough to undermine the credibility of the entire BNP. He’s the best asset the liberal left have.

    Put him up against a few Black or Jewish panelists, just watch him froth at the mouth.

  42. persephone — on 28th September, 2009 at 1:55 pm  

    ” Put him up against a few Black or Jewish panelists, just watch him froth at the mouth.”

    And a “wench” or two

  43. Paul — on 28th September, 2009 at 2:39 pm  

    One of the main reasons that there is a BNP, is that there are liberals who think there ought to be a BNP. The alternative option is of course to ban it, for which there are enough instruments available, especially anti-terrorism laws and powers. That applies in other EU countries with xenophobic parties. People who think that the BNP ought to be a legal political party, and that others ought to ‘engage in debate’ with it, are by definition pro-BNP. Their willingness to defend the BNP indicates that xenophobia is not confined to the typical BNP voter.

    What I don’t understand is how they can combine this insistence on debating the BNP, with denial of the BNP’s policy concerns. To advocate debate with the BNP suggests a recognition of the concerns of its voters. However, on many other issues, this blog and its regular contributors downplay or deny these concerns. (It’s true the BNP is itself evasive).

    A specific example: Geert Wilders recently proposed the deportation of several million Muslims. He back-pedalled the next day, and the BNP hides behind “voluntary repatriation”. There is probably substantial support for mass deportations, and yet concrete proposals are absent from the political arena. Now, I know what Sunny Hundal would say to that. He would say: “no evidence for that option, its at most a tiny minority who want that option, British voters are concerned about extremism, we (Asians / Muslims) must therefore deal with the extremists in our own communities”. Such denial of widespread xenophobia is a typical response, from the political and media elite.

    But if you follow this logic, then either

    a. the BNP belong to the ‘tiny minority’ – so in that case why spend time prominently debating with them?

    b. the BNP agree with Sunny Hundal and the political mainstream – meaning they have no problems with Islam as such, or with immigration as such, they just want the government (and the Muslim communities) to deal with the Islamist extremists. So in that case, what’s the point of the debate?

    If the mainstream response is indeed correct, then surely it is all very simple. The government can intern the ‘tiny minority’ of Islamists, and the ‘tiny minority’ of Muslims who support them, and indeed the ‘tiny minority’ of EDL supporters. Then, with these 300 or so people interned somewhere like Thurso, the BNP will dissolve itself, harmony will prevail, and Britain will be happy and glorious once more.

  44. Morrigan — on 28th September, 2009 at 2:40 pm  

    Kenan Malik on the BBC:

    “The writer and economist Philippe Legrain is unimpressed. “It shows a complete lack of trust in the British people to suggest that if they’re exposed to racist views on television, they’ll all be swayed by them.”

    Many [new BNP supporters] are traditional Labour supporters who now feel abandoned by the political mainstream, anxious about their future and distrustful of any figure of authority…

    It is the failure to engage with them, and with their fears and concerns, that helped pave their way to the far right…

    Others fear that support for the BNP will continue to grow unless mainstream politicians accept that indigenous Britons are being unfairly treated. It’s a view that has led many politicians who are not racist nevertheless to echo the claims of the far-right…”

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/8275282.stm

  45. Markj — on 28th September, 2009 at 3:41 pm  

    Maybe someone from HT so people can see how similar HT and the BNP are.

  46. Shatterface — on 28th September, 2009 at 3:56 pm  

    ‘People who think that the BNP ought to be a legal political party, and that others ought to ‘engage in debate’ with it, are by definition pro-BNP. ‘

    You’re a bit fucking thick, aren’t you?

  47. 5cc — on 28th September, 2009 at 4:40 pm  

    Just having another look at the answers to questions linked to in the post at the top.

    The answer says that anyone who trusts government immigration stats is gullible, and the BNP will conduct a population audit. So we’re supposed to trust the party of Richard ‘three murders in Barking’ Barnbrook over the current ONS.

    That’ll work.

  48. dave bones — on 28th September, 2009 at 5:19 pm  

    Markj- Yup, HT or Choudharry or this lee character, but only if he is going to properly froth. Why have boring people on all the time?

  49. 5cc — on 29th September, 2009 at 2:57 pm  

    Jai/Rumbold:

    Did you ever get answers to any subsequent set of questions, or were there only the two sets? I can find the first set, and the ones linked to above but I can’t seem to find any others.

    Interesting to go through stuff with a clear head when things aren’t so immediate as they were months ago.

  50. Jai — on 29th September, 2009 at 3:20 pm  

    5cc,

    As far as I know, so far only those two sets of questions have been formally presented to the BNP by the intermediary.

    However, during the weekend I did present another opportunity for responses to two further sets of questions from the full list, as indicated here http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/6008#comment-179433 and here http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/6008#comment-179439 .

    As you can see, no answers were forthcoming.

    *******************************************************

    On a separate note, for future reference, is there a way to confidentially contact you offline via email or via your blog ?

  51. 5cc — on 29th September, 2009 at 3:42 pm  

    Jai,

    My email address is in the full profile at 5cc.

  52. Jai — on 29th September, 2009 at 3:59 pm  

    Thanks 5cc.

  53. Duncan Stott — on 29th September, 2009 at 9:49 pm  

    During the Q&A session at the Lib Dem Conference, Nick Clegg said Chris Huhne was putting himself up for Question Time against Griffin.

  54. Rumbold — on 29th September, 2009 at 9:51 pm  

    5cc:

    Sorry, just saw your comment for some reason. Those, as of today, are the responses that we have received.

    Duncan Stott:

    Thanks for that. I hope Huhne proves up to it.

  55. Richard — on 4th October, 2009 at 10:42 am  

    I’d like to have seen John Cruddas or Chuka Umunna on there for Labour, and someone erudite like Stephen Fry. Can’t wait to see the BNP look a bunch of fools.

  56. Nick Seacole Griffin — on 4th October, 2009 at 11:01 am  

    I think Labour ought to represented by the saucy lil’ Hazel Kitkat Blears, Jackie Jackboots, Jack Straw of Blackburnistan or maybe even Lord Mandelson of Corfu so we could all get a good chance to feast our eyes on his twenty-thousand-quid Patek Philippe watch.

    “Tho’ cowards flinch and traitors sneer …”

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