The BNP responds


by Rumbold
22nd June, 2009 at 3:23 pm    

Recently eGov sent the BNP a list of the ’85 Questions’. We have now received an answer to the first twenty questions, while the other questions remain unanswered, with no indication of when they will be. The response was written by Lee John Barnes, a member of the BNP’s legal affairs’ team and a well-known blogger. Below his unedited response, a number of us have printed our collective reaction to his answers:

1. Would Nick Griffin, Andrew Brons and all other members of the BNP be willing to submit to multiple independent DNA tests in order to confirm that none of them have any non-European ancestry within a particular timeframe (eg. the last 3000 years)?

Why? It is not BNP policy to utilise or demand DNA tests on members.

2. If Nick Griffin, Andrew Brons, or any other members of the BNP are found to have any non-European ancestry at all within the timeframe mentioned above, would the individuals concerned be willing to resign their membership of the BNP immediately and, upon the election of a future BNP government, submit to all the policies which would be implemented, including repatriation to a country which is the closest match for their non-European ancestry?

Another non-sequitur – as the BNP do not ask members to submit to DNA tests why should we require someone to leave the BNP on any such basis.

3.On what basis can the BNP, specifically Nick Griffin, credibly insist that it is not actually a white supremacist organisation, when non-white British citizens are barred from joining it despite the fact that no such restrictions apply to white/Caucasian people originating from outside Britain?

We live in a multi-cultural society predicated upon the principle that every community has the right to organise ethno-specific groups to represent and protect their community interests in our multi-cultural society.

All other racial, ethnic, national, religious groups within Britain have specific organisations to represent and promote their community interests from charities to legal lobby groups. The ONLY group in our multi-cultural society that has no ethno-specific community organisations to represent their interests as a racial group are the indigenous White British, English, Northern Irish, Welsh and Scottish. The Equality Bill presently before Parliament adds to the plethora of existing laws under the Race Relations Acts and will impose positive discrimination, affirmative action plans and quotas as regards non-white racial groups that will actively discriminate against indigenous Britons and White Europeans in Britain on the grounds of their sex and race. Therefore until the Race Relations Acts, all anti-free speech laws and the Equality Bill are repealed then the BNP will exist to fight for the interests of all indigenous White British citizens, and all assimilated White European peoples within Britain who self classify themselves as White British, who suffer direct and indirect racial discrimination based on their racial origins as a result of the racist Race Relations Acts and the Equality Bill.

4.Specifically which policies of the National Front in relation to non-white British citizens do Andrew Brons and the BNP as a whole renounce or support?

Ask him. The BNP have no interest in the National Front or its policies.

5.Specifically which policies and ideology of the historical German Nazi party does the BNP as a whole renounce or support, considering the confirmed admiration for Hitler and his organisation amongst several senior members of the BNP?

All of it. Calling the BNP ‘fascist’ or ‘Nazi’ makes about as much sense as calling the Labour Party ‘Communist’ or ‘Bolshevik’, it bears no basis to reality. When the media start to believe their own propaganda then the media are in the grip of a self constructed psychosis.

6. Specifically which aspects of Hitler’s book Mein Kampf does Nick Griffin agree with, considering that he is on record as stating that he has “learned a lot” from it?

Ask him.

7. How does the BNP reconcile historical and ongoing admiration of the Nazis and their policies with a) the fact that Britain went to war to destroy the Nazis, including subsequently supporting the prosecution and execution of various senior Nazis and other captured members of Nazi Germany for war crimes and crimes against humanity, and b) the fact that the BNP has been declaring the actions of Britain during WW2, including several major victories, as “examples of British greatness”?

1) The BNP does not admire the Nazis

2) Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?

3) Our fathers and grandfathers fought for freedom from fascism, today we fight for freedom from Liberal Fascism, Political Correctness, Globalism, Islamism and the Corporate Media that undermine our democracy. The struggle is the same, only the enemies are different.

8. How does the BNP reconcile the above with a) Nick Griffin praising the Waffen SS and simultaneously attacking the RAF for its bombing of Nazi Germany during his time as editor of The Rune between 1995 and 1997, b) the fact that, during a demonstration at Coventry Cathedral in 1998, Nick Griffin accused British airmen involved in the wartime effort of having engaged in “mass murder”, and c) the fact that Nick Griffin has been on record as claiming that the Holocaust is a “hoax” perpetrated by the victorious Allied powers, making the following statement in 1998: “I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the Earth was flat…..I have reached the conclusion that the “extermination” tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria”?

Ask him.

9.Will the BNP’s proposed policies in relation to non-white British citizens also be applicable to Jewish British citizens? If the answer is “Yes”, then all further queries in relation to non-white British citizens should be interpreted to also include Jewish British citizens.

It may have escaped your notice that most Jewish people in the UK are white. Those Jews who are not white mainly live either in Ethiopia or Israel. Note that the Israeli government have been accused of racism for stopping any more Black Jews entering Israel – http://www.africaresource.com/rasta/sesostris-the-great-the-egyptian-hercules/ethiopian-black-jews-denounce-racist-israeli-minister/

10.Nick Griffin has claimed that the BNP’s policies and ideology are in line with the teachings of Christianity. Is the BNP therefore claiming that, as the Head of the Church of England, Queen Elizabeth II agrees with the BNP’s interpretation of Christianity? If not, is the BNP claiming that the Queen’s own interpretation of Christianity is wrong?

1) The BNP is a secular party that defends British culture which includes Christianity.

2) We have no idea of the Queen’s interpretation of Christianity and nor would we assert we do.

3) What the Queen believes is her own private opinion and we would suggest that you mind your own business and leave the Queen alone and not use her as a political football in your infantile attacks upon the BNP.

11.After the election of a BNP government, what would be the official policy in relation to Gurkhas who have served in the British armed forces and/or are serving at that particular time, ie. Will the recently-awarded right to British citizenship be revoked; will Gurkhas already possessing British citizenship due to military service be “encouraged” to engage in “voluntary repatriation”; will Gurkhas possessing British citizenship be afforded identical legal rights and protections as white/Caucasian British citizens?

1) Gurkhas who served in the British armed forces will be given by a BNP government a much larger inflation linked army pension within their own country based on the exact same amount of money as those pensions that all ex-British Army veterans get in the UK, which we will also link to rises in inflation, and they will also have the right to enter the UK and utilise British NHS services etc at any time. Those who wished to settle in the UK on medical grounds would be allowed to settle in the UK with members of their extended families and receive NHS treatment and government relocation assistence.

12.Under a BNP government, would other non-white members of the British armed forces currently possessing British citizenship be afforded identical legal rights and protections as white/Caucasian British citizens?

Yes.

13.During its various references to Britain’s historical participation in the two World Wars of the 20th century, why does the BNP never mention the fact that millions of non-white soldiers from the former British Empire fought alongside white/Caucasian soldiers on the side of the Allied powers in both World Wars, including 2.5 million soldiers from the Indian subcontinent during WW2 (comprising the largest volunteer army in recorded history), and including numerous non-white soldiers who were awarded medals for their military service and performance by the British authorities of the time?

Yes they did, as did many of their own peoples who also fought alongside the Nazis from members of Indian Legion in the Waffen SS to Muslim dividions in the Waffen SS. All Empires in history have utilised people within the boundaries of their Empire to fight for them. That does not mean we in Britain should open our borders today to every one who fought for the British Army in World War Two or their descendants. They were handed back their countries after the fall of Empire as the prize of their sacrifice in WW2 and therefore we, and our children, do not owe them anything today. Britain no longer has an Empire, therefore we no longer owe them any debt or have any responsibility for them in any way.

Their reward was to be given back their own countries after the war.

14.To what extent does the BNP renounce or support the policies and ideologies of modern-day Neo-Nazi organisations across Europe, especially considering Nick Griffin’s ongoing efforts to build a pan-European alliance with organisations similar to the BNP based on the European mainland?

We are Nationalists. Nazis are pan-nationalist Aryanists. They are not nationalists. Therefore the BNP has no contacts with Neo-Nazi organisations. Unfortunately the media suffering in the grip of its own psychosis, is not intelligent enough, rational enough or impartial enough to actually educate themselves about the facts nor tell the truth about what the BNP actually stands for.

15. To what extent does the BNP renounce or support the policies and ideology of the Ku Klux Klan in the United States, considering Nick Griffin’s confirmed links with the organisation?

We are 100 % against such groups. Nick Griffin has never had any links with the KKK. This is just another media lie. I once stood in a lift with Keith Richards, does this mean I am member of The Rolling Stones ? Tony Blair has met and shook hands with Gerry Adams and Nelson Mandela, does that mean he was in the IRA and the ANC ?

16.What percentage of BNP members, especially those at the senior levels of the organisation, are currently or have historically been active in participating on the white supremacist Stormfront internet forum and agree with the primary ethos of the website and its founder?

Who knows and who cares. We believe in free speech. We may not like what some of our own people believe or say but as long as we live in a democracy and they stay within the law that is their own business. We do not police peoples minds. Only Liberal Fascists feel that they must have laws and powers to invstigate what people think and say. The real fascists in this country are those who in the name of anti-fascism and ‘ The War Against Terrorism’ have created the most pernicious fascist regime in this countries entire history – from the CCTV surveillance society where we have the most amount of cameras in the world in Britain, trackers bugs in wheelie bins, all E Mails being collected, all phone calls being tapped, secret police databases being built up on peoples opinions, ID cards, DNA swabs, samples and records stored in secret databases, secret evidence allowed in court cases, internment without trial and extraordinary rendition flights from UK airports. Whilst the real fascists are in power, their lackeys use the media to peddle myths to the public about the ‘fascist BNP’. How dumb must people be not to see the New Labour Police State all around them.

17.As public figures seeking high political office, would the BNP be willing to release the names of senior party members who are currently or have historically been active in participating on the Stormfront internet forum?

We do not collect that information and frankly no-one cares, apart or course, from those liberal, leftist and media idiots that see fascists everwhere, except in the reflection of their own mirrors or in the New Labour government that has created the Police State we are forced to live in today.

The real fascists in this country are the ones in Parliament and the Media. They conspire to steal our rights and liberties and then to divert peoples attentions away from the truth by pointing at the BNP and calling us ‘fascists’. The real fascists run our country, the police, ACPO, the Trades Unions, the Corporate Media and the nationalised banks.

18.How will a BNP government ensure the safety of Britain’s female population, considering that a senior member of the BNP has been on record as stating that he believes “women enjoy being raped”?

What this BNP member said was idiotic. That was one members stupid opinion. He is not alone though in saying idiotic things. This entire questionaire is full of idiotic questions and statements and the entire country run is by corrupt idiots who believe in nonsense and talk lies and speak rubbish.

Seeing as women in London who are raped or sexually assaulted are most likely to be victims of foreign criminals allowed into our country, then once we have deported most of them then all women of all races in our country will be far safer.

Race is clearly a factor both in victims and perpetrators of rapes in London.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1451606/Muggers-blamed-for-increase-in-gang-rapes.html

Scotland Yard is treating the evidence with care because it has sensitive racial overtones. It suggests a disproportionately high involvement of young black or Asian males in group sex attacks and that a high proportion of the victims are white females.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/3397433.stm

Women and girls of white or European appearance accounted for 59% of victims with 28% of victims described as African or Caribbean.

Suspects of African or Caribbean backgrounds were identified in 49% of attacks or allegation of assaults and 13% were committed by men of Indian or Pakistani appearance.

We also have exposed the issue of Muslim gang rape of young white children and will impose Capital Punishment upon any individuals involved in grooming childen for sex and prostitution.

http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/93550

FOREIGNERS carried out one in six rapes in Britain last year, police figures have revealed.

And migrant workers, illegal immigrants and even tourists were responsible for up to a third of all sex attacks in some areas.

In Greater London, the worst area affected, foreigners were charged in connection with one in three rapes, statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information Act show. Other areas with large immigration populations – Cambridgeshire, Merseyside, Hertfordshire, Avon and Somerset – also recorded high numbers of non-UK citizens charged with sex attacks.

Police blame the influx of eastern Europeans into Britain following EU enlargement in 2004 for compounding the problem and have called for tougher border controls.

19. How will a BNP government ensure the safety, protection and welfare of Britain’s current and future disabled population, considering that a senior member of the BNP has been on record as stating that he supports forced euthanasia of the handicapped and others deemed to be “a waste of time, money and resources”, including the very old and (especially) newborn babies, in response to the death of David Cameron’s baby in spring 2009?

Once again a single member said something stupid. What he said has nothing to do with BNP policy. The BNP have not passed the Abortion Laws that since 1967 have killed 6 million babies in Britain. Nor are the BNP the government that allows abortion for babies over 24 weeks if they are disabled. Many of the disabled in this country are lucky to have ever been born seeing as they can aborted at any time under the present abortion laws. They are lucky to be alive today due to Labour, Liberal and Tory policies which made a disability as grounds for a late abortion. The BNP respect all our people. Many of our top activists are also either disabled or have family members who suffer from disabilities.

Below is a story about comments made by individual Tory councillors talking rubbish, so does this mean the Tories are anti-disabled and will sterilise the White working class?

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2008/03/27/tory-councillor-suggests-killing-off-disabled-kids-to-save-cash-115875-20364018/

A sick Tory has suggested saving cash by killing off disabled children in care.

Senior councillor Hugh Jackson made the vile remark just days after David Cameron visited his area and claimed the party had changed.

Tory John Ward, who sits on Medway council, Kent, quit on Tuesday after calling for jobless mums, like Karen Matthews, to be sterilised.

20. What contingency measures does the BNP plan in order to effectively deal with the likely massive increase in accident- and illness-related casualties and deaths amongst the British population due to the rapid collapse of the NHS upon the pre-emptive emigration and/or expulsion/repatriation of non-white British citizens currently working as medical professionals in the NHS, considering that 16% of nurses are non-white, as are 40% of new dentists and 58% of new doctors ? (Figures: June 2009)

More nonsense conjecture based on media rubbish. The BNP will begin a phased plan of re-nationalising the International Health Service that used to be the National Health Service. We will no longer steal medical staff from the Developing World and rob the poorest people on the planet of their precious doctors and nurses. We will ensure that the NHS is able to run and function with British medical graduates as opposed to asset stripping the Developing World of their medical staff and leaving hundreds of millions of poor, mainly Black people without any health care. The theft of nurses from Africa is a crime against humanity. In the midst of the AID’s epidemic, famines and social collapse the NHS has plundered the continent for its most essential and valuable people. This has to stop. There is no moral argument for using African doctors and nurses in the NHS, only what should be shame. As the NHS is re-nationalised then contracts for foreign staff will be phased out.

Pickled Politics’/eGov’s reaction:

The refusal to submit to DNA tests to prove their whiteness is very striking, as it undermines the BNP’s modus operandi, which rests on a racial ideal of ‘Britishness’, rather than a cultural one.

The ‘ask him’ response is also telling, as it would surely only take a simple denial to disprove these assertions. Given that the ’85 Questions’ have made it onto television, and have been sent to the BNP, it is unlikely that Nick Griffin is unaware of them. While the lack of a denial doesn’t prove anything, it fails to quash such assertions.

A number of the questions are brushed aside, such as on the NHS, with the unproven statement that the BNP will simply find enough whites to do the job. They may well do, but given that such roles require years of training, it is unclear what will happen in the interim. Such a vacuum will hit children, old people and the disabled the hardest, since they tend to be, on average, the most vulnerable in society.

A small number of non-whites will be allowed to settle in Britain (answer to question 11). I wonder how that will go down with the wider membership, particularly as they like to downplay or even ignore that vast contribution made by millions of non-whites to the Imperial armed forces during the world wars.

The BNP has condemned those who condone rape and abuse against disabled children, yet rather than talk about action against said persons, they instead used the opportunity to launch another tirade against foreigners.


              Post to del.icio.us


Filed in: The BNP






143 Comments below   |  

Reactions: Twitter, blogs
  1. pickles

    New blog post: The BNP responds http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4889


  2. Charlotte Cooper

    RT @pickledpolitics: New blog post: The BNP responds http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4889


  3. Fabienne

    RT @pickledpolitics: New blog post: The BNP responds http://bit.ly/Qisnr


  4. Alex J. Thomas

    RT @pickledpolitics The BNP responds | Pickled Politics http://tinyurl.com/nnos3l (via @tweetmeme)


  5. Alex T Pitofdarkness

    #BNP pretends to answer questions, instead provides 50% non-answers and 50% stereotypical polemic http://tr.im/pkSY #thebnparetwats


  6. Nikesh Shukla

    RT @pickledpolitics New blog post: The BNP responds http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4889


  7. Ryan Bestford

    The BNP respond to 20 of the 85 questions asked by Pickled Politics – http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4889 (via @pickledpolitics)


  8. Laura M

    RT @pickledpolitics The BNP responds | Pickled Politics http://tinyurl.com/nnos3l (via @tweetmeme) Fucknuts!


  9. Laura M

    Re http://tinyurl.com/nnos3l the #bnp answer to no 18 is most infuriating. Stop pretending to care about (white) women, you fucks!


  10. tankgreenslinks

    the BNP answer some questions – http://is.gd/19nsW – *jaw drop* @ the stupendous ignorance of answer #13 & the gall of #20.


  11. links for 2009-06-22 « Embololalia

    [...] The BNP responds | Pickled Politics incl claim that "Seeing as women in London who are raped or sexually assaulted are most likely to be victims of foreign criminals allowed into our country, then once we have deported most of them then all women of all races in our country will be far safer. " (tags: sexualviolence racism bnp uk politics) [...]


  12. Zach J Richards

    The BNP responds | Pickled Politics http://bit.ly/qFABx


  13. BNP Wives - Page 2 - YD Scuba Diving Forums

    [...] for them in any way. Their reward was to be given back their own countries after the war. Source In other words: Yeah, thanks for helping us out, despite the fact that we did kind of pillage your [...]


  14. Listings for Derbyshires in Merseyside

    [...] Pickled Politics " The BNP responds [...]


  15. CCTV Services, An Asset That Business Can Not Do Without - The Blog Planet

    [...] Pickled Politics » The BNP responds [...]




  1. Denim Justice — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:26 pm  

    “Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?”

    Actually many Asian and African citizens of the Empire gave their lives fighting the Nazis. What a stupid wanker.

  2. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:31 pm  

    Denim juctice
    “Actually many Asian and African citizens of the Empire gave their lives fighting the Nazis. What a stupid wanker.”

    And many Muslims including in my own family.
    Its worth remebering that the Muslim League supported the UK in World War II while the predominantly Hindu congress party was neutral.

    Let alone the Muslim soldiers who fought for French freedom .
    But the BNP/Zionist narrative which Barnes continues is that Muslims were all Nazi collaboraters

  3. hantsboy — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:38 pm  

    Hmm. It is true that the British Empire had access to large manpower reserves among the peoples subject to it.
    But they weren’t conscripted like the British of these Islands and would have joined as volunteers.
    I doubt whether many joined to fight on an ideological basis any more than those whom they fought.
    There is a lot of hot air about all this.
    Most people had little choice about it.
    Many who joined from the Empire did so out of poverty or lack of any opportunities elsewhere in their lives. Not a lot has changed in this regard.

  4. Denim Justice — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:41 pm  

    “I doubt whether many joined to fight on an ideological basis any more than those whom they fought.”

    So the Nazi soldiers were all cuddly victims who shovelled people into ovens despite not fighting on an ideological basis?

    So on the one hand you had British white people FORCED to fight the Nazis – and you had Asian and African subjects of the Empire who CHOSE to fight the Nazis. And it’s the latter who are the ones who did not fight on an ideological basis?

  5. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:46 pm  

    hantsboy
    “I doubt whether many joined to fight on an ideological basis any more than those whom they fought.”

    Thats true for all soldiers including the majority of British soldiers- WWII wasnt overwhelmingly popular in the UK whatever the later gloss but soldiers were required to fight.Look at the guy who shot up the holocaust museum in the US recently- a WWII vet!

    Recall how popular Chamberlains “peace in our time” was

    “But they weren’t conscripted like the British of these Islands and would have joined as volunteers.”

    Bizarre that you posit volunteers as being less driven than conscripts!

  6. hantsboy — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:47 pm  

    So the Nazi soldiers were all cuddly victims who shovelled people into ovens despite not fighting on an ideological basis?

    Germans had to go and fight for Hitler whether they supported his aims or not.
    I even know a German speaking Frenchman from Alsace who was carted off to the eastern front.
    Hated every minute of it. And deserted when he could.

    But it is true that those from India and Africa volunteered their services for whatever reason. I very much doubt whether ideology was one of them whatever they teach kids nowadays.

  7. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:54 pm  

    “But it is true that those from India and Africa volunteered their services for whatever reason. I very much doubt whether ideology was one of them whatever they teach kids nowadays.”

    Likewise British soldiers. Britain didnt go to war to stop the holocaust no matter how much Blair tries to spin it that way

  8. Rumbold — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:55 pm  

    I wrote this a while back (not sure what the bit right at the bottom is though). The figures are still useful:

    http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1506

    42 VCs won in the two world wars. Two and a half millions volunteers in the Indian Army at its height.

    Yes, Bose’s Indian National Army was on the side of the Nazis. But the BNP’s ideological ancestors were fascists, so no prizes for guessing their leanings.

  9. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:56 pm  

    hantsboy
    “But it is true that those from India and Africa volunteered their services for whatever reason. I very much doubt whether ideology was one of them whatever they teach kids nowadays.””

    Interestingly you seemed to be describing the gurkhas- so presumably you think they should be sent home?

  10. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 3:58 pm  

    This is about Indian muslims soldiers role in WWII
    (for some reason they are called Pakistani 2 years before that nation even existed)

    http://masud.co.uk/ISLAM/bmh/BMH-Britains-Pakistani-communities-and-their-contribution.htm

  11. Vikrant — on 22nd June, 2009 at 4:29 pm  

    As I said, mercenaries. They would have fought for the Germans, if they’d had an empire

    And without those “mercenaries” Britannia would have crumbled in the war.

  12. Roger — on 22nd June, 2009 at 4:41 pm  

    Epitaph on an Army of Mercenaries

    These, in the day when heaven was falling,
    The hour when earth’s foundations fled,
    Followed their mercenary calling,
    And took their wages, and are dead.

    Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
    They stood, and earth’s foundations stay;
    What God abandoned, these defended,
    And saved the sum of things for pay.

    A.E. Housman

  13. Sally — on 22nd June, 2009 at 4:47 pm  

    I wouldn’t have even bothered answering you. They’re stupid questions designed to make the BNP look stupid! You failed!

    Fact is, there are many organisations with limited membership for certain racial groups and the BNP is one of them!

    Live with it!

  14. Vikrant — on 22nd June, 2009 at 4:53 pm  

    Fact is, there are many organisations with limited membership for certain racial groups and the BNP is one of them!

    And how many of them are parties aspiring for political office? When BNP MEPs go to Brussels they are supposed to represent all their constituents, not just whites y’know…

  15. persephone — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:02 pm  

    “ask him”

    1. PP has asked him by because by contacting the BNP or Lee Barnes directly, Nick Griffin as the BNP leader is ultimately responsible for any response.

    Nick Griffin is also responsible for the ‘silly’ comments by what Lee Barnes state as single members (of whom there are several in this alone) Again and ultimately, Griffin was in charge when they were appointed and continue to be appointed by the BNP. If these individuals have publicly said inappropriate things what has he done to review their involvement in the BNP? Their continued involvement, unchecked, shows that he & the BNP are accepting of the comments.

    2. Alternatively, are the BNP saying that their lawyer is responding w/t recourse to the BNP Leader. If so, all his responses are therefore invalid which also puts him, as a lawyer, in conflict with the client that he is advising. So what is his client paying him to do exactly if its not to represent their interests?

  16. persephone — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:03 pm  

    ” Seeing as women in London who are raped or sexually assaulted are most likely to be victims of foreign criminals allowed into our country, then once we have deported most of them then all women of all races in our country will be far safer.”

    This and the numerous other related comments are incendiary – it fuels race hate & race crime. I wonder what the Solicitors Regulation Authority would make of this.

  17. Clairwil — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:04 pm  

    Aw! It’s a pity they didn’t go for the DNA testing. According to this report Nick Griffin has quite interesting ancestry.

    http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/108958/Derek-family-secrets-of-BNP-leader-Nick-Griffin

  18. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:08 pm  

    It was the people of the world, against the Nazis and the Japanese. Someone lost someone somewhere or, knew someone, who had lost someone. In one way or another, we all knew somebody who’d suffered during WW2.

    But, Hitler is dead. The SS officers are dead. The war is over. So why are you people still obsessing over the Nazis? Let me tell you this. The vast majority of BNP members had ancestors who gave their lives or sustained crippling injuries defending Britain against the Nazis.

    I lost two great uncles who fought the Nazis. And yes, I am a BNP member through and through. Now get this through your 5″ thick craniums. When you call me, or another BNP member a “Nazi” you couldn’t insult me, or my kind (the English, Welsh, Scots & Irish) anymore if you damn well tried.

    We, defended Britain as you and your ancestors did for either their countries sake, or to aid Britain.

    How dare you call us Nazi. You bound this soul-staining insult around like it’s was an ordinary everyday word.

    How dare you call us Nazi!!!!

  19. persephone — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:12 pm  

    ^^ with any mental condition, the first place to start recovery is to stop denial

  20. Boyo — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:16 pm  

    “We will no longer steal medical staff from the Developing World and rob the poorest people on the planet of their precious doctors and nurses. We will ensure that the NHS is able to run and function with British medical graduates as opposed to asset stripping the Developing World of their medical staff and leaving hundreds of millions of poor, mainly Black people without any health care. The theft of nurses from Africa is a crime against humanity.”

    Clever, if weasel, words.

  21. Don — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:29 pm  

    Recruitment of medical staff from the Developing World (do we still say that? I lose track) is an issue that needs to be addressed, but it is not as simple as that.

    Colin, you are right on one point – it is very likely that almost everybody posting here had family members who fought the Nazis. I’ll even concede that technically the BNP as constituted is not a Nazi party. But we know how and from where it evolved – for a bite-sized illustration of that, Mr Brons’ political trajectory should be adequate.

    To steal from Churchill, the BNP could not be called nazis without some risk of a slight terminological inexactitude.

  22. Oliver — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:32 pm  

    Well, at least the BNP knows what ‘non-sequitur’ means! sorry, couldn’t read past the answer to question 2… i’m not quite sure the point of engaging with these people, you can’t deal rationally with irrational people.

  23. Ravi Naik — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:39 pm  

    How dare you call us Nazi. You bound this soul-staining insult around like it’s was an ordinary everyday word.
    How dare you call us Nazi!!!!

    No, the term neo-nazi is a precise term, and is well applied to the BNP. Mark Collet, David Duke, Don Black, Stormfront are pretty much a part of the BNP.

  24. Sgt Twining — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:44 pm  

    Well, I think from the very educated responses, we cannot ignore these individuals.

  25. Ravi Naik — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:50 pm  

    More context on the new BNP.

  26. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 5:56 pm  

    @ Don.

    Britain has a multicultural society whether you, or I enthuse over it or not. This is now the face of Britain. I accept it. It sounds like you do to.

    However, unless we find the maturity to stop trading insults and blows with one another we will never co-exist let alone see eye-to-eye on basic issues.

    I’m as much a Nazi as you are Don. I estimate that 99% of ordinary, everyday BNP members are the same as me. Things change Don. The NF like the Nazis have died out.

    BNP MEP Andrew Brons got caught up in the NF when he was a young impressionable man. He’s explained his mistakes publicly about his involvement with the NF in over 20 times since elected.

    Brons is right to point out that the vast majority of Labour politicians were commies and Marxists in their formative years. Now, if we are getting into point scoring, we should remember that Stalin killed 3x the number of souls that Hitler did.

    Unless people resign these facts to there rightful place which is history there will be no change, no trust, no peace.

    Whats it going to be Don?

  27. Don — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:05 pm  

    Since the BNP wants my family out of the country – no trust, no peace between us.

  28. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:16 pm  

    Fascinating. Let’s address a few of these.

    2) Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?

    Given the fact that a disproportionate number of the British South Asian population consists of Indian Sikhs/Punjabis and people whose ancestry lies in what is now modern-day Pakistan, both groups which were very heavily involved in the Allied war effort, I believe the answer in many, many cases would be “Yes”.

    Secondly, Winston Churchill’s own family have angrily denounced Nick Griffin and the BNP for attempting to hijack Churchill’s wartime legacy:

    Links: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1187368/Family-Winston-Churchill-slams-BNP-far-right-partys-attempt-hijack-wartime-leaders-legacy.html, http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23698929-details/Churchill's+family+denounces+BNP+election+broadcast/article.do, and http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/may/26/churchill-grandson-denounce-bnp-election-broadcast .

  29. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:17 pm  

    Yes they did, as did many of their own peoples who also fought alongside the Nazis from members of Indian Legion in the Waffen SS to Muslim dividions in the Waffen SS.

    That’s an interesting way to represent those historical events. Let’s examine the actual figures:

    Number of Indian soldiers who sided with the Axis powers: 40,000. (Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_National_Army ).

    Number of Indian soldiers who fought on the side of the Allies: 2.5 million. (Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India_in_World_War_II ).

    Therefore, out of the 2.54 million Indian soldiers involved in WW2, 98.4% fought on the side of the Allies.

  30. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:19 pm  

    Let’s take it further:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India_in_World_War_II

    Summary: Several Indian princely states, within the British Raj, provided large donations to the Allies to combat the threat of Nazism and Fascism. Indian troops fought the Axis Powers in South East Asia, North Africa and southern Europe.

    Indian soldiers were particularly involved in the following:

    Mediterranean, Middle East and African theatres of World War II:
    East African campaign
    North African campaign: Operation Compass, Operation Battleaxe, Operation Crusader, First Battle of El Alamein, Second Battle of El Alamein.
    Anglo-Iraqi War
    Syria-Lebanon campaign
    Anglo-Soviet invasion of Iran
    Italian campaign: Battle of Monte Cassino
    Battle of Hong Kong
    Battle of Malaya
    Battle of Singapore
    Burma Campaign: Battle of Kohima, Battle of Imphal

    Details:

    Indian Army involvement

    At the outbreak of World War II, the Indian army numbered 205,000 men. Later during World War II the Indian Army became the largest all-volunteer force in history, rising to over 2.5 million men in size.[1] These forces included tank, artillery and airborne forces. Indian soldiers earned 30 Victoria Crosses during the Second World War.

    The Middle East and African theatre

    The British government meanwhile sent Indian troops to fight in West Asia and northern Africa against the Axis. India also geared up to produce essential goods such as food and uniforms. Ores were mined to support the war[citation needed]. Pre-Independence India provided the largest volunteer force (2.5 million) of any nation during World War II.

    The 4th, 5th and 8th Indian Divisions took part in the North African theatre against Rommel’s Afrika Korps. Furthermore, the 4th and 5th Indian Divisions took part in the East African campaign against the Italians in Somaliland, Eritrea and Abyssinia.

    In the Battle of Bir Hacheim, Indian gunners played an important role by using guns in the anti tank role and destroying tanks of Rommel’s panzer divisions. Maj PPK Kumaramangalam was the battery commander of 41 Field Regiment which was deployed in the anti tank role. He was awarded the DSO for his act of bravery. Later he became the Chief of Army Staff of independent India in 1967.

    The invasion of Italy

    Indian forces played a significant part in liberating Italy from fascism. The British Army of India contributed the 3rd largest Allied contingent in the Italian campaign after the US and British forces. The 4th, 8th and 10th Infantry Divisions and 43rd Gurkha mechanised Infantry Brigade were involved, notably the former two at the famous Battle of Monte Cassino and all of them in the torrid fighting on the Gothic Line in late 1944 and 1945.

    War in Burma

    The Indian army was the key allied fighting force in the Burma Campaign. The Indian Air Force’s first assault mission was carried out against Japanese troops stationed in Burma. The British Indian Army was key to breaking the siege of Imphal when the westward advance of Imperial Japan came to a halt.

    The formations included the Indian III Corps, Indian IV Corps, the Indian XXXIII Corps and the Fourteenth Army.

    As part of the new concept of Long Range Penetration Patrols (LRPP), Indian troops were trained in the present state of Madhya Pradesh Under their commander then Brigadier (later Major General) Orde Charles Wingate. These troops were named “Chindits”. These troops were then used in the Burma Campaign with a high rate of success[citation needed] in March 1943, thereby aiding the overall Allied effort in the Burma theatre.

  31. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:21 pm  

    1) The BNP does not admire the Nazis

    Factually incorrect, as per the question regarding Nick Griffin’s own sympathies towards the Nazis, to which an answer was not provided beyond “Ask him”.

    The original question was as follows:

    “8. How does the BNP reconcile the above with a) Nick Griffin praising the Waffen SS and simultaneously attacking the RAF for its bombing of Nazi Germany during his time as editor of The Rune between 1995 and 1997, b) the fact that, during a demonstration at Coventry Cathedral in 1998, Nick Griffin accused British airmen involved in the wartime effort of having engaged in “mass murder”, and c) the fact that Nick Griffin has been on record as claiming that the Holocaust is a “hoax” perpetrated by the victorious Allied powers, making the following statement in 1998: “I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the Earth was flat…..I have reached the conclusion that the “extermination” tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria”?”

  32. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:23 pm  

    6. Specifically which aspects of Hitler’s book Mein Kampf does Nick Griffin agree with, considering that he is on record as stating that he has “learned a lot” from it?
    Ask him.

    Nick Griffin did actually provide an official explanation (of course, this may not necessarily be a comprehensive answer) some time ago.

    Link: http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/the-real-bnp/the-BNP-in-their-own-words.php

    Quote: “The chapter I most enjoyed was the one on propaganda and organisation there are some really useful ideas there.”

    ******************************************************************

    The section on ‘propaganda’ (Chapter 10 of Mein Kampf), incidentally, is particularly notable for Hitler’s thoughts on the benefits of what can be termed the ‘Big Lie’ propaganda technique.

    Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Lie

    Quote: “The Big Lie (German: Große Lüge) is a propaganda technique. It was defined by Adolf Hitler in his 1925 autobiography Mein Kampf as a lie so “colossal” that no one would believe that someone “could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously”.

    The source of Big Lie technique, from Chapter 10 of Mein Kampf:

    But it remained for the Jews, with their unqualified capacity for falsehood, and their fighting comrades, the Marxists, to impute responsibility for the downfall precisely to the man who alone had shown a superhuman will and energy in his effort to prevent the catastrophe which he had foreseen and to save the nation from that hour of complete overthrow and shame. By placing responsibility for the loss of the world war on the shoulders of Ludendorff they took away the weapon of moral right from the only adversary dangerous enough to be likely to succeed in bringing the betrayers of the Fatherland to Justice.
    All this was inspired by the principle–which is quite true in itself–that in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie, since they themselves often tell small lies in little matters but would be ashamed to resort to large-scale falsehoods. It would never come into their heads to fabricate colossal untruths, and they would not believe that others could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously. Even though the facts which prove this to be so may be brought clearly to their minds, they will still doubt and waver and will continue to think that there may be some other explanation. For the grossly impudent lie always leaves traces behind it, even after it has been nailed down, a fact which is known to all expert liars in this world and to all who conspire together in the art of lying.

    —Adolf Hitler , Mein Kampf, vol. I, ch. X[1]”

    ***************************************

    One of Sunny’s recent articles on PP also touched upon Griffin’s opinions in this area. The part concerning what he plans to do once he achieves power and gains control of the British media is particularly interesting.

    Link: http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4800

    Quote: About ten years ago Nick Griffin gave a prominent speech in the United States at a American Friends of the British National Party event. In fact you can watch the speech online, and he says in his speech:

    “There’s a difference between selling out your ideas and selling your ideas. And the BNP isn’t about selling out its ideas, but we are determined to sell them. Basically that means to use saleable words such as freedom, security, identity, democracy. Nobody can criticise them. Nobosy can come at you and attack you on those ideas – they are saleable. Perhaps one day, by being rather more subtle, once we’re in a position where we control the British broadcasting media, then perhaps one day the British people might change their mind and say ‘yes, every last one must go’. Perhaps they will one day. But if you hold that out as your sole aim to start with, you’re not going to get anywhere. So instead of talking about racial purity, we talk about identity.”

  33. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:24 pm  

    That does not mean we in Britain should open our borders today to every one who fought for the British Army in World War Two or their descendants. They were handed back their countries after the fall of Empire as the prize of their sacrifice in WW2….. Their reward was to be given back their own countries after the war.

    Factually and historically false. With regards to the Indian subcontinent, there were indeed originally negotiations along the lines of Independence being granted in return for the participation of Indian soldiers in WW2. However, in reality, the subcontinent achieved independence via combination of the various Indian independence movements and (particularly) the fact that the Allied war effort had placed such a massive strain on Britain that eventually it simply no longer had the resources to be able to maintain an overseas imperial colony such as the subcontinent.

  34. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:25 pm  

    2) We have no idea of the Queen’s interpretation of Christianity and nor would we assert we do.

    3) What the Queen believes is her own private opinion and we would suggest that you mind your own business and leave the Queen alone and not use her as a political football in your infantile attacks upon the BNP.

    Avoidance. Given the fact that the Queen is Head of the Church of England and holds the title of Defender of the Faith, her opinion of the BNP’s claims to be acting in the name of Christianity is very relevant indeed.

  35. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:28 pm  

    More nonsense conjecture based on media rubbish. The BNP will begin a phased plan of re-nationalising the International Health Service that used to be the National Health Service. We will no longer steal medical staff from the Developing World and rob the poorest people on the planet of their precious doctors and nurses. We will ensure that the NHS is able to run and function with British medical graduates as opposed to asset stripping the Developing World of their medical staff and leaving hundreds of millions of poor, mainly Black people without any health care. The theft of nurses from Africa is a crime against humanity. In the midst of the AID’s epidemic, famines and social collapse the NHS has plundered the continent for its most essential and valuable people. This has to stop. There is no moral argument for using African doctors and nurses in the NHS, only what should be shame. As the NHS is re-nationalised then contracts for foreign staff will be phased out.

    – Ignores/avoids the fact that huge numbers of non-white medics will pre-emptively leave (I expect the United States will be the first destination choice and will welcome them with open arms) if the BNP seems to be heading for an election victory, and others will leave asap afterwards.

    – Fixated on depicting non-white medics as “foreigners” (see references to “foreign contracts” etc), thereby avoiding/ignoring the huge influx of non-white doctors (especially from the Indian subcontinent) during the 60s and early 70s due to the shortage of doctors in the UK at the time, and the British government therefore actively recruiting medics from the Commonwealth countries. It goes without saying that the vast majority (quite possibly all) of the Asian doctors who arrived in those times are now full-fledged British citizens, and have been for approx. 40 years, if not more. More details here: “How Asian doctors saved the NHS” — http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3239540.stm ).

    – Ignores all the non-white (especially Asian) doctors in the UK who were subsequently born in this country, have always been full-fledged British citizens, and attended medical school in the UK during the past ~40 years.

    – Ignores the fact that approx. 30% of medical students in the UK are non-white, the majority of whom are not only South Asian but are also full-fledged British citizens and therefore fall under the definition of “British medical graduates”.

  36. Sonamarg — on 22nd June, 2009 at 6:31 pm  

    ”Seeing as women in London who are raped or sexually assaulted are most likely to be victims of foreign criminals allowed into our country, then once we have deported most of them then all women of all races in our country will be far safer.”

    Actually, 97% of women who are victims of rape and sexual assault are attacked by a man they already know, usually their husband, boyfriend, father or other family member. Bearing in mind that 1 in 4 women in Britain is a victim of sexual/domestic violence during her lifetime, most straight white women in relationships are partnered with white men, and only about 8% of the British population is non-white, most men in Britain who rape and beat women of all colours must be white.

    Deporting “foreign criminals” won’t help the vast majority of white rape victims who are raped by white men. But I guess the cliched old fantasy of Rudolph Valentino’s The Sheik is a pretty easy one to sell to a bunch of paranoid, fascist morons like BNP voters.

  37. MaidMarian — on 22nd June, 2009 at 7:01 pm  

    ‘The real fascists run our country, the police, ACPO, the Trades Unions, the Corporate Media and the nationalised banks.’

    So essentially anyone who disagrees?

    This shows up the real issue with the BNP, they are a group of people totally devoid of any plan beyond blaming the other. Sure, that may be politics but it is not government. Am I to assume that a BNP government would have let now nationalised banks go to the wall? Tell that to the public.

  38. Clairwil — on 22nd June, 2009 at 7:01 pm  

    Peter Mandleson was a member of the Young Communist league from 1971-1976 before rejoining the Labour Party aged 23.

    Andrew Bron’s ‘youthful dalliance’ with nazism began in 1964 and ended in 1986 with his resignation from the National Front aged 39 making him the worlds oldest misguided young man’.

  39. Vikrant — on 22nd June, 2009 at 7:06 pm  

    2) Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?

    Yep… a granduncle who fought with the Mahratta Light Infantry lays buried in Monte Cassino.

  40. Refresh — on 22nd June, 2009 at 7:20 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    ’2) Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?’

    And they must be turning in their graves!

  41. Shamit — on 22nd June, 2009 at 7:47 pm  

    Mr. Barnes wrote an eloquent follow up email to eGov monitor as we were late in responding to him. It was not by choice but because his email went to the spam folder (we get bombarded with press releases from Chairman Griffin).

    You could take a look at the email exchanges here:
    http://www.egovmonitor.com/files/BNPresponsemail.pdf

    [eGov monitor/Policy Dialogue International bears full responsibility for putting these emails in the public domain and Pickled Politics were not consulted in this matter and therefore have no responsibility][But either way there is no credible expectation of privacy when writing to the editor of a media organisation]

  42. Amrit — on 22nd June, 2009 at 9:11 pm  

    So… in short, the BNP’s responses are a mish-mash of ‘avoid and misrepresent.’

    Did they mean ‘globalisation’ instead of ‘globalism’?

    We believe in free speech. We may not like what some of our own people believe or say but as long as we live in a democracy and they stay within the law that is their own business.

    But… but… a BNP-controlled Britain wouldn’t be a democracy…

    Calling the BNP ‘fascist’ or ‘Nazi’ makes about as much sense as calling the Labour Party ‘Communist’ or ‘Bolshevik’, it bears no basis to reality.

    But… but… your man Colin Brown just said this:

    Brons is right to point out that the vast majority of Labour politicians were commies and Marxists in their formative years. Now, if we are getting into point scoring, we should remember that Stalin killed 3x the number of souls that Hitler did.

    Tut tut tut.

    Agree with Boyo about the response to Q20. Very weaselly words indeed.

  43. comrade — on 22nd June, 2009 at 9:16 pm  

    They were handed back their countries after the fall of Empire as the prize of their sacrifice in WW2.

    Which country was handed back volunteerily, ‘none’

    Why is everybody exeggerating that the British fought the Nazis out of hate for Facism. Why didn’t the British and the American open the Second Front when asked by Stalin?

    The BNP, called for the Troops to be used against the Miner in 1984, and know it’s calling the Trade union Facist, so which section of the British working does it represant?

  44. comrade — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:26 pm  

    Has anybody read Fascism and Big Business by Daniel Gurerin. It’s a must read to understand what fascism is all about. I believe it was fisrt written in 1938.

  45. riverScrap.com — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:54 pm  

    The BNP doesn’t back DNA tests because they would expose its contradictions. It prefers to let judgments over “indigenous” ethnicities be made on purely superficial grounds, i.e. ‘does he look like a darkie’.

    I’m of Austro-Hungarian descent – which supposedly is acceptable to them, because its European. Look a bit closer at the ethnic origins of the Hungarians, however, and you’ll discover that they are Magyars who hail from the Ural mountains – the border region between Europe & Asia.

    Anyone who knows anything about ethnic groups knows that they are often imaginary, conjured up as much by culture & language as by scientific fact. That is why the BNP is scared of DNA data.

  46. blah — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:02 pm  

    BNP

    “We also have exposed the issue of Muslim gang rape of young white children and will impose Capital Punishment upon any individuals involved in grooming childen for sex and prostitution.”

    If youre so anti gang rape why is the BNP Oldham organiser Robert Bennett a convicted gang rapist of two young white teenagers?

    Indeed if you are as tough on crime as you claim youd jail half your party
    http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/the-real-bnp/BNP-a-party-of-convictions.php

  47. Howard Ericson — on 23rd June, 2009 at 5:50 am  

    “The section on ‘propaganda’ (Chapter 10 of Mein Kampf), incidentally, is particularly notable for Hitler’s thoughts on the benefits of what can be termed the ‘Big Lie’ propaganda technique.”
    Anyone with any intellect who reads the relevant section of Mein Kampf quoted above can see that Hitler is referring to a technique used by those he opposes rather than one he intends to use himself. Seems that Hitler himself is subject to the ‘Big Lie’

  48. Howard Ericson — on 23rd June, 2009 at 6:00 am  

    BNP Criminals? Lets look at a few more from the Labour Party

    LABOUR PARTY VIOLENCE

    May 2007 A COUNCILLOR was convicted of beating up his Ukrainian-born wife after smearing her face with curry during a drink-fuelled argument. Hartlepool borough councillor Trevor Rogan grabbed his wife by the throat, hit her, twisted her arm and pulled her hair during the attack in the early hours of October 22 last year.
    http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/topstories/display.var.1433316.0.couon_his_wife.php

    Labour Councillor (Barnsley/Yorkshire), Jack Brown – Fined £250 and bound over to keep the peace in 2005, following an incident at a Mayoral lunch where Brown had attacked another councillor, Roy Miller, and threatened to kill him. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/derbyshire/4349966.stm

    ASLEF Union boss, and Labour activist, Martin Samways – Punched a woman union official in the face during a drunken brawl at a summer barbecue, according to evidence heard at an employment tribunal for fellow ASLEF bigwig Shaun Brady, who was sacked by the union for his part in the fight. Mr Brady told the 2005 hearing: “Julie Atkinson walked past, returning from the toilet. He (Samways) lashed out at her, saying “you c***”, and hit her in the face. I could see blood”. Samways resigned after the incident. http://www.lse.co.uk/ShowStory.asp?story=WU2619020P&catid=6

    Labour Councillor (Bromsgrove/Redditch), Athol Deakin – Convicted of assaulting a neighbour in 2006. Given 100 hours community service, and ordered to pay compensation to his victim plus costs. http://www.thisisbromsgrove.co.uk/mostpopular.var.1158558

    Labour Peer, Member of the Scottish Parliament, former Scottish Sports and Culture Minister and former MP (Glasgow), Lord Watson of Invergowie – Convicted and jailed for 16 months in 2005 for Arson. Watson had been caught on CCTV attempting to burn down the five star Prestonfield House Hotel in Edinburgh by setting fire to a pair of curtains. The Labour Lord was apparently enraged by Hotel staff refusing to serve him wine due to his abusive and threatening behaviour http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4156/is_20041114/ai_n12592165

    Labour MP, John Heppell – Sank his teeth into another Labour MP, Bob Marshall-Andrews (yes, him again – see above) during a fight in the House of Commons bar in 2005. Mr Heppell is also known as `knuckles` in political circles, after having tattoos of the words `love` and `hate` removed from the knuckles of his hands. http://www.order-order.com/2006/02/whip-bites-man-story.html

    Labour Councillor (Rotherham/Yorkshire), Jahangir Akhtar – Sentenced to community service for helping his son and brother beat up a diner in a restaurant.
    At the strictly controlled and stage-managed 2005 Labour Party Conference in Brighton, an old man of 82 in the audience was set upon and violently ejected from the building by two enormous Labour goons during a speech by the Foreign Secretary Jack Straw. He was then detained by police under the Prevention of Terrorism Act. His crime? He had dared to utter a single word, “nonsense”, in response to the inane babbling

    Labour Councillor (Farnham/Berkshire), Jogindar Bal – Stripped of his taxi drivers license in 2004 after repeatedly failing to declare his 1999 assault conviction to the taxi licensing authorities.

    Labour Councillor (Rochdale/Manchester), Gholam Murtaza – Convicted and jailed for 6 months in 1998 for Assault and Affray, after attacking two women police officers with a knife. Murtaza also won his seat on the council illegally in 2003, as the seriousness of his criminal record disqualified him from standing in the first place, according to British electoral law. Typically, the Labour Party tried to lie their way out of the scandal by claiming he had concealed his past from them at the time of his selection as a candidate. However, the local Labour MP, Jim Dobbin, received a letter at the time from the Chief Constable of Greater Manchester Police, David Wilmot, giving full details of Councillor Murtaza`s conviction, and the vicious, knife-wielding Labour thug himself said: “People in the party were aware of my conviction while I was in prison. I told Heyward and Middleton MP Jim Dobbin at that time because I was fighting my conviction. The local Labour Party was fully aware of my conviction. I declared it at my interview, and on my application form”. http://www.rochdaleobserver.co.uk/news/s/34/34213_labour_loses_council_control_after_resignation.html

    Labour Government Minister (Pensions), Chris Pond – Convicted, cautioned, and fined for criminal damage in 2005, after attacking a neighbour’s house following a dispute over parking spaces. His victim, Nicola Ashton said in court “He was like a madman” http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/03/20/upond.xml&sSheet=/portal/2005/03

    2001, Labour MP Paul Marsden defected to the LibDems, after claiming he had been roughed up by Labour whip office “thugs”. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/1702514.stm

    Labour Mayor (Bolton/Lancashire), Prentice Howarth – Being investigated by police in 2005 after she was caught on video vandalizing a neighbour’s car, causing hundreds of pounds worth of damage. The neighbour had set up CCTV cameras to catch the culprit after repeated attacks upon his brand new £15,000 Citroen Xsara Picasso. Mrs Howarth has admitted responsibility but is, somewhat bizarrely, claiming the vandalism was an `accident`. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/manchester/4679271.stm

    Labour Councillor (Pontypridd/Wales), Ken Brookman – Bit off a mans ear in front of his victims wife and 12-year old daughter, following a dispute over a seat on a train. Convicted on 2 counts of unlawful wounding and given a fine and suspended 2-year sentence in 1997.

    Labour Councillor (East Staffordshire), Doug Haw – Convicted and jailed for 9 months in 2006 for beating up Mrs Winnifred West – a woman of 83. The 36 year old Labour thug punched the helpless old lady in the face causing cuts and bleeding, following a trivial dispute over a parking space. http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/detail.asp?cat=General%20News&id=6449101

    Labour Councillor (Kirkby, Merseyside) Charlie Preston – Convicted and jailed for 5 years in 1982 for assault and burglary. Preston broke into the home of a 64 year old man, and beat him up in his bed as he slept before robbing the house. The judge described the case as “As bad a matter of burglary as I can remember”. Preston also held the position on the Council of, wait for it…. `Deputy Cabinet Member for Youth, Citizenship, and Community Safety`. http://www.kirkbytimes.co.uk/news_items/2003_news/charlie_preston_councillor.html

  49. Howard Ericson — on 23rd June, 2009 at 6:29 am  

    DNA tests? Why should any BNP member submit themselves to such a thing. These tests are in their infancy are subject to misinterpretation and can not be necessarily be relied upon to give meaningful results. The BNP are ethnic Nationalists and in seems that in some peoples minds that the British are not entitled to an ethnic identity
    An ethnic group is a set of people who associate with one another on the grounds of perceived common origin, history, culture and mythology. People outside that group can enter and become part of it if they are excepted, are indistinguishable from it and have no obvious other ethnic origin. An ethnic group know who they are and what their essence is. A bit of outside admixture does not destroy that essence just as a small bit of oil does not destroy the essence of a beach. But empty the contents of an oil tanker on the beach and that essence is destroyed. Yes an ethnic identity is excusive by nature, but some of us have learnt to live with the fact that we can never be a Maoris or a Zulus.
    The English, Welsh, Scots and Irish have evolved closely related ethnic identities out of the closely related, essentially North West European, tribal entities that founded the nations of these Islands. Since those foundations there has been very little immigration until recent times. We ethnic ‘British’ have a right to define ourselves and to be among what we regard as our own within our own living space and maintain what we regard as our own identity and culture. Real evil is the deliberate and continuing policy to introduce very large numbers of immigrants of all hues, ethnic origins into the native British cultures whilst at the same time introducing increasingly draconian laws to force people into accepting the situation and stamp on decent. Supreme evil is the ethno-genocide we are suffering as the establishment and their lackeys try to talk us out of existence. This evil has been precipitated by the forces behind international capitalism and globalisation who are destroying our identities to bring about their brave new world. In the words of Bilderberger David Rockafeller in 1991 “It would have been quite impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the light of publicity during those years. But the world is more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supra-national sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practised in the past” The toy town radicals of UAF and Hope not Hate are just useful idiots in this process.

  50. Howard Ericson — on 23rd June, 2009 at 6:43 am  

    More Labour perverts:

    Entire Labour Party conspired to conceal the activities of Labour Party activist, social worker and serial child-molester Mark Trotter, who died from AIDS in 1995 before he could be convicted. http://www.whatnextjournal.co.uk/Pages/Back/Wnext6/Hackney.html

    Prominent Edinburgh Labour party activist and election candidate, Rab Knox – Convicted and jailed for 3 years in 2005 for a horrific sex attack on a woman passenger in his taxi cab. Knox had previously been dubbed Labours “Mr Anti-Sleaze” in Scottish political circles due to his unimpeachable integrity and general all-round saintlyness. Top bloke! http://edinburghnews.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=180892005

    Labour Councillor (North Lincolnshire), David Spooner – Convicted and jailed for 1 year for masturbating in front of 2 young boys.

    Labour Mayor (Todmordon/West Yorkshire), John Winstanley – Convicted and jailed in 1986 for rape and threats to kill. After raping and threatening to kill his terrified victim, Winstanley then ordered the woman to go on all fours before urinating on her

  51. Howard Ericson — on 23rd June, 2009 at 6:46 am  

    Yet more

    Labour Councillor (Hornchurch/Essex), Alan Prescott, who was also a senior magistrate – Convicted and jailed for 2 years in 2001, for molesting children at the East London care home where he was the superintendent. Prescott, described in court as a “pillar of his local community” admitted carrying out sex attacks on four teenage boys as they slept in their beds. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,565800,00.html

    Prominent Kent Labour Party activist Mark Tann (who has met Tony & Cherie at Party functions) – Convicted and jailed for 15 years in 2002 for sexually assaulting a girl of 9, and raping a 4-year old girl on 2 separate occasions. And no, that’s not a miss-print. She was FOUR YEARS OLD. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2669865.stm

    Labour Parliamentary candidate (Cheadle/Cheshire), Paul Diggert – Subject of a 2002 police investigation into the alleged procurement of underage girls for sexual purposes via internet chatrooms. According to the `Sunday Mirror` (3/11/02), Diggert had admitted to having four underage girls that he was `grooming` for sex. In 2004 Diggert was convicted of making and distributing indecent pictures of children. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=news&q=%22Paul+Diggert

    Labour Councillor (Westlands/Worcestershire), Keith Rogers – Convicted, fined, and placed on the sex offender’s register in 2003, after downloading over 2,000 hardcore child porn photos on his computer. http://archive.worcesternews.co.uk/2003/10/1/168589.html

    Labour Councillor (Newton Aycliffe/Durham – In Tony Blair’s Sedgefield constituency), Martyn Locklin – Convicted on 8 counts of rape and indecent assault on teenage boys in 2001, and jailed for 15 years (reduced to 12 on appeal). Locklin was a top local Party bigwig on first-name terms with Tony Blair, after escorting the PM during visits to his constituency on several occasions. The judge also put the Labour rapist on the sex offender’s register for life, telling him: “You will be watched for the rest of your days. You need to be”. http://archive.darlingtonandstocktontimes.co.uk/2002/4/3/140310.html

  52. Howard Ericson — on 23rd June, 2009 at 6:48 am  

    The perverts friend

    In the 1970’s and 1980’s Harriet Harmen and a number of other current leading Labour party members were senior figures in the National Council for Civil Liberties. At the time Harmen joined the Paedophile Information Exchange, had already been affiliated to the NCCL for three years. Another group, Paedophile Action for Liberation, a Gay Liberation Front offshoot, had also been affiliated to NCCL until it was absorbed by PIE. PIE, was an organisation which campaigned openly for adults to have sex legally with children. One time secretary of Paedophile Action for Liberation was Jonathan Walters who was also on the governing council of the NCCL. During her time as the NCCL legal officer she called upon the government to make sexually explicit photographs or films of children legal unless there was evidence that the subject had been harmed.

  53. inders — on 23rd June, 2009 at 7:21 am  

    2) Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?

    Fought but didn’t die. Does that mean I can join the BNP now ? And lets not forget the Indian famine of 1943 where 3 million people died and rice was still being diverted to the armed forces.

  54. Gareth — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:11 am  

    “1. Would Nick Griffin, Andrew Brons and all other members of the BNP be willing to submit to multiple independent DNA tests in order to confirm that none of them have any non-European ancestry within a particular timeframe (eg. the last 3000 years)?

    Why? It is not BNP policy to utilise or demand DNA tests on members.”

    But DNA is part of the BNP’s propaganda:

    “Nick Griffin shows that the argument put forward by the multiculturalists that ‘we are a mongrel nation of immigrants’ is a lie. Importantly he also reveals that the revolution in DNA studies indicates that the ancestors of some two-thirds of our indigenous population came to these islands at the end of the last Ice Age, and that those of Celtic and Anglo-Saxon ancestry are far fewer than originally thought.”

    http://www.britishpride.org/?p=172

    So why not put your money where your mouth is and utilise the ‘revolution in DNA studies’ to show how indigenous your members really are? Or is being able to ‘just know’ good enough?

    “When asked who could be a BNP member, Mr. Griffin said “people who are indigenous to this country”. The reporter then followed up asking Mr. Griffin how are these indigenous people recognized – ready for Mr. Griffin’s answer? – “you just look, you just know”…”

    2) Our fathers and grandparents were the ones who fought and died against the Nazis – did yours?

    Yes, and they would prefer not to be associated with you:

    Dear Mr Griffin,

    We couldn’t help but notice that there was egg on your face (and on your suit jacket) on the day after you were elected MEP for North West England.

    Please don’t leave egg on ours.

    You wore a Poppy lapel badge during your news conference to celebrate your election victory. This was in direct contravention of our polite request that you refrain from politicising one of the nation’s most treasured and beloved symbols.

    The Poppy is the symbol of sacrifices made by British Armed Forces in conflicts both past and present and it has been paid for with blood and valour. True valour deserves respect regardless of a person’s ethnic origin, and everyone who serves or has served their country deserves nothing less.

    The Poppy pin, the Poppy logo, and the paper Poppy worn during Remembrance are the property, trademark and emblem of The Royal British Legion.

    For nearly 90 years, The Royal British Legion has pursued a policy of being scrupulously above the party political fray. It is vital that everyone – the media, the public and our beneficiaries – know that we will not allow our independence to be undermined or our reputation impaired by being closely associated with any one political party. This is more important now than ever.

    On May 27th, 2009, the National Chairman of The Royal British Legion wrote to you privately requesting that you desist from wearing the Poppy or any other emblem that might be associated with the Legion at any of your public appearances during the European Parliamentary election campaign.

    He appealed to your sense of honour. But you have responded by continuing to wear the poppy. So now we’re no longer asking you privately.

    Stop it, Mr Griffin. Just stop it.

    Regards,

    The Royal British Legion

    http://bigrab.wordpress.com/2009/06/17/letter-to-nick-griffin-from-the-british-legion/

  55. Ken — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:25 am  

    It looks to me you all have an obsession with race/creed/clan way above the BNP !

  56. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:31 am  

    @ 51: Hurrah.

    Does anyone know of any more examples of other orgn’s/individuals who have denounced the BNP?

    We should create an Unguest Book – the reverse of a Guest book – of all the people & orgn’s that publicly denounce the BNP or aspects of its policies. This book should be updated & published at regular intervals. The Unguest Book should be all the things that are uninvited by this country.

  57. Gareth — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:34 am  

    @ Ken

    When a party bases it’s policies on protecting the rights of the ‘indigenous population’ they should have a more robust system of identification than ‘you just know’.

  58. Ken — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:49 am  

    Gareth

    This ‘more robust system of identification’ sound like it’s been done before in Germany is this what you want ?

  59. Gareth — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:03 am  

    @ Ken

    You’re putting words in my mouth.

    I don’t believe the need for identification exists because I don’t belive the need to deport people based on their ethnic background exists.

  60. hantsboy — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:18 am  

    Don’t forget the British had to leave India after Independence despite many having long standing roots there.

  61. Ken — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:23 am  

    Sorry Gareth

    I thought the policy was (from their site) ;

    ‘On current demographic trends, we, the native British people, will be an ethnic minority in our own country within sixty years.

    To ensure that this does not happen, and that the British people retain their homeland and identity, we call for an immediate halt to all further immigration, the immediate deportation of criminal and illegal immigrants, and the introduction of a system of voluntary resettlement whereby those immigrants who are legally here will be afforded the opportunity to return to their lands of ethnic origin assisted by a generous financial incentives both for individuals and for the countries in question.

    We will abolish the ‘positive discrimination’ schemes that have made white Britons second-class citizens. We will also clamp down on the flood of ‘asylum seekers’, all of whom are either bogus or can find refuge much nearer their home countries’.

    If I am not mistaken the voluntary resettlement is already the current Government policy
    (I bet the ‘indigenous population’of Australia and America wish they had adopted tighter methods on mass imigration)

    And before you start calling me all the standard names I am not a member of any political party or organisation

  62. Ravi Naik — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:42 am  

    Don’t forget the British had to leave India after Independence despite many having long standing roots there.

    I think they left because they wanted to leave. I am unaware of any racial laws in the Indian constitution that prevented white people – specially those with strong roots – to leave.

    While the BNP and their supporters try hard to demonstrate that other organisations have rules that discriminate on the basis of race – and therefore there is a double-standard applied against them – I have yet to see one that does. And this is actually without considering the fact that the BNP is aspiring for political office – which means that they should represent all British Nationals, not just one group. So their claim of double-standard fails on two accounts.

    The only thing that comes really close to the BNP’s manifest is South African Apartheid. They want to create a social system where they distinguish between indigineous, White Europeans and Mixed/non-Whites. They want segregation: housing, schools,jobs, hospitals, public places.

    So, the question of how will the BNP determine who is indigineous and who isn’t is relevant. South Africa had the pencil test. Asking why the BNP is afraid to show their genetic tests, so that we can assert how “indigenous” they are, and seeing how they deflect that, is another effective method to attack their racial policies.

  63. rhory fraser — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:43 am  

    Does eGov claim that the post-1950 wave of mass immigration is, in any way, comparable to the previous one, two, ten thousand years of influx?

    The relative racial homogeneity of Britain prior to 1950 is not seriously in question by anyone apart from proponents of enforced multiculturalism. Yes, of course, there were tiny, insignificant groups of Non-European origin but these amounted to less than 0.1% of the population.

    The BNP are neither loonies nor Nazis for pointing out these undeniable facts.

  64. Ravi Naik — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:51 am  

    There is a 10-part series on the BNP manifest which you should watch, it is really funny. But the conclusion pretty much summarises the whole thing.

  65. Gareth — on 23rd June, 2009 at 9:55 am  

    @hantsboy

    Colonial masters pulling out of a country after independence has no relevance to this discussion.

    @Ken

    I can’t find anything regarding the current government’s voluntary resettlement policy. I overstated the BNP’s current policy (although I sincerely believe that enforced resettlement is their ultimate aim) but my point still stands, how will they decide who is native British? And, as you bought up voluntary resettlement, how will they fund the “generous financial incentives both for individuals and for the countries in question”?

    I also think comparing the conquest of the Americas and the settlement of Australia to the UK is a bit of a leap.

  66. bnp/zionist/hinduvata — on 23rd June, 2009 at 10:14 am  

    while its nice to see consensuc against the BNP the fact is many of the people on here rightly appalled by the BNP notion that “indigenous whites should have priority over other Brits” are zionists or supporters of Hinduvata who apply exactly the same criteria as the BNP (we were here before you) to arrogate more rights and preferential treatment to Jews in Israel
    and Hindus in India over their Arab/Muslim minorities

    They are only against the BNP because it effects THEM

  67. Clairwil — on 23rd June, 2009 at 10:45 am  

    @Gareth,
    The IOM run two assisted voluntary repatriation schemes on behalf of UKBA for ‘irregular migrants’ and asylum seekers.

    http://www.iomlondon.org/

    The BNP wish to extend this to include non-white British Citizens and vastly increase the sums payable. Apparently it’s to be funded out the foreign aid budget.

  68. Jai — on 23rd June, 2009 at 10:54 am  

    Gareth,

    And, as you bought up voluntary resettlement, how will they fund the “generous financial incentives both for individuals and for the countries in question”?

    Very good question. You may be interested in checking out Qs 41-45 here: http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4832

    Specifically:

    41. What will be the standard BNP procedure in order to deal with non-white British citizens who refuse voluntary repatriation and do not submit to compulsory repatriation?

    42. Specifically what procedures will a BNP government implement in order to “encourage” non-white British citizens to accept voluntary repatriation? Please provide the maximum level of detail possible.

    43. Exactly what percentage of Britain’s foreign aid budget will be used in order to provide the “generous financial incentive” to encourage the voluntary repatriation of approximately 6 million non-white British citizens?

    44. What will be the total financial amount required in order to provide this “generous financial incentive” for up to 6 million people?

    45. Will Britain’s white/Caucasian population be subject to taxation by a BNP government in order to finance this incentive?

  69. Ken — on 23rd June, 2009 at 10:56 am  

    Gareth
    The Government are involved with VARP (Voluntary Assisted Return and Reintegration Programme)

    I am sure if we got our troops back to the uk away from Iraq some savings of life and money could be made (another BNP policy per thier site)

    won’t the native British be the ones who are not ‘
    criminal imigrants or illegal immigrants’ ? as they won’t have been VARP’d as above ?

    at least the issues are now being discussed by MP’s and the media and not brushed under the carpet.

  70. Gareth — on 23rd June, 2009 at 11:41 am  

    Clairwil – thanks for the link, I’ll have a good read tonight!

    Jai – I’ve seen all the questions (good work) but was wondering what Ken’s opinion was.

    Ken – I was against the war in Iraq but it is not practical (or in my opinion ethical) to pull out of Iraq to save money. And infact the BNP propose a rise in spending on defense.

    Also are you assuming that every immigrant will want to return?

  71. Ravi Naik — on 23rd June, 2009 at 11:56 am  

    This is interesting- It will give the BNP the opportunity to use their lame “other interest groups are also racist” argument.

  72. Jai — on 23rd June, 2009 at 12:16 pm  

    Ravi, you may find the following interesting too, since you’ve mentioned this website a few times previously (and this obviously also relates to Qs 16 and 17 in Rumbold’s main article above): Stormfront are actively monitoring eGov’s dialogue with the BNP, including the responses which have just been provided by Mr Barnes.

    Link: http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?p=7011140

  73. Ken — on 23rd June, 2009 at 12:26 pm  

    Gareth

    yes good questions but ask the BNP (can you also ask the 3 main parties why they avoid facing the issue of mass immigration)

    I am not assuming every immigrant will want to return the policy I assume the policy would be similar to how the government are involved with VARP (Voluntary Assisted Return and Reintegration Programme)

    I take it you are not objecting to the deportation of criminal and illegal immigrants?.

    The war in Afganistan and Iraq have cost too many lives on all sides and caused British born citizens to go and fight against British troops – how can any of that be Ethical ??

  74. hantsboy — on 23rd June, 2009 at 12:34 pm  

    Boys and girls and sahibs

    The EHRC are threatening an injunction against the BNP in view of its membership policy being restricted to us white folk.
    But surely the question is:
    Why should non whites want to join the BNP ?
    Seems a pointless exercise unless they whole heartedly agree with its policies.

  75. Sid [not THE Sid] — on 23rd June, 2009 at 12:44 pm  

    The hostility and self satisfied smugness of the accuser, sorry questioner here is blatant and unfortunate. Like it or not the BNP have reformed over the last 15 or so years and are now a mainstream political party. I get the impression that if the best part of one million people voted BNP in the recent EU elections, that they are all to be denigrated by the political liberal elite as being ignorant and / or foolishly “protest voting” for the “wrong party”. Such an attitude is both insulting and discriminatory, but then it is probably OK to insult and discriminate against those who don’t conform to what we are told to believe is “politically correct”.

    As to the questions about Nick Griffin’s opinions, I believe Mr Barnes is right to say “ask him”. Lee Barnes cannot speak for Nick Griffin, only Nick Griffin can do that.

  76. Refresh — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:01 pm  

    You talk such rubbish. Apart from noting that 1 million people voting BNP is a major sign that the mainstream parties (New Labour in particular) have failed.

    New Labour used and abused its own support base to stay in power and sustain the careerism that is now rife. In doing so it wrecked the solidarity of the working class which used to cut across all races.

  77. Charlie — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:02 pm  

    ‘but then it is probably OK to insult and discriminate against those who don’t conform to what we are told to believe is “politically correct”.’

    Sid people interested in politics have always slagged off their opponents. Some sneer at the ‘looney left’ or the ‘PC Brigade’ others have a go at wingnuts’ and ‘hangers and floggers’. No matter what your political affiliation someone will be having a pop at you. If the BNP are such delicate flowers they can’t the the rough and tumble perhaps they should give up politics and take up something gentler, like golf.

  78. Refresh — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:04 pm  

    As for Nick Griffin answering his own questions, is an indication they are not quite set up to deal with the scrutiny they should now expect. The BNP legal office sought to answer on behalf of the party which should include the esteemed leader.

    An obvious indication that they aren’t quite mainstream yet, and the job is to ensure they don’t fool the public into becoming so.

  79. aftab — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:05 pm  

    Scope of Political Marketing

    http://www.political-marketing.net Offer political Marketing Services

    Political Marketing is being used and implemented with different names and different shapes since centuries. In 1950 Political Marketing was defined as a separate subject please sees history of Political Marketing for reference and details.

    Still this subject is in developing phase and need to do a lot to formally recognize Political Marketing as separate subject. In my point of view Political Marketing is highly significant in all countries especially in democrat governments and more especially to developed countries. Political Marketing is essential for political parties, leaders, government and as well as for general public. Political Marketing brings stability in political culture of a country that in return brings prosperity in national economy at root and gross level. Without Political Marketing or misuse of Political Marketing it is really intricate to better understand public needs and it is so intricate to create and develop good governance in a society.

    Visit http://www.political-marketing.net for more details

    To better understand the scope of Political Marketing I would like to quote two examples. 1st for the country where Political Marketing is being implement since many years and in contrast to this the another country where Political culture is not developed yet in parties as well as political leaders are not aware about Political Marketing.

    On 1st hand I will like to quote USA. Where we can see very clear that Americans are implementing Political Marketing since many years in America, before elections the candidates create and develop a philosophy for their election campaign. So they are clear about what they are communicating in their dialogue. At all level their philosophy remains same, their goals, mission and objective does not change, audience to audience and place to place.

    What ever they communicate for coalition parties or public, in New York or in any other state, the theme of their communication at all level remains same because they are well prepared, we can’t find any contradiction in their speeches, it builds harmony and trust in public. As a result we can see that in America normally election forecasting is done before elections by survey and pools and election result proofs those predictions.

    Visit http://www.political-marketing.net for more details

    On other hand I would like to quote an example of a developing country where political culture is not as developed yet. We can see that in Pakistan there is political instability, political leaders in Pakistan are not well aware about the importance of Political Marketing due to lack of knowledge. There is no research, no philosophy and no proper developed campaign. One leader is talking and communicating other things compare to other leader of same party, even we can notice very clearly that same leader is communicating in different way with different theme and objective on different occasions and at different territories. Its due to lack of research, lack of proper philosophy and agenda and without preparation of any centralized campaign. As a result public don’t believe their promises and other parties get advantage of their contradictions, however we can see instability, lack of trust inside party and no clear vision.

    If we summarize all discussion and keep in mind both examples its clear that without research, developed philosophy and centralized political marketing and election campaign and theme it is impossible to build public trust and harmony at national level. we must give a direction to political activities to get good results for a better future.

    For the reason our organization, political marketing services slogan is “VOTE FOR TOMORROW” that describes well all functions of political marketing at all levels, government, political parties, leaders and for public.

    To keep in touch with us please join Political Forum at http://www.political-marketing.net/forum

    Article written by Mr. Aftab Hussain
    http://www.political-marketing.net

  80. Refresh — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:07 pm  

    Sid[not The Sid]

    Sorry I thought you were the Sid. Thanks for pointing that out. So please ignore my opening sentence. That would have been reserved for The Sid.

  81. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:08 pm  

    “Lee Barnes cannot speak for Nick Griffin, only Nick Griffin can do that.”

    Lee Barnes, as their legal adviser, is speaking on behalf/in representation of the BNP & Griffin is the BNP leader. Seems quite straightforward. Or is some hiding?

  82. Charlie — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:10 pm  

    @Refresh,
    Well you’d have thought a party leader’s views would be well known within the party especially by a senior party member like Lee Barnes. It all just looks very unprofessional and evasive.

  83. Charlie — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:17 pm  

    ….It all just looks very unprofessional and evasive.

    Not to mention making Griffin look like a control freak. Does he really have such little confidence in his senior party members that he won’t authorise them to answer simple questions on his behalf?

    On the one hand we are being asked to believe that the BNP has reformed and left behind it’s nastier politics. Are we expected to believe that there was no debate about this, that during the course of discussing reforming the party no one raised formerly held views to explain why they’d given them up.

  84. Rumbold — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:18 pm  

    Refresh:

    Actually, I edited his name so there wouldn’t be confusion.

  85. Refresh — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:24 pm  

    Thanks Rumbold.

  86. Ravi Naik — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:30 pm  

    Lee Barnes, as their legal adviser, is speaking on behalf/in representation of the BNP & Griffin is the BNP leader. Seems quite straightforward. Or is some hiding?

    Lee Barnes wrote this article last week. That’s new BNP for you – and this is for their top legal minds.

  87. hantsboy — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:45 pm  

    Once funds flow into BNP they will retain an army of slick lawyers and smooth talkin’ PR types just like the LIBLABCON.
    Will be a lot harder to knock them off their perch then.
    Maybe this is what our corrupt mainstream politocos are scared of.

    Great theatre all this you’ve got to admit.

    Loads more entertainment to come.
    Haven’t had such a laugh for years.

  88. Kismet Hardy — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:47 pm  

    “Seeing as women in London who are raped or sexually assaulted are most likely to be victims of foreign criminals allowed into our country, then once we have deported most of them then all women of all races in our country will be far safer.”

    You heard it here first kids. WHITE MALES DON’T RAPE

  89. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:51 pm  

    “Not to mention making Griffin look like a control freak. Does he really have such little confidence in his senior party members that he won’t authorise them to answer simple questions on his behalf?”

    Or is it because party members have little faith in Griffin. In that, if Griffin says something untoward/erroneous they can, as an organisation, distance themselves from him and just say that it was a silly comment made by an individual … as they have done in some of Lee Barnes other official responses…

    Or they cannot answer the questions because:

    - they do not know the answer as they have not fully thought out their policy
    - they do not want to give the answer as it would be political suicide
    - they do not have the capability to answer

    Either way it makes you wonder why they think they can run a whole country when they are ill equipped to answer a few fundamental questions

  90. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:53 pm  

    “Great theatre all this you’ve got to admit.

    Loads more entertainment to come.
    Haven’t had such a laugh for years.”

    Agreed. Especially the comment @91

  91. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 1:54 pm  

    where has the edit/save facility gone?

  92. hantsboy — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:02 pm  

    persephone

    I voted BNP and will do so again but I have no illusions about their capacity.
    They are all too human like the rest of us .
    If they have any sense they will move away from the strictly ‘biblical’ ideology that plagues both far left and right politics and go with the flow-wherever it takes them.

    What they have done (remarkably for a shoe string outfit) is to open up a debate on ethnicity integration and culture and the rapid change to our demographics.

    Previously taboo topics and deeply uncomfortable for many.
    But let it roll.

  93. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:08 pm  

    @90 “Once funds flow into BNP they will retain an army of slick lawyers and smooth talkin’ PR types”

    So the BNP leader is not a good spokesperson then? But I thought that was his job as a leader.

    If you are a member this does not show much confidence in the individuals currently ‘in charge’

    Did you realise that a lot of the slick lawyers & PR’s are non indigenous

  94. Sid — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:08 pm  

    @ Refresh, I ave no idea who “THE Sid” is, this is the first time I have visited this website.

    I’m simply pointing out what I believe to be the hypocrisy of people who label the BNP bigoted persecutors of minority groups. All the while they are saying that BNP supporters and voters are a minority, then persecuting them.

    I’m not a politician, and I wouldn’t want to be. It seems to be more about sound bytes and metaphors than policies and activism these days.

  95. Refresh — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:13 pm  

    Sid there isn’t actually The Sid, there just happens to be another long-term poster called Sid. And its confusing when another turns up and starts sounding almost like him.

    Perhaps you could call yourself ‘Sid not Sid’ or something.

  96. Rumbold — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:32 pm  

    Bit harsh Refresh. They don’t sound very similar.

  97. persephone — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:38 pm  

    Hantsboy @ 95

    “have no illusions about their capacity.”

    Your comments @90 belie that – also see @96

    ” They are all too human like the rest of us”.

    BNP policies are inhumane and divisive. This appeal to humanity & being like the rest of us then is one sided it seems…

    “If they have any sense they will move away from the strictly ‘biblical’ ideology”

    Does mean a BNP interpretation of Christianity/the Bible. If so, please share.

    You say ‘if they have any sense’ – again not a show of confidence

    ” open up a debate on ethnicity integration and culture and the rapid change to our demographics. Previously taboo topics and deeply uncomfortable for many.”

    PP are all up for the debate, thats why the questions were submitted – though not all answered – is the latter because of deep discomfort?

  98. tomoe yamanaka — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:44 pm  

    soldiers fight because they are told too

  99. Charlie — on 23rd June, 2009 at 2:44 pm  

    ‘All the while they are saying that BNP supporters and voters are a minority, then persecuting them.’

    The BNP are not being persecuted here. All this blog has done is ask them questions which is hardly persecution. If the BNP and it’s supporters can’t handle normal political scruitiny like all the other parties thats their problem. I can’t see any reason to accord them special treatment. They’re adults, they have views, they should be prepared to defend them like everyone else has to.

  100. Gareth — on 23rd June, 2009 at 3:10 pm  

    Ken (re 76)

    I don’t believe mass immigration is an issue.

    Re immigrants who commit crimes – if they serve out their sentence then in my eyes that’s their ‘debt to society’ paid and they should be free just like our indigenous criminals. The issue of appropriate sentences is another matter however.

    Illegal immigrants are deported at present.

    Re Afghanistan/Iraq – Like it or not we are in these countries and have turned them into warzones. Whether we were just and right to start these wars is another debate. However, to pull out without trying to stabilise these countries – now we’re there – is what I believe would be wrong.

  101. hantsboy — on 23rd June, 2009 at 3:33 pm  

    Persephone

    The BNP have opened up debate.
    We are discussing things like repatriation and race replacement which would have driven our political establishment crazy only a few months ago.
    I’ve no objection if minorities want to join up.
    They have to subscribe to policy if they do.

  102. 1mongrel — on 23rd June, 2009 at 3:42 pm  

    That’s very generous of you Gareth(103), let’s hope the victims of these uneccessary extra crimes spring back to life or have their wounds healed when the debt is repaid.

  103. SidW UK — on 23rd June, 2009 at 3:44 pm  

    Changed me name a little :)

    Perhaps the fact that the “No Platform” policy was a total failure, might it not be about time we saw Nick Griffin on Question Time? Of course the audience would have to be restricted to intellectuals only, just to stop the unwashed from turning it into the Jerry Springer Show.

    It is time this was all out in the open, censorship and repression of speech and thought only build resentment. For an example of this watch the French, they have just banned the Burkha, a recipe for disaster if ever there was one. But then they do like a riot over there!!

  104. munir — on 23rd June, 2009 at 3:55 pm  

    What strikes me about Barnes’ response is the BNP’s contardictory nature.They continually whitter on about media lies about them and reminding us not to believe all we read in the media at the same time as using often the SAME papers to justify their policies and stances!!!

  105. backatya — on 23rd June, 2009 at 3:57 pm  

    hantsboy
    “The BNP have opened up debate.
    We are discussing things like repatriation and race replacement which would have driven our political establishment crazy only a few months ago.”

    Great now everything is up for debate lets start a debate about sterilising BNP members or puting them in camps or dropping them in the middle of the Atlantic ocean

    there are many people who would support such policies

  106. Clairwil — on 23rd June, 2009 at 4:23 pm  

    #107,
    What confuses me is they complain about lies and distortion of their beliefs, are given the opportunity to set the record straight here and refuse to explain their position in any depth. Very peculiar.

  107. Adnan — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:30 pm  

    hantsboy @ 95

    Referring to the BNP as “they”? I was under the impression that when you were talking about “BNP Central” in earlier postings that you were an activist.

  108. Adnan — on 23rd June, 2009 at 8:33 pm  

    Apparently, DNA testing is too expensive and unreliable. Apparently, they’ve got an insider at one of the paint companies who’ll produce a “British” colour swatch.

  109. hantsboy — on 24th June, 2009 at 7:46 am  

    there are many people who would support such policies
    backatya

    Yes but not if they joined the BNP.
    Then they would have to accept policy.
    ie establish the caucasian white population as the dominant element in the UK.
    No race replacement in 5 years or 50 years.
    If you are happy with that- and no doubt some long established immigrants are, then as far as I’m concerned you should be able to sign up.

  110. Ravi Naik — on 24th June, 2009 at 10:10 am  

    Ravi, you may find the following interesting too, since you’ve mentioned this website a few times previously

    Thanks for the link, Jai. It is fascinating to see that the genetic tests stroke a nerve there, and that at least one of them saw the documentary “100% English”.

  111. Ravi Naik — on 24th June, 2009 at 10:14 am  

    I meant, struck a nerve. Where is that preview feature?

  112. Jai — on 24th June, 2009 at 10:47 am  

    Ravi,

    It could actually be taken even further than that.

    Given Nick Griffin’s repeated statements about “indigenous” British people apparently all sharing the same European ancestry “after the last Ice Age”, along with his now-increasing remarks about “10,000 years” and so on, perhaps Q1 in the list should be modified to expand it beyond the original suggested 3000-year timeframe and say “non-European ancestry within the last 10,000 years”.

  113. Jai — on 24th June, 2009 at 12:26 pm  

    The Wikipedia article on “The Big Lie” propaganda technique I mentioned earlier also some further interesting points:

    Quote:

    “The phrase was also used in a report prepared during the war by the United States Office of Strategic Services in describing Hitler’s psychological profile:

    His primary rules were: never allow the public to cool off; never admit a fault or wrong; never concede that there may be some good in your enemy; never leave room for alternatives; never accept blame; concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong; people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.”"

    Sounds familiar, doesn’t it ?

    In fact, it has further ramifications when one bears in mind that John Tyndall, the founder of the BNP and Nick Griffin’s immediate predecessor as leader of the organisation, was also an admirer of Hitler’s writings and even stated “Mein Kampf is my bible”.

    Links:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Lie

    http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/h/hitler-adolf/oss-papers/text/profile-index.html

    http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/h/hitler-adolf/oss-papers/text/oss-profile-03-02.html

  114. munir — on 24th June, 2009 at 12:57 pm  

    hantsboy
    “ie establish the caucasian white population as the dominant element in the UK”

    You mean as opposed to the 90% it is now.

    You should watch the youtube video on the BNP posted elsewhere- it mentions how teh policies of the BNP which arent loony are for the things we already have.

    But what do you expect from policy made on the back of a fag packet?

  115. Ravi Naik — on 24th June, 2009 at 12:59 pm  

    By the way, Jai, thanks for reminding us about this speech: Nick Griffin admits that racial purity is his goal. He should provide the results of his genetic tests NOW.

  116. Ravi Naik — on 24th June, 2009 at 1:03 pm  

    The Wikipedia article on “The Big Lie” propaganda technique I mentioned earlier also some further interesting points

    Very interesting. You find nazi stains on this party everywhere you look. Lee Barnes’s article that I linked (#89) uses the same language as the Mein Kampf.

  117. Andy — on 24th June, 2009 at 10:20 pm  

    I’ve just perused most of these comments. Sheesh!

    You really do try to dig as deep as you can to pick things apart don’t you? Says everything about the accusers.

    Oh, that guy who stated. “….a senior member of the BNP has been on record as stating that he believes “women enjoy being raped”?”

    This individual was an active ‘tory party member when he made that statement. Its strange how it magically came into the open after he was found to be in the BNP. At least Griffin sacked and banned him on the spot for it. Unlike the ‘torys.

    Mein Kampf aside. I once read a book called “1984″ From G. Orwell. I’m happy to be placed “..on record as stating that he has “learned a lot” from it..”

    Simply because my skin crawled when I found great chunks of it were implemented in Blairs last Manifesto.

    Lo and behold! The estate of G. Orwell made an attempt to take Blair and the Labour party to court over it. I’m afraid it came to nothing because they gave the Labour party diplomatic status under Alister “of course there are WMD’s in Iraq” Darling..

  118. Andy — on 24th June, 2009 at 10:37 pm  

    The NHS:
    Do you honestly think for one moment if the BNP get in power BANG! No foreign NHS workers. Leaving us in tatters?

    Not only selfish and deluded but how stupid can you sound to the general public like myself?

    I liked those rock solid replies of the respondent. Especially, “ask him”. Only bigots and the ‘psychiatrically challenged’ talk on behalf of others without question…. Then there is the legal implications.

    I give the BNP respondent 10/10 for forthrightness.
    The questionnaire: 3/10 for effort but the obvious bias over deep history.. Thats so stupid! I was a labour voter for 30 years.. Does that make me vote Labour now?

    Get real!

  119. L.Bowron — on 26th June, 2009 at 7:44 am  

    Recently eGov sent the BNP a list of the ‘85 Questions’.
    Can you show me the list of 85 questions sent to all the other legal parties.

  120. Jai — on 26th June, 2009 at 2:56 pm  

    Can you show me the list of 85 questions sent to all the other legal parties.

    As a “legal party” seeking election to 10 Downing Street via the British democratic process, supplying professional, accurate, well-informed answers in response to queries from the electorate/the general public about their background, affiliations, ideology and planned policies should therefore not be a problem for the BNP, irrespective of questions being supplied to the other political parties running for election.

  121. L.Bowron — on 26th June, 2009 at 3:07 pm  

    Jai, that doesn’t answer my question. All I am asking is CAN I see the list of 85 questions presented to ALL the other parties?

  122. Jai — on 26th June, 2009 at 3:28 pm  

    This 85 questions list was precisely calibrated for the BNP.

    If someone wanted to compile a list of questions to address all the other parties running for election, with each list customised for each party, then I’m sure it would be an enjoyable undertaking and would elicit some interesting answers from the parties concerned.

  123. L.Bowron — on 26th June, 2009 at 6:54 pm  

    Jai,
    Therefore if I asked eGov to compile a list of questions for Labour, Conservative, Liberal and UKIP they would equally oblige?

  124. Don — on 26th June, 2009 at 7:11 pm  

    Compile your own list. We might even comment on it here. And if it isn’t total drivel I don’t see why it would not be forwarded.

    In fact, why not suggest ten for each right now? I’d probably pitch in with a couple to help you out. We’d have our 85 in no time.

    Do you seriously believe anybody here thinks other parties should go unquestioned?

    (Oh, and Colin? Sunny specifically said you could post on BNP threads, just not elsewhere. So no need for the silly name game.)

  125. L.Bowron — on 27th June, 2009 at 10:05 am  

    ‘…Do you seriously believe anybody here thinks other parties should go unquestioned? …’

    That’s exactly my point Don, if we question one party then surely we should be questioning ALL parties.

    Think I shall get my head together and compile a few questions then, I may be sometime, watch this space!

  126. Rob — on 7th July, 2009 at 10:42 am  

    I would love to see Jackie Smith’s Internet browsing habits.

    And as for DNA, do you think Lib/Lab/Tory would all say yes to that?

    How about questioning Labour on how they are handicapping the security services by not allowing them to racially profile people in the name of political correctness? Little old white ladies from Devon do not tend to be Suicide Bombers!

    And you can’t get more Totalitarian than signing us up to the EU with no referendum, as we were promised!

    Not to mention the lop-sided application of hate crime legislation against whites.

  127. personalX — on 18th July, 2009 at 5:04 am  

    no wonder there is a witch hunt against the BNP as evidenced by these half-baked questions and the response from egov. The BNP actually stand for something different from the rest of the garbage – the more you make the native European peoples feel uncomfortable in their own lands the more they will resent it, the more parties like the BNP will thrive. No wonder they do well with the anti-White antics of the current government.

  128. Julian the Apostate — on 18th July, 2009 at 8:35 am  

    Ravi Naik deserves thanks for posting the link he did.

    Barnes is – at a guess – one of those ferociously hyper-intelligent and well-informed people with several bees in his bonnet and an inability to get things in order.

    Parading selections from Barnes’ published opinions is the surest turn-off for smart people inclined to join or even support the BNP.

    Yet these is another consideration and Vikrant in #14 brought it to mind:

    The United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples quite clearly states that organizations run by and for indigenous peoples have the right to decide who is and is not permitted membership.

    That awful and beyond-the-pale site, AMERICAN RENAISSANCE, has discussed the issues of Native American tribes like the Cherokees trying to exclude Black Cherokees from tribal membership and the various benefits conferred by membership[at the time of deportations like the ‘Trail of Tears,’ the Cherokees took their black slaves Westward with them.

    As you can imagine, this has been a subject of great angst for the Thinking American Left because goodthinkful people simply HATE seeing Hispanic – Black or Redskin – Black conflict.

Sorry, the comment form is closed at this time.

Pickled Politics © Copyright 2005 - 2010. All rights reserved. Terms and conditions.
With the help of PHP and Wordpress.