Questions for the BNP: part five


by guest
18th June, 2009 at 9:31 am    

[This concludes PP/eGov's 85 questions that the BNP need to answer, but are still refusing to do so- Rumbold's note]

Religious impact of a BNP government

74. During an interview on Sky News with Adam Boulton in June 2009 shortly after the relevant elections, Nick Griffin clearly stated that he would use the current Saudi Arabian policy on non-Islamic places of worship as a guideline for official policies towards non-Christian places of worship under a BNP government, thereby effectively turning Britain into a Christian version of Saudi Arabia. Therefore, upon the election of a BNP government, will it be legal to build new non-Christian places of worship?

75. Will it be legal to maintain existing non-Christian places of worship or will they be a) allowed to fall into disrepair or b) destroyed?

76. What will be the official BNP policy towards non-Christian white/Caucasian British citizens who have adopted other religions (eg. Buddhism, Hinduism, Sikhism, Islam or any others) or are the children of such individuals?

77. Will the individuals described in point 76 be “encouraged” to re-convert to Christianity or will they be subject to either voluntary or compulsory repatriation?

78. If the answer to the first question in 77 is “Yes”, exactly what measures will be taken by relevant authorities under a BNP government to “encourage” non-Christian white/Caucasian British citizens to re-convert to Christianity?

79. What will be the official BNP policy towards Christian, agnostic or atheist white/Caucasian British citizens who wish to convert to a non-Christian religion – will this be explicitly prohibited or “discouraged”?

80. Exactly what measures will be taken by relevant authorities under a BNP government to “discourage” conversion to non-Christian religions amongst the individuals described in point 79?

81. Under a BNP government, exactly what will be the punishment for apostasy amongst Christian white/Caucasian British citizens?

82. What will be the response of a BNP government if the execution of any of these policies in the name of Christianity is objected to by Queen Elizabeth II or (upon her death) her successor in her/his formal capacity of Head of the Church of England and Defender of the Faith?

83. What will be the response of a BNP government if the execution of any of these policies in the name of Christianity is objected to by any members of the clergy comprising the Church of England?

Sports and athletics

84. What contingency measures does the BNP plan in order to ensure Britain’s continued competitiveness and success in international sporting events if non-white British people are prohibited from representing Britain in these events and/or have been “voluntarily repatriated”?

85. How does the BNP propose to deal with white/Caucasian British sportspeople and athletes currently involved in international sporting events being prohibited by international sports bodies from participating in any future international events upon the election of a BNP government, especially if the sportspeople/athletes concerned do not agree with the BNP’s policies and ideology in this matter?

(Previous parts here, here, here and here)


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  1. pickles

    New blog post: Questions for the BNP: part five http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/4869


  2. tankgreenslinks

    the instalment of the 85 questions for the BNP – http://is.gd/15d7X – these are some of my favourites. i’d love to hear the answers. ;)


  3. tankgreenslinks

    the final instalment of the 85 questions for the BNP- http://is.gd/15d7X – these are some of my favourites. i’d love to hear the answers. ;)


  4. Zach J Richards

    Questions for the BNP: part five | Pickled Politics http://bit.ly/173U6V


  5. links for 2009-06-18 « Embololalia

    [...] Questions for the BNP: part five | Pickled Politics Religious impact of a BNP government; Sports and athletics (tags: bnp uk politics) [...]


  6. paternosterlift

    RT @pickledpolitics Questions for the BNP: part five | Pickled Politics http://cli.gs/avSJGG (via @tweetmeme)


  7. Tom

    @carbonkid85 See: http://bit.ly/oZCNn ; http://bit.ly/5PQ8f ; http://bit.ly/pKUTy ; http://bit.ly/uDwjS ; http://bit.ly/pzduV #BBCQT


  8. Tom

    @carbonkid85 See: http://bit.ly/oZCNn ; http://bit.ly/5PQ8f ; http://bit.ly/pKUTy ; http://bit.ly/uDwjS ; http://bit.ly/pzduV ;




  1. platinum786 — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:51 am  

    Q86. If Jesus was the return to earth, would you let him be a British citizen, bearing in mind he’s not white.

  2. Rumbold — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:54 am  

    Heh Platinum786 (#2).

    Of course the BNP wouldn’t allow him in- he is a Middle Easterner who spends his days walking round asking people to give up all their money.

    Oh, and thanks for the story tip- post going up tomorrow.

  3. chairwoman — on 18th June, 2009 at 10:26 am  

    “Q86. If Jesus was the return to earth, would you let him be a British citizen, bearing in mind he’s not white.”

    And Jewish.

  4. Jai — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:04 am  

    Regarding the “Sports and athletics” section, the following article by The Telegraph is also extremely relevant. BNP MEP Andrew Brons believes that Kent-born British Army veteran and double Olympic gold medal winner Dame Kelly Holmes cannot be regarded as fully British in terms of her identity, due to her mixed-race heritage:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/5524684/Kelly-Holmes-is-not-fully-British-says-BNP-MEP-Andrew-Brons.html

  5. munir — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:27 am  

    Its comical to complain about “islamization” … then adopt policies from Saudi Arabia !

  6. hantsboy — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:31 am  

    Why should Jesus want to be British ?
    Did he want to become a Roman Citizen ?

    He did say ‘render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s’ so probably had a common sense view of political realities.
    If you are the Son of God why bother with things like nationality.

  7. munir — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:31 am  

    “Q86. If Jesus was the return to earth, would you let him be a British citizen, bearing in mind he’s not white.”

    “chairwoman

    And Jewish.”

    Does anyone know what the current BNP’s actual party policy is towards British Jews? I ask because they have a Jewish councillor who they are keen to trumpet.
    Their policy towards Black and Asian Britons seems quite clear.

  8. munir — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:34 am  

    hantsboy
    “Why should Jesus want to be British ?
    Did he want to become a Roman Citizen ?

    He did say ‘render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s’ so probably had a common sense view of political realities.
    If you are the Son of God why bother with things like nationality.”

    the point, hants boy, is the BNP is trumpeting “Britain as a Christian land” and defending Christianity and Christian values while their policies would exclude the central figure of the Christian religion

  9. Jai — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:36 am  

    Re: #6

    Actually I wonder if someone like Kelly Holmes would even be allowed to represent Britain at any international sporting events, if a BNP government was elected.

    The same question also applies to other non-white/mixed-race/Asian etc sportspeople and athletes, including ex-England cricket captain Nasser Hussain and ex-Middlesex and Surrey captain Mark Ramprakash, along with spin bowler Monty Panesar, Colin Jackson, Linford Christie, boxers Amir Khan and Frank Bruno, and numerous others.

    And of course, all of the above would also be subject to the BNP’s planned policies targetting non-white British citizens, including “voluntary repatriation”.

  10. hantsboy — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:49 am  

    Hmm. I know the Fuhrer had a similar problem with Jessie Owen at the 1936 Olympics.
    If Nick Griffin is PM in 2012 would he be loathe to shake a few dusky hands I wonder ?

  11. Ravi Naik — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:59 am  

    Actually I wonder if someone like Kelly Holmes would even be allowed to represent Britain at any international sporting events, if a BNP government was elected.

    Actually, in the latest manual of language and discipline (rule #13), they do say that non-whites can represent Britain in sports.

  12. Ravi Naik — on 18th June, 2009 at 12:07 pm  

    Why should Jesus want to be British ?

    The point is that Jesus is not indigenous. If the BNP does not accept non-indigenous as members of his party, why is he campaigning with one on the background, and even wants Britain to become a Nation built on a non-indigenous religion originated from the Middle East?

    This sort of nationalism is so flawed!

  13. Vikrant — on 18th June, 2009 at 12:12 pm  

    If Nick Griffin is PM in 2012 would he be loathe to shake a few dusky hands I wonder ?

    Shit I’m still trippy from last night, but i can tell you that, it’ll never happen not in 2012, nor 2016, never ever!

  14. chairwoman — on 18th June, 2009 at 12:36 pm  

    “Does anyone know what the current BNP’s actual party policy is towards British Jews? I ask because they have a Jewish councillor who they are keen to trumpet.
    Their policy towards Black and Asian Britons seems quite clear.”

    As I understand it Munir, their official line is we’re ok as long as we support them, but their Fuhrer is a holocaust denier, and they have a not so hidden agenda that you don’t have to dig too hard to find, that they’ll take a different (and not more pleasant) line should they come to power.

    As to their ‘Jewish’ councillor, she knows less about Judaism than La Fluffita (my dog).

  15. Colin Brown — on 18th June, 2009 at 3:31 pm  

    Who here wants to distort this statement?

    The enemies of British Nationalism continue to parrot the claim that the BNP is a “racist party.” This claim is most often repeated because the BNP unashamedly addresses itself to the issues and concerns of the indigenous British population, and because it seeks to ensure that British people remain the majority population in this country.

    Opponents point to the fact that the BNP has an all-white membership, and that we address issues concerning white people.

    If the BNP is racist for holding this position, then, we I suggest, all of the following organisations – some of them state funded – are also “racist” because they too address themselves exclusively to the issues and concerns of their respective communities:

    1. Watford Asian Community care
    2. Watford African Caribbean Association
    3. National Black Police Association
    4. Metropolitan Black Police Association
    5. Black Londoners Forum
    6. Black Information Link (BLINK)
    7. Operation Black Vote
    8. Federation of Black Housing Organisations (FBHO)
    9. Black Training Enterprise Group
    10. Southwark Black Heritage Organisation
    11. The Action Group for Irish Youth
    12. Asians In Media (AIM)
    13. Barfi Culture (Asians)
    14. Black Britain
    15. Black Enterprise
    16. Black net Community
    17. The Black Presence In Britain
    18. Black Search
    19. Black UK Online
    20. Board Of Deputies of British Jews
    21. Chinatown Online
    22. Clickwalla (Asian)
    23. Dimsum (Chinese)
    24. Doncaster Chinese
    25. CEMVO
    26. Every Generation (Black)
    27. Jewish.Co.UK
    28. Jewish Telegraph
    29. MMLondon (Asian)
    30. Red Hot Curry (Asian)
    31. National Association of Nigerian Communities – UK (NANC)
    32. Barnsley Black and Ethic Minority Initiative

    Have you noticed how the media NEVER calls any of these organisations “racist” even though they are openly organised along ethnic lines and stand for the rights of their respective communities?

    It seems as if every group has the right to have an organisation speaking up for its rights – EXCEPT the indigenous British people.

    In reality, none of these organisations are “racist” — each and every community has the inalienable right to look after its own interests. This includes the indigenous British folk, and the BNP is proud to be the party which stands up for the rights our folk and country, in exactly the same way that all of the above organisations stand up for their folk.

  16. Shamit — on 18th June, 2009 at 4:06 pm  

    “our folk and country”

    Do these organisations say those who are not of their race cannot be a member? Are any one of these political party and seek to win political power?

    One thing you got right — it is OUR country — and it includes all of us.

    The indigenous British folk — define it. Why parrot things when they are not true? Or you knowlingly do it — I don’t know what is more harmful for the country, the ignorance or aiding and abetting a racist organisation with full knowledge and understanding of their motivations

    On the folk and country bit – Colin if you really cared about OUR country then you would not have gone anywhere near voting for BNP let alone be a member.

  17. redpesto — on 18th June, 2009 at 4:50 pm  

    “Q86. If Jesus was the return to earth, would you let him be a British citizen, bearing in mind he’s not white.”

    On the other hand, he’d be the only migrant who could walk across the English Channel rather than taking the ferry.

  18. Jai — on 18th June, 2009 at 4:51 pm  

    Just to follow on from what Shamit has said in #18:

    the issues and concerns of the indigenous British population, and because it seeks to ensure that British people remain the majority population in this country.

    This mindset is the fundamental problem, because it is fixated on the term “British” to interchangeably mean race/ethnicity and nationality, and imposes rigid parameters on both (particularly the latter).

    Unless and until people who think this way adjust their thinking to either widen their concept of “the British race” or (perhaps more realistically) accept that, in the 21st century, the meaning of “nationality” means “citizenship”, then this problem will remain.

    It is also worth bearing in mind that absolutely huge numbers of “non-indigenous” British citizens regard Britain as being their home and as “our country” in the same way that (and as much as) “indigenous” British citizens do — not with any intention to “take over the country” or “displace/outnumber” their “indigenous” compatriots, but in the same way that, for example, the London-born children of people who had moved from Birmingham to the capital would regard London as their home (literally and emotionally), especially if they had spent their entire lives in the capital and still lived there, even if their ancestral roots lay in Birmingham and there was some degree of secondary connection there too.

    To expand this further, the vast majority of non-white British citizens who have grown up in Britain (especially those who were actually born here) view themselves as predominantly Western and (correspondingly) the West as a whole to be their primary home. They are no different in this aspect to anyone else in the Western Hemisphere, including the residents of Europe and both North & South America in their entirety. This also applies to many aspects of their behaviour, ways of thinking and cultural influences — again, just like everyone else.

    And before anyone starts talking about “hijabs” and “burkhas” and so on, apart from the fact that this doesn’t automatically mean there is some kind of lack of loyalty towards this part of the world irrespective of their observance of some of their more traditional beliefs, it’s worth bearing in mind that the reason you might not (think you) see huge numbers of very obviously Westernised non-white Brits (especially South Asians) is because you either don’t mix in those circles or because you simply don’t notice them, because they look and act just like everyone else and are therefore not as “visible” a minority as their more conservative/traditional counterparts.

    If you are shown what appears to be a blank piece of paper, your eye will automatically be drawn to the handful of dots in the middle. It doesn’t necessarily mean the rest of the paper is actually blank, especially if large sections of it appear to be no different to the rest of the page.

  19. Leon — on 18th June, 2009 at 4:57 pm  

    Why is it we have such a shitty version of nationalism in England? The Scots and the Welsh have got it right when it comes to nationalism I can tell you…

  20. chairwoman — on 18th June, 2009 at 5:37 pm  

    “27. Jewish.Co.UK
    28. Jewish Telegraph”

    *Very Big Sigh Indeed*

    Jewish.Co.UK is a website where anybody can discover where to avail themselves of goods and services primarily of interest to the Jewish community.

    The Jewish Telegraph is a newspaper where anybody can read articles about, letters from, and the opinions of Jews of the UK in the North of England and Scotland.

    They are not clubs, they are in the public domain, and everybody is free to read them, buy from them, sell to them, and contribute to them.

    As bananabrain would say, sheesh!

  21. Colin Brown — on 18th June, 2009 at 5:37 pm  

    @ Shamit.

    “Do these organisations say those who are not of their race cannot be a member? Are any one of these political party and seek to win political power?”

    Double standards again Shamit. Forget about those organisations above aspiring to become political parties. Instead, imagine the reaction of the press if just one, (White) organisation tried to form any such group dedicated to looking after white only interests?

    We wouldn’t hear the last of it for years. There would be arrests/fines and jailterms handed out left right and centre for forming such a group.

    Black/Asian-only ‘groups’ in Britain are beyond scrutiny even though they refuse to represent any other racial ethnicity other than their own.

    Because of this duplicity, only ‘whites’ may be vilified as racists. Blacks and Asians are immune from any wrong-doing in a country that isn’t even their natural homeland.

    This, is why the BNP exists. If it didn’t, no-one at all, would be looking out for indigenous Brits.

    Your are the bigot the racist the fascist. Not us!

  22. Ravi Naik — on 18th June, 2009 at 5:40 pm  

    Opponents point to the fact that the BNP has an all-white membership, and that we address issues concerning white people. If the BNP is racist for holding this position, then, we I suggest, all of the following organisations -
    1. Watford Asian Community care

    Colin – this is blatant dishonesty for two major reasons.

    The first – and most obvious one – is that you have to prove that these organisations actually prevent people from different races or backgrounds from joining. You may laugh, why would a white person join the “Watford African Caribbean Association” – well, a mixed person with black and white ancestry might. The BNP does not allow Kelly Holmes to join in, despite having an English indigenous Anglo-Saxon mother. Do you agree with that, Colin? Are you proud to be a member of your party?

    Secondly, the organisations in your list cater specific interests of different communities: it is hardly racist on that account. The BNP, on the other hand, is a political party that wants to govern Britain and therefore represent the interests of all British nationals. When it bars all non-whites and worse, all people with mixed ancestry, it is pretty much saying that all these people do not belong here due to their race.

    So, yes the BNP is not just racist, it is damn racist. And they know it is wrong to be racist, or they would just admit it.

  23. Colin Brown — on 18th June, 2009 at 5:56 pm  

    @ chairwoman

    #27, #28. These organisations exist ‘exclusively’ to serve Jewish-only interests. > Jewish Dating, Jewish Blogging, Points of Jew, Jewish Traveller, and so on.

    Your trying to split hairs again.

    Could the Brits form an organisation called [English Dating](to the exclusion of all other races and creeds)without huge media scrutiny and racist connotations? No. The website owner would be deemed a racist, he would then be heavily smeared by the corrupt UK media, pressure groups would rally and complain to the authorities that the website should not be allowed to exist for a minute longer.

    The Brits are the victims chairwoman.

    And you lot know it.

  24. Ravi Naik — on 18th June, 2009 at 5:57 pm  

    Funny how the BNP reduces itself to a community interest group.

    I would be happy if the BNP caters the specific needs of Anglo-Saxon racists – as much as “Watford African Caribbean Association” caters its community, but in that case, they both have very little to offer as a national political party, and represent the interests of every British national.

  25. 5cc — on 18th June, 2009 at 6:05 pm  

    @Colin

    You might like this link:

    Is the BNP racist?

    And you might like to consider whether any of those organisations explicitly ban other races from working for them. I have no idea, myself.

  26. chairwoman — on 18th June, 2009 at 6:14 pm  

    But they’re just not exclusive.

    They are primarily of interest to Jews, I’m not denying that, but they are used by businesses owned by all races to sell their products.

    As for the Jewish dating, there is no ban on people other than Jews participating. I know that there are people out there who have a ‘thing’ about Jews, and they join the Jewish dating sites.

    Non Jews read and write to and for the Jewish Chronicle regularly. I don’t know much about the Jewish Telegraph as I don’t live in the North.

    My late husband’s family is Catholic, at my mother-in-law’s funeral last year, my daughter, Katy, was not allowed to receive Communion as she is not a Catholic (I was unable to go due to my medical condition), as the only person there not entitled to receive Communion, judging by your standards, she should have been aggrieved, and felt discriminated against.

    Is that the sort of ‘victimisation’ you’re talking about?

    And why do you think these groups evolved in the first place? Just in case you don’t know, it was because our people weren’t welcome in your people’s organisation.

    Absolute twaddle!

  27. Colin Brown — on 18th June, 2009 at 6:18 pm  

    Ravi Naik.

    No organisation / body / club exists in England to represent the British interest (except for the BNP).

    Brits are overwhelmingly under-represented racially speaking.In stark contrast to this, non-Brits are over represented. Hence the list above (and that’s the short version).

    We are being pushed out – displaced from our homeland.

    The only organisation fighting our corner is the BNP and [PP] along with several regular contributors are doing their level best to ensure that we a consigned as a race to the history books.

    These attacks are nothing less than a bloodless genocide against the British. We’ve had all we can take.

  28. chairwoman — on 18th June, 2009 at 6:32 pm  

    Colin Brown – Get a grip!

    There are 67 million people in this country. Approximately 6 million of those are ‘alien corms’ for want of a better phrase. Even allowing for a 10 o/o error in ‘our’ favour, you seem pretty much in the ascendant.

    You know, you couldn’t actually be more wrong about ‘incomers’. The majority of us – yes, yes, I know there are religious lunatics amongst all groups – enjoy British traditions. We like Bonfire Night and Christmas decorations, and Bank Holidays, and autumn mornings, and walking our dogs, and all that stuff that you poor things think you have to have been descended from Vikings or Celts – both invaders by the way – to enjoy.

    In which universe does that add up to being displaced from (y)our homeland?

  29. Ravi Naik — on 18th June, 2009 at 6:55 pm  

    No organisation / body / club exists in England to represent the British interest (except for the BNP).

    Colin, you forgot the National Front. Both the BNP and NF are the only political organisations that represent the interests of Anglo-Saxon racists. I would hate that people like you felt disfranchised.

    You will agree with me that the majority of whites do not want the BNP and the NF to represent their interests. And indeed everyone else.

    These attacks are nothing less than a bloodless genocide against the British. We’ve had all we can take.

    Do you feel that my presence in Britain is contributing to genocide?

  30. inders — on 18th June, 2009 at 6:59 pm  

    Whites will die without the BNP !

    Jeez I didn’t know it was that important. Perhaps White British should divide their votes between the BNP and the WWF.

  31. Shamit — on 18th June, 2009 at 7:00 pm  

    Colin

    I am sitting next to a British Asian Officer of the UK Armed forces who has just got back from Afghanistan. He commands British Troops and fights for Queen and Country and what do you do?

    Villify those who protects the very freedom you cherish by putting their lives on the line.

    And you reckon he is not British enough? And you are.

    And I am racist? Would Nick Griffin ever put on an uniform? NO he does not have the BALLS — being fair, courageous and serving honourably — thats everything against what the BNP stands for.

    You wanna play with the big boys get some real arguments here — and this campaign we have started would reach far beyond this blog and guess what we know how to play the game — and its very easy as the vast majority of the country thinks your views are completely and utterly unacceptable. So you lose whichever way you look at it — you pathetic example of a British citizen. How unfortunate are we to have idiots and bigots like you around in OUR COUNTRY

    Now I suggest you retreat with some grace before I am forced to unveil your stupidity and hypocricy more.

    *********************************************8

  32. Shamit — on 18th June, 2009 at 7:09 pm  

    ADmin folks

    What happened to my comment guys? It just disappeared

  33. Katy Newton — on 18th June, 2009 at 7:13 pm  

    There’s a bit of a difference between serving the interests and standing for the rights of your community on the one hand, and trying to kick everyone else out on the other, that people like Colin might want to give serious thought to. The BNP isn’t standing up for British rights. If it was it would be standing up for everyone who’s legally British, whatever colour or religion they were.

  34. Jemmy Hope — on 18th June, 2009 at 7:18 pm  

    If the BNP is not racist, not fascist, not bigotted, what is the point of it? It used to be the alternative for Conservatives who were protesting against their party, but now there’s UKIP.

  35. Don — on 18th June, 2009 at 7:46 pm  

    No organisation / body / club exists in England to represent the British interest

    Actually, there are a great many. National Trust, British Legion … . They just don’t define Britishness the way you do. As long as your definition is obsessed with keeping people out, with hostility towards anyone with a visible difference to yourself, with fear and hatred of the other, then yeah. BNP is probably the right place for you.

  36. platinum786 — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:07 pm  

    Colin should be on TV… in fact we should do a BNP exclusive version of Big Brother, I’d watch it.

    He calls BarfiCulture.com a racist organisation. Ironic that he, a white man who supports the BNP is posting that on a blog owned by the same Sunny Hundal who used to run Barfi Culture. Sunny has allowed you to be a part of his community, would you let Sunny be a member of the BNP? No. That is why your racist, and the other lot on that list aren’t.

  37. Leon — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:41 pm  

    Shamit, no idea. I haven’t touched anything…!

  38. Shamit — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:49 pm  

    Its back on Leon. Thanks mate.

    Whatever you did or not do it worked.

  39. douglas clark — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:54 pm  

    I think Don is right.

    There are many ways of defining ‘Britishness’ and none of them fit a political agenda whatsoever.

    It is pretty well ‘British’ to want to keep a ‘level playing field’. It is pretty well ‘British’ to treat folk as we find them, y’know, one to one. It is pretty well ‘British’ to think that the BNP are an alien invention.

    Germany, circa 1930.

  40. douglas clark — on 18th June, 2009 at 9:58 pm  

    Ahem,

    Why am I not allowed to edit my own comment?

    Sunny?

    Rumbold?

    What the heck is this about?

  41. Colin Brown — on 18th June, 2009 at 10:31 pm  

    Personally, I’m fed up defending myself in my own homeland from hordes of English hating foreigners who have flooded soft-touch Britain to loot our benefit system for all it’s worth!

    A lot of immigrants simply don’t want to integrate. They don’t spend money with the English – preferring instead, to keep ‘OUR’ money among ‘their’ own kind. Yet despite this insult, the English buy exotic takeaways and sit down in exotic restaurants every other night of the week spending our hard earned money with non-Brits. We then jump into non-Brit driven minicabs parting with even more of our money for them to take us home.

    It’s all one-way with immigrants. All they do is take, take, take. And to top matters, they then call English patriots, BNP supporters, and Nationalist racists for pointing out some uncomfortable facts that expose them as the greed-ridden frauds they really are.

    I know, I’m wasting my time with you lot. However, let’s have one more try at breaking through.

    Just because the boy scouts don’t allow girls to join doesn’t mean that they hate girls – quite the opposite I suspect! – it’s just that they are an organisation for boys. The same principle applies to the BNP. The BNP exists to preserve Britain’s traditional culture and character as a European country, and to protect the native population of European descent from a daily onslaught of politically-correct persecution.

    It’s that simple. When you people start respecting us (the host) a little more we my just start respecting you. Until then, I doubt that we’ll agree on much do you?

  42. 5cc — on 18th June, 2009 at 10:33 pm  

    @Shamit (post 34)

    It’s not just most British people that aren’t massive fans of the BNP. The other far right parties in Europe don’t seem that impressed either – BNP fails to find support among European far right parties.

    It’s nice to be popular.

    This bit is just too funny to leave out:

    “Nobody, however, seems prepared to touch the Greater Romania Party, whose MEPs were involved in the break-up of the far-right Identity, Tradition, Sovereignty group in the last Parliament. They broke up the group after only 11 months in a row with Alessandro Mussolini, the daughter of Il Duce, after she called all Romanians criminals. ”

    That’s the problem with coalitions of Nationalists. No telling when they’ll start with their rubbish stereotypes of how they’re all inferior to each other.

  43. douglas clark — on 18th June, 2009 at 10:39 pm  

    Anyway, as our rulers – it is their site, after all – describe or decide their reasoning on edit, or not, well, there is a far better debate to be had.

    If the BNP is not racist, not fascist, not bigotted, what is the point of it? It used to be the alternative for Conservatives who were protesting against their party, but now there’s UKIP.

    There is no point at all to it, unless they admit that they are a nodding, winking, racist, fascist scumbag party.

    Sadly, they don’t.

    And some people vote for them.

    It’d make you sick…..

  44. 5cc — on 18th June, 2009 at 10:43 pm  

    @Colin

    You’ve just degenerated into spouting dodgy cliches like a caricature of a blowhard in a pub. It’s getting boring and I’m losing patience.

    In reference to your last point about boy scouts. Girls have been allowed to join the scouts for years now.

    Wikipedia’s Scout Association entry

  45. Colin Brown — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:01 pm  

    OK 5cc, I’ll throw you a bone.

    A small number of law-abiding immigrants might make Britain more “interesting”, but a large number simply makes Britain more alien.

    However, research shows us that levels of communal co-operation are highest in neighbourhoods which are most homogenous. If you want to change the nature of this country, you should have the decency to ask the people for their approval first.

    We were never asked if we wanted millions of aliens to be allowed to move here or if we wanted the character of the country changed.

    If Labour are so convinced of the value of immigration, why don’t they have the courage and honesty to hold a referendum on it?

  46. 5cc — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:20 pm  

    @Colin

    Don’t think I haven’t heard all this stuff before. They’re standard BNP debating points. I’m sure Jai and others here are just as familiar with them.

    “However, research shows us that levels of communal co-operation are highest in neighbourhoods which are most homogenous.”

    What research? References please.

    “If you want to change the nature of this country, you should have the decency to ask the people for their approval first.”

    The BNP run in elections all the time and rarely get anywhere. People are asked their approval of your solutions all the time and soundly reject them every time. You got 6.2% of a measly 34% turnout.

    “We were never asked if we wanted millions of aliens to be allowed to move here or if we wanted the character of the country changed.”

    Except in several elections where people were given the option of voting for parties with a much stricter set of immigration laws than the current one. As for the character of the country changing – mobile phones changed the character of the country. Did you want a vote on them? What about the internet? The automobile? Want a referendum on the automobile?

    “If Labour are so convinced of the value of immigration, why don’t they have the courage and honesty to hold a referendum on it?”

    Dunno. You’d have to ask someone from Labour or a Labour supporter, but given that people consistently over estimate the number and proportion of immigrants and asylum seekers in Britain, given the hostile press coverage of immigration matters and given the fact that people believe odd things like it’s law that white men get rejected for jobs in favour of ethnic minorities and women regardless of their qualifications, I can understand the reluctance.

    We live in a representative democracy after all.

  47. Shamit — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:37 pm  

    Colin –

    How sad when logic fails like a true BNP idiot you go back to sprouting blatant lies that 10 year old would find hilarious.

    So fuck off and don’t come back here bitch and guess what on this blog we are the host and as far the country goes this is OUR COUNTRY — sadly we have to acknowledge that it is also yours.

    Now, before I lose my patience any further I suggest you run. Run fast and don’t let the metaphorical door hit you on the way out you stupid moron.

    I am not an immigrant and most of the people here talking are not — so stop bitching about your life and as Platinum says work hard boy – maybe you could meet that mortgage payment.

  48. douglas clark — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:37 pm  

    Well, I’m not so bored as 5cc!

    I think he gave up around your post at 44. Would that be right?

    In the spirit of Jai, can we take your post apart?

    Y’know, word for word?

    You said:

    Personally, I’m fed up defending myself in my own homeland from hordes of English hating foreigners who have flooded soft-touch Britain to loot our benefit system for all it’s worth!

    Well, lets take that apart, shall we?

    What evidence do you have Colin Brown, that foreigners hate the English? They might, perchance, quite like you.

    Personally, I don’t, but there you go..

    But, I do like a lot of English people. Och, I don’t know, Sunny and Jai, and folk like that? Born here, grew up here and overcome your pathetic prejudices to be citizens I admire.

    Or what of Leon?

    He is the child of a mixed race relationship. I might not agree with everything he says, but his origins are neither here nor there. In fact, they are the future.

    Just so’s you know, sex beats religion beats race. Think of it as a paper, scissors, stone game.

    Personally, I’m fed up defending myself in my own homeland from hordes of English hating foreigners who have flooded soft-touch Britain to loot our benefit system for all it’s worth!

    Well, why are you doing it? You are probably not, as a BNP supporter actually ‘fed up’ at all. You are probably enjoying the feeling that it is ‘your homeland’.

    On which subject:

    The BNP exists to preserve Britain’s traditional culture and character as a European country, and to protect the native population of European descent from a daily onslaught of politically-correct persecution.

    It is nobodies ‘Homeland’. You, of all racist twerps, should at least y’know, you know, that that is an Adolf Hitler quote?

    I have more in common with the people that write here that I do with Colin Brown.

  49. douglas clark — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:47 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    Why was it that most white people thought your policies were shite? Apart from the obvious?

  50. Don — on 18th June, 2009 at 11:47 pm  

    All they do is take, take, take.

    After you just moaned about how Brits eat at restaurants and take-aways before jumping into cabs. The service staff of which are just take, take, take.

    Colin, I’m just guessing here, but after a few pints, have you ever explained your ‘All you do is take, take, take’ analysis to cabbies and waiters who have just spent ten hours putting up with that shit?

  51. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:03 am  

    Colin Brown,

    You do write the most astounding shit, don’t you?

    OK 5cc, I’ll throw you a bone.

    A small number of law-abiding immigrants might make Britain more “interesting”, but a large number simply makes Britain more alien.

    Really?

    I find Asians more likely to vote, and thus engaged, rather than your lot. Your lot are fascists.

    Done and dusted…

  52. Shamit — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:04 am  

    Douglas@51 -

    That’s brilliant.

    Very well said. Interesting that when logic fails as 5CC, Ravi, Jai and others have pointed out — folks like Colin revert back to their BNP talking points.

    BNP = Brain Not Present

    Even though they don’t have any brains when they talk it seems like a case of constipation in the brain with a bad case of vocal diarrhoea.

    ************************************

    Colin

    The campaign we have started is going to end up reducing BNP vote share and we would show you up to be the morons you are. Most importantly, the country would know that supporting you is like supporting Mugabe.

    That worked out nicely for Zimbabwe — isn’t it interesting your Chairman (the liar) Griffin wants to emulate Mugabe (the black supremacist)? Damn son — ideologies make strange bedfellows.

  53. Amrit — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:21 am  

    Seeing as how I am a dirty heathen foreigner, can I marry the lot of you Picklers, please? Now?

    Colin is such wonderful entertainment. Like Don, I particularly enjoyed the progression from this:

    A lot of immigrants simply don’t want to integrate. They don’t spend money with the English – preferring instead, to keep ‘OUR’ money among ‘their’ own kind. Yet despite this insult, the English buy exotic takeaways and sit down in exotic restaurants every other night of the week spending our hard earned money with non-Brits. We then jump into non-Brit driven minicabs parting with even more of our money for them to take us home.

    to this:

    The BNP exists to preserve Britain’s traditional culture and character as a European country, and to protect the native population of European descent from a daily onslaught of politically-correct persecution.

    What a glorious admission of failure. Translation: ‘Them foreigns are evil YET the ‘native population’ insists on mixing with them… why… Why?! Never mind, WE are the REAL TRUE WHITIES FTW 4-EVAAA!’

    Please, Colin – keep ‘em coming. While you’re at it, might I remind you to send round a memo to the likes of my boyfriend? He’s one of your ‘indigenous whites’ (who, curiously enough, doesn’t really ever ‘buy exotic takeaways’, visit ‘exotic restaurants’ or take any taxis – ‘non-Brit driven minicabs’ or otherwise). Yet he’s in love with a NON-WHITE (shock! horror!) FELLOW BRITISH CITIZEN. Me.

    Launch into enough tabloid-style rants, and you might maybe have a less than 0.0000000000000000000000001% chance of changing his and many others’ minds!

  54. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 6:49 am  

    A lot of immigrants simply don’t want to integrate. They don’t spend money with the English – preferring instead, to keep ‘OUR’ money among ‘their’ own kind. Yet despite this insult

    Another contradiction from the BNP narrative is this: they moan about immigrants not wanting to integrate and for sticking with their own, but then they moan about miscegenation and racial genocide. They moan about lazy immigrants who don’t do anything and abuse welfare, but then they moan about immigrants who take their jobs.

    Some people are just born – I am sorry to say – losers.

  55. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:07 am  

    It’s not just most British people that aren’t massive fans of the BNP. The other far right parties in Europe don’t seem that impressed either – BNP fails to find support among European far right parties.

    I was really waiting for this news, many thanks for linking it, 5cc. I wanted to see whether Lega Nord and Wilder’s party would side with the BNP, and they didn’t. Good for them.

    To put things in perspective, Lega Nord is considered to be an anti-immigrant and xenophoblic Italian party (which they are), and that is why the BNP was so excited to form a parlamentary group with them. But Lega Nord – unlike the BNP – accepted this “coloured” woman to represent them, and she got elected as Mayor for Lega Nord in one of Milan’s towns. And Le Pen, who is a good friend of Nick Griffin, had in the last French election, this poster, and this Muslim fellow representing them.

    These people still engage in social exclusion, but compared to the BNP, they seem pretty moderate.

  56. platinum786 — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:35 am  

    Colin, it’s not my fault your foods bland and expensive. If it wasn’t I might be tempted to eat at an English resturant. The best part of English food is fish and chips, the second best is pasta and that’s Italian. Furthermore, nobody asks you to go eat curries. By the way your droning on it seems that your rectum is still being reminding you of the last curry you had. Take some Fennel seeds, that’ll fix it.

    It’s also not my fault you BNP guys are too lazy to work as taxi drivers. I’ve told you, there is nobody in this world who can stop you working as a taxi driver. All you need is a clean driving license and to pass the test and once your vehicle is checked to ensure it’s roadworthy, bobs your uncle. If you’re too lazy to do that who’s fault is it? Are you a generational dole dosser or did this start with you?

    Also since when did we not spend money in the English economy? Who are all highstreet stores owned by? Who do we mortage our houses from? You sounds stupider and stupider, perhaps some of your buddies can come to help you?

    How can you possibly claim we hate England. We love it here, especailly people like you. You make me smile with every post you write. You’re an intellectual gladiator like the modern Boudica, Jade Goody.

    You know why you’ll never get rid of us ‘darkies’ Colin? Because your not clever enough too. When it comes down to it, nobody gives a damn other than about number 1. Do you think people will want to swap their kids A-level chemistry teacher, the asian fella who’s had a career in chemistry, with you Colin? You can barely spell.

  57. hantsboy — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:43 am  

    Slightly off topic here.
    It’s clear that many of us indigenes don’t understand Asian culture.
    Although we might walk the same streets we don’t mix at a fundamental human and cultural level.

    Now I would like to ask a serious question.
    Does the caste system operate here in the UK ?
    Do Asian families still insist on age old tradition in choosing marriage partners ?

    Has caste died out in the UK.
    Many Asians seem reluctatnt to answer questions of this nature.

  58. Rumbold — on 19th June, 2009 at 8:08 am  

    Well said just about everyone apart from Colin. I am sure that Colin gives non-whites the benfit of his thoughts on a frequent basis, while they smile at him in a concerned yet affectionate way.

    Hantsboy:

    The caste system still plays an important part in marriage for some British Asians, though it has less impact in people’s day to day lives than it does in India.

  59. platinum786 — on 19th June, 2009 at 8:42 am  

    Hantsboy, yeah the caste system exists. It’s not intense like it used to be in India, Pakistan etc but it exists. Whereas in the past it was a way of identifying who you are, now it’s a way of identifying your history.

    For example, in the punjabi culture a lot of the castes are based on occupation, ie farmers, carpenters, millers, fletchers, potters, smiths, hmm… sounds familiar doesn’t it? :)

    I’m not 100% sure on how the hindu version of the caste system work.

    As for marraige, yes, parents do still interfere in who their children get married too. It varies from family to family. Some people still have arranged marraiges, others have mums who scare their partners away playing the typical mother in law role…

  60. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 9:29 am  

    Skin colour and other aspects of physical appearance are not the issue; I’ve tried to explain to you that for a society to be cohesive, it needs to be largely homogeneous.

    The fact is, that the closer people are related to you, the greater your affinity towards them. People feel a greater affinity towards their traditional fellow countrymen than towards foreign immigrants.

    That doesn’t mean that they hate foreign immigrants any more than the fact that you love your family more than the family next door doesn’t mean you hate your neighbours.

    Many of you are ‘too progressive’ to see the simplicity of this point.

  61. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 9:47 am  

    Does the caste system operate here in the UK ?
    Do Asian families still insist on age old tradition in choosing marriage partners ?

    Has caste died out in the UK.
    Many Asians seem reluctatnt to answer questions of this nature.

    Yes, it does operate here, and we do talk a lot about caste in PP. You will find that we think that castecism, like racism, is abhorrent.

  62. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 9:48 am  

    @Colin

    “Skin colour and other aspects of physical appearance are not the issue; I’ve tried to explain to you that for a society to be cohesive, it needs to be largely homogeneous.”

    Why then are the BNP keen to invite Ireland to become part of the UK, when their culture is different and wrapped up in a different sort of religion to the UK that used to actually be illegal here?

    “People feel a greater affinity towards their traditional fellow countrymen than towards foreign immigrants.”

    Oh come on. You can’t say it’s not about physical appearance and skin colour and then talk about ‘traditional fellow countrymen’ who you yourself define as being the same skin colour. Especially when the BNP are inviting another country to become part of the UK. A country of ‘traditional fellow countrymen’ who also happen to be white.

    Not up for answering why you can’t answer what the BNP would do if not enough ethnic minorities took up the offer to leave the country?

  63. Jai — on 19th June, 2009 at 9:49 am  

    It’s all one-way with immigrants. All they do is take, take, take.

    Linking this back to Q20 in Part Two……

    20. What contingency measures does the BNP plan in order to effectively deal with the likely massive increase in accident- and illness-related casualties and deaths amongst the British population due to the rapid collapse of the NHS upon the pre-emptive emigration and/or expulsion/repatriation of non-white British citizens currently working as medical professionals in the NHS, considering that 16% of nurses are non-white, as are 40% of new dentists and 58% of new doctors ? (Figures: May 2009)

    …..perhaps it would also be beneficial for someone to calculate approximately how many “indigenous white/Caucasian” British people’s lives have been saved directly because of the actions of non-white medical professionals in Britain during the past 40 years.

    The statistics should cover intervention in all stages of the patients’ lives, from neonatal medicine and paediatrics right through to geriatrics, obviously including surgery, emergency medicine, oncology, obstetrics & gynaecology, GP interventions and so on.

    Let’s hear the total number.

  64. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:01 am  

    The fact is, that the closer people are related to you, the greater your affinity towards them. People feel a greater affinity towards their traditional fellow countrymen than towards foreign immigrants. That doesn’t mean that they hate foreign immigrants any more than the fact that you love your family more than the family next door doesn’t mean you hate your neighbours.

    Many of you are ‘too progressive’ to see the simplicity of this point.

    It is not simplicity that keeps us from seeing your point, is that your point is simplistic.

    Affinity is much more complex than people looking like each other. Stay a few months in some remote village in Norway, and you will find yourself having closer affinity to a British Asian than with blonde blue-eyed Norwegian. People also feel stronger affinity with those that share the same interests, same values, etc.

    Social cohesion comes from people respecting their differences, not forcing society to become a homogeneous block. That is why nationalist and communist regimes have to be totalitarian.

  65. Jai — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:09 am  

    I’m not 100% sure on how the hindu version of the caste system work.

    Ancestral occupations, same as Platinum786′s explanation in #62. The same applies to Sikhs, although the religion of Sikhism itself of course takes a very dim view of the concept and actively preaches against it.

    It’s basically a more formal version of the class system which, until relatively recently, was of course still endemic here in Britain.

    Do Asian families still insist on age old tradition in choosing marriage partners ?

    I suspect that the BNP would be shocked to find out exactly how many UK-born British Asians (especially Indians) these days date & marry spouses of their own choice just like most other people in the Western Hemisphere. It’s 2009, not 1979.

    In most ways, 2nd-gen British Indians (and huge numbers of Asians whose ancestry lies in the other countries comprising the subcontinent) are no different in cultural influences, mores, dress, interests, lifestyle and behaviour than other 2nd-gen Brits whose parents are from other parts of the Western world.

    The 2nd-generation British Indian population and huge numbers of other British Asians are much, much more Westernised and “culturally assimilated” than most of their parents are. It’s very important to remember that, because we’re talking about people who were (mostly) born and grew up in the West during the past 40 years. Stereotypes apparently prevalent amongst the BNP and its supporters are not only grossly inaccurate, they’re also decades out of date.

    And bear in mind my point in the last two paragraphs of #20 about getting a distorted perception of matters simply because some people stand out more than others from the same background.

  66. Rumbold — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:11 am  

    Colin Brown:

    Ravi is right. I grew up in an area with a lot of South Asians, and so feel closer to them (because they are locals), than white people from France. I don’t regard this as strange, as it is shared experiences and reference points that bind people together more than anything.

  67. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:21 am  

    @5cc

    If memory serves me right, it was the Duke of Wellington who said that if he had been born in a stable it would not have made him a horse!

    The British are a European people; those who descend from Africa or Asia are not. Why distort this truth?

    If ethnics did decided to leave Britain under the existing voluntary repatriation scheme it would not (in my estimation) cost that much in net terms.

    Don’t forget that the UK would make huge savings in terms or reduced expenditure on education, health care, policing, new housing, social services, benefit payments, translation services ..and so on.

    What if ethnics wanted to stay?

    Firstly, the BNP have nothing against immigrants who are law-abiding and productive. They would be free to remain as long as they wish and would be treated as one should always treat a guests: with courtesy, fairness and friendship.

  68. Shamit — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:24 am  

    Jai – Rumbold – Leon

    The BNP has responded to the formal request from eGov monitor on the first 20 questions. Please check your emails asap and get back to me.

    They got their legal team to respond to our questions — interesting stuff but while the email address says legal@bnp — they make it clear they don’t speak for Mr. Griffin or Mr. Brons.

  69. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:29 am  

    Well done, Shamit and Jai. Hope to see their responses soon!

    Still, it is best that you verify the authenticity of your source. I am surprised that their legal team say they don’t speak for their leader.

  70. Rumbold — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:35 am  

    Shamit:

    We should publish tomorrow once we consider our responses to their responses.

    Lee John Barnes reads Pickled Politics (or used to).

  71. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:42 am  

    Put as much ‘spin’ on cohesiveness as you like. No amount of sugar-coating will hide the facts.

    Sydney, Feb.11 (ANI):

    Migrants from non-English speaking countries are less likely to be volunteers than Australian-born people or migrants from English-speaking nations a new study shows. About 18 per cent of Australian-born middle-income earners aged 25-64 were reportedly more than happy to do volunteer-related work, while in the case of people from non-English speaking countries, the figure was only 13 per cent.

    According to Ernest Healy, a senior research fellow at Monash University’s Centre for Population and Urban Research, this statistic challenges the notion that ethnic diversity leads to a stronger and more cohesive society.

    Professor Healy used various levels of volunteering as an indicator of social cohesion, and showed that suburbs with a high degree of ethnic diversity have markedly lower rates of volunteering than more homogeneous localities.

    The Sydney Morning Herald said the study is based on 2006 census data for Melbourne, and clearly establishes that migrants from non-English speaking countries are less likely to be volunteers than Australian-born or people from English-speaking countries, even when their income and age are similar.
    The study also says that the length of residence in Australia makes little difference, and nor does citizenship, while proficiency in English has a small impact.

    However, Dr. Healy says it would be wrong to conclude that migrants from non-English speaking countries were unfriendly and uncaring and less altruistic than Australian-born people.

    The findings appear to support research by Robert Puttnam, of Harvard University, that ethnic diversity can hasten a withdrawal from “collective life”.

    Source: http://tinyurl.com/nxuaxb

  72. damon — on 19th June, 2009 at 11:33 am  

    To Colin Brown, I’d say that Uslter ‘Loyalists’ who have attacked Romanian gypsies in recent days, bring into contrast, the reaction of local change in the community (between there and the rest of the UK).
    I mean … if you are a local, and live in the same few streets in south Belfast that the Romanian Roma people have been moving into recently – within your community there may well have been a mood of not welcoming these people from the fringes of eastern Europe.
    ”What are they doing in Northen Ireland if they are not entitled to work or claim benifits?” you might ask.
    I have heard a lot of liberal indignation over this – but what to do about migrations of large numbers of Eastern European Roma people to western Europe, I have heard less about.
    Some people in Belfast showed that they were not willing to have their streets and housing estates, be one of the places where a long term project of intergrating Roma people into the wider European society might take place.

    And let’s understand that there might be at least a fear of ”neighbours from hell” in the minds of these (let’s be honest) most parochial and insular of UK citizens.

    I of course deplore the bigoted attacks and reaction to those Roma people. But I’ve been around that bit of south Belfast before, and the neighbourhood changes quite markedly over a few hundred yards, from the more middle class ‘University area’ (around Malone road), to the staunchly loyalist ”Village” area just too the west. I knew there would be problems if immigrants started moving into working class areas in Belfast.
    Even Filipino nurses were were having their homes attacked in the area several years ago.

    I completely disagree with Colin Brown’s ‘world view’.
    But I understand his primitive instincts.
    What he says about ”diversity hastening withdrawl from collective life” might be true. If it is, then we (who hate racism and tribalism) have to deal with those realities.

    And I guess, that in an area like the ”Village” in South Belfast (an area of small streets and terraced houses whose front doors open directly onto the street) – and everyone knows everyone else …. then I guess those people are much the same as small town (‘village’) people all over the world.
    I think we expect a higher standard from western people.

  73. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 11:44 am  

    What he says about ”diversity hastening withdrawl from collective life” might be true. If it is, then we (who hate racism and tribalism) have to deal with those realities.

    Can you expand this?

  74. Refresh — on 19th June, 2009 at 11:55 am  

    Colin Brown #74

    I am so glad you brought up Australia. I am a bit surprised though that you didn’t use it as an example to stress how an external culture might go about dealing with the indigenous population, in this case the Aborigines.

    If other countries took the same attitude as you do, then I am afraid this tiny little island of ours is going to struggle finding space and the resources to sustain itself.

    How many millions should be heading back from Australia, US, SA, Canada and so on?

  75. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:00 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    This is the link to the actual Sydney Morning Herald article:

    http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/fewer-volunteers-in-migrant-suburbs/2008/02/10/1202578600916.html

    Just for the record the extract you have produced missed out this:

    ” It was likely their altruism was directed to friends, families and neighbours, not through organised civic, sporting, and welfare organisations.”

    Doctor Healy is saying that he is measuring something, civic engagement, and then admitting that his measuring tape doesn’t extend to the whole of the subject under debate. Funny that, don’t you think?

    He’ll only measure it if it’s done ‘The Australian Way’.

    I’d have thought that a study into voter registration and, y’know, voting, was a better measure of civic engagement. But what do I know?

  76. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:15 pm  

    Oh! And I see I am not alone in my assumption that the good Doctor should be asked how long a piece of string is:

    http://tinyurl.com/mcnhbl

    Though, clearly, the Minister says it rather more diplomatically…

  77. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:16 pm  

    As I understand it, the Romanian people refuse to live alongside the Roma. The Roma have been forced out by the Romanians into living in ghettos owing to the Roma’s reluctance to turn their back on a lifestyle that revolves around violent crime.

    The Roma’s are social-lepers of their own doing. No one with an ounce of civility as a standard to be upheld wants to live with them.

    Wherever Roma’s settle, the host community suffers greatly from their presence.

    No matter how well intentioned progressive liberals are, they cannot make a square peg fit a round hole. Bless em’ for trying, but it simply cannot be done.

    This is where right minded thinkers come into their own. We can spot these problem years before liberals admit to them. Yet people like myself, are labeled racist, fascist, or bigot for pointing out the glaringly obvious.

    Go figure.

  78. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:24 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    Do I take your silence on the, ahem, case, you thought you’d made at 74 to mean that you are having second thoughts about it?

  79. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:34 pm  

    douglas clark. Please clarify your question.

    I have a thick head today owing to a Cobra beer drinking competition last night.

  80. Refresh — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:35 pm  

    Mr Brown, I did want to understand what the links might have been between those racist thugs in Northern Ireland and BNP supporters. The links between the racist groups here and loyalist militants are longstanding.

    They were, I understand, shouting C18 chants.

    Do you approve of their actions? And do you have your own list of ‘social-lepers’?

    The best, and probably most generous description of this dispicable act was by Esther Rantzen, to paraphrase:
    ‘They have hated for so long that it is ingrained. They love to hate.’

    This psychological ball and chain needs to be shaken off for you to become whole.

  81. persephone — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:47 pm  

    @ 60 ” Has caste died out in the UK.”

    No unfortunately it has not. I believe the British Monarchy still adhere to it in their own inimitable style. Some people also feel that all they do is TAKE, TAKE, TAKE too.

    The more you think you are different the more it appears you are alike.

  82. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:50 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    And here was me thinking you’d refuse to drink that stuff!

    Doctor Healys’ research doesn’t accurately measure what it claims to measure. It assumes that in order to be altruistic you must do it through semi formal channels, such as sporting clubs, civic organisations and welfare groups. (By the way, it is he that is defining altruism as a measure of social engagement, not me.) So any other form of altruism, through individual involvement with your family, friends or neighbours is not included in the measurement. I find that naff. The latter half of the article I linked to at 79 does a far better job than I could at demolishing his precepts. Which is why you may wish to withdraw your support for it.

  83. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:55 pm  

    @ Refresh.

    No one wants to see any person attacked and for that reason all right-minded people will condemn the attacks on the Roma over the past few days.

    It is important to remain mindful that the Gypsy community is notorious for its extremely high rate of criminality and anti-social behaviour. Everyone in Romania and Eastern Europe knows this and it is one reason why their governments are so keen to encourage them to go elsewhere.

    While there are no recent figures available for Gypsy crime in Belfast, British police went on record in February 2008 as saying that they were struggling to cope with an 800 percent rise in crimes committed by Romanian Gypsies in Britain.

    In an article in the magazine Police Review, top officers expressed their fears after an unprecedented rise in offences by that community.

    The magazine quoted the officers as saying that the “dramatic increase” in crime is putting a strain on forces across the country since migrant gangs began to flood into the UK following EU accession in January 2007.

    Statistics revealed a staggering 339 Gypsy-origin crimes were being carried out every month in London since the influx — compared to just 30 in 2006.

    Supt Bernie Gravett said pick pocketing children are causing the biggest drain since they started to move out of the capital to target backwater communities.

    The senior officer — who heads a 12-strong Met unit dedicated to the problem in Westminster — said: “It’s not just London — it’s affecting every force in the UK.

    “This is a new type of crime that we are encountering. It is the criminal exploitation of children who come from very poor backgrounds in a foreign country.”

    He said the police were “shocked when a survey of 126 Romanian children in London revealed that their convictions were spread across 32 police force areas around the UK.”

    According to Met officers, the villains, who rake in around £100,000 from each child each year, are using children as young as six to unleash this crime wave which can net them up to £200 million annually.

    Gangs buy the children from impoverished parents in Romania for as little as 200 Euros before they are trafficked to the UK.

    Until the immigration policies of both Tory and Labour regimes are addressed, the problems as seen in Belfast are only likely to worsen.

    I am quite sure that the people of Belfast are reacting to what they see as provocation from the Gypsy invasion of their city, and while I cannot support their reaction, I think that it was fairly predictable, given what everyone knows about Eastern Europe’s Gypsy population.

  84. damon — on 19th June, 2009 at 12:58 pm  

    Ravi Naik, I’m sure PP might have discussed this in the past, but there is the ”Discomfort of strangers” essay by David Goodhart that caused a stir in 2004.
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2004/feb/24/race.eu

    What those Loyalists in Belfast were saying to (after the ‘troubles’ were over and NI moved to peace and normality between the ‘two’ communities) was: ”FFS. As soon as we find peace between Catholic and Protestant, are we to become just like Luton or Birmingham?”

    I think the working class communities of Belfast (both Catholic and Protestant), might reject the future of their neighbourhoods becoming just like those in places like Luton and East Ham.

    As I’ve been writing this, I have seen that Colin Brown has written again @ 80.

    I shudder to think of the Britain he wants where this level of gut reaction is the norm (and in government).

    The Roma people in Romania are a marginalized people for sure.
    But I think that instead of silliness like this: ”Folk against Fascism”
    http://www.billybragg.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=5374
    and it’s childish Woodie Guthrie/Billy Bragg symbols like this:
    http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs081.snc1/4875_97508796681_721836681_2421456_5050128_n.jpg
    …that the issues have to be taken seriously.

    Can I just bring up a story that was in the news (The Sun) a year ago, and is being brought to trial right now?
    It’s this one:
    http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article1203159.ece
    Of the girl starved to death in Handsworth Birmingham.
    On a previous very left wing site I was on … when I brought this up a year ago I faced harsh rejection.
    It was just from the sun newspaper afterall, and therfore was to be totally discounted.
    (And I was called a racist for highlighting it).

    In the article, a long term resident (Mr Bhagu Patel, a retired postal worker), had said (or was it just The Sun’s horrible distortions?) that in previous years, the more settled community in Handsworth, of Blacks, Whites and Asians would have noticed a new family moving in and things being not normal with that family.

    I had wanted to try to bring up how things can change when communities go from being settled, to transient (for example). But on that other forum, the mood was to angrily reject even the proposal of such a discussion

  85. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:15 pm  

    douglas clark.

    Unlike progressives, I’m not into hair splitting. I’ll leave that profession to you guys. Right-wing thinkers don’t cogitate over an issue a 1000 times or more -dissecting it into atom sized molecules before arriving at the decision that it’s a lame duck.

    I can spot a flawed concept a mile away. But hey, if that’s what rocks your world, knock yourselve out.

  86. platinum786 — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:18 pm  

    If I did a Michael Jackson, could I stay?

  87. Refresh — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:19 pm  

    Mr Brown, you have not answered the pertinent questions:

    Longstanding links with militant loyalists; and your personal list of social-lepers?

    And of course returnees from US, SA, Canada, Australia etc.?

  88. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:21 pm  

    @Colin (#70)

    You’re getting lazy now – you’ve nicked a lot of your post from a document called ‘I have a dream‘.

    The trouble is, putting together all this stuff in the context of the discussion we’re having here only exposes how contradictory the stuff the party spouts actually is.

    “The British are a European people; those who descend from Africa or Asia are not. Why distort this truth?”

    Depends what you mean by “the British”. This causes problems with what you said earlier about people feeling a greater affinity for their own countrymen. Most people of European descent are not my fellow countrymen. Some people descended from Africa and Asia are. If you’re saying that people of Eurpoean descent can be British but those descended from Africa and Asia can’t, then you’re talking about racism, pure and simple. Because the criteria of who can and can’t be British is based on their race.

    “Firstly, the BNP have nothing against immigrants who are law-abiding and productive. They would be free to remain as long as they wish and would be treated as one should always treat a guests: with courtesy, fairness and friendship.”

    This is cut and pasted from the answer to an imaginary question in ‘I have a dream’ that goes:

    What about those immigrants who want to stay? Would they be able to live her [sic] in peace without being harassed or persecuted?

    That’s not what I asked. Nor is your paraphrase.

    I asked what would happen if not enough people took up the financial incentives. The reason I said ‘not enough’ is because the BNP document ‘Countering the smears‘ gives this target:

    Ethnic minorities should be just that – minorities, making up no more than 2-3% of the population of any given area.

    What would the BNP do to meet these targets if not enough people took the financial inducements?

    Incidentally, the answer you’ve so thoughtfully prepared with your CTRL+C and CRTL+V fingers seems a bit rubbish and evasive, and I have problems with it.

    In your posts on the last lot of questions, when you were talking about your imaginary law that said women and ‘ethnics’ must be employed over white men, regardless of their ability and qualifications – you said

    That [nonexistent law] makes me a ‘leper’ under present UK employment law. There is no way around it.

    The BNP document, ‘Policies states:

    We also call for preference in the job market to be given to native Britons.

    So, by your own definition, ethnic minorites who don’t leave the country will be treated like lepers rather than guests. Your cut and paste answer looks a bit like vague spin.

    I wonder what else they’d be treated to (aside from being treated like lepers). For now, can you answer what the party will do if the financial incentives aren’t enough to reduce the number of ethnic minorities to the level specified?

  89. persephone — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:34 pm  

    ” Unlike progressives, I’m not into hair splitting. Right-wing thinkers don’t cogitate over an issue a 1000 times or more – dissecting it into atom sized molecules before arriving at the decision that it’s a lame duck.

    I can spot a flawed concept a mile away. But hey, if that’s what rocks your world, knock yourselve out.”

    Explains why BNP supporters cannot answer questions comprehensively or use credible data to back up their concepts. Which leads one to think that their ideology is based on nothing more concrete than the concept of racism.

  90. Jai — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:37 pm  

    Well done, Shamit and Jai. Hope to see their responses soon!

    No thanks necessary for me, Ravi — this is entirely an eGov initiative, and full credit for this development and any positive outcomes therefore goes to Shamit and his team.

  91. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 1:38 pm  

    @ Refresh.

    Sorry old chap. I’m not into playing along with witch hunts paricularly when I’m the prey.

    Besides, I thought you people had received your first (20 BNP) questions back today? Surely there’s enough for you to start dissecting until nothing remains.

    After all, it wouldn’t do to have an opposing view to ‘progressiveness’ on the table would it?

  92. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:00 pm  

    Colin Brown at 88,

    Hairsplitting?

    If you just cut and paste stuff, editing out the chunks that don’t support your case, I’d argue that that is playing a propoganda war. I’ve done the (minimal) research necessary to suggest that Dr Healys’ opinions are not science based but merely opinion. On that playing field anyone can play. As you aptly prove.

    Off topic slightly, but I like to think that this is an evidence based site. So, if I say something like ‘everyone agrees with me about x, y or z.’, I’d expect to be challenged on it and I wouldn’t be offended if I was.

    Finding supportive data for any position at all is pretty easy to do on the Internet. What it doesn’t do is give anyone reading your links a flavour for, is the merit of the arguement. I am fairly satisfied that your (partial) link at 74 doesn’t prove anything much at all, except possibly the gullibility of the Monash Universities’ Grants Committee.

  93. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:05 pm  

    @ persephone

    What you term as ‘comprehensively’ – (all be it from a progressives viewpoint) right minded thinkers would term as non-bureaucratic common sense (a quality progressives are void of).

    Think of BNP minds working in a similar fashion to Occam’s razor, sometimes called Ockham’s razor.

    Illustration: When you hear the sound of heavy hooves coming up behind you expect to see horses when you turn around – NOT Zebras.

    That’s the logic of a BNP mind in practice.

    Progressives over analyze everything – rarely arriving at any logical conclusion. Which begs the question: What purpose do you fulfill in life, other than to label those who disagree with your archaic thought processes as racists?

  94. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:10 pm  

    @Colin

    Every time you encounter data that contradicts your conclusions, you’ve called it ‘hair splitting’ and rejected it.

    That’s not Occam’s Razor, that’s Confirmation Bias.

    “Illustration: When you hear the sound of heavy hooves coming up behind you expect to see horses when you turn around – NOT Zebras.”

    But what you’ve been doing is the equivalent of hearing heavy hooves, looking behind you and seeing zebras and deciding they’re horses anyway, because it’s what you originally thought.

  95. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:25 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    Occams Razor – which is a very useful tool – works on the basis that when two descriptions of an event contradict each other the simpler explanation is probably the right one.

    Though I’ve never heard of it being applied to propoganda before now. You live and learn.

  96. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:33 pm  

    @5cc.

    You’re typical of the liberal-mindset in that you continually search for ambiguity in right-minded arguments that fundamentally challenge your political agenda.

    If I didn’t know better, I’d say you’re a student of the Marxist ‘Critical Theory’ paper.

    Are you?

  97. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:34 pm  

    By the way, and this is a true story, the only time I heard hooves thundering across the landscape and turned around it was Giraffes. Big, so they are, especially up close and personal.

    Bloody Safari Parks.

    You really shouldn’t mix camels and giraffes in an open area, but it would be PC gorn mad to separate them now, wouldn’t it?

  98. Refresh — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:37 pm  

    Mr Brown

    I would not like you to think that you are prey, so I’ll leave those questions hanging in the air. Perhaps they can go in the appendix after Jai’s Q85.

  99. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:38 pm  

    @Colin

    Never read it.

    I’ve answered your question. Will you answer mine from #91?

  100. Refresh — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:40 pm  

    Ravi, you mentioned that BNP has policy which would allow non-white sportspeople to represent the country. I suspect this probably has a footnote which says ‘for now’.

    ‘For Now’ is Griffin’s motto.

  101. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:47 pm  

    @Colin – sorry for the double post. Missed this bit:

    “You’re typical of the liberal-mindset in that you continually search for ambiguity in right-minded arguments that fundamentally challenge your political agenda.”

    You haven’t offered many right minded arguments. You’ve offered wrong minded ones, like how it’s the law that women and ‘ethnics’ are employed in front of white men when it isn’t.

    You’re just wrong and I’ve shown how, at least in this regard. You’re dodging the points from #91.

  102. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 2:59 pm  

    @5cc

    As you’ve pointed out I’m ‘always wrong’. What’s the point of me answering further questions for you?

    I’ll only provide you progressives with more opportunities to atomise my reply until nothing remains of it.

    My research into PP is nearly complete.

    Thank you for the help so far.

  103. Jai — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:01 pm  

    Ravi, you mentioned that BNP has policy which would allow non-white sportspeople to represent the country. I suspect this probably has a footnote which says ‘for now’.

    ‘For Now’ is Griffin’s motto.

    It would be helpful to the discourse if Ravi or anyone else with access to the relevant document could copy & paste the full text of the section(s) relating to official BNP policy towards non-white British sportspeople and athletes.

  104. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:13 pm  

    @Colin

    “As you’ve pointed out I’m ‘always wrong’.”

    This is just pure comedy, because…

    No I haven’t! That bit you put in quotation marks is something I haven’t actually said!

    I said ‘you’re just wrong, at least in this regard‘. See the qualifier at the end of the sentence? It means ‘not always’, and I was referring to the bit about thinking non existent laws actually exist.

    I’m sorry if that wasn’t clear, but you could have asked instead of sticking something I didn’t say in quotation marks.

    Now we’ve clarified I don’t think you’re always wrong, care to answer the questions?

    Of course I’m going to pick holes in the answers if there are any. Pointing out that laws you claim exist actually don’t, and that the BNP want to treat ethnic minorities in the way that you yourself described as like a leper (as opposed to respected guest as you claim) isn’t ‘nitpicking’. It’s pointing out where you contradict yourself or are just plain wrong.

  105. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:21 pm  

    Colin Brown,

    My research into PP is nearly complete.

    Are you going to publish it somewhere? If it is as error strewn as the ‘facts’ you have presented here, it should be comedy gold.

  106. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:29 pm  

    @5cc

    The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

    Which rating do you place yourself in 5cc?

  107. Roger — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:29 pm  

    If the B.N.P. are so enthusiastic about christianity- as defined by the B.N.P.- what do they intend to do about their disagreement with the leadership and nearly all of the membership of the Church of England and the Roman Catholic churches about religious and social policies? The bishop in the C. of E. who seems to come closest to their views is Dr Ali-Nazri, Bishop of Rochester: would this outweigh the fact that he is not- in the opinion of the B.N.P.- properly British?
    Furthermore, what is the B.N.P.’s attitude the Odinist pagans in their membership? Are they to be forcibly converted to chtistianity?

  108. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:31 pm  

    @Colin

    “Which rating do you place yourself in 5cc?”

    The one that spots that your post was a rather desperate dodge.

  109. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 3:43 pm  

    @Roger.

    Seeing that the current government has turned pockets of Britain into virtual theocracies eg. (Tower Hamlets, Bradford etc..) I presume by the unwavering line of questioning that you expect a BNP government to be God-like and cure society of its ills overnight?

    What world are you people living on? What have you been smoking? – Look at the questions you’ve asked.

    Some of you are behaving like Marxist interrogators on here. Grow up and evolve.

  110. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 4:18 pm  

    It would be helpful to the discourse if Ravi or anyone else with access to the relevant document could copy & paste the full text of the section(s) relating to official BNP policy towards non-white British sportspeople and athletes.

    It is here, Refresh and Jai. Here is the html version.

    A bit of context on this document. It is supposed to be a manual of discipline and language for BNP members so that they can hide their true colours. The previous version of this manual (2005), asked their members not to use the terms “British Asians” because there isn’t such a thing. Instead, the manual suggested to use the term “Racial foreigner”. Some journalist found this document (it was hidden) on their website, and those cowards rewrote it completely a few days later just as the EU elections were looming. The new version was completed in the last week of April this year. Here is the 2005 version if you wish to compare.

    There is now no mention about Racial foreigner, British Asian. Instead there is this:

    Rule #13: The BNP defines British people in both civic and ethnic terms.
    Immigrants, and descendants of immigrants who have settled here from non-
    European countries, are British in the fullest civic sense of the word, and entitled to the rights of all British subjects. This includes all rights and duties (such as full protection under the law) and all other aspects of participatory society, such as national sports teams, military service, civic associations and the like. The BNP also defines British people in an ethnic sense, in that we are the
    descendants of the traditional peoples of England, Scotland, Wales and the island of Ireland.

  111. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 4:44 pm  

    Progressives over analyze everything – rarely arriving at any logical conclusion. Which begs the question: What purpose do you fulfill in life, other than to label those who disagree with your archaic thought processes as racists?

    Let’s get this straight Colin: the party you support is racist because it excludes people on the basis of race, no matter how integrated they are. This is a party that is proud to exclude the likes of Kelly Holmes, who they not consider British enough, even though she has an “indigenous” English mother. This is the most primitive form of racism: to exclude someone on the basis of how racially pure they are.
    Even extreme-right wing parties in Europe do not want to be associated with the BNP.

    We analyse things because we have capable brains: it should be obvious even to you that everything you have said so far has been shown to be either false or contradictory.

  112. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 6:11 pm  

    @ Ravi.

    I agree. Let’s get this racist bullshit straight.

    A racist is a man who honors his race, reveres his ancestry, prefers — like virtually everyone — to be with his own kind, and believes that his genetic inheritance is worth preserving in the same way that liberals believe that the spotted owl, snail darter, American Indians and Australian aborigines are worth preserving.

    From this definition it can be seen that there is nothing whatsoever the matter with being a racist, and indeed that if liberal logic is followed in the case of the spotted owl and Australian aborigines, then liberalism is compatible with every sort of racism — not that liberals would follow their own logic, or any logic, for that matter.

    Now it is true that racists are sometimes accused of “hate” in their attitude toward other races, and it must be admitted that there are probably some racists who do hate the members of other races in some fashion or another. Hate, however, has nothing to do with racism per se: While a man may love or care about his own race, this does not mean that he has any special negative feelings about other races, any more than a man who loves his family can be said to hate other families.

    Among those most often thought to exhibit race “hatred” are “rednecks”, “skinheads”, “Archie Bunkers” and other whites from the lower economic strata who are thought to be too stupid, uneducated or otherwise unsophisticated to understand the wonders and marvels of the highbrow liberal multicultural philosophy.

    Such people are indeed often unsophisticated, and frequently exhibit strong negative emotions toward nonwhites, with the result that they make themselves easy targets for liberal anti-racists, who have little difficulty in holding them up to contempt. As it happens, however, the liberals are too clever by half. The very reason that lower-class whites frequently exhibit such strong negative emotions toward nonwhites is precisely because it is lower-class whites who are the first to be directly threatened by nonwhites. This is because it is those on the economic margins who cannot afford to move to the suburbs to get away from the urban decay which blacks and other minorities inevitably bring; and thus it is these lower-class whites who must contend on a daily basis with the frequently-uncivilized behavior of such minorities. What all this means, then, is that the liberals who pride themselves on “compassion” for the “poor” and the “underclass” in fact follow policies which damage poor and underclass whites, but which leave the mostly-wealthy liberals unaffected

    The urban decay which minorities bring — and the hate which it generates in the white underclass that has to contend with it — is actually part of a race war which is going on not only in England and America, but in the entire Western world. In fact, it is really more than a race war, since groups other than races are involved: ethnic minorities, women, homosexuals, the handicapped, children, and a great many others, with yet others constantly entering the fray.

    The bottom line is that progressives create breeding grounds in which to foster feelings that can later be converted into the ‘racist’ labeling which you are so very fond of. We are the victims of your social manipulation. Liberals are true racist.

    We on the other hand are innocent pawns caught up in your sick little war of mass social engineering.

  113. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 6:27 pm  

    A racist is a man who honors his race, reveres his ancestry, prefers — like virtually everyone — to be with his own kind, and believes that his genetic inheritance is worth preserving in the same way that liberals believe that the spotted owl, snail darter, American Indians and Australian aborigines are worth preserving.

    1) If racism is so noble, why does the BNP reject the notion that it’s racist?

    2) Liberals do not want American Indians and Australian aborigines to be preserved as you are insinuating: we are not breeders (nice try mixing human beings with animals such the spotted owl): each individual is free to associate to whom he or she wants. Nobody has the right to tell them to stick with their own kind to “preserve the genes”.

    See if you understand: you are free to be with racists, and mate with racists. Do you have small ears and feel like that’s worth saving? Just get a partner with those features (just hope that all her family has small ears!) What is wrong is that you expect all your countrymen to feel and act the same way you do.

    That is why we call you fascist and racist. If you want to redefine those terms and make them noble, that’s up to you. But you fool no one.

  114. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:08 pm  

    Colin @ 115,

    A racist is a man who honors his race, reveres his ancestry, prefers — like virtually everyone — to be with his own kind, and believes that his genetic inheritance is worth preserving in the same way that liberals believe that the spotted owl, snail darter, American Indians and Australian aborigines are worth preserving.

    So, how do you answer mixed race couples then? They perhaps see something in each other that transcends your frankly prescriptive approach. They presumeably do not share your views on genetic inheritance.

    I think it is down to us as the dominant species on the planet to make it liveable for the likes of the spotted owl and the snail darter. As far as Australian Aboriginies and North American Indians are concerned it is surely up to them to decide whether they want to ‘marry in’ or ‘marry out’, y’know they are part of this species that we call human who have personal agency, they don’t need you or I to decide stuff like that for them.

    Just out of curiosity why do racists always bring up Aboriginies and North American Indians? It seems to me that the assumption that is made is that they have a ‘high strangeness’ about them or, perhaps it is hoped, that no-one knows a damn thing about them.

    Yet it is really easy to research it. This article suggests that over half of the Aborigine population in Australia doesn’t agree with you:

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/apr/06/aborigines-australia-marriage

    Yes, that’s right, over half of the eligible Aborigines choose to marry someone who is not from their group. Rather blows a hole in your arguement about group think, don’t you think?

  115. Ravi Naik — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:13 pm  

    it is lower-class whites who are the first to be directly threatened by nonwhites.

    There are non-whites in every socio-economic class, Colin. And the ills that affect lower-class whites like hooliganism, alcoolism, school dropout, and teenage pregnancies are also the result of too much contact with non-whites, uh?

    it is really more than a race war, since groups other than races are involved: ethnic minorities, women, homosexuals, the handicapped, children, and a great many others, with yet others constantly entering the fray.

    You seem like an utter parody of an extremist. I mean, children and handicapped?

  116. Rumbold — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:26 pm  

    Ah yes. The handicapped. The silent killers.

  117. douglas clark — on 19th June, 2009 at 7:33 pm  

    Ravi,

    If you actually managed to make any sort of sense out of your second quote from Colin Brown you are a better man than I. That sentence had me scratching my head, for I am not sure whether these folk:

    In fact, it is really more than a race war, since groups other than races are involved: ethnic minorities, women, homosexuals, the handicapped, children, and a great many others, with yet others constantly entering the fray.

    are supposedly on Colins’ side of the fence, our side of the fence or just a catch all for everyone that isn’t Mondeo Man.

  118. Roger — on 19th June, 2009 at 8:16 pm  

    Come on, Mr. Brown, if you can’t answer my questions, keep quiet.
    For the benefit of abyone who can answer them::
    If the B.N.P. are so enthusiastic about christianity- as defined by the B.N.P.- what do they intend to do about their disagreement with the leadership and nearly all of the membership of the Church of England and the Roman Catholic churches about religious and social policies? The bishop in the C. of E. who seems to come closest to their views is Dr Ali-Nazri, Bishop of Rochester: would this outweigh the fact that he is not- in the opinion of the B.N.P.- properly British?
    Furthermore, what is the B.N.P.’s attitude the Odinist pagans in their membership? Are they to be forcibly converted to chtistianity?

    Incidentally, Mr. Brown, you had better do some research in biology. Individuals do not evolve.

  119. whywasntthiscoveredinthemedia? — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:12 pm  

    Why the HELL wasnt this covered in the mainstream media

    http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090619/FOREIGN/706189808/1013/NEWS

    and why wasnt this guy convicted under the terrorism act?

    he was convicted with “breaching the peace”

  120. Colin Brown — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:22 pm  

    @Roger

    RE: “Individuals do not evolve”.

    Clearly!

    I will now leave you Bolshevik worshipers to carry on with the revolution. It was fun debating with such a narrow spectrum of commies.

    I’ll be watching. Behave yourselves now.

    Colin.

  121. 5cc — on 19th June, 2009 at 10:52 pm  

    “I will now leave you Bolshevik worshipers to carry on with the revolution. It was fun debating with such a narrow spectrum of commies.”

    Yeah! Colin sure showed us, with his imaginary laws, question dodging and almost incomprehensible rambling about race war involving, er, kids and disabled people.

    In our dirty commie faces, pinkos!

    (Thanks to Jai for the nice words and letting me play. Got a bit strange towards the end there).

  122. Golam Murtaza — on 20th June, 2009 at 8:45 am  

    Interesting to see that Colin found it “fun” to have his arse repeatedly kicked in a debate. He must be some kind of weirdo masochist.

  123. Colin Brown — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:19 am  

    Still watching.

  124. persephone — on 20th June, 2009 at 10:55 am  

    still watching but not answering any questions with any credibility

    why do racists find it hard to admit the basis of their opinions are down to racism (and random articles that they cut & paste from)

  125. chairwoman — on 20th June, 2009 at 10:56 am  

    I though Colin had an “ass” rather than an “arse”, which, according to the instructions of my faith (Ten Commandments), I shall make it a point not to covet.

  126. Colin Brown — on 20th June, 2009 at 12:10 pm  

    Asians can’t hide behind victimhood for much longer.

    Your attempt at oppressing the majority through smug faced politicians such as Keith Vaz who exists only to serve the Asian agenda is coming to an end.

    Asians have taken much from the pockets of the British and given little in return.

    It appears to me that Asians only exist to serve the interests of their own kind. You are a self-centered race. A one-sided race. A race that knows only how to take from England. What do you give back?

    In affect, you’re a parasitic race. You leech off of the good will and tolerance of the British with a thinly disguised smile as we walk among you. Yet we know in your hearts that you despise us.

    I’ve learned from you, not to spend my money outside of my own people. I’ve stopped going in Indian restaurants, takeaways, and drinking Indian beer a long time ago in protest against your duplicity as a people.

  127. Shamit — on 20th June, 2009 at 1:00 pm  

    Bravo Colin!

    In your convoluted mind you are still not racist yet your verbal outburst clearly demonstrates otherwise.

    Duplicity is the hallmark of the BNP with clear symptoms of deluded hallucination. Should be locked up in a mental asylum – you are a danger to yourself and of course to society.

    Refuting your claims are so easy with statistics and anecdotes yet I choose not to do so. Simply because, I think this blog and most commentators on it are far out of your league. So I think its best for all our sanity to say goodbyes now with the knowledge that the electorate is going to cream you guys in the next election.

    And if this blog and the commentators on it have a little contribution to that we would be very proud.

    Now please leave.

  128. Shamit — on 20th June, 2009 at 1:13 pm  

    All those so called “Indigenous people” who are being saved by Asian surgeons –

    or the Asian businesses that are bailing out Jaguar and Corus –

    Or the Armed forces officers and the police who serve the country and community -

    they are all just taking while Nick Griffin with his lies and racism is giving back so much to the country. And that appeals to you Colin.

    What does that say about yourself? Attacking Asians who have given far more than they have taken. I know hard to believe – but education, logic are beyond your reach so I understand.

  129. Ravi Naik — on 20th June, 2009 at 1:57 pm  

    I’ve stopped going in Indian restaurants, takeaways, and drinking Indian beer a long time ago in protest against your duplicity as a people..

    Funny, didn’t you say this: I have a thick head today owing to a Cobra beer drinking competition last night. (#82)

    Oh. my. god. you lied.

    In affect, you’re a parasitic race. You leech off of the good will and tolerance of the British with a thinly disguised smile as we walk among you. Yet we know in your hearts that you despise us.

    Uhm… Hitler used the exact same language to refer to Jews. Are you saying we are the new Jews? If so, I am very glad to hear that.

    You may think that because you are a young straight white male with no disabilities that you deserve some sort of deference on that account. But you are worthless and lazy individual with very disgusting views (I mean racial war? children and disabled?), and you deserve every scorn that you get here in this blog and in real life. I totally understand why you support Nick Griffin – he is the only one that tells what you want to hear: that your worthless self can only be the result of inferior parasites living here.

    My feeling is that you are going to be disappointed for a long long time.

  130. Leon — on 20th June, 2009 at 2:11 pm  

    Asians can’t hide behind victimhood for much longer.

    Examples of Asians ‘hiding behind victimhood’ please?

  131. Roger — on 20th June, 2009 at 2:20 pm  

    “It appears to me that Asians only exist to serve the interests of their own kind. You are a self-centered race. A one-sided race. A race that knows only how to take from England. What do you give back?”

    If the term “race” can be applied with meaning to anything but the human race anyone who thinks that Asians are one race is extraordinarily unobservant.

  132. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 2:48 pm  

    Gordon Brown
    In affect, you’re a parasitic race. You leech off of the good will and tolerance of the British with a thinly disguised smile as we walk among you. Yet we know in your hearts that you despise us.

    Ravi Naik
    Uhm… Hitler used the exact same language to refer to Jews. Are you saying we are the new Jews? If so, I am very glad to hear that.

    People use this language about Muslims all the time Ravi

  133. Colin Brown — on 20th June, 2009 at 3:08 pm  

    Ravi likes the idea of Asians being seen in the same light as the Jews. We’ll, who am I to say no to that.

    Below is a very fresh Daily Mail article on why Hitler disliked the Jews. I find it strange that you want to associate with them. Maybe that’s where I got the victimhood idea from!

    Asians want to be Jews? http://tinyurl.com/lewjh3

    Selfish Asians: http://tinyurl.com/nmgvvv

    Violent Asians: http://tinyurl.com/mq7m3a

    Predatory Asians: http://tinyurl.com/mhenfv

    Stupid Asians: http://tinyurl.com/5fzm7o

  134. Don — on 20th June, 2009 at 3:14 pm  

    blah,

    Freudian slip, there? Gordon may have his faults but being a shifty, dishonest low-grade racist isn’t one of them as far as I know.

    Just out of interest, Colin, what contribution have you made to British society? And while boycotting curry and Tiger beer, why not carry a card in your wallet, like a donor card only saying that in the event of an accident you decline to be treated by black or asian medical/paramedical staff.

    (Don’t worry, they’ll still treat you, but at least you’ll have some sort of consistency.)

  135. Golam Murtaza — on 20th June, 2009 at 3:16 pm  

    Colin’s really starting to lose it now.

  136. Ravi Naik — on 20th June, 2009 at 3:30 pm  

    Yes, it is getting embarrassing.

  137. Colin Brown — on 20th June, 2009 at 3:35 pm  

    Yes Don. But who trained them? Who paid for the training? How many equally qualified Brits were denied the opportunity to apply?

    Asians belong to the government recognised minority grouping – (victimhood). That means you, (as Asians) enjoy an automatic priority over us.

    Those of you who have a pair of balls sometimes, stand up and tell it how it is. (but there’s so few of you)

    Here’s an honest Asian: http://tinyurl.com/kw8mhn

  138. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:05 pm  

    Don
    “blah,

    Freudian slip, there? Gordon may have his faults but being a shifty, dishonest low-grade racist isn’t one of them as far as I know.”

    nah just trying to annoy Colin rather than compare Gordy to a Nazi loser

  139. Don — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:09 pm  

    But who trained them? Who paid for the training?

    In a great many cases, their country of origin. Which in itself is a matter of concern.

    Last year two thirds of newly-registered doctors, and more than 40% of nurses, came from abroad. (2005)

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4349545.stm

    How many equally qualified Brits were denied the opportunity to apply?

    None, unless you have actual facts to present showing otherwise. And I notice you have avoided the question of your own contributions to our society.

  140. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:15 pm  

    Colin Brown

    “Selfish Asians: http://tinyurl.com/nmgvvv

    would say ten years ago the Asian community was viewed as a law abiding, hard working and respectful community.

    All I see now is young boys and girls barely out of their nappies roaming the streets dressed like drag queens making a nuisance of themselves.

    Now, I know we shouldn’t generalise and not everyone is the same but I do say it is time we reclaimed the streets.

    The local town centres have become no go areas for families, because of the hostile nature of some people doing the rounds’.

    I have become almost ashamed of the abusive teenagers with the language of a sewer and no respect for themselves never mind for others. Just last week I witnessed three young Asian lads push their way past a young white family and when confronted simply swore at the man and walked off. Embarassing..it’s infuriating.”

    The ironic thing is this is the result of growing up in a valueless modern Britain-as the author says the older generation are hard working, polite and law abiding. Look around you Col – youngsters of ALL races are selfish arrogant and rude (though not all).Some do things that are downright evil. Would you accept bringing up what happened to Jamie Bulger as an example of what white working class children are?
    So blaming “Asians” for this is stupid. Teenagers in the subcontinent are nothing like this.

  141. Katy Newton — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:18 pm  

    He’s contributed nothing. That’s the BNP for you. A party made of social nonentities and professional failures who never quite got where they wanted to and can’t stand seeing people who did. So much easier to believe that you’re being held back by minorities than to face the fact that you just aren’t up to the mark, isn’t it? I swear, no one plays the race card like the BNP do.

  142. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:21 pm  

    Colin Brown

    “Predatory Asians: http://tinyurl.com/mhenfv

    This is about Asian youth “grooming” young white girls.
    Why exactly are you concerned for these poor girls given your Oldham BNP organiser Robert Bennett was the ring leader in the gang rape of two white 17 year old girls?

    http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4161/is_20020414/ai_n12839620/

    And you expect people to believe the BNP will be tough on crime?

  143. brilliant-anti-bnp-resource — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:27 pm  

    Well done Jai for this series

    May I draw everyones attention to another brilliant (and hilarous) debunking of the BNP

    Its strength is it actually goes through what the BNP says in its policy documents

    It is in ten parts starting here

    BNP policy made easy
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ3em5xgSuA

    The first comment left sums the video up
    “This is the most logical analysis that I’ve come across, illustrating how illogical and irrational the BNP actually is. I’ve just watched Part 1 of 10 and am now looking forward to watching the remaining 9. Thanks bnprbarking for all this effort.”

  144. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:33 pm  

    Katy Newton
    “He’s contributed nothing. That’s the BNP for you. A party made of social nonentities and professional failures who never quite got where they wanted to and can’t stand seeing people who did. So much easier to believe that you’re being held back by minorities than to face the fact that you just aren’t up to the mark, isn’t it”

    Katy you are lying. The semi-literate dustbin men and fork lift truck drivers with no GCSEs who make up the BNP would all be doctors and lawyers if it wasnt for those Asians and Jews taking their rightful jobs.

  145. Ravi Naik — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:44 pm  

    Asians belong to the government recognised minority grouping – (victimhood). That means you, (as Asians) enjoy an automatic priority over us.

    Besides the race card as Katy said, no other party plays the victim card as the BNP (check their website, no policies only whining). It is rather amusing to see him accusing us of the same.

  146. Leon — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:49 pm  

    I swear, no one plays the race card like the BNP do.

    Well said.

  147. Ravi Naik — on 20th June, 2009 at 4:57 pm  

    May I draw everyones attention to another brilliant (and hilarous) debunking of the BNP

    Wonderful. :)

  148. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 5:21 pm  

    ‘The semi-literate dustbin men and fork lift truck drivers with no GCSEs who make up the BNP would all be doctors and lawyers if it wasnt for those Asians and Jews taking their rightful jobs.’

    I genuinely object to this approach. There is nothing wrong with being a dustman or fork lift truck driver, just as there is nothing wrong with being a taxi driver. There is dignity in labour; and don’t be foolish to presume that they are supporters of the BNP. Do not generalise or it will be the biggest mistake you will make. Just be glad there are people who do clear the bins and vast majority of them have no time for the BNP and see them for the charlatans they are.

    This isn’t the only comment of this nature. I will not give ground on this. You so easily forget that the dividing line between working class of one colour and that of another is artificial. And I might add, the most dangerous BNP supporters shelter amongst the middles classes. Brons after all was a lecturer.

  149. Don — on 20th June, 2009 at 5:31 pm  

    @151

    Well said.

  150. chairwoman — on 20th June, 2009 at 5:44 pm  

    “There is nothing wrong with being a dustman or fork lift truck driver, just as there is nothing wrong with being a taxi driver. There is dignity in labour;”

    Suddenly I feel like singing the Internationale!

  151. Rumbold — on 20th June, 2009 at 5:51 pm  

    Well said Refresh. If people didn’t collect our rubbish then we would notice pretty quickly. If most white collar jobs vanished, we wouldn’t notice.

  152. Don — on 20th June, 2009 at 6:05 pm  
  153. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 6:19 pm  

    Don, I hope that’s the Billy Bragg version.

  154. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 6:59 pm  
  155. comrade — on 20th June, 2009 at 7:15 pm  

    ‘The semi-literate dustbin men and fork lift truck drivers with no GCSEs who make up the BNP would all be doctors and lawyers if it wasnt for those Asians and Jews taking their rightful jobs.’

    Refresh, thanks for standing up for people like myself who fall in the above catogory. The upper strata of the working class, always has looked down on us, its nothing new. I say fuck them all. As for the BNP, they are not the most dangerous as enmey, because, we can easily indentify them, the most dangerous is the likes of Mr Brown ‘British Jobs for British People’ This is the slogans the BNP used in its election campaign

  156. chairwoman — on 20th June, 2009 at 7:29 pm  

    Don and Refresh

    Thank you for the links. I’ve sat and sang along with both versions and feel quite rejuvenated.

    comrade

    You made three very interesting points, and hardly seem semi-literate to me.

    One of the best read and most intelligent men I have ever met used to sell newspapers outside our local underground station. He was a Communist, an opera lover, and a general bon viveur. And I am taking this opportunity to salute him.

    How the BNP would have loathed him!

  157. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:01 pm  

    Refresh
    “I genuinely object to this approach. There is nothing wrong with being a dustman or fork lift truck driver, just as there is nothing wrong with being a taxi driver. There is dignity in labour; and don’t be foolish to presume that they are supporters of the BNP. Do not generalise or it will be the biggest mistake you will make. Just be glad there are people who do clear the bins and vast majority of them have no time for the BNP and see them for the charlatans they are.”

    You are right and I apologise for the comment. There is nothing wrong with manual labour. The point I was making was people who look to scapegoat immigrants or ethnic minorities for their own failure to get on in life, when the fault is theirs.

    There is nothing wrong with being a forklift driver. There is alot wrong with being a BNP member who blames ethnics for the fact he is a fork lift driver not a doctor

  158. blah — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:07 pm  

    One thing Jai missed in his comment on the religious strife the BNP could bring is perhaps the most important one: its attitude towards Northern Ireland

    as with others on the far right the BNP is closely aligned with the extremist UVF Loyalist groups. One of the BNP’s magazine had a front cover around the time of 9/11 asking why Bin Laden was being hunted down and the terrorist Gerry Adams wasnt and was allowed to be part of the Northern Ireland government. Their rule would destroy the delicate balance in Northern Ireland and even result in a return of the troubles

    Their proposed idea of having the Republic of Ireland join the UK is a non starter: does anyone think that given its history the Irish would want that? They were even neutral in WWII!

  159. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:08 pm  

    Blah, I appreciate your comment thanks. I have seen others make similar ones and its a trap that must be avoided at all costs.

  160. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:10 pm  

    Chairwoman,

    I too had to listen, and it reminded me of how quickly we can throw away so much that took generations to build.

  161. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:15 pm  

    Comrade,

    no thanks needed as all I did was stand up for myself. And I would be more than pleased to stand with you.

    Don,

    just to save you the effort here it is:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRD51qEJ8t4

  162. Refresh — on 20th June, 2009 at 9:51 pm  

    Mr Brown, just so you are not left out:

    Billy Bragg – All You Fascists (are bound to lose)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1Ib0-yKmoA

    See the reminder to everyone in 2nd comment there:

    ‘I saw him last night on his miner’s strike commemoration tour. And yes, all us white-working-class members of the audience enjoyed this wee song, with many joining in. The BNP do not represent us! ‘

  163. Roger — on 20th June, 2009 at 10:09 pm  

    “One of the BNP’s magazine had a front cover around the time of 9/11 asking why Bin Laden was being hunted down and the terrorist Gerry Adams wasnt and was allowed to be part of the Northern Ireland government.”

    Whether they knew it or not, the B.N.P. had a good point there. A former poacher is the best game-keeper. Rather than trying to kill them all, getting the Taliban to compete to be the first to betray the others would be a much more effective policy.

    “Their proposed idea of having the Republic of Ireland join the UK is a non starter: does anyone think that given its history the Irish would want that? They were even neutral in WWII!”

    Several tens of thousands of citizens of the Irish Free State- as it then was- fought in the British armed forces in WWII. In fact, until very recently- perhaps ten or fifteen years ago- the British government could have destroyed the economy of the Irish republic and brought it to a state of economic abjection simply by treating its citizens like any other non-Commonwealth citizens.

  164. douglas clark — on 20th June, 2009 at 10:36 pm  

    Unforunately, well, really unfortunately, our chum Colin Brown is a one trick pony.

    I am not some sort of sanguine racist. In fact, I think that the pure blood idea is a scientific nonsense.

    But, Colin Brown assumes that, because we might, or might not, share an ancestry, that he has the right to speak for me?

    Sorry, gloves off, no, he fucking doesn’t.

    douglas clark is a bit angry right now. (if I knew how to Twitter)

  165. Clairwil — on 20th June, 2009 at 11:12 pm  

    Let’s face it and I hate to say it but Colin is a bit rubbish really. Can the BNP not send over someone with a grasp of policy? I’m mad with curiosity as to what the answers to all those questions are yet all poor Colin can manage is a bit of cut and paste and an appalling tantrum that would shame a two year old.

    It’s no surprise no one will employ him really. Where he makes his bloomer is in thinking the immigrants are stealing his job whereas they’ve probably just worked out that one’s chances of employment are enhanced if one doesn’t behave like a lunatic when asked a simple question.

    Still talk about turkeys voting for Christmas BNP welfare policy would have folk like Colin working for their benefits. Perhaps he could tell us how he feels about this and what sort of work it is he fancies doing full time for £64 a week.

  166. Colin Brown — on 20th June, 2009 at 11:58 pm  

    @ Refresh.

    Billy Bragg is the living embodiment of the enemy within. He’s a talentless, soulless – sellout! And he’ll sell you out for the right price too!

    If you want to know your enemy, you need to understand their level of diversity to gauge them properly.

    Here’s a random (non-political) selection of Britishness.

    Absorb it – hate it – love it, but this is the British.

    1), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JugUQJv9YlY

    2), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkUpto_ohEc

    3), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StxpWgfhjIg

    4), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHQItmEunOM

    5), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1Pu8hET2yo

    6), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90u1IV4dw8o

    7), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CmhqoB1lNE

    8), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHRmK76q1eE

    9), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wlDmslyGmGI

    10), http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK2UUKuw2bo

  167. douglas clark — on 21st June, 2009 at 6:34 am  

    Colin Brown,

    As you have never directly answered anything I have had to say – the nearest you got was to accuse me of hairsplitting – I wonder what huge contribution you have made to the human race? Y’know, as a white supremacist?

    I don’t think there is a Nobel Prize for cutting and pasting selectively, but then that is probably a failure of these pasty Swedes. Nor is there one for claiming something is law when it isn’t.

    Prejudice – for that is what you and yours have in spades – allows you to fart off here with the impunity of an ignorant arse.

    It has been pointed out to you, in a pretty civil manner it must be said, that your complete ignorance about how the NHS works belies any capability you claim to have to analysis.

    I don’t care, much, whether you claim to have passed exams. But I do care that your brain is fundamentally fucked.

    And I am as white as you are. It is what goes on in the head that is fundamentally different. You have been tolerated around here, and people have answered your prejudices, in a pretty civil way, it must be said. I doubt the corollary.

    I can read the likes of Sunny Hundal, Jai, Leon and a lot of other folk that write here, either above the line or below it, and be frankly challenged on what I thought I thought. That is good, so it is…

    And they don’t make up stuff. Which is what you do, by either being selective about the truth – hairsplitting hah! – or just completely wrong.

    Please go back to the adult nursery which are BNP websites where you are probably seen as an intellectual rather than the tit you obviously are. That’s the problem with trying to discuss stuff with grown ups, you tend to get owned. Although your complete failure to engage with anyone here is a tactic that your lot use all the time. You can’t debate.

    You do not own whiteness, and have no right to claim that you speak on behalf of something so ephemeral, so stupid, that it suggests you can measure everything and understand nothing.

  168. chairwoman — on 21st June, 2009 at 8:40 am  

    “I don’t think there is a Nobel Prize for cutting and pasting selectively,”

    Heh :)

  169. Refresh — on 21st June, 2009 at 10:09 am  

    Mr Brown, can I assume by your response at #169 to my offering you a manifestation of white working class culture at #165, that you are acknowledging that you are a fascist?

  170. Refresh — on 21st June, 2009 at 10:37 am  

    Your selection at #169 is actually pretty good, I love it. For political reasons too. one way or another every one of those artists would be totally opposed to you (in most cases quite agressively):

    Sinead O’Connor – Mandinka (1989 Grammy’s)
    James Galway – Annie’s Song
    John Williams plays A.Barrios Mangore
    Ian Dury and Blockheads – HIT ME
    Princes Diana – Elton John – Goodbye Englands Rose*
    David Bowie-Wild Is The Wind
    Blondie Heart of glass HD
    Stanley Myers: Cavatina (solo piano version)
    Joe Cocker – You are so beautiful (nearly unplugged)
    Paul Weller plays Broken Stones

    *not sure about that particular rendition of course.

  171. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 11:13 am  

    @ douglas clark.

    Douglas, clearly your progressivness is blinding you to the innate loyalty you should naturally possess towards your own people.

    (I guess you believe that statement is ‘racist’ in itself to you Doug)

    If I was being unkind, I’d pigeonhole you a self-loathing traitor. But I’ll leave at ‘progressive’, working on the assumption that you are suffering from a mental disorder known as ‘liberalism’.

    Naturally, you have my sympathy. I really hope that you can pull through Douglas.

    Here’s some free online help that could put you on the road to recovery: http://tinyurl.com/m9cr8c

  172. Ravi Naik — on 21st June, 2009 at 11:18 am  

    Absorb it – hate it – love it, but this is the British.
    John Williams plays A.Barrios Mangore

    You couldn’t be more wrong.

    John Williams is actually son of a Chinese Australian and an Englishman (no BNP membership there!), and was born in Australia. And that beautiful song he is playing, is from Agustín Barrios (no BNP membership either).

    This piece is actually, in my opinion, the most beautiful piece Barrios created and was also to be his last. It is called “Una limosnita por amor de Dios”, which translates to “An alm for the love of God”.

    Stanley Myers: Cavatina (solo piano version)

    John Williams’s version on the guitar is also good.

  173. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 11:31 am  

    @ Refresh.

    Yes. In a sense you are correct. But this a universal problem with all elitists. People that have £millions in the bank, can afford to be hi-brow about a lot of things (politics included).

    However, I’m not about to take away their contribution to the world just because they feel “compelled” to join in with other elitist by banging the anti-BNP drum in tune with their liberal thought waves.

    Their talents, energy, and professionalism is typically British. I’m proud of them even – If they “openly” despise my choice of politics.

    Why don’t you dig up some dirt to see if any of these artist side with the progressive view of the BNP? I’m sure if you move enough earth, you’ll find something to back up your assumptions.

  174. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 11:50 am  

    Ravi. Your hairsplitting again. John Williams mum, was Chinese. His father British. He was educated at the Friern Barnet Grammar School, London, England.

    Look, you people just don’t get it do you. We have Italians, Greeks, Chinese, Gay’s and Jews in the BNP. Some of these members represent us at council level.

    We are a European party. There are 540m Europeans. The vast majority of which the BNP associate with. (Roma excluded. Nobody I know, wants to be associated with them).

  175. chairwoman — on 21st June, 2009 at 1:28 pm  

    Blondie? British?

  176. Ravi Naik — on 21st June, 2009 at 2:53 pm  

    Look, you people just don’t get it do you. We have Italians, Greeks, Chinese, Gay’s and Jews in the BNP. Some of these members represent us at council level.

    Chinese?

  177. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 2:59 pm  

    According to the leaked BNP membership list yes – Chinese.

  178. Don — on 21st June, 2009 at 3:20 pm  

    The Rainbow BNP!

    If we had realised how warm, inclusive and cuddly you were, welcoming gay and straight, european and asian, jew and gentile, we wouldn’t have been so stern with you.

  179. Jai — on 21st June, 2009 at 3:23 pm  

    I also see that we still have not received a proper response to my post #66.

    To re-iterate:

    It’s all one-way with immigrants. All they do is take, take, take.

    Linking this back to Q20 in Part Two……

    20. What contingency measures does the BNP plan in order to effectively deal with the likely massive increase in accident- and illness-related casualties and deaths amongst the British population due to the rapid collapse of the NHS upon the pre-emptive emigration and/or expulsion/repatriation of non-white British citizens currently working as medical professionals in the NHS, considering that 16% of nurses are non-white, as are 40% of new dentists and 58% of new doctors ? (Figures: May 2009)

    …..perhaps it would also be beneficial for someone to calculate approximately how many “indigenous white/Caucasian” British people’s lives have been saved directly because of the actions of non-white medical professionals in Britain during the past 40 years.

    The statistics should cover intervention in all stages of the patients’ lives, from neonatal medicine and paediatrics right through to geriatrics, obviously including surgery, emergency medicine, oncology, obstetrics & gynaecology, GP interventions and so on.

    Let’s hear the total number.

    ******************************************************

    This is an excellent article which is highly relevant:

    “How Asian doctors saved the NHS”:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3239540.stm

    It goes without saying that the vast majority (quite possibly all) of the South Asian doctors who arrived in those times are now full-fledged British citizens, and have been for approx. 40 years, if not longer.

    It’s also worth mentioning that approximately 30% of current medical students in the UK are non-white, the majority of whom are not only South Asian but are also British citizens. Furthermore, let’s not forget all the non-white (especially South Asian) doctors in the UK who were born in this country, have always been full-fledged British citizens, and attended medical school in the UK during the past ~40 years.

  180. Jai — on 21st June, 2009 at 3:25 pm  

    Incidentally, I see that it didn’t take long for “Colin Brown” to contradict his own claims in #115 that, apart from those he refers to as “unsophisticated”, a racist (as per his definition of the term) doesn’t necessarily harbour any animosity — indeed, actual hatred — towards people from other backgrounds. I’m referring specifically to his posts #129 and #136 onwards.

  181. Jai — on 21st June, 2009 at 3:57 pm  

    It’s all one-way with immigrants. All they do is take, take, take.

    Let’s “take” this further:

    It would be interesting to have comprehensive answers to the following queries on the list:

    Q34. Exactly how much of Britain’s current GDP, in terms of gross, net, and overall percentage figures, is a result of the non-white British population?

    Q35. What would be the estimated financial loss to Britain’s GDP upon the withdrawal of all domestic assets by non-white British citizens submitting to “voluntary repatriation” or involved in pre-emptive emigration upon the election of a BNP government?

    Q36. According to May 2009 figures, exactly what percentage of non-white British citizens are tax-payers and are not receiving government benefits? Figures should be broken down according to suitable groups, eg. British Asian (or British Indian, British Pakistani etc), along with British African, etc.

    Q37. According to May 2009 figures, exactly what percentage of white/Caucasian British citizens are tax-payers and are not receiving government benefits?

    …..And here’s another one we could add:

    “What percentage of, for example, the total adult British Indian population falls within the 40% Income Tax bracket ? Corresponding percentages for the total adult British population as a whole along with the total white/Caucasian British population respectively should also be supplied.”

    ********************************

    In the meantime, here are some further relevant statistics:

    - British Asians are responsible for 6% of the UK’s total GDP even though they comprise only 4% of the total British population.

    Considering that the UK’s GDP for 2008 was estimated to be $2,674 billion, 6% of that figure is still a huge amount in dollar terms and disproportionately high compared to the proportion of the total British population which consists of British Asians.

    (References:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Asian

    http://www.britishasiantrust.com/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_United_Kingdom

    http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2009/01/weodata/weorept.aspx?pr.x=68&pr.y=19&sy=2006&ey=2009&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&c=112&s=NGDPD%2CNGDPDPC%2CPPPGDP%2CPPPPC%2CLP&grp=0&a= )

  182. Don — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:16 pm  

    Colin,

    You have probably by now delighted us long enough, but before you go could you clear up a few points around some questions you have been avoiding?

    # Do you accept that you were factually incorrect when you claimed that a law on the statute books privileged ‘ethnics’ and women over white males, preventing you from getting a job worthy of your talents? That such a law neither exists nor is proposed? Not hairsplitting, you were just flat wrong.

    # Can you give us even a sketchy idea of the contribution you have made to our society which entitles you to refer to other people as parasites? For example, would you say your tax contributions have covered the amount spent on your education, health care and whatever benefits you have drawn over the years? Or, less prosaically, any notable sporting, artistic, scientific, or engineering achievements which have brought lustre to these isles?

    Anything?

    At all?

    # Would you agree that you have failed to grasp the reliance that the health service has on medical staff originating and trained overseas and that the policies you propose would lead to the immediate and catastrophic collapse of the health service in this country?

    # Did you really think Debbie Harry was British?

    (I met Debbie Harry at a post gig party in ’79. Not relevant, just don’t often get a chance to mention it.)

  183. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:17 pm  

    Jai. Seeing that most Asians now have the jobs Brits used to do, the corner shops we used to own, the taxi business we started, the property letting agencies, I’m unsurprised that you account for 6% of the GDP.

  184. Jai — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:49 pm  

    Seeing that most Asians now have the jobs Brits used to do, the corner shops we used to own, the taxi business we started, the property letting agencies, I’m unsurprised that you account for 6% of the GDP.

    Colin, you forgot to mention all the British Asians also working in medicine, law, dentistry, pharmacy, IT, management consultancy, IT consultancy, chartered accountancy, internal business strategy, and the investment banking sector.

    For example.

    All of which, incidentally, are extremely competitive fields to break into and work in, and where the primary criteria are academic qualifications, previous career history, organisational cultural fit, intellectual firepower and interpersonal skills.

    If you think that the opportunity to work in these fields — let alone actually securing an appropriate university position and subsequently landing a job in the target sector, frequently followed by the necessity to acquire relevant postgraduate qualifications — is handed to non-white British people on a silver platter, deliberately over and above equally-or-more-qualified white British candidates, with the primary factor being race rather than the other criteria I mentioned, and with this approach continuing in relation to promotion, assignment allocation, investment in training, along with internal corporate/organisational politics that one needs to successfully navigate in order to progress in one’s chosen field, especially if one is targetting the most prestigious and well-paid areas of one’s profession (or already works in that area)……then I’m afraid the reality is very, very different from what you presume it to be.

  185. Ravi Naik — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:52 pm  

    Seeing that most Asians now have the jobs Brits used to do, the corner shops we used to own, the taxi business we started, the property letting agencies, I’m unsurprised that you account for 6% of the GDP.

    Cry me a river must be your favourite song. :)

  186. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:57 pm  

    Progressives use the ‘liberal-construct’ to further themselves. They are as racist / fascist and bigoted as the next person. They simply use ‘liberalism’ to deflect scrutiny from their objectives.

  187. Don — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:57 pm  

    We?

    Who the hell is ‘we’?

    How many corner shops did you use to own?
    How many taxi businesses did you start?
    I’m guessing none. Because you wouldn’t put in the hours and the sweat.

    I remember back in the early seventies when an Indian guy bought a corner shop at the end of the road where I had my digs. Sure enough the white owner of the long established rival shop went under pretty quickly. He just didn’t understand that we were using the new shop because it was bloody open when we needed it. Right to the end he refused to stay open after five. And if the Indian guy didn’t stock something you wanted, you told him and he stocked it, he didn’t just mutter that there was no demand. In short, he was better at the job.

    Meritocracy in action.

  188. Ravi Naik — on 21st June, 2009 at 4:59 pm  

    I’m unsurprised that you account for 6% of the GDP

    Since you’ve boycotted “our” beer and “our” restaurants to teach “us” a lesson, I suggest you boycott “our” hindu number zero, and the positional system. So, please stick with the roman numeral system, or better yet, the indigenous numeral system invented in the British isles.

    Good luck representing 6%. :)

  189. Colin Brown — on 21st June, 2009 at 5:09 pm  

    What you’ve done is taken advantage of a people who value life with their families above that of an 18 hour working day. Yes. in the 60′s / 70′s life was slower – but we liked it that way.

    You see, we are not a people driven by greed. You Asians worship money like it was your God.

    You’ve turned a cohesive country into a smaller version of Calcutta. That may make England feel like home to you, but it has the opposite affect on us.

  190. Jai — on 21st June, 2009 at 5:16 pm  

    All of which, incidentally, are extremely competitive fields to break into and work in, and where the primary criteria are academic qualifications, previous career history, organisational cultural fit, intellectual firepower and interpersonal skills.

    And performance.

    That’s the bottom line. In these fields, performance is the number one criteria. And non-white Brits (including those who are Asian) are not cut any slack or done any favours when it comes to expectations of future performance and assessment of current or historical performance. Not by a long shot.

  191. Don — on 21st June, 2009 at 5:39 pm  

    Jai,

    I seriously doubt Colin can grasp what it means to work in a competitive field where one is judged on performance.

    As far as he is concerned, he’s white so he is entitled. And if he isn’t where he thinks he should be, it’s all because of the Other.

    Actually, this constant whining is becoming embarrassing.

  192. charlottelydia — on 21st June, 2009 at 11:28 pm  

    I know this comment is massively late in the thread – but Tower Hamlets is a theocracy?! I’m guessing he means a Muslim theocracy? Or just every religion that isn’t C of E? Having lived here for four years I’m struggling to understand how this could even possibly be thought to be true…
    The thing that I truly don’t understand about the BNP is – if they think that immigration and multiculturalism are so damaging for the white British population, why do they think we white liberals are still so anti-BNP? I mean, I know they think we’re all brainwashed, namby-pamby limp liberals but I’m not sure why this would mean we wanted to be discriminated against or persecuted by this supposed horde of non-white immigrants.

  193. douglas clark — on 22nd June, 2009 at 12:00 am  

    I really wonder if our Colin is not just a wind up? No-one that can type and google can be that uninformed, unless deliberately…

    Just a thought…

  194. Roger — on 22nd June, 2009 at 4:21 am  

    More probably “Colin Brown” is three BNP members working together: one can read, one can write and the third is there to keep an eye on those two intellectuals.

  195. Ravi Naik — on 22nd June, 2009 at 9:13 am  

    Look, you people just don’t get it do you. We have Italians, Greeks, Chinese, Gay’s and Jews in the BNP. Some of these members represent us at council level.

    So, basically you have foreigners doing the work that the British do not want to do – representing the BNP. :)

    I think you are taking the piss. I mean, is the BNP really accepting Chinese and openly gay people? Why people should waste time with you, when you make things up?

  196. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 9:41 am  

    You see, we are not a people driven by greed. You Asians worship money like it was your God.

    There is considerably irony in this statement, considering that London and New York are the world’s biggest financial centres and the greatest proponents of free market capitalism.

    The subprime mortgage collapse and the subsequent global “credit crunch”, with the disastrous impact on the global economy, originated here in the West, especially the US. There are reasons behind the phrase “When America sneezes, Britain catches a cold” and the causes of the problems in the American and British financial markets having such a huge negative impact on large swathes of the rest of the world.

    You’ve turned a cohesive country into a smaller version of Calcutta. That may make England feel like home to you, but it has the opposite affect on us.

    Unlikely, given the fact that:

    a) approximately 95% of Britain’s population is not of South Asian ethnicity, and since the highest levels of most governmental, professional and corporate fields in the UK are still dominated by white/Caucasian people, the fraction of the British population consisting of South Asians would not have such a disproportionate effect on the country (especially as South Asians are not evenly or heavily distributed across all of Britain’s urban or rural centres) — plus South Asians are not particularly highly represented in the entertainmnent industries, so they would not be disproportionately influential on British culture in that aspect either;

    b) huge numbers of 1st and 2nd-generation British Asians (especially amongst the Indian section of the population) are not, and never have been, involved in the service sector but are affiliated with the professions & industries I listed in #187;

    and c) The majority of British Asians under the age of 40 (who constitute the majority of the British Asian population as a whole) grew up in Britain, and therefore “Calcutta” would not “feel like home” to them any more than it would for the other 1.7 billion inhabitants of the Western Hemisphere.

  197. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 9:49 am  

    As far as I know, the BNP membership department doesn’t ask applicants if they are ‘openly Gay’ or Chinese.

  198. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:19 am  

    Chinese people are not European in terms of their racial background and geographical ancestry.

    It therefore begs the following question: If the BNP solely seeks to represent white/Caucasian people in Britain, why are those with Chinese ancestry allegedly allowed to join ?

    Assuming that Colin is telling the truth, of course.

  199. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:31 am  

    @ Jai.

    The vast majority of English people (the working class)place family life way above the pursuit of wealth. Of course we have to work. But (9 till 5) is good enough for us. This way, we can spend evenings and weekends with our children to aid them in their development.

    Brits have much smaller families than Asians. We therefore have fewer family members available to baby sit our children if the need arises for us to work longer hours.

    This has been our way for thousands of years. Owing to evolutionary and cultural differences, Brits simply cannot compete with South Asians and Muslims.

    In essence, you are taking advantage of our slower reproductive cycles – turning our disadvantage, into a profit. This doesn’t make you more intelligent. It simply makes you opportunists – a quality the British frown upon.

    This brings me full circle back to my original analysis that your actions as a people are indeed parasitic in nature.

  200. Ravi Naik — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:34 am  

    As far as I know, the BNP membership department doesn’t ask applicants if they are ‘openly Gay’ or Chinese.

    Sorry, this is a joke.

  201. Shamit — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:50 am  

    “Brits have much smaller families than Asians. We therefore have fewer family members available to baby sit our children if the need arises for us to work longer hours.”

    Colin – again the tendency to extrapolate without factual data.

    Most of the Asians I grew up with in Britain are either the only child or one of two. That does not really represent large families.

    On working long hours – irrespective of race, creed, religion – I hate to add what Jai already said as I am not as eloquent.

    Working hard is about aspiration and achievement. Aspiring to be something and achieve something is not what people should look down upon.

    One of the reasons we do not have Google’s, or Microsoft’s in this country is due to our lack of willing to do it.

    In that mix, if the British Asian lot are working hard – that is good for Britain and you should be thankful not contemptuous. But then again you support the BNP so not surprised.

  202. chairwoman — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:53 am  

    “This way, we can spend evenings and weekends with our children to aid them in their development.”

    Recent studies have shown that indigenous working class British children lag behind Chinese, (most) South Asian, Jewish, African children and Caribbean girls at all core development stages.

    Do the evenings and weekends spent aiding the children with their development concentrate on their academic studies, or mastering the latest Wii game, or sitting in the ‘family room’ or ‘beer garden’ down at the local?

    The late Chairman, who was as ‘indigenous’ as they come, was of the opinion that for the majority of the WWC, school was merely somewhere to send the children during the day to get them off their hands, and that their greatest fear was for them to become educated, and think that they were ‘better’ than their parents.

  203. Ravi Naik — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:54 am  

    This brings me full circle back to my original analysis that your actions as a people are indeed parasitic in nature

    Parasitic is defined as an organism that depends on others for survival. The people you are whining against actually work for long hours for their own survival and their families, they do not depend on the government, on “your” people or anyone else.

    The opposite is true: your constant embarrassing whining, the fact that you feel you have some kind of entitlement even though you are a worthless individual, makes you a parasite, or a wannabe parasite. Think that’s unfair? Don asked you several times how you have contributed to society, and you were unable to provide anything.

    As Jai demonstrated, when 4% of the population you loath generate 6% of the wealth, they are not leaching, they are actively contributing to this society.

  204. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 10:58 am  

    Brits have much smaller families than Asians.

    Provide verifiable statistics for the average number of children that British Asians under the age of 40 have. Split the data according to British Indian, British Pakistani, British Bangladeshi and British Sri Lankan. Provide corresponding data for the average number of children that white/Caucasian British people under the age of 40 have. Finally, divide each set of data according to socio-economic group and/or income level.

    We therefore have fewer family members available to baby sit our children if the need arises for us to work longer hours.

    Makes a false assumption about the proportion of British Asians under the age of 40 who live in extended families, particularly those who fall into the 40% Income Tax bracket.

    This has been our way for thousands of years.

    Historically false. Families having the maximum number of children possible has been prevalent in many parts of the world including Britain, due to high infant mortality rates, lack of adequate healthcare, lack of a sufficiently high standard of living, and (until relatively recently) lack of access to effective contraception.

    As standards of living rise, the number of children that survive increases and there is therefore less need to have more children to compensate, coupled with access to effective birth control. This has been the case here in Britain during the past century, and has also been duplicated by large numbers of the British Asian population, especially those who are Indians and particularly amongst the affluent.

    In essence, you are taking advantage of our slower reproductive cycles

    Provide verifiable medical sources confirming that white British people inherently have “slower reproductive cycles” compared to South Asians.

    Owing to evolutionary and cultural differences

    Provide verifiable medical sources confirming that white/Caucasian British people are inherently less fertile than South Asian British people, including the specific historical and biological reasons for this to be the case.

  205. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:06 am  

    No.

    Shamit you are wrong.

    Check for yourself. Asians have twice as many offspring on average as Brits.

    http://www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?v=25

  206. chairwoman — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:10 am  

    Did those UK statistics only refer to the births of indigenous Britons?

    If so, please refer us to the statistics for the non-indigenous.

    Thank you.

  207. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:11 am  

    Jai.

    The UK is located in the Northern hemisphere. It is a well known fact, that inhabitants of colder countries have fewer children than those who inhabit warmer climates.

    Keep it real.

  208. Shamit — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:15 am  

    Colin

    Again extrapolating without evidence.

    Nowhere in the link do we see the birthrate among the British Asian population or any comparative data on birthrates or population in the UK.

    So am i really wrong?

    Listen to “the better angels of your nature” and quit supporting this racist bigoted and utterly worthless organisation called the BNP.

    Come on you know you want to.

  209. Ravi Naik — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:19 am  

    Colin, with all this talk about “indigenous” and “asian” family values, you seem to forget that Britain has the highest rate of teenage pregnancies in Europe (and STDs), and these sectors of society are heavily dependant on welfare. Your romantic view of Britain deserves some honest scrutiny. The fact that the BNP is unwilling to do that, is no excuse for you not to.

  210. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:37 am  

    Colin Brown

    “You see, we are not a people driven by greed. You Asians worship money like it was your God.”

    Hate to agree with a BNP scumbag but Colin is right; the greed and materialism in the Asian community is grotesque . It is an anathema to all the religious traditions Asians follow.

  211. Jai — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:50 am  

    It is a well known fact, that inhabitants of colder countries have fewer children than those who inhabit warmer climates.

    British Asians are inhabitants of the UK. The number of children that the inhabitants of warmer climates have is therefore completely irrelevant in this situation.

    Keep it real.

    Indeed, Colin. It’s generally not good scientific practice to assume that statistics & behaviour pertaining to the inhabitants of countries thousands of miles away have any bearing on, for example, the reproductive behaviour of people whose ancestry may lie in that part of the world but who actually live in other countries, particularly when the people concerned have actually grown up in the West during the last 40 years and are therefore fully a part of the Western Hemisphere’s population along with the other 1.7 billion people I mentioned earlier.

  212. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 11:55 am  

    Ravi.

    Agreed.

    Sadly, many British teenagers have lost their way. They are an embarrassment – a stain on our image as a people. However, the opportunity of social mobility, has been denied them by a succession of Labour/Tory misrule spanning the last five decades.

    Advertising in all it’s forms has further influenced our teens to behave in this disgraceful way. TV adds such as Durex and alcopos have helped to send our children (not all) into a spiral off depravity

    I get depressed when I see British teenage girls walking about in clothing that leaves very little to the imagination. They would look just as attractive if not more so in a long summer dress.

  213. douglas clark — on 22nd June, 2009 at 12:06 pm  

    Colin is of course misusing statistics, much in the same way as he has misused cut and paste. Though there is a complete continent with an absolute birth rate you could count on your fingers and possibly toes. And it is, indeed, very cold.

    Colin, I know you can use Google, well at least make it work, comprehension might be quite a good thing too.

    Try Googling

    Demographic Transition Model

    for some fairly straightforward explanations about why birth rates are higher in poorer parts of the world. The country that tops the list you linked to – Niger – is near the bottom of the same CIA factbook for life expectancy, a paltry 44.28 years. And there are thirteen basket cases below that too. Pity the prospects of the child born in Swaziland where life expectancy is 31.99 years.

  214. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 12:45 pm  

    Colin Brown
    “I get depressed when I see British teenage girls walking about in clothing that leaves very little to the imagination. They would look just as attractive if not more so in a long summer dress.”

    Nice to know you are so conservative. So why does your party want to ban the Muslim hijab (headscarf)?

  215. munir — on 22nd June, 2009 at 12:48 pm  

    Colin Brown
    “Sadly, many British teenagers have lost their way. They are an embarrassment – a stain on our image as a people. However, the opportunity of social mobility, has been denied them by a succession of Labour/Tory misrule spanning the last five decades.”

    Are you serious? Yeah the poor in the past could easily improve their social mobility. Though there are still barriers its never been easier for people from poor backgrounds to progress. How many of their grandparents generation had the chance to go to university or do other than manual jobs ?

  216. Colin Brown — on 22nd June, 2009 at 1:36 pm  

    @ “So why does your party want to ban the Muslim hijab (headscarf”)

    I haven’t heard the BNP call for the hijab to be banned. Please provide a link.

    The BNP certainly aren’t keen on the Burka because it represents a symbol of female oppression imposed by men that are thought to be insecure or repressive to their own women.

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