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  • Technorati: graph / links

    Who did you vote for today?


    by Sunny on 4th June, 2009 at 1:36 pm    

    I hope you did, because if you didn’t then you’re helping the BNP.



      |   Trackback link   |   Add to del.icio.us   |   Share on Facebook   |   Filed in: Current affairs




    81 Comments below   |   Add your own

    1. hantsboy — on 4th June, 2009 at 1:41 pm  

      BNP of course

    2. Sally — on 4th June, 2009 at 1:52 pm  

      me too… BNP!

    3. David T — on 4th June, 2009 at 1:57 pm  

      Lovely Claude Moraes is at the top of the Labour list - a VERY easy choice.

    4. Cyburn — on 4th June, 2009 at 1:58 pm  

      UKIP

    5. damon — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:06 pm  

      Green. Even though I’m not particularly Green.
      I couldn’t do the Arthur Scargill party, and the No2EU party who I’d only seen a three minute braodcast about.
      Taking the vote away from a BNP voter was a motivation, as well as was not voting Labour.
      ‘Do the least harm’ was the reason for my vote.
      Pointless I know, but I got some slight pleasure just by going through the motions of voting and interacting with the people who manned the polling station.

    6. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:17 pm  

      I trust that those of you out there who voted for the BNP are aware of the fact that senior members of the party include people who (like Iran’s Ahmedinejad) deny the Holocaust, believe women “enjoy” being raped, and believe that handicapped people should be subject to forcible euthanasia (that’s “medical executions” to those of you who are unfamiliar with the term).

      Presumably none of you had relatives who fought in Europe in WW2, or are particularly close to female family members (or are women yourself), or have any handicapped friends or relatives amongst your immediate or extended family, or possess some kind of guarantee that you will not become handicapped yourselves (due to illness or an accident) during the reign of any hypothetical BNP government.

      Oh, wait…..

    7. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:19 pm  

      I would have been tempted to vote for Labour if Hazel Blears had been dragged to the ducking pond. Not least because she thinks her leaving in the way she has earns her credit after her expense claims - whereas I think Brown should leak everything he can about her financial affairs.

      If Hoon had also gone, and been pilloried I wouldn’t have hesitated. He will go of course, and I hope Brown makes the most of it.

      As for Cameron and Clegg - I have a feeling they’ve lost the plot. We, the public are surely thinking that they are trying to bury their own MPs expense claims by putting it all on Brown. A bit like what they did to Michael Martin. Brown’s hand will be strengthened by all this.

      So after due consideration, its the Greens (despite that fool Thatchell) or some socialist party.

    8. platinum786 — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:20 pm  

      I voted Labour… they serve my purposes….

      We have a lib dem council and they’re a flop, exactly the same as everyone else, just less efficient. So i thought, might as well vote for the crooks who are good at what they do.

      I like the fact there were so many anti Europe parties, it’ll mean splitting the BNP vote base.

    9. Sally — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:28 pm  

      Jai, you want to believe all that daft propaganda that’s down to you. I just want my country back and to not feel like a second class citizen in it…

      I’m fed up with the crap that Labour has done in the name of multiculturalism. Multiculturalism doesn’t work!!!

    10. zain — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:32 pm  

      Labour.

    11. Don — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:32 pm  

      I’ll be voting after work. Lib-dem or green.

    12. Ravi Naik — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:33 pm  

      believe that handicapped people should be subject to forcible euthanasia (that’s “medical executions” to those of you who are unfamiliar with the term).

      Who defended that position?

    13. Amrit — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:33 pm  

      I just want my country back

      Well then, eff off back to where you came from, alright?

      I find it hilarious that you think actual, recorded BNP actions are ‘daft propaganda’, but then once an ignorant deluded racist, always an ignorant deluded racist.

      You might not feel like a second-class citizen if you weren’t a racist out-of-touch ass… oh wait.

      Same as Don, I will soon be heading off. Probably Lib Dem, I think, after finding out that the Greens are anti-stem-cell research.

    14. Ravi Naik — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:38 pm  

      I will be voting lib-dems. I will not vote Labour for the next decade, and I still can’t find myself voting for the conservatives, but I may soon.

    15. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:45 pm  

      Ravi,

      Who defended that position?

      Apparently it was a remark by Geoff Marshall, one of the BNP’s central London campaigners, in response to the death of David Cameron’s child earlier this year.

    16. hantsboy — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:50 pm  

      Jai.

      What’s the BNP take on caste do you know ?

      lol

    17. Ravi Naik — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:54 pm  

      Apparently it was a remark by Geoff Marshall, one of the BNP’s central London campaigners, in response to the death of David Cameron’s child earlier this year.

      The reason I ask is that I cannot find any source that confirms this.

    18. Ravi Naik — on 4th June, 2009 at 2:56 pm  

      What’s the BNP take on caste do you know ?

      According to stormfront, Aryans introduced the caste system in India. So I guess Nick Griffin thinks it is a nice thing.

    19. Steve Baker — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:00 pm  

      Yeah, Amrit, A good british name c*nt! You eff off!!!

    20. Shamit — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:11 pm  

      Steve

      Manners manners my boy.

      You really don’t want to get your ass kicked on this blog or do you? Your choice.

      Sally

      You want to live in your delusional world that’s fine by me — but please don’t for a minute suggest that your viewes represent majority British view.

    21. munir — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:14 pm  

      Steve Baker
      “Yeah, Amrit, A good british name c*nt! You eff off!!!”

      Shockingly for a BNP voter you appear to be extremely dumb. Amrit was clearly parodying Sallys comment about “wanting her country back” by saying what the BNP say to Asian and Black Britons (yes they exist)
      “Well then, eff off back to where you came from, alright?”

      Dont worry though -if your lot of losers get in (which you never will) nearly everyone will be effing off including a large part of the white population.

    22. munir — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:15 pm  

      Ravi naik
      “According to stormfront, Aryans introduced the caste system in India.”

      So whats your take on who introduced the caste system?

    23. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:17 pm  

      Sally,

      you want to believe all that daft propaganda that’s down to you.

      See Amrit’s comment #13. And incidentally, Nick Griffin also has explicit links to America’s KKK. I suppose you’re okay with that too.

      I just want my country back and to not feel like a second class citizen in it…I just want my country back and to not feel like a second class citizen in it

      Let’s get this straight. Out of a population of approximately 60 million people in Britain, approximately 50 million are white.

      Furthermore, the bulk of senior positions in the Government, along with the media, entertainment industries, corporate sectors and medical fields are held by white people.

      And yet, you feel like a “second class citizen” and believe that the country is not in “your” hands.

      Interesting.

      I’m fed up with the crap that Labour has done in the name of multiculturalism.

      It’s nothing compared to the devastating impact on this country as a result of a hypothetical BNP government implementing its various ill-thought-out policies and the global response to them.

      Presumably you haven’t considered exactly what will happen to Britain as a result of the subsequent US-led-and-enforced international sanctions, trade embargoes/boycotts of British goods and services, total collapse of the economy, complete destruction of the British banking sector (far beyond what’s recently occurred), mass starvation due to a cessation of foreign food imports, explusion of Britain from NATO and the United States terminating its military alliance with the UK, and the possible military consequences of the US and its allies objecting to a BNP government with access to nuclear weapons.

      If you think you’ve got it bad now, take some time out to think about what would actually happen if the BNP were in power, resulting in Britain quickly becoming a worldwide pariah. The world is far more interconnected and globalised than you think, and other countries (especially the United States) have the power to wreak a revenge against a “Griffin Government” and the British citizens that elected him which would completely destroy this country.

      Unless you think that an African-American US president in control of the most powerful country on the planet, with a rapidly increasing and influential domestic non-white population, and who is currently busy building diplopmatic and trade ties with non-white majority countries across the world, is just going to turn a blind eye to a British government with an explicitly racist attitude towards non-white people.

      I’m afraid the real world doesn’t work that way. This is the reality of life in 2009, regardless of the BNP’s wishful thinking. Elect the BNP to Number 10 Downing Street and you sign Britain’s death warrant — because of what the rest of the world (especially the United States) will do to this country in retaliation soon afterwards.

      I hope the rest of you friendly BNP-supporting folks on this thread are taking notes too. Try to think about the consequences in the context of how the world actually is, not how you would like it to be.

    24. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:19 pm  

      Hantsboy,

      What’s the BNP take on caste do you know ?

      I’m not a Hindu but why don’t you explain it to us, unless you think that Ravi’s comment #18 is accurate.

      Cheers mate.

    25. munir — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:26 pm  

      “Sally,

      you want to believe all that daft propaganda that’s down to you.”

      “Jai

      See Amrit’s comment #13. And incidentally, Nick Griffin also has explicit links to America’s KKK. I suppose you’re okay with that too”

      Thats actually one of teh stupidest things about the BNP. If you visit their website you will see loads of articles complaining about the media being liars and fabricating stories… while at the same time they report stories often from the same papers about evil immigrants!!

    26. Shamit — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:33 pm  

      Most Hindus hate the caste system as it is probably the worst manifestation of the darker side of Hinduism. And BNP goes and wants to take credit for it. Hey you can have the credit Hantsboy if you want it. We don’t want it.

      ***********************

      Sally — you are the Einstein aren’t you? Could you follow through a logical analysis of what would be the impact of BNP core policies in Britain?

      If you could understand it then maybe Jai’s post would make sense. But reading I know is hard isn’t it

      If you have problems with some (or many) of the the big words and ideas Jai may have used please do not hesitate to ask for help. We would be kind I promise.

    27. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 3:35 pm  

      Steve Baker,

      Yeah, Amrit, A good british name c*nt! You eff off!!!

      Just to supplement Shamit’s response to your well-spoken, articulate, and devastatingly original “message” to Amrit, if you are familiar with this website then you will hopefully already be aware of the response that members of the BNP and their supporters have received on previous occasions, regardless of their best efforts to intimidate people here (verbally or intellectually) or spread their propaganda about “racial superiority”, “racial purity”, “indigenous British people” and so on.

      If not, then I recommend you go through the archives and familiarise yourself with previous dicussions on the matter. You may wish to do a search specifically for the usernames “Bert Rustle” and “Isaac Brown”.

      However, if you and your BNP-supporting friends here currently intend to continue making racially offensive remarks against other commenters and gratuitously try to provoke people, I’m giving you all an opportunity to retain your dignity and make a civilised exit. I strongly advise you all to take it, before I change my mind.

    28. Rod — on 4th June, 2009 at 4:04 pm  

      Seriously, I can’t believe the people who actually votes for the BNP, the leaflets they send through the post are ridiculous I dont even know why they are allowed to publish stuff like that.
      But after surfing the web and reading through different comments of the BNP supporters, is it just me or are they actually retarded who doesn’t have an idea on how an economy works?

    29. joe90kane — on 4th June, 2009 at 4:14 pm  

      Who did you vote for today?

      The Scottish National Party of course.

    30. JuliaM — on 4th June, 2009 at 4:15 pm  

      “…after surfing the web and reading through different comments of the BNP supporters, is it just me or are they actually retarded who doesn’t have an idea on how an economy works?”

      Hell, we’ve got a Chancellor who can’t add up, so I guess anything’s possible…

    31. Mr. Feathers — on 4th June, 2009 at 4:40 pm  

      Conservative.

    32. Don — on 4th June, 2009 at 5:07 pm  

      Voting done. Went Green in the end, although tempted by Proclaim Jesus is Lord Party. Very low turnout here so far - very low. It’s a rural area and an older population who maybe don’t feel connected to Europe, but it could lead to an interesting result. If the big parties aren’t getting their vote out (I wasn’t canvassed once and only got leaflets from LibDems, BNP and Tories)then UKIP and Green could be players. BNP isn’t even a blip around here.

    33. Vikrant — on 4th June, 2009 at 5:08 pm  

      I’d voted UKIP if i was back home…

    34. chairwoman — on 4th June, 2009 at 5:28 pm  

      Applied too late for postal vote so haven’t done so, though heavens only knows who I’d have voted for.

      We have had virtually no electoral literature delivered here at all apart from the Daily Mirror’s hope not hate leaflet.

    35. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 5:48 pm  

      But after surfing the web and reading through different comments of the BNP supporters, is it just me or are they actually retarded who doesn’t have an idea on how an economy works?

      They don’t seem to be quite up to speed on the impact on a country’s economy if deeply-integrated international investment and business ties are terminated. Not to mention the military ramifications of the United States pulling the plug on the transatlantic “special relationship” and turning from Britain’s strongest ally into its most influential and most heavily-armed enemy.

      And that’s before we even begin to address the effect of a complete cessation of the import/transmission of American products in the entertainment industry, or the impact on the tourism industry (with the associated damage to the economy) of a US-led global boycott of business-related or recreational travel to the UK, with no travel to the US (or any of its allies) allowed by America either unless it’s in extenuating circumstances and/or in the case of permanent immigration or refugees seeking asylum from the BNP regime.

      No more American programmes or films on Sky, on DVD or in the cinema, folks; no more American music either, except via Youtube (unless the US blocks British internet access to that too). And no more holidays to the US or many other popular international destinations either. Those happy days will be over if you elect the BNP — not because the BNP will necessarily ban all this themselves, but because the rest of the world (again, especially the US) will implement and enforce these restrictions on Britain.

      The resulting impact on British culture and everday life will be much more severe than you may think.

      Vote the BNP into power, and the end result will not be “getting your country back” — it will actually turn Britain into a global outcaste like North Korea or Afghanistan under the Taliban, with similar consequences for the British population and the lives of ordinary people here.

    36. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 5:59 pm  

      or the impact on the tourism industry (with the associated damage to the economy)

      The travel industry too. Imagine the scale of the collapse of British airline companies involved in international flights, including BA.

      It wouldn’t be a pretty sight, to say the least.

    37. Chris Baldwin — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:05 pm  

      Labour and proud. Bring back Clause Four.

    38. Jai — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:11 pm  

      The bottom line is the following: If any of you reading this who support the BNP think that life for ordinary people in Britain would just “carry on as normal” if you ever managed to successfully elect a BNP government, only with no non-white people around, but in all other aspects exactly like it currently is or some kind of return to a “pre-multiracial society”, and with minimal national and international repercussions, then you’re very, very naive.

      As I said before, do some serious thinking about how the world in 2009 really is, not how the BNP claim it is or how you would ideally like it to be.

    39. Vikrant — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:12 pm  

      Jai,

      BNP voters like their party are one-trick ponies. I doubt they seriously give two hoots for such fancy words like economy!

    40. Faisal — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:16 pm  

      The Lib Dems. As a vote of gratitude to Vince Cable.

    41. Amrit — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:38 pm  

      Steve Baker:

      I’ve got the PERFECT British name for you. Tosser.

      And that is the last time (for now) that I deal with ‘Lauren Baker’, ‘Steve Baker’, ‘Isaac Brown’ and other assorted BNP trolls.

      Arguing with a goat would be vastly more intelligible/enjoyable/intellectually challenging. Come back when you know not to use Polish Spitfires/Italian pensioners/American steelworkers on your ‘daft propaganda.’ Ta ta!

      Shock horror, I voted Lib Dem as previously forecast.

    42. Don — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:38 pm  

      Yeah, Vince is the man.

      Jai, I’ve just remembered that, oh must be thirty years ago, I read a novel about a UK under a far-right NF type regime with football hooligan militias and pariah status.

      I think it began with an exiled British journo whose plane had been forced to land at Heathrow due to mechanical failure and who was then taken off by thugs…and then some stuff happened.
      It was a good book.

    43. Clairwil — on 4th June, 2009 at 6:56 pm  

      I voted No2EU.

    44. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 7:52 pm  

      OK just been - this household has gone 100% Green.

      According to guardian of the ballot box at my polling station, this afternoon has been very busy. I do hope that’s a sign of a Green landslide.

      Also has anyone noticed stories in their local papers where BNP supporter have been racially abused. There is one in mine. Just wondered if it was a repear of a well-worn strategy.

    45. Rumbold — on 4th June, 2009 at 7:53 pm  

      I voted Jury Team. Reza Zindabad!

    46. Clairwil — on 4th June, 2009 at 8:06 pm  

      Refresh,
      I haven’t seen that but I did hear they’ve been making a show of checking the ballot boxes and muttering about fraud, presumably getting their excuses in early.

    47. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 8:39 pm  

      Rumbold,

      ‘I voted Jury Team.’

      Come on. Why? When you realise that the individuals might be independent but for the guy funding it its a vanity project (isn’t he called Judge?) you’ve got to think twice. Don’t you?

      And isn’t he connected in the City, and may even be more sympathetic to the bankers than is good for mankind?

    48. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 8:48 pm  

      Clairwil,

      Interesting ploy on their part. Sounds like they want to play it like it was Zimbabwe.

    49. Narinder Purba — on 4th June, 2009 at 8:54 pm  

      Sunny, who did you vote for? I’m curious!

      I’ve been out with chatting to voters today and the mood is - as you would expect - rather dour.

      I have heard lots of people saying that they’re not voting at all, which is truly tragic. At a grass root level, I do think that the recession and the whole expenses debacle has put people off politics. You would have thought it would inspire people to get more involved in politics, but for the majority of people who actually vote - which is generally older folk- they’re fed up with the system. Lots of them, who have voted for as long as they can remember, are not voting at all. It’s a massive shift. Expect low votes.

      Meanwhile, young people have no time for politics. I’m not making sweeping generalizations, but if you actually go in your area and have proper discourse with young people from 18-28, you’ll find if you did a poll, that most of them will 1) not vote and 2) not care about voting. Again, this is a cultural thing that has developed in a consumer driven democracy. They don’t ‘get politics’ and thus have a ‘couldn’t give a fuck attitude’.

      Interesting times!!!

    50. A Councillor Writes — on 4th June, 2009 at 8:59 pm  

      I voted LibDem, well I wouldn’t wouldn’t I.

      However, I voted for them as the only real pro-European party. One of the tragic legacies of this government has been to never even try to bring Britain closer to the heart of Europe as Phony Tony promised back in 1997.

    51. Clairwil — on 4th June, 2009 at 9:07 pm  

      Refresh,
      Well they’d been scamming a fortune in donations off their supporters in the run up to this and using the promise of record gains to do so. If they don’t do as well as promised a lot of folk are going to be feeling cheated. Someone else will need to take the blame if the Griffin gravy train …ooops.. leadership is to avoid being derailed.

    52. comrade — on 4th June, 2009 at 9:10 pm  

      I vote for the Socialist labour Party. out of the EU and into the rest of the World.

    53. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 9:39 pm  

      Comrade, I looked at that option but decided against it. I heard their party political broadcast was pretty good, simple and to the point.

    54. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 10:08 pm  

      Just heard the great news, Purnell has gone. A bit too late for me, I’ve already voted. Another one who was mired in the expenses debacle.

      I hope Brown doesn’t fluff it now. A moment for greatness is on him.

    55. 5cc — on 4th June, 2009 at 10:27 pm  

      I had to traipse across London to my mum’s because I didn’t get my change of address in on time all so I could vote Green and get back home and find out they’re anti stem cell research. Bugger. Thanks Amrit.

      I also found out that my Daily Mail reading mother voted for UKIP because ‘the man sounded alright on the telly’.

      Lucky I go through the, “Don’t fall for the stuff from the BNP,” “Who’s the BNP?” routine several times every single election.

    56. Clairwil — on 4th June, 2009 at 10:30 pm  

      I’ve just heard that voting turnout in Glasgow (my stamping ground) is an apalling 7%. Is that a record low?

    57. sarah — on 4th June, 2009 at 11:06 pm  

      Lib Dem.

      Jai @ 6- ‘BNP believe that handicapped people should be subject to forcible euthanasia’ Can I have a link to that policy, please?

    58. Andy Gilmour — on 4th June, 2009 at 11:07 pm  

      SNP for me.

      If I lived in England, it’d have to have been the Lib Dems, because the English Green Party is just far too attached to various species of “woo” nonsense…

      Ho hum.

    59. Sunny — on 4th June, 2009 at 11:21 pm  

      I voted Green. My mother, who I went with to vote, turned into some massive Green supporter overnight and told everyone she met on the way to vote Green! hehe

    60. Refresh — on 4th June, 2009 at 11:23 pm  

      Sarah its not really all about policy, its what makes up the membership. Just as we do not tolerate MPs who remain silent on spurious expense claims, we would not vote for people who tolerate members who do or have advocated inhumane attitudes.

    61. nobodys fool — on 5th June, 2009 at 12:28 am  

      ukip, stop britain becoming a county council

    62. Clairwil — on 5th June, 2009 at 1:42 am  

      @Sarah,
      It’s not policy -yet. He posted the remarks on this blog

      http://thevoiceofreason-ann.blogspot.com/2009/02/sympathy-for-caring-compassionate.html

    63. platinum786 — on 5th June, 2009 at 9:04 am  

      It’s a shame that I’ve not come across any BNP leaflets or campaigners. I would have told them to go back to where they came from. I have a sound theory. Black people don’t get sunburnt in Africa, Asian people don’t get sunburnt in Asia, The spanish don’t get sunburnt in Spain, neither do the Italians get sunburnt in Italy.

      Then why do white people in Britain get sunburnt? Obviously not your country, so Eff off. It could work well to confuse them, as long as nobody with more than 1 brain cell decides to blabber on about Science and facts. We all know BNP voters don’t do facts, we don’t need to tell them any either.

      I was also wanting to taunt them about staying in Britain and outbreeding them, but alas, no BNP people came around to our hood.

    64. Jai — on 5th June, 2009 at 9:48 am  

      @Sarah,
      It’s not policy -yet. He posted the remarks on this blog

      Thanks Clairwil.

      I’d recommend that everyone reading this takes some time out to browse through that article and the subsequent comment thread when you have a spare few minutes. It makes for quite horrific reading.

      The guy’s knowledge of classical European history seems to be somewhat lacking too, giving the sweeping and inaccurate generalisation he’s made about the ancient Greeks and Romans allegedly supporting this practice (the Spartans definitely did, but the Athenians didn’t, and Roman attitudes to disability and parental [especially paternal] acceptance of newborn children weren’t quite how he’s claiming them to be either).

      Interesting seeing his sneering deflection of the spot-on comparison another commenter made with the Nazi policy on dealing with disabled people, but not unexpected.

    65. Jai — on 5th June, 2009 at 10:25 am  

      Don,

      Jai, I’ve just remembered that, oh must be thirty years ago, I read a novel about a UK under a far-right NF type regime with football hooligan militias and pariah status.

      I think it began with an exiled British journo whose plane had been forced to land at Heathrow due to mechanical failure and who was then taken off by thugs…and then some stuff happened.
      It was a good book.

      Sounds pretty interesting. The fallout from the election of a BNP government would be even more destructive in the present day, considering how the worldwide economy works and the extent of globalisation that Britain has been subject to.

      Tying this in to my reply to Clairwil above and also Ravi’s previous comments, I think that greater publicity and awareness within the general British public about attitudes on multiple relevant matters amongst senior BNP members, the party’s planned policies upon achieving power, and the real-world national and global consequences of a BNP government would definitely be a good idea. People should know exactly what they’re voting for, and what would happen to their lives and to the country as a whole if they succeeded in electing the BNP. As I said earlier, the consequences would be far more extensive and widespread than just “getting rid of the darkies”.

      I wonder if any supporters of the BNP or indeed the party’s own members would be able to effectively provide credible rebuttals and detailed explanations in response to a point-by-point breakdown of exactly what would happen to British society and its infrastructure economically and militarily upon the election of a BNP government, and what contigency measures they have planned in order to secure the safety & survival of the remaining British civilian population and ensure the continuing viability of Britain so that it doesn’t collapse into an ostracised, poverty-stricken “failed state”.

      Perhaps someone should ask them. It would be interesting to see what kind of comprehensive response would be forthcoming, or if (as I suspect) it would be pie-in-the-sky rhetoric similar to Anjem Choudary/Al-Muhajiroun’s “Black flag of Islam over Downing Street” aspirations, with little understanding of the on-the-ground real-life repercussions of such an organisation achieving national political power. When I refer to the BNP as the “British Taliban Party”, I’m not exaggerating; people should really look at the precedents of Taliban-ruled Afghanistan for an example of the impact of massive economic collapse and worldwide ostracisation that would similarly result right here in Ol’ Blighty.

    66. damon — on 5th June, 2009 at 2:21 pm  

      I just heard that a guy from The English Democrats won the mayoralty race in Doncaster.
      As well as cutting his own salary from £63,000 to £30,000 and cutting the number of councillors in half and scrapping some of these events:
      United Nations Day, Black History Month and (I think) International Women’s day.
      http://www.doncaster.gov.uk/Living_in_Doncaster/Equalities_and_diversity/Celebrating_Diversity/Celebrating_Diversity.asp

      Sounds pretty reactionary about cutting all those events, and maybe is a foretaste of what the BNP could do if they weren’t so unelectable because of the ‘Nazi/Fascist’ tag which is used (probably rightly) to undermine them.

    67. Refresh — on 5th June, 2009 at 3:05 pm  

      OK Hoon’s gone!

      Had this happened on Wednesday or even up to 8:00pm Thursday, I’d have voted Labour.

      And yes possibly even considered joining to work for the reinstatement of Clause 4.

    68. bananabrain — on 5th June, 2009 at 3:14 pm  

      And yes possibly even considered joining to work for the reinstatement of Clause 4.

      deary me - and it’s supposed to be conservatives who want to turn the clock back to the golden age of never-was.

      b’shalom

      bananabrain

    69. Refresh — on 5th June, 2009 at 3:17 pm  

      You sneer Bananabrain, but its the taxpayer, the public, the workers that saved the economy. LOL

    70. bananabrain — on 5th June, 2009 at 3:23 pm  

      which includes the middle class, mr clever-pants. or are you suggesting that the economy was somehow bailed out by a combination of bob crow, ken livingstone and the SWP?

      b’shalom

      bananabrain

    71. Refresh — on 5th June, 2009 at 3:42 pm  

      And the middle class aren’t blind either, they know the price they’ve had to pay - they would realise the dream they were sold had a price.

      Are you opposed to having the railways in public ownership; and the banks (although that’s already happened)?

      I mean come on, how does the middle class get paid? The growth in consultancy culture, as one example, came from a bribe from the government to the middle classes - just look at all the quangos. Are they not almost invariably chock-a-block with the middle class?

      Look again at the managerial level of the voluntary sector, are they not the middle class. All hankering after central government funding. I would say if anything Blair nationalised the middle class.

      And do not get carried away with the notion that the captains of industry have contributed anything of lasting value. They have relied heavily on corporate welfare throughout. That’s public money to keep them afloat, keep them investing in innovation, in training and worst of all they still do their damndest to avoid paying tax.

    72. bananabrain — on 5th June, 2009 at 3:59 pm  

      Are you opposed to having the railways in public ownership;

      it depends what you mean. they are a critical national asset, so ought to be accountable to the country in some way, but equally, as someone who, without putting too fine a point on this, knows something about how this sector works, the productivity, innovation and efficiencies will simply not happen without the private sector’s involvement. it is, however, a very complex issue.

      and the banks (although that’s already happened)?

      the same obtains for the banks; the problem was the regulatory regime being too lax, but the solution is certainly not for the government to kid itself that it is competent to run the banking system when it can’t even run an IT procurement project.

      I mean come on, how does the middle class get paid? The growth in consultancy culture, as one example, came from a bribe from the government to the middle classes - just look at all the quangos. Are they not almost invariably chock-a-block with the middle class?

      one might think, listening to you, that nobody middle class works for the employers of these consultants, in the NHS, or in government, or wherever. one might think that there are no middle-class teachers, or doctors, even. this attitude of yours belongs in the ark.

      Look again at the managerial level of the voluntary sector, are they not the middle class. All hankering after central government funding. I would say if anything Blair nationalised the middle class.

      i suppose you think that nobody should be allowed to work in the public sector unless they are working class. what codswallop.

      And do not get carried away with the notion that the captains of industry have contributed anything of lasting value. They have relied heavily on corporate welfare throughout. That’s public money to keep them afloat, keep them investing in innovation, in training

      i dare say i know more about innovation than you do, as i work in it - and i can tell you that it is very much a commercial issue in the private sector. government money for innovation goes largely to small businesses, the universities - oh, of course, that’s the middle class again, isn’t it, shame. we should just ban middle class people from universities and eliminate the petty-bourgeoisie, you maoist imbecile.

      b’shalom

      bananabrain

    73. Adnan — on 5th June, 2009 at 4:07 pm  

      Bananabrain @ 72 - a surprisingly restrained response!

    74. Refresh — on 5th June, 2009 at 4:14 pm  

      Bananabrain, oh no its going to turn into one of those threads. And try not to insult or you will be talking to yourself.

      As for being in innovation, good for you. Interestingly so am I, possibly much longer than you have.

      Why the presumption that the middle class is opposed to nationalised industries?

      I think you really have missed the point about the middle class. From your outlook it suggests whilst the middle class continues to be fed and watered in the manner they are accustomed to they will continue to support the status quo. The middle class, this might sound like an echo, is not homogenous.

    75. Dave S — on 5th June, 2009 at 4:34 pm  

      Shock news: Anti-voting anarchist (plus anarcho-friends) voted for the Green party!

      And then we all confessed to it later over dinner… hah!

    76. Adnan — on 5th June, 2009 at 4:38 pm  

      Refresh @ 74 The issue is that you yourself don’t seem to recognise that the middle class is not homogeneous. You appear to caricature the middle classes as either tax-avoiding super-rich or useless management consultants making money hand-over-fist in PFI projects.

    77. Refresh — on 5th June, 2009 at 4:55 pm  

      Adnan,
      The point I was attempting to make was that new labour co-opted the middle class by growing the consultancy culture. And they are being paid from central government through quangos. A form of benefit culture.

      I have known quite a few. And have worked with some of those quangos too.

      As for corporate welfare, there is an excellent book by George Monbiot which outlines this trend very well. Its the flow of money from below to the top.

      People who do deserve praise in the private sector are those that actually, genuinely create wealth. Not those that threaten, as an example, to move their production or call centres abroad unless they get some sort of bribe or grant.

      And then there are those who do avoid tax. PFI of course is another scam.

    78. marvin — on 5th June, 2009 at 5:10 pm  

      Heh. For the first time in history Labour doesn’t control a single council in England!

    79. The Dude — on 5th June, 2009 at 9:29 pm  

      Lib Dems or more precisely, Vince Cable. A way must be found to make this giant of an intellect, lead this country OUT of the mess that both Labour and Tories have got it into. Vince Cable is the ONLY man I trust, period! The two main parties have all but merged into one another, leaving the man in the street with nowhere to go except the Lib Dems.

    80. Hamed — on 5th June, 2009 at 11:57 pm  

      BNP of course

    81. KEV — on 5th June, 2009 at 11:59 pm  

      BNP Rule and always will.



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