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	<title>Comments on: Not supportive of Shabina Begum</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370</link>
	<description>Current affairs for a progressive generation</description>
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		<title>By: Sunny</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16759</link>
		<dc:creator>Sunny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 13:15:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16759</guid>
		<description>Yeah but my porn stars beat your chinese any day. 
Yeah, I&#039;ve seen that conversation before - absolutely hilarious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah but my porn stars beat your chinese any day.<br />
Yeah, I&#8217;ve seen that conversation before &#8211; absolutely hilarious.</p>
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		<title>By: David T</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16756</link>
		<dc:creator>David T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:57:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16756</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s nothing. I sometimes get strange, neatly arranged, chinese letters which are linked to blogs in Hong Kong.

At least - unlike Milosovic groupie Neil Clark - you don&#039;t carry on conversations with them:

http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=17766817&amp;postID=113603271998970249</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s nothing. I sometimes get strange, neatly arranged, chinese letters which are linked to blogs in Hong Kong.</p>
<p>At least &#8211; unlike Milosovic groupie Neil Clark &#8211; you don&#8217;t carry on conversations with them:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=17766817&#038;postID=113603271998970249" rel="nofollow">http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=17766817&#038;postID=113603271998970249</a></p>
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		<title>By: Sunny</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16754</link>
		<dc:creator>Sunny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:49:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16754</guid>
		<description>Woohoo! I got pornstars reading my blog too now. Beat that David T!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Woohoo! I got pornstars reading my blog too now. Beat that David T!</p>
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		<title>By: David T</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16745</link>
		<dc:creator>David T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:01:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16745</guid>
		<description>Well, in fairness to Nick Griffin, he didn&#039;t launch the prosecution against himself. 

Still, if the state want to fund this sort of pr for paranoid racists, fair enough. At least it provides work for lawyers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, in fairness to Nick Griffin, he didn&#8217;t launch the prosecution against himself. </p>
<p>Still, if the state want to fund this sort of pr for paranoid racists, fair enough. At least it provides work for lawyers.</p>
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		<title>By: Siddhartha Singh Muslim</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16743</link>
		<dc:creator>Siddhartha Singh Muslim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 11:38:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16743</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;They also got to spread their message that â€˜muslims are under fundamental attack in all aspects of their life CREATE THE CALIPHATE NOW!!!!!!!!&lt;/i&gt;

I didn&#039;t see much of that thankfully. 

BTW, the tab for promoting the BNP as a bunch of gentle high-minded protesters fighting for the Right for Freedom of Expression and values of the Enlightenment was also picked up by the Legal Aid in the last Nick Griffin trial. Meanwhile, violent racist attacks are up by 6%.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>They also got to spread their message that â€˜muslims are under fundamental attack in all aspects of their life CREATE THE CALIPHATE NOW!!!!!!!!</i></p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t see much of that thankfully. </p>
<p>BTW, the tab for promoting the BNP as a bunch of gentle high-minded protesters fighting for the Right for Freedom of Expression and values of the Enlightenment was also picked up by the Legal Aid in the last Nick Griffin trial. Meanwhile, violent racist attacks are up by 6%.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16742</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 11:33:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16742</guid>
		<description>My reaction to Mr T was &#039;hmmmm&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My reaction to Mr T was &#8216;hmmmm&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16741</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 11:30:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16741</guid>
		<description>That LoL was @ bevan kieran</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That LoL was @ bevan kieran</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16740</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 11:26:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16740</guid>
		<description>LoL!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LoL!</p>
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		<title>By: David T</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16739</link>
		<dc:creator>David T</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 11:26:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16739</guid>
		<description>No, she won.

She won in the sense that 

(a) Hizb ut Tahrir got on the telly, where they were left to spout about fundamental freedoms and basic rights, like a bunch of fluffy liberals; 

(b) They also got to spread their message that &#039;muslims are under fundamental attack in all aspects of their life CREATE THE CALIPHATE NOW!!!!!!!!&quot;

(c) The tab for this public relations blitz was paid by Legal Aid. Didn&#039;t cost them a penny. 

Of course Begum didn&#039;t get to go to school for two years for no good reason at all, but hey, in this life, you gotta make sacrifices.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, she won.</p>
<p>She won in the sense that </p>
<p>(a) Hizb ut Tahrir got on the telly, where they were left to spout about fundamental freedoms and basic rights, like a bunch of fluffy liberals; </p>
<p>(b) They also got to spread their message that &#8216;muslims are under fundamental attack in all aspects of their life CREATE THE CALIPHATE NOW!!!!!!!!&#8221;</p>
<p>(c) The tab for this public relations blitz was paid by Legal Aid. Didn&#8217;t cost them a penny. </p>
<p>Of course Begum didn&#8217;t get to go to school for two years for no good reason at all, but hey, in this life, you gotta make sacrifices.</p>
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		<title>By: BevanKieran</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16738</link>
		<dc:creator>BevanKieran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 11:07:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16738</guid>
		<description>Err Forida... SHE LOST!!!!!

Great to see the benefits of covering up and letting it go on adjacent comments...only on PP!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Err Forida&#8230; SHE LOST!!!!!</p>
<p>Great to see the benefits of covering up and letting it go on adjacent comments&#8230;only on PP!</p>
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		<title>By: Forida Khatun</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16736</link>
		<dc:creator>Forida Khatun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Mar 2006 10:56:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16736</guid>
		<description>i personally feel that the victory of shabina begum is an example to all. we should be entitled to freedom of expression right?just like the danish newspapapers using freedom of expression to insult the Prophet Muhammad (SAW). in islam a muslim woman is has to wear overgarment ie a jilbab to cover the clothing she wears at home.although kameez is acceptable a jilbab is a prerequisite to the society today.by covering herself a muslim woman is liberated, her body is not on display for strangers to ogle at, she is too precious for that.we should praise the british high courts for the decision,it shows that we are not moving backwards like the french in what they call &#039;secular&#039; which i find rather ridiculous nut we are moving forward and accepting our human rights as ie freedom of expression.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i personally feel that the victory of shabina begum is an example to all. we should be entitled to freedom of expression right?just like the danish newspapapers using freedom of expression to insult the Prophet Muhammad (SAW). in islam a muslim woman is has to wear overgarment ie a jilbab to cover the clothing she wears at home.although kameez is acceptable a jilbab is a prerequisite to the society today.by covering herself a muslim woman is liberated, her body is not on display for strangers to ogle at, she is too precious for that.we should praise the british high courts for the decision,it shows that we are not moving backwards like the french in what they call &#8216;secular&#8217; which i find rather ridiculous nut we are moving forward and accepting our human rights as ie freedom of expression.</p>
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		<title>By: sahara knite</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16405</link>
		<dc:creator>sahara knite</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Mar 2006 12:44:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-16405</guid>
		<description>Pls can people not use my name to post on this forum to air there views.

thanks
Sahara</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pls can people not use my name to post on this forum to air there views.</p>
<p>thanks<br />
Sahara</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15868</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 15:50:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15868</guid>
		<description>Raz

Yeah, but it&#039;s not happening, there is no groundswell amongst desi Muslims to forsake their ethnic and cultural roots - rather the opposite. That&#039;s why they have to resort to foot stamping techniques like this to try and get their way. To manufacture alienation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Raz</p>
<p>Yeah, but it&#8217;s not happening, there is no groundswell amongst desi Muslims to forsake their ethnic and cultural roots &#8211; rather the opposite. That&#8217;s why they have to resort to foot stamping techniques like this to try and get their way. To manufacture alienation.</p>
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		<title>By: raz</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15861</link>
		<dc:creator>raz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 15:26:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15861</guid>
		<description>The insiduous way that the &#039;pure&#039; Islam of the Wahabist/Pizza HuT types is pushed onto moderate Muslims, particularly South Asians, is sickening. I&#039;ve seen this happen in Pakistan, where the mad mullahs rant about &#039;Hinduised&#039; Weddings and festivals such as Basant, and try and suppress music and film. It&#039;s a shame such attitudes have emerged in this country as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The insiduous way that the &#8216;pure&#8217; Islam of the Wahabist/Pizza HuT types is pushed onto moderate Muslims, particularly South Asians, is sickening. I&#8217;ve seen this happen in Pakistan, where the mad mullahs rant about &#8216;Hinduised&#8217; Weddings and festivals such as Basant, and try and suppress music and film. It&#8217;s a shame such attitudes have emerged in this country as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Rohin</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15846</link>
		<dc:creator>Rohin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 14:44:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15846</guid>
		<description>I agree with what you say Sid, completely - but when you say you&#039;re with Zobia, wasn&#039;t she saying she supported Shabina? She said &quot;let her wear what she likes as long as it doesn&#039;t compromise health and safety and isn&#039;t offensive&quot;.

Surely that&#039;s not what you&#039;re saying as that undermines the entire concept of school uniform.

However I do agree with Zobia that too much has been made of this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with what you say Sid, completely &#8211; but when you say you&#8217;re with Zobia, wasn&#8217;t she saying she supported Shabina? She said &#8220;let her wear what she likes as long as it doesn&#8217;t compromise health and safety and isn&#8217;t offensive&#8221;.</p>
<p>Surely that&#8217;s not what you&#8217;re saying as that undermines the entire concept of school uniform.</p>
<p>However I do agree with Zobia that too much has been made of this.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Swipe</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15845</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Swipe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 14:42:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15845</guid>
		<description>Is this the right forum in which to enquire what Shabina intends to wear on mufti days?

http://rswipe.blogspot.com/2006/03/crisis-in-our-schools-personal.html


..thought not.


Bob</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is this the right forum in which to enquire what Shabina intends to wear on mufti days?</p>
<p><a href="http://rswipe.blogspot.com/2006/03/crisis-in-our-schools-personal.html" rel="nofollow">http://rswipe.blogspot.com/2006/03/crisis-in-our-schools-personal.html</a></p>
<p>..thought not.</p>
<p>Bob</p>
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		<title>By: Siddhartha Singh Muslim</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15843</link>
		<dc:creator>Siddhartha Singh Muslim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 14:35:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15843</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m with Zobia, who at 4.01am was lucid enough to articulate the opinions of Muslims. And I stress Muslims without the need for reaching for qualifications such as &quot;moderate&quot; or &quot;strict&quot; etc.

Muslims have been sending their kids to schools in wchool uniforms in dozens of countries for hundreds of years and in order to do so, it has been incumbent on the parents and the kids that they respect the schools&#039; rules. *sigh*
Lets get this straight: The full back jilbab is a modern (at least of the last 200 years) and cultural interpretation of an Islamic tenet of modest clothing for women. Muslims should not feel forced or obliged to follow this interpretation and its not even Sunna (optional, recommended), let alone Fard (obligitory).

Shabina Begum&#039;s school was not prejudiced, uncooperative or inflexible to the requriements of Muslim dress for girls in any way. Quite the opposite, they&#039;ve been exemplary. 

Just as Don finds it offensive to to see 12-year olds in &#039;Porn Star&#039; tops, I also find it offensive to see girls as young as 4 or 5 covered up. Are these people suggetsing tha men should find them sexually attractive? When I ask parents why theey have little Sara (aged 4 and three quarters) in a full hijab, I&#039;m invariably told &quot;She needs to get used to it&quot;.

Its a shame that the loudest and most regressive group of Muslims are motivated to do their best to force their interprestations (based largely on awkward-ist identity politics) on Muslims in the UK to appear to be *the* consensus for Muslim parents and schoolchildren.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m with Zobia, who at 4.01am was lucid enough to articulate the opinions of Muslims. And I stress Muslims without the need for reaching for qualifications such as &#8220;moderate&#8221; or &#8220;strict&#8221; etc.</p>
<p>Muslims have been sending their kids to schools in wchool uniforms in dozens of countries for hundreds of years and in order to do so, it has been incumbent on the parents and the kids that they respect the schools&#8217; rules. *sigh*<br />
Lets get this straight: The full back jilbab is a modern (at least of the last 200 years) and cultural interpretation of an Islamic tenet of modest clothing for women. Muslims should not feel forced or obliged to follow this interpretation and its not even Sunna (optional, recommended), let alone Fard (obligitory).</p>
<p>Shabina Begum&#8217;s school was not prejudiced, uncooperative or inflexible to the requriements of Muslim dress for girls in any way. Quite the opposite, they&#8217;ve been exemplary. </p>
<p>Just as Don finds it offensive to to see 12-year olds in &#8216;Porn Star&#8217; tops, I also find it offensive to see girls as young as 4 or 5 covered up. Are these people suggetsing tha men should find them sexually attractive? When I ask parents why theey have little Sara (aged 4 and three quarters) in a full hijab, I&#8217;m invariably told &#8220;She needs to get used to it&#8221;.</p>
<p>Its a shame that the loudest and most regressive group of Muslims are motivated to do their best to force their interprestations (based largely on awkward-ist identity politics) on Muslims in the UK to appear to be *the* consensus for Muslim parents and schoolchildren.</p>
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		<title>By: Jai</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15841</link>
		<dc:creator>Jai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 14:26:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15841</guid>
		<description>Compare this to the photos of those two Lahori girls at the cricket match which Raz posted yesterday. It&#039;s ironic that many (Asian) British Muslim girls/women are becoming more conservative than their counterparts in the country their parents came from.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Compare this to the photos of those two Lahori girls at the cricket match which Raz posted yesterday. It&#8217;s ironic that many (Asian) British Muslim girls/women are becoming more conservative than their counterparts in the country their parents came from.</p>
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		<title>By: Sanjeev</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15835</link>
		<dc:creator>Sanjeev</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 14:00:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15835</guid>
		<description>I am glad of the outcome. If it had gone the other way it would have been a disgrace.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am glad of the outcome. If it had gone the other way it would have been a disgrace.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Singh</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15834</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Singh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Mar 2006 13:50:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/370#comment-15834</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know if I would call it Arab supremacism JOnz. As much as it is aimed at a rejection of Hindus and Sikhs and a differentiation of Asian Muslims from their ethnic and cultural roots, it is aimed at the majority of British Asian Muslims who think they are demented and are peferctly secure in their ethnic and culture identities and see no reason why being Muslim should alienate them from their ethnicity, nor make them aspire to Arab ideals, nor alienate them from their non Muslim Asian cousins. I suspect people like Raz and Fe&#039;reeha and Sid will be able to say more on it. 

As always, like I said from the start, this is primarily about mainstream Asian Muslims being challenged and hounded by the fringe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know if I would call it Arab supremacism JOnz. As much as it is aimed at a rejection of Hindus and Sikhs and a differentiation of Asian Muslims from their ethnic and cultural roots, it is aimed at the majority of British Asian Muslims who think they are demented and are peferctly secure in their ethnic and culture identities and see no reason why being Muslim should alienate them from their ethnicity, nor make them aspire to Arab ideals, nor alienate them from their non Muslim Asian cousins. I suspect people like Raz and Fe&#8217;reeha and Sid will be able to say more on it. </p>
<p>As always, like I said from the start, this is primarily about mainstream Asian Muslims being challenged and hounded by the fringe.</p>
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