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  • India-Pak cricket insults force website closure


    by Sunny
    15th February, 2006 at 4:46 pm    

    Just shows how maturely Indian and Pakistani cricket fans can behave eh?

    A torrent of racist and abusive postings on the BBC’s Test Match Special website has forced the corporation to close its message board.

    Part of the site was suspended after the BBC received complaints that a number of users were sending insulting religious messages and promoting terrorism on the South Asian section of the Test Match Special website. [Times Online]

    I wonder when people will actually grow up and get laid.
    [hat tip Contrarymary]


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    Filed in: India,Pakistan,South Asia,Sports






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    1. Pickled Politics » Will it all kick off in Germany?

      [...] See also: India-Pak cricket insults force website closure, Aussie racism in cricket - again, Problems for Pakistani women on the pitch [...]




    1. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 4:58 pm  

      I agree with the comments made by Sunny, but I read the interesting fact that 17% of University students in India cited Hitler as a role model for leader of India, taken from the New Statesman special on India. In addition to this I had a family friend stay over during the summer who was from India and educated, yet was one of the most racist of people I had ever met, he seemed to think that the riots that had occurred post the assassination of Gandhi and in Gujarat in the 21st century were amusing. I think the postings on the BBC message board are a reflection of the world that we live in.

    2. Jay Singh — on 15th February, 2006 at 4:58 pm  

      That is just typical swill of the kind where these freaks usually hang out. It’s just that this time they took their filth to the BBC.

    3. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:00 pm  

      I do not think there are a minority of ‘freaks’. The mentality of people who live in India is quite different from Asians who have been brought up in Europe.

    4. Jay Singh — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:03 pm  

      Well Vladimir, there is swill posted on the internet by people from all backgrounds you know - and they are freaks because they are abnormal in the things they say and the way they express themselves.

    5. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:07 pm  

      I agree with you that there are people who will hide behind their monitors and be racist. But I don’t think that these people can be ignored and defined as a minority.

    6. Jay Singh — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:10 pm  

      But I don’t think that these people can be ignored and defined as a minority

      Really? Why’s that? Seems to me that you are a bit of a generalising chomping-at-the-leash internet warrior yourself.

      Anyway, the BBC has published photos from the latest Abu Ghraib scandal for anyone interested.

    7. contrarymary — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:16 pm  

      the comments aren’t nice and further complicated by the fact that fans of India may be masquerading as Pakistani fans and posting nastiness so it looks bad on Pakistani fans. And vice versa.

      however compared to the banter and insults thrown around each and every week at your average football match it’s no contest!

    8. Sunny — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:22 pm  

      I’m not suprised by the Hitler %… I’m pretty sure the RSS crew and definitely the Shiva Sena crew are big Hitler fans. I remember reading somewhere that Bal Thackeray said he admired Hitler.

    9. contrarymary — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:29 pm  

      England fan chants include - I’d rather be a paki than a turk (England fans when England last played Turkey in 2001, I think)

      two world wars and one world cup (England versus Germany anytime since 1945 onwards and most likely this summer too)

      you’re a town full of bombers (Hull City to QPR fans post 7/7)

      sign on, sign on with a pen in your hand, coz you’ll never get a job (sung to the tune of walk on, sung by any opposing fans to Liverpool FC)

      racism in spain’s primera liga directed towards black players - including England when they played in spain last year.

      sport = tribal = nationalistic = xenophobia = racism (not that it should but it’s often how it pans out)

    10. David T — on 15th February, 2006 at 5:39 pm  

      Cricket, lovely cricket
      At Lords where I saw it…

    11. Unity — on 15th February, 2006 at 7:21 pm  

      E-hem…

      Should just point out that in the last few weeks the Beeb has been posting messages on the footie boards about adding posting restrictions as the forums are blowing out their bandwidth allocation and they can’t afford any more (???).

      Rather convenient to have to shut TMS board in such circumstances, don’t you think…

    12. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 7:49 pm  

      “The mentality of people who live in India is quite different from Asians who have been brought up in Europe.”

      It certainly is. The majority of Asians posting that tripe on the BBC South Asia cricket board live in England.

    13. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 9:05 pm  

      But the 17% of people who see Hitler as a role model for leader of India are not English but Indian.

    14. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 9:17 pm  

      “But the 17% of people who see Hitler as a role model for leader of India are not English but Indian.”

      Maybe, but I would bet there are people in Britain who see Hitler as a role model as well, especially the types who support the BNP. They just each admire different qualities in Hitler for their own reasons. Same reason that large numbers of people support bin Laden when polls come out in Muslim countries. Same reason why some admire and even make saints of certain popes, even though they were historically responsible for mass murders and brutal inquisitions. Same reason why there as so many schools in India named after St. Xavier, even though he was a cruel, murderous, vile man who supported the torture of non-Christians, the inquisition and its unspeakable brutalities, trashing temples etc. Go figure. Same reason why people all over this world make heroes out of dubious characters all the time. Each person has their own opinion as to who is worse than whom. The world is a weird place.

    15. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 9:19 pm  

      I mean Brits making a hero out of someone like Churchhill is dubious in my opinon. But that’s just me.

    16. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 9:23 pm  

      Some people would I agree, but not approximately 2 out of every 5, with an university education

    17. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:08 pm  

      Some people would I agree, but not approximately 2 out of every 5, with an university education

      Well, maybe not openly because admiring Hitler is a much worse sin in historically anti-semitic Europe than in India, where Jews found a safe haven and have never been the target of anti-Semitism. So Indians might be more honest about answering that question because they don’t have that baggage. After hanging out with educated Brits and Aussies and listening to the name-calling that just comes naturally to them, especially after a few drinks, (they see it as a bit of fun of course) anything is possible.

      Also, can you please post the link to your source for the story that 17 percent of Indian college students see Hitler as a role model? Thanks.

    18. El Cid — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:09 pm  

      let it go el cid, let it go

    19. Sunny — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:10 pm  

      Heh, I always wondered what the whole St Xavier thing was all about.

      Unity - you reckon? I always thought the Beeb had a super-fat pipe to the net because of their existing bandwidth needs. Hmm…

      The article lists some pretty vile crap though.

    20. Siddharth — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:12 pm  

      I heard Mein Kampf was on the curriculum of the Secondary School Matriculation in the state of Gujarat under the stewardship of then governor, Mr Narendra Modi. Is this true?

    21. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:15 pm  

      The story of Xavier and the subsequent Goa Inquisition in India is well documented. Did my comment on Churchill upset someone?

    22. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:15 pm  

      It was in the New Statesman magazine the special edition on India dated 30th Janurary on page 32. There is a copy of this on the internet too, but via an athens account on a PDF file.

    23. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:17 pm  

      page 22 sorry

    24. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:23 pm  

      Thanks. Will try to access it. As for Mein Kampf, I read that the readings on Hitler that caused concern and offence were actually introduced under a previous Congress regime. But will try and verify that one way or the other.

    25. Siddharth — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:24 pm  

      From last July:
      http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4711475.stm

    26. Rohin — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:26 pm  

      I have an athens account, what do I do to find it?

      Irrespective, a country like India can’t be surveyed accurately. In fact I remember reading about this - wasn’t the survey performed in a university in Ahmedabad? I’ll do some digging…

      There are plenty of people in India, as Sunny said - the Hindu fundas - who are fed bullshit about Hitler. They are told he was an inspirational speaker and an immensely popular and powerful leader (true) but the horrors of the holocaust and his warfare are down-played or omitted. So I would not be that concerned if some confused young men said they admired Hitler - what’s more disappointing and alarming is when people like Thackeray, politicians and teachers say it.

    27. Vladimir — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:33 pm  

      Hey Rohin I sent you a copy of the file.

    28. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:38 pm  

      Gujarat Standard 10 Textbooks / Chapter on WWII (Orig Print Date 1993)

      Social Studies, Standard 10
      Gujarat State Board of School Textbooks
      First Edition 1993, Last Reprint was in 2003

      According to the preface, this book was prepared as part of the New Education Policy-1986,
      and duly approved by the State Government of Gujarat.

      If I’m correct, Modi became chief minister in 2001. The textbooks were reissued. Someone needs to check and see if there are any differences between the books in 2003 and those in 1986 and if Modi’s govt. doctored them for their own purposes.

      I also don’t rely on any story that cites Father Cedric Prakash. He and his cohort John Dayal have been roundly condemned by fellow Christians such as PN Benjamin for being communal.

    29. Checks and balances — on 15th February, 2006 at 10:43 pm  

      I agree with Rohin. Anti-semiitism is pracitally unheard of in India. Any Indian students who claim to admire Hilter (well some may just misguidedly admire him as a “tough” leader, the way some people admire Pinochet (including Lady Margaret Thatcher!), Mussolini, Stalin, Napoleon etc.) are probably uneducated about his mass murders of Jews and Roma. I’ve even met a Brit, educated at a very posh boy’s school in England, who didn’t really know what the Holocaut was and had to be educated about it.

    30. Sunny — on 15th February, 2006 at 11:11 pm  

      Did my comment on Churchill upset someone?

      Not really…. if you do a search for him here, you’ll see that we haven’t been exactly flattering towards him either.

    31. mirax — on 16th February, 2006 at 2:41 am  

      Indian fascists- the hindutva brigade - do admire Hitler openly as Indian marxists love Stalin and Mussolini (I know of quite a few Indians named Lenin and Stalin, the mayor of Chennai is one such). BUT, and this is a very big BUT, I’d be extremely wary of any poll that found out 2/5 of Indian uni grads admired Hitler, even in Gujarat which seems a steaming cauldron of hate.

      The indian intelligentsia is overwhelming pro-palestine and sometimes, some are anti-zionist, but antisemitism, just does not have any space in the Indian make-up; there are too many communal/caste grievances for that.

    32. Vikrant — on 16th February, 2006 at 8:25 am  

      Well yes SS and BD types do admire Hitler. As for Indians being racist, i’d have to agree with Vladmir within our own people Sub-continentels have most unkind things to say about Africans and Whites and even about other Indians. I for one am Bongophobic ;) .

    33. Neel — on 16th February, 2006 at 8:45 am  

      I dispute the fact that Gujarat is a steaming cauldron of hate. I’ve been there many times and have regularly seen Hindu/Muslim religious processions passing through areas of the other religion without any problems.

      When i was there 2 weeks ago there was a State holiday for a Muslim festival (cant remember the name) and they had closed many roads for the procession to pass through.

      Our family friends in Surat’s next door neighbours are Christian and both families couldn’t be closer, religion simply isen’t an issue. The warmth in relations is evident to see.

      I got loads more anecdotal evidence but just want to dismiss the idea that everyone in Gujarat is at each others throats !

    34. Rohin — on 16th February, 2006 at 9:18 am  

      Vikrant, what’s this Bong obsession? At first I just thought it was you poking fun at Sid or me, but it’s gone on and on. Were you molested by a Bengali uncle or something?

    35. Jai — on 16th February, 2006 at 10:24 am  

      It’s possible that the right-wing types back in India who admire Hitler also do so because he fought against the British (“my enemy’s enemy is my friend” etc).

      But yes there is an element back there which admires tyrannical leaders, somewhat naively I think.

    36. Vikrant — on 16th February, 2006 at 1:33 pm  

      Bhickrant was bheing funny.

    37. Vikrant — on 16th February, 2006 at 1:35 pm  

      But yes there is an element back there which admires tyrannical leaders, somewhat naively I think.

      Well having read NCERT History books, i’ve seen a tendency to play down holocaust. Most writers on board being staright outta JNU methinks its generally due to odd Israeli-obbession of Indian commi communists.

    38. mirax — on 16th February, 2006 at 2:28 pm  

      “But yes there is an element back there which admires tyrannical leaders, somewhat naively I think”

      The dispute is about the relative size of this element. Maybe I am wrong (hardly happens though;-)..) but nearly 1/5 of the grads? Just doesn’t square with my understanding and experience, is all.

      That said, indians’ racism against africans is on a whole different scale and order compared to their attitudes(often obsequious and forelock tugging) towards whites.

    39. El Cid — on 16th February, 2006 at 2:48 pm  

      Ahem. What’s a bong Vik?
      I thought it was a rudimentary contrapcion for smoking puff involving a bucket and a bottle of washing up liquid.
      Question 2: when you say “Sub-continentels have most unkind things to say about Africans and Whites and even about other Indians,” are there any real-life examples that you can remember? How about one for each?
      For social scientific reasons you understand. I’m just curious.

    40. Rohin — on 16th February, 2006 at 3:02 pm  

      Washing up liquid? Oh dear oh dear. I’m sure I’ve referred to my bong-expertise on here before (Vikrant authors uncyclopaedia entries on Islam, I contribute to wikipedia entries on specialist bongs), so I shan’t go into details again.

      But in this regard, Bong = Bengali. It’s non-derogatory slang, we use to it to describe ourselves as much as (if not more than) others use it to talk about us. I sometimes use it to differentiate between Bongs (from West Bengal) and Bangers (from Bangladesh).

    41. El Cid — on 16th February, 2006 at 4:38 pm  

      why thank you Ro.
      the washing up bottle is supposed to be empty btw

    42. Vikrant — on 16th February, 2006 at 4:47 pm  

      Vikrant authors uncyclopaedia entries on Islam

      Well i got more than 600 contribs on Wikipedia mate…
      And my biggest contribution to Uncoclopedia has the article on France and Hinduism mindya!

    43. Vikrant — on 16th February, 2006 at 4:55 pm  

      Well El Cid, Indians dont think twice before calling an African a nigger or “kallu” (in Hindi) even if his skin is just a shade darker than theirs! Well in Indian stereotypes,
      Bongs are quarrelsome, Gujaratis are cunning enterprenuers, Marathis are meek people white collar and blue collar ppl, Rajputs are haughty (they call themselves descendents of Sun!), Sikhs are stupid (just like the Irishmen in our jokes),Biharis are unruly, North easterners are Chinese blah blah. Actually Indian culture is not a homogenous entity. With Hindis and South Indians being the dominant ethnicities rest of cultures getting fucked in between. So its a sort of hate-love relationship between them.

      As for Whites, you’d rather not hear the things me gran has gotta say about them!

    44. Rohin — on 16th February, 2006 at 8:00 pm  

      600 wikipedia contributions? I’ve done 3 - which I think are things I know as much as anyone in the world about. Surely you can’t be an expert on 600 things? Name a few of your meaty contributions and I’ll check them out.

      That’s nuts, how many days of your life have you lost?

    45. Vikrant — on 17th February, 2006 at 11:41 am  

      Well most contribs have been occasional para’s or two, but i’ve started: article on Marathas and Hinduism in UK other significant contribs can be checked out here:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/AMbroodEY

    46. Petals just fell from heaven — on 17th February, 2006 at 12:03 pm  

      Rohin, so is ‘bong’ a generalised term then?
      In other words if I end up calling my colleage (whose Bengali) a bong, he won’t be offended?

    47. Vikrant — on 17th February, 2006 at 12:40 pm  

      Bengalis call themselves Bang or Bangla… no prizes for guessing how its pronounced.

      Btw Rohin, amro aplo aplo Bangla!

    48. Vikrant — on 17th February, 2006 at 12:40 pm  

      err… it should have been “alpo” there

    49. sadam — on 16th March, 2006 at 2:57 pm  

      sadam hussain ia am raan and sulman

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