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	<title>Comments on: How left-wingers destroyed Sarah Palin</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418</link>
	<description>Current affairs for a progressive generation</description>
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		<title>By: Kismet Hardy</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132952</link>
		<dc:creator>Kismet Hardy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132952</guid>
		<description>It just hit me like a bullet.

Obama will be president.

Obama will be assassinated.

Just like MLK, there&#039;ll be a riot

Widespread anarchy

The people of America will beg for the republicans to come back and restore order through a show of might and force

I read something very similar in Revelations 13

It&#039;s in the bible, you see</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It just hit me like a bullet.</p>
<p>Obama will be president.</p>
<p>Obama will be assassinated.</p>
<p>Just like MLK, there&#8217;ll be a riot</p>
<p>Widespread anarchy</p>
<p>The people of America will beg for the republicans to come back and restore order through a show of might and force</p>
<p>I read something very similar in Revelations 13</p>
<p>It&#8217;s in the bible, you see</p>
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		<title>By: douglas clark</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132945</link>
		<dc:creator>douglas clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:29:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132945</guid>
		<description>Ah, Don, you seem a tad upset about her remarks on fruit flies. This is the slightly more forceful response from the usually cool PZ Myers:

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/10/sarah_palin_ignorant_and_antis.php

The comments are worth a scan too!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, Don, you seem a tad upset about her remarks on fruit flies. This is the slightly more forceful response from the usually cool PZ Myers:</p>
<p><a href="http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/10/sarah_palin_ignorant_and_antis.php" rel="nofollow">http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/10/sarah_palin_ignorant_and_antis.php</a></p>
<p>The comments are worth a scan too!</p>
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		<title>By: Don</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132924</link>
		<dc:creator>Don</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 14:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132924</guid>
		<description>Douglas @21,

Good link. The man is impressive, passionate oratory combined with iron self-control. Total contrast to the mugging, smirking and winking of his opponents. 

As for Palin, I agree with shariq, S, and others. The attack strategy could have backfired if Palin had not been, serendipitously, revealed as an even weaker choice than anyone initially thought.

Check out her understanding of basic science (she thinks research is funny).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCXqKEs68Xk

As someone remarked (can&#039;t remember where), she is one kind of stupid masquerading as another kind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Douglas @21,</p>
<p>Good link. The man is impressive, passionate oratory combined with iron self-control. Total contrast to the mugging, smirking and winking of his opponents. </p>
<p>As for Palin, I agree with shariq, S, and others. The attack strategy could have backfired if Palin had not been, serendipitously, revealed as an even weaker choice than anyone initially thought.</p>
<p>Check out her understanding of basic science (she thinks research is funny).</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCXqKEs68Xk" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCXqKEs68Xk</a></p>
<p>As someone remarked (can&#8217;t remember where), she is one kind of stupid masquerading as another kind.</p>
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		<title>By: Leon</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132921</link>
		<dc:creator>Leon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 14:11:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132921</guid>
		<description>5cc, please don&#039;t encourage him, he lives to derail threads with his obsessions...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>5cc, please don&#8217;t encourage him, he lives to derail threads with his obsessions&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: John Lilburne</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132914</link>
		<dc:creator>John Lilburne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2008 10:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132914</guid>
		<description>@ Pablo

Nick Cohen&#039;s articles probably look even sillier &lt;i&gt;before&lt;/i&gt; they are published and a sub-ed has had a chance give them a going over.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Pablo</p>
<p>Nick Cohen&#8217;s articles probably look even sillier <i>before</i> they are published and a sub-ed has had a chance give them a going over.</p>
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		<title>By: 5cc</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132687</link>
		<dc:creator>5cc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 16:28:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132687</guid>
		<description>Sorry to take this off topic, but could Billericaydicky explain how Diane Abbot&#039;s CiF piece is white hating?  I don&#039;t see it myself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry to take this off topic, but could Billericaydicky explain how Diane Abbot&#8217;s CiF piece is white hating?  I don&#8217;t see it myself.</p>
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		<title>By: douglas clark</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132663</link>
		<dc:creator>douglas clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 12:09:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132663</guid>
		<description>Sunny,

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/ are saying that, if the election was called today the Electoral Vote would split 344 / 194 for Obama.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sunny,</p>
<p><a href="http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/</a> are saying that, if the election was called today the Electoral Vote would split 344 / 194 for Obama.</p>
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		<title>By: Refresh</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132662</link>
		<dc:creator>Refresh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 12:08:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132662</guid>
		<description>Shuggy,

&#039;I was talking about how the ‘culture wars’ are a distraction, indeed a symptom, of a lack of proper class-based politics in the US.&#039;

That is absolutely correct! It is tragic how many &#039;cultural&#039; movements have made use of class-based politics and then moved on once they&#039;ve got what they&#039;ve wanted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shuggy,</p>
<p>&#8216;I was talking about how the ‘culture wars’ are a distraction, indeed a symptom, of a lack of proper class-based politics in the US.&#8217;</p>
<p>That is absolutely correct! It is tragic how many &#8216;cultural&#8217; movements have made use of class-based politics and then moved on once they&#8217;ve got what they&#8217;ve wanted.</p>
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		<title>By: MaidMarian</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132661</link>
		<dc:creator>MaidMarian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 11:49:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132661</guid>
		<description>I have just read through that Cohen article, I don&#039;t actually see much wrong with that, at least in its broad thrust.

There probably is an entirely legitimate argument that Palin has not played to her strong points - or at least has not been well used by the McCain campaign.  Saying that though, I suspect that Cohen is on to something when he says, &#039;The slogans that move their hearts and stir their souls are directed against their enemies: Bush, the neo-cons, the religious right.&#039;

I read that as whoever was up there as candidate would have run into exactly the same.  Simply by being a candidate, Palin has become the personification of what the hate is directed at.  Granted, the Democrats may well have been swimming with the tide, but they did not create that tide.

We can and should rail all day long about how the right has used smear, but it is nothing to revel in just because it&#039;s Palin.  I do accept that out there in the fetid atmosphere of a campaign this thinking won&#039;t hold too much water.  It will be very interesting in the next election in the UK to see whether Sunny thinks that this level of personality politics is aceptable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have just read through that Cohen article, I don&#8217;t actually see much wrong with that, at least in its broad thrust.</p>
<p>There probably is an entirely legitimate argument that Palin has not played to her strong points &#8211; or at least has not been well used by the McCain campaign.  Saying that though, I suspect that Cohen is on to something when he says, &#8216;The slogans that move their hearts and stir their souls are directed against their enemies: Bush, the neo-cons, the religious right.&#8217;</p>
<p>I read that as whoever was up there as candidate would have run into exactly the same.  Simply by being a candidate, Palin has become the personification of what the hate is directed at.  Granted, the Democrats may well have been swimming with the tide, but they did not create that tide.</p>
<p>We can and should rail all day long about how the right has used smear, but it is nothing to revel in just because it&#8217;s Palin.  I do accept that out there in the fetid atmosphere of a campaign this thinking won&#8217;t hold too much water.  It will be very interesting in the next election in the UK to see whether Sunny thinks that this level of personality politics is aceptable.</p>
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		<title>By: Katy Newton</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132658</link>
		<dc:creator>Katy Newton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 10:39:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132658</guid>
		<description>I do tend to think that people need to remember the year that Neil Kinnock&#039;s Labour Party was definitely, definitely going to get in - and then didn&#039;t.  Personally, I&#039;m holding off both celebrations and extended gloating until I know who&#039;s in the White House.  But that&#039;s just me.

Also, once you get past the fact that some college student in America has nothing better to do than collect pictures of Barack Obama holding babies, &lt;a href=&quot;http://yeswecanholdbabies.wordpress.com/2008/10/02/happiest-little-boy-in-the-world/obama-2008-2/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; is a lovely photo.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do tend to think that people need to remember the year that Neil Kinnock&#8217;s Labour Party was definitely, definitely going to get in &#8211; and then didn&#8217;t.  Personally, I&#8217;m holding off both celebrations and extended gloating until I know who&#8217;s in the White House.  But that&#8217;s just me.</p>
<p>Also, once you get past the fact that some college student in America has nothing better to do than collect pictures of Barack Obama holding babies, <a href="http://yeswecanholdbabies.wordpress.com/2008/10/02/happiest-little-boy-in-the-world/obama-2008-2/" rel="nofollow">this</a> is a lovely photo.</p>
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		<title>By: persephone</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132656</link>
		<dc:creator>persephone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 10:30:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132656</guid>
		<description>@23 &amp; 24  Even if he does not win (looking more unlikely by the day) I do think the strategy has produced some very positive results &amp; opens the door in the US to others seeing the real possibility of a non white president being a serious &amp; close contender. I deem that a success in itself</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@23 &amp; 24  Even if he does not win (looking more unlikely by the day) I do think the strategy has produced some very positive results &amp; opens the door in the US to others seeing the real possibility of a non white president being a serious &amp; close contender. I deem that a success in itself</p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132649</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 09:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132649</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Finally, since the election hasn’t been actually held yet, it would be wise to wait for the result before you declare a strategy to have worked, I would have thought.&lt;/i&gt;

That did cross my mind too</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Finally, since the election hasn’t been actually held yet, it would be wise to wait for the result before you declare a strategy to have worked, I would have thought.</i></p>
<p>That did cross my mind too</p>
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		<title>By: Shuggy</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132643</link>
		<dc:creator>Shuggy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 08:41:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132643</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The key difference is that even some left-wingers in the UK were making that argument, scared as they are of criticising anyone on the right in case they look a bit elitist.&lt;/i&gt;

I didn&#039;t read Nick&#039;s article and don&#039;t have time to do it now but I&#039;m not concerned about appearing elitist and certainly not for attacking a rightwing politician.  I was talking about how the &#039;culture wars&#039; are a distraction, indeed a symptom, of a lack of proper class-based politics in the US.  I don&#039;t see why you think pointing out Palin&#039;s inexperience has anything to do with this.  I also think it&#039;s a bit of a stretch to assume that otherwise McCain would have won.  Finally, since the election hasn&#039;t been actually held yet, it would be wise to wait for the result before you declare a strategy to have worked, I would have thought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The key difference is that even some left-wingers in the UK were making that argument, scared as they are of criticising anyone on the right in case they look a bit elitist.</i></p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t read Nick&#8217;s article and don&#8217;t have time to do it now but I&#8217;m not concerned about appearing elitist and certainly not for attacking a rightwing politician.  I was talking about how the &#8216;culture wars&#8217; are a distraction, indeed a symptom, of a lack of proper class-based politics in the US.  I don&#8217;t see why you think pointing out Palin&#8217;s inexperience has anything to do with this.  I also think it&#8217;s a bit of a stretch to assume that otherwise McCain would have won.  Finally, since the election hasn&#8217;t been actually held yet, it would be wise to wait for the result before you declare a strategy to have worked, I would have thought.</p>
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		<title>By: Sunny</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132642</link>
		<dc:creator>Sunny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 07:57:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132642</guid>
		<description>Obama has good numbers, but landslide? I don&#039;t see that happening. He could still lose if they take Pennyslvania and hold on to Florida and Ohio and a few others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obama has good numbers, but landslide? I don&#8217;t see that happening. He could still lose if they take Pennyslvania and hold on to Florida and Ohio and a few others.</p>
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		<title>By: douglas clark</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132630</link>
		<dc:creator>douglas clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 02:17:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132630</guid>
		<description>Sunny @ 16,

I beg to differ. 

It is with rhetoric, commitment and frankly a transendence of party like this, that you win big, not small:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/22/202519/82/506/639197

I have heard a lot of Obama, and that is the best yet. Watch the embedded video. That is reaching &lt;i&gt;way&lt;/i&gt; beyond your base. That is what landslides are made of.

The article itself is well worth reading for another perspective on how to fight an election.

Anyone got a good cure for insomnia?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sunny @ 16,</p>
<p>I beg to differ. </p>
<p>It is with rhetoric, commitment and frankly a transendence of party like this, that you win big, not small:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/22/202519/82/506/639197" rel="nofollow">http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/22/202519/82/506/639197</a></p>
<p>I have heard a lot of Obama, and that is the best yet. Watch the embedded video. That is reaching <i>way</i> beyond your base. That is what landslides are made of.</p>
<p>The article itself is well worth reading for another perspective on how to fight an election.</p>
<p>Anyone got a good cure for insomnia?</p>
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		<title>By: Nyrone</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132628</link>
		<dc:creator>Nyrone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2008 00:40:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132628</guid>
		<description>That Nick Cohen article really does make painful reading. Does he realize how utterly ridiculous he now looks?

I broadly agree with the point being made. The left and liberals residing in the upper echelons of the Democratic party in the US have always been scared and timid about going on the attack because they felt they could be percieved as unpatriotic and weak. I&#039;m glad they discovered their balls again and went on the attack about Palin, because it has obviously worked.

The obvious secondary point being that liberals in the UK have a lot too learn from this strategy. I agree, why do progressives hide under bedsheets even when they have the better arguments on key issues?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That Nick Cohen article really does make painful reading. Does he realize how utterly ridiculous he now looks?</p>
<p>I broadly agree with the point being made. The left and liberals residing in the upper echelons of the Democratic party in the US have always been scared and timid about going on the attack because they felt they could be percieved as unpatriotic and weak. I&#8217;m glad they discovered their balls again and went on the attack about Palin, because it has obviously worked.</p>
<p>The obvious secondary point being that liberals in the UK have a lot too learn from this strategy. I agree, why do progressives hide under bedsheets even when they have the better arguments on key issues?</p>
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		<title>By: BenSix</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132607</link>
		<dc:creator>BenSix</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 20:43:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132607</guid>
		<description>Kismet,

My personal favourite has been &quot;Moosolini&quot;...

http://www.sadlyno.com/archives/12964.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kismet,</p>
<p>My personal favourite has been &#8220;Moosolini&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.sadlyno.com/archives/12964.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.sadlyno.com/archives/12964.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132601</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:32:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132601</guid>
		<description>On a lighter note:
http://tinyurl.com/5mfk4b</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On a lighter note:<br />
<a href="http://tinyurl.com/5mfk4b" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/5mfk4b</a></p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132599</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:14:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132599</guid>
		<description>Also, does being negative extend to purposely misrepresenting people, even telling untruths, because in a battle between black and white there can never be shades of grey? Where would you draw a line?
And since you put left winger in quotation marks, I&#039;m kind of wondering where ethics fit on your left-right spectrum. Or does the end justify the ends?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, does being negative extend to purposely misrepresenting people, even telling untruths, because in a battle between black and white there can never be shades of grey? Where would you draw a line?<br />
And since you put left winger in quotation marks, I&#8217;m kind of wondering where ethics fit on your left-right spectrum. Or does the end justify the ends?</p>
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		<title>By: Sunny</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/2418/comment-page-1#comment-132595</link>
		<dc:creator>Sunny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:08:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/?p=2418#comment-132595</guid>
		<description>Cold anallysis. Will explain more later and respond to your questions folks. I&#039;ve been thinking a lot about the rise of conservatives while I&#039;ve been here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cold anallysis. Will explain more later and respond to your questions folks. I&#8217;ve been thinking a lot about the rise of conservatives while I&#8217;ve been here.</p>
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