the sikhs have a long way to go, to create a strong community with good communication, and loyality to their religion.

the muslims being talked about- mainly pakistanis, have a strong cultural mix of indian-punjabi wid a twist of islamic influence.

the sikhs are still realising how india and the british destroyed their kingdom leaving them with no strength.

as a muslim i feel people should try harder to understand sikhs more and aknowledge that is 70-80′s generation of sikhs and muslims, fueled on drugs alcohol and lust who used violence and hate for no reason.

the youth of today probally find racim pointless and boring

As to the majority of muslims? You don’t hear of them since they are quietly getting on with it & this does not make good headlines nor fit the propaganda of the day

Because it’s just about everyone, isn’t it? Muslims are in tension with Jews, with Christians, with Western society, with white people, with Afro Carribeans Christians, with atheists, with Hindus, with Buddhists. With secularists, with guide dogs, with the kitchen sink. What else could the shiny happy Islamophonic webcast discuss, if it came down to Muslims and Tensions? There’d be no room for anything else to talk about.

Because Muslims seem to be in tension with EVERYBODY.

Muslims in tension with non Muslims. Will anyone ever ask the question, and do a podcast, asking WHY? Why is that? Why can everyone else generally get along, and yet Muslims are in tension with everybody they rub up against? I’d certainly listen to that, might even download it to my i-pod for when I go jogging. Looking forward to it, Riazat.

by the way all of this political correctness is giving me a headache

basically the problem is rooted here; the muslims want to make a nice home for the upcoming arrival of the zombie army, and their leader the mighty penis.
now this may seem a bit far fetched but i will explain all.

the kabba at mecca is actually an ancient cult shrine, similar to a hindu shrine. at this place there was peaceful worship of the male genitalia of the hindu deity shiva. thsi was practiced by a mass orgy that circulated the kabba, and ensued the city of mecca. the black stone is an offering to this penis god, and the muslims hope that this will please him by them selves making love to it. nowadays this has progressed into people merely kissing the black stone.

and as for the zombie army, well teh muslims beilieve that all of those good muslims who were buried after they died will come back to life as a zombie army. they will then create a caliphay or all muslim world. this is why the muslims thought their jihad are attempting to create their own caliphay by conversions and murder. tehy sincerely believe that this will please the zombie army and they will be spared.

now personally i see this central belief as islam as a bit too much to accept in the near religious equilibrium we have found ourselves in between Buddhists, Christians, Sikhs, Jews, and all other monotheistic and fearing religions.

i believe that the destruction of the last caliphay or the ottoman empire was a great success for the forces of sanity.

so the muslims cannot be blamed for tehir brainwashed selves, but only for their actions. personally whatever a person believes to be true in tehir heart is their God given right but forcing the insanity onto other people is the opposite.

these muslim ideals may never be destryod but the least tehy can do is stop tehir lies and conversions.

feel free to reply and say your piece

Douglas:
Why do you persist in talking to the religiously obsessed? You might as well talk to a wall.

Such people will always be judgmental of others, labeling fornicators or what not.

Its almost as bad as trying to convince a redneck that a black man can be president.

Sorry chum, it is you doing it to yourself.

According to the religion they are. If they want to ignore the religion thats up to them- but if they seek validation from it for what they are doing from Islam they wont find it – its fornication not an Islamic marriage.

Which was my point, not yours. It’s all in the mind, in’t it? And you, along with other religious groups can only survive through a process of indoctrination.

You fear independence of spirit. In your own words:

of the danger of children not being brought up as Muslims

One of the dangers quite clearly is that they’ll stop being so stupid as to throw the word fornication about willy nilly.

Then you say this:

Strange – you abused me for saying Muslim men shouldnt marry non-Muslim women then ask me why Muslim men are allowed to marry non-Muslim women .Shouldnt you ask someone who agrees with such things?

I called you a tit because you are coming across as one. That is not abuse. You are now an admitted monoculturalist that apparently has world domination in mind. I quote:

Yes Douglas Clark if it is narrow minded and “incredibly annoying” for the Muslim minority to want to maintain itself and its identity I’m happy to be so.

Apart from the fact that there are 1.4 billion Muslims and one of me, I find that you are not a minority at all. You just pretend to be. It is just another meme that folk play in their heads. Remember that point? Some, like you, more ridiculously, than others.

The funny thing is that some will claim that religious Muslims are seeking to take over x country/ spread Islam and amongst their tactics is marrying non-Muslim women- indeed the podcast Sunny mentions alludes to the fanatsy that Muslim men are targeting Sikh Girls for conversion – when its the religious who most oppose such unions.

That is really not the issue, is it? The issue seems to be that Wahhabism and Money are now trying to take over the Muslim faith. If I were a Muslim, I’d be a bit worried about that. Aren’t you?

“Pretty fundamentalist, aren’t you?”

A meaningless nonsensical term

me

“All the pretty words in the world dont change the fact that a Muslim woman ‘married’ to a non-Muslim man or a Muslim man married to a non-Christian/Jewish/Muslim woman are fornicators.”

“No they aren’t. It’s just in your mind.”

According to the religion they are. If they want to ignore the religion thats up to them- but if they seek validation from it for what they are doing from Islam they wont find it – its fornication not an Islamic marriage.

” And why the greater restriction on the woman than the man?”

Strange – you abused me for saying Muslim men shouldnt marry non-Muslim women then ask me why Muslim men are allowed to marry non-Muslim women .Shouldnt you ask someone who agrees with such things?

Muslim men can only marry religious Christian and Jewish women and its not at all encouraged quite the opposite.

The funny thing is that some will claim that religious Muslims are seeking to take over x country/ spread Islam and amongst their tactics is marrying non-Muslim women- indeed the podcast Sunny mentions alludes to the fanatsy that Muslim men are targeting Sikh Girls for conversion – when its the religious who most oppose such unions.

Pretty fundamentalist, aren’t you?

All the pretty words in the world dont change the fact that a Muslim woman ‘married’ to a non-Muslim man or a Muslim man married to a non-Christian/Jewish/Muslim woman are fornicators.

No they aren’t. It’s just in your mind. And why the greater restriction on the woman than the man?

The call for Muslim women (its always women strangely) to marry out is just ethnic cleansing by stealth. Shouldnt Pakistani Christian women be marrying out more?

All the pretty words in the world dont change the fact that a Muslim woman ‘married’ to a non-Muslim man or a Muslim man married to a non-Christian/Jewish/Muslim woman are fornicators.

Whats hilarious is your cluelessness. Muslim mean arent allowed to marry “women of other religions” without restrictions- specifically they are only permitted to marry BELIEVING Christian and Jewish women ; and in non-Muslim lands this borders on forbidden because of the danger of children not being brought up as Muslims.

I’d like to highlight some words you put in small letters:

of the danger of children not being brought up as Muslims

Well, your faith is weak, is it not? You are yet another group of folk that can only perpetrate your beliefs through childhood indoctrination?

That is really annoying and incredibly narrow minded.

And you do realise you are a complete utter tit, don’t you?

This “hypocrisy” is simply because of the inequlity of the two religions mentioned- a Muslim man married to a Jewish or Christian woman will respect her religion since Muslims believe Moses and Jesus to be prophets and both religions to have recieved revelations from God. A non-Muslim man married to a Muslim woman will not respect her religion and will consider it a false one. Big difference

Nope, no difference, just idiocy or stupidity on your part. Who are you to speak for atheists? It is entirely possible to respect someone and yet disagree with their religion. So big difference equals no difference.

Stop being a tit.

“And I find the hypocrisy of letting Muslim men marry women of other religions whilst forbidding Muslim women to do so as hilarious.”

Whats hilarious is your cluelessness. Muslim mean arent allowed to marry “women of other religions” without restrictions- specifically they are only permitted to marry BELIEVING Christian and Jewish women ; and in non-Muslim lands this borders on forbidden because of the danger of children not being brought up as Muslims.

This “hypocrisy” is simply because of the inequlity of the two religions mentioned- a Muslim man married to a Jewish or Christian woman will respect her religion since Muslims believe Moses and Jesus to be prophets and both religions to have recieved revelations from God. A non-Muslim man married to a Muslim woman will not respect her religion and will consider it a false one. Big difference

BTW while were on teh subject why werent any of the Sikh Gurus female?

“You do realise that since the days of the Mughals, Muslims on the sub-continent have used rape of Sikh and Hindu women (and still are doing so) as a political and violent tool.”

And you do realise that Hindu and Sikh men (who make up a disproptionate percentage of the Indian army in Kashmir) are raping Muslim women in Gujurat and Kashmir as a political and religious tool

You chose to make so many assertions but gave no evidence:

1. You spoke of the fact that forced conversions exist? WHere? Some citable evidence that does not emerge from the BNP?

2. There is a power struggle within the MCB? Again, who is your source, based on what report? Can we have a profile of the actors in this drama?

‘And quit picking on the Sylhetis, for god’s sake. You are engaging in tribalism, even if you are of Sylheti background yourself’

Actually Sid is of Dhakaiya Bengali ethnic origin. I on the other hand am of Sylheti origin. As is Halima.

Castism or remnants of castist thinking at least, is still to be found throughout Bangladesh, including Dhaka.

In fact it is well entrenched despite increased social mobility in Bangladesh. To give an example when an acquaintance in Bangladesh wished to marry, a proposal came from a family whose daughter was a qualified Doctor. However, his mother (always the women!) refused to entertain the match as the girl’s father was a Machwa (fisherman). She was somewhat upset that the proposal was even put to her. Doctors are otherwise highly sought after in South Asia for marriage purposes.