Sunny Hundal website



  • Family

    • Liberal Conspiracy
    • Sunny Hundal
  • Comrades

    • Andy Worthington
    • Angela Saini
    • Bartholomew’s notes
    • Bleeding Heart Show
    • Bloggerheads
    • Blood & Treasure
    • Campaign against Honour Killings
    • Cath Elliott
    • Chicken Yoghurt
    • Daily Mail Watch
    • Dave Hill
    • Dr. Mitu Khurana
    • Europhobia
    • Faith in Society
    • Feminism for non-lefties
    • Feministing
    • Gender Bytes
    • Harry’s Place
    • IKWRO
    • MediaWatchWatch
    • Ministry of Truth
    • Natalie Bennett
    • New Statesman blogs
    • Operation Black Vote
    • Our Kingdom
    • Robert Sharp
    • Rupa Huq
    • Shiraz Socialist
    • Shuggy’s Blog
    • Stumbling and Mumbling
    • Ta-Nehisi Coates
    • The F Word
    • Though Cowards Flinch
    • Tory Troll
    • UK Polling Report
  • In-laws

    • Aaron Heath
    • Douglas Clark's saloon
    • Earwicga
    • Get There Steppin’
    • Incurable Hippie
    • Neha Viswanathan
    • Power of Choice
    • Rita Banerji
    • Sarah
    • Sepia Mutiny
    • Sonia Faleiro
    • Southall Black Sisters
    • The Langar Hall
    • Turban Head

  • We must stand up for Muslim civil rights


    by Sunny
    20th November, 2007 at 2:33 pm    

    Rather than treating British Muslims as a monolithic group represented by the likes of the MCB, we should regard them as fellow citizens and actively defend the attack on their civil liberties. If we don’t do it then the Islamists will step in.

    This is vital not only to defeating terrorism but also protecting our democratic rights. On Sunday Henry Porter said “We must not tolerate this putsch against our freedoms”. I agree. Under the threat of terrorism this government is doing everything it can in order to curtail our freedoms, hoping it will succeed by tacitly indicating that it will only apply to Muslims.

    We can either get organised and resist this or be willing participants.

    From my article today on comment is free.


                  Post to del.icio.us


    Filed in: Civil liberties,Current affairs






    32 Comments below   |  

    Reactions: Twitter, blogs


    1. Sofi — on 20th November, 2007 at 2:53 pm  

      for starters: what are ‘islamists’?

    2. Sofia — on 20th November, 2007 at 2:59 pm  

      yes..could you please start using the phrase “religious fanatics” since islamist legitimises their use of islam as some sort of justification for their crap

    3. sonia — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:04 pm  

      eh? we musn’t treat ‘them’ like a monolithic group - but we must defend ‘their’ civil liberties as fellow citizens. right no probs there - so what’s this about ‘Muslim’ civil rights? don’t you mean civil rights of fellow citizens - whether muslim jewish christian or jedi knight or no religion - just fellow citizens full stop?

    4. sonia — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:05 pm  

      and im interested in your usage of ‘we’ and ‘them’ are you suggesting Muslims aren’t part of the ‘we’.

    5. sonia — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:07 pm  

      ANyhow, in getting past that, yes of course everyone should stand up for rights and civil liberties on the premise of being a human. ( i of course would like to extend it past the human, but i’ll stick to human for now)

    6. Sunny — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:22 pm  

      Islamists are like more hardline Muslims… like the Muslim Brotherhood crew.

    7. Sofi — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:29 pm  

      sunny doesnt need a spokes person but im thinking he means: stick up for one’s civil rights per se. and if it does violate one’s right, and they happen to be muslim (in the current climate muslims do seem to hog the limelight right?) …then do your bit. HUMAN RIGHTS! YAY

    8. Sofi — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:30 pm  

      so islam+extremist=islamist ?

    9. Sofia — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:33 pm  

      Sunny - being a hardliner is one thing..being an extremist is another..they are not mutually exclusive nor are they the same…
      There are many interpretations of text and although i don’t take the hardline view in all cases…i can’t just completely ignore them…extremists on the other hand I have no problem wanting to ignore.

    10. Sofi — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:34 pm  

      are you not feeding these extremist egos by labelling them “islamists”, sunny? its like they claim to be doing it in the name of islam and you listen and tell them what they want to hear..at the expense of offending a whole religion and its predominant peaceful NON EXTREMEST following.

    11. Jigsaw — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:47 pm  

      Why would he be an embarassment to Sikhs, Jigsaw

      His pathetic, half-baked assumptions about Sikh philosophy and Sikh society, his constant brown-nosing of the British establishment, his anal fixation with the Sikh Federation, his unwillingness to stick up for Sikhs (when compared to his constant harping the Muslim cause), his liberal, sandal wearing, wet-your-pants-at-bed-time-not-happy-unless-I’m-sad outlook on life to name a few

      However, he is of course a source of much amusement also: his receding hair-line, his inability to find a wife, his hilarious appearances on TV and him getting cleaned up on CIF on a weekly basis.

      Please Sunny, convert to Islam and do us all a favour.

      jigsaw. how would you define an islamist in the context its used above?

      Islamists are people who follow Islam by the book. End of.

    12. Sofi — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:50 pm  

      Oh my. Jigsaw. you sound so bitter. if i didnt know any better i’d say you got burned by our Man once upon a time…and are now walking wounded..

    13. Sofia — on 20th November, 2007 at 3:56 pm  

      jigsaw, you’d think that sunny had bitten off yer balls or something…

    14. Jai — on 20th November, 2007 at 4:00 pm  

      However, he is of course a source of much amusement also: his receding hair-line, his inability to find a wife, his hilarious appearances on TV and him getting cleaned up on CIF on a weekly basis.

      Neither your tone nor the contents of your own remarks here are in line with “Sikh philosophy” either, Jigsaw.

    15. Rumbold — on 20th November, 2007 at 4:19 pm  

      Jigsaw sounds familar.

      Sunny:

      I think Sonia makes a good point in #3 when she says that we need to defend everybody’s civil liberties, though I sense that is what you were getting at anyway. It is important to show those Muslims who have done nothing wrong and feel under threat that Britain is not out to get them.

      Japanese internment began in 1942, not 1948.

    16. Sunny — on 20th November, 2007 at 4:40 pm  

      Jigsaw is our poor and angry friend Muzumdar. Banned from here repeatedly, he now spends his life going on websites to slag me off and coming back here under different names. I told you he was a twat Rumbold.

      Whoops, thanks for the correction.

      Sonia - to clarify, I’m using ‘Muslims’ and ‘we’ because I feel much of the new legislation is specifically aimed at Muslims and not designed to be used equally for everyone. Unless non-Muslims make some noise about it, then it’ll carry on being used in a discriminatory manner.

    17. Sofi — on 20th November, 2007 at 4:44 pm  

      Sunny, is the poster in question gay?? i ask only because it could serve to substantiate my theory above.

    18. Rumbold — on 20th November, 2007 at 4:45 pm  

      Sunny:

      “Jigsaw is our poor and angry friend Muzumdar. Banned from here repeatedly, he now spends his life going on websites to slag me off and coming back here under different names. I told you he was a twat Rumbold.”

      I suspected as much. He used to have something to offer this site, but now he only seems to return in order to insult you. A shame, as on his day he could argue rather well.

    19. sonia — on 20th November, 2007 at 5:19 pm  

      As I said, it is important to highlight the encroaching upon civil liberties - for everyone. yet not too long ago, there was a post, an explosive one possibly, in the consequences it had, when *some people* were rather dismissive of some people feeling their civil liberties were being encroached upon.

      i think it would be a tad sight more useful, if we stuck to human rights and civil liberties for all, otherwise it runs the risk of ‘you didn’t stick up for my rights’ so i wont stick up for yours silliness. It would be good to not have that kind of thing happening.

      i meant Sunny you said “them”, and then you said ‘we’ - so I was wondering who you were including as ‘we’ and who you were including as ‘them’.

    20. sonia — on 20th November, 2007 at 5:42 pm  

      I feel you should change the title to WE must Stand up for OUR civil rights.

    21. Don — on 20th November, 2007 at 5:42 pm  

      Perhaps it would have been better phrased as standing up for muslims’ civil rights, rather than muslim civil rights?

    22. douglas clark — on 20th November, 2007 at 7:02 pm  

      Yeah, I tend to agree with Don and Sonia. We should all be covered by the same set of civil rights and they should apply to everyone equally.

      I’ve read a lot of Sunnys’ stuff over the last couple of years and am therefore completely confident that that is what he meant. So, he’s still got a long way to go if he wants to be a politician!

      Excellent piece btw.

    23. Matt W — on 20th November, 2007 at 7:33 pm  

      >we should regard them as fellow citizens and actively defend the attack on their civil liberties

      Ignoring the “them” and “we” thing, I like that.

      To me, Islamists are those who seek to implement the political agenda implicit in Islam in the modern world, and I would contrast that with the approach of willingness to compromise with more modern political traditions - perhaps due to a different approach to divine revelation and interpretation of the tradition.

      When I say “political agenda implicit in Islam” I am referring to the drive in the religion for creation of a Muslim government where a Muslim community exists.

      To put it simplistically, I’d identify Islamism as an ideology based on the religion, which is perhaps implicit.

      Obviously there are lots of nuances, but that is how I see it.

      Open to clarification, however…

    24. Avi Cohen — on 20th November, 2007 at 7:54 pm  

      This is an interesting article:

      http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=30&ItemID=14331

      Which can provide some background on the subject being discussed.

    25. Morgoth — on 20th November, 2007 at 11:13 pm  

      Which can provide some background on the subject being discussed.

    26. Morgoth — on 20th November, 2007 at 11:14 pm  

      Only if you’re a simple-minded idiot who swallows the Islamist Victimology Trope wholesale, that is.

    27. douglas clark — on 20th November, 2007 at 11:24 pm  

      Morgoth,

      You talkin’ to me?

    28. Morgoth — on 20th November, 2007 at 11:41 pm  

      Do you swallow the victimology trope wholesale, douglas?

    29. douglas clark — on 21st November, 2007 at 12:19 am  

      Fuck off you stupid little moron.

    30. Morgoth — on 21st November, 2007 at 12:58 am  

      That’ll be a yes then.

    31. douglas clark — on 21st November, 2007 at 3:34 am  

      No. See elsewhere.

    32. Cover Drive — on 21st November, 2007 at 7:53 am  

      A week ago I heard Lord West, the security minister, on the radio clearly say that he still needed to be “fully convinced that we absolutely need more than 28 days” for how long a terrorist suspect can be held without charge. After a few hours and a trip to Downing Street he had completely changed his tune. The home minister Jacqui Smith has no firm view how much the limit should be extended. The case for 56 days is very flimsy and will almost definitely be rejected if it is put to parliament.

      I think Mr Brown is driven more by political reasons rather than genuine concerns about national security. I find this debate about the time limit a waste of time. The erosion of civil liberties ultimately plays into the terrorists’ hands. There needs to be more debate about prevention of terrorist acts.

      We do live in different times. The terrorist threat is real but we must defend our civil liberties not only to defeat terrorism but also to prevent the state curbing our freedom. Although we’re far from being a totalitarian state if you take away civil liberties then you take away more of our democratic rights.

    Sorry, the comment form is closed at this time.

    Pickled Politics © Copyright 2005 - 2010. All rights reserved. Terms and conditions.
    With the help of PHP and Wordpress.