Chaos in Pakistan


by Sunny
19th October, 2007 at 4:39 am    

Oh god.

At least 132 people were killed and hundreds injured late on Thursday night as suspected suicide bombers targeted former prime minister Benazir Bhutto on her return from eight years in self-imposed exile.

Two explosions went off a minute apart shortly after midnight near Karsaz close to the vehicle Ms Bhutto was travelling in, at the head of a procession of hundreds of thousands of Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) supporters who had flooded the streets of Karachi to welcome the return of their leader. The attack bore the hallmarks of Al Qaeda and resembled assassination attempts by militants linked to the terrorist network on President General Pervez Musharraf and Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz in recent years.

Pakistan

PP contributor Fe’reeha sent me this yesterday (before the attack happened):

In recent months Benazir’s political conduct has been fiercely criticised by sceptics with even senior members of a party like Aitzaz Ahsan showing disappointment at PP’s apparent unison with military government of President Musharraf.

An oxford graduate and the first ever woman to become PM of a Muslim country, Ms Bhutto holds all the right moderate credentials which have made her the darling of the western world. Her open support for the US War on Terror and condemnation of the Taliban, topped with her new found vocal condemnation of Dr Qadir of Pakistan, has made her just what the (US) doctor ordered.

Another fear was that President Musharraf, who had vowed to cleanse Pakistan of all corrupt Pakistani politicians when he came to power in 1999 after a bloodless coup, had become so unpopular that any deal with him would tarnish PPP’s public image. Moreover, some have said Bhutto’s deal with the government betrays the PPP’s history of fighting military rule.

Yet the outpouring of emotion on the streets yesterday at her return cannot be easily ignored. At best it portrays the support PPP would always hold despite the scandals and corruption charges, and at worst it reflects how deeply Pakistan is still in the clutches of the feudal network. The two upholders of Pakistan’s so-called promising moderate future, Ms Bhutto and President Musharraf, still depend on this uneducated and unenlightened code of conduct for their base.


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  1. bikhair aka taqiyyah — on 19th October, 2007 at 6:33 am  

    Dam Pakistanians!

  2. bikhair aka taqiyyah — on 19th October, 2007 at 6:57 am  

    More to the point. There is a level of hatred and evil in some people that places them outside of humanity. I dont think they are human.

    I hope all those who perished are placed in the higest levels of paradise.

  3. Michael Knight — on 19th October, 2007 at 7:51 am  

    This is very very sad, may the dead RIP.

    I can’t understand why Bhutto (or her party) decided to make such an extravagant entrance….she could easily have come into the country quietly or taken a helicopter from Karachi instead of making that bus journey.

  4. Letters From A Tory — on 19th October, 2007 at 8:15 am  

    I have a horrible feeling that there is a lot more going on in Pakistan than the mainstream UK media reports. Despite the governments ‘support’ for the war in Iraq and Afghanisation, the voters in Pakistan are not quite so content.

    http://lettersfromatory.wordpress.com

  5. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 9:44 am  

    what a huge tragedy.

  6. Rumbold — on 19th October, 2007 at 9:54 am  

    I agree with Bikhair- the people that did this are inhuman scum.

  7. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:01 am  

    May those who died rest in peace. I don’t understand why musharraf allowed her to come to karachi. He knew there were death threats…why did he cordone off large areas when sharif came back..he could have done the same for bb. Why the hell is she back anyway…funny how those corruption charges have suddenly been dropped…where’s that lying shit of a husband of hers..or has she conveniently managed to deflect interest away from him too…

  8. sonia — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:45 am  

    terrible news. its ridiculous what’s going on in the world these days. people making such a big deal about one person coming back – what kind of idiots blow themselves up because a bloody ex-prime minister came back? cos someone told them to?

    hallmarks of al-qaeda? it seems to be plenty of people’s chosen method nowadays.

    i hope bangladesh doesn’t start to go down this route. bloody dictators, the bangladeshis might think the Pakistani ‘govt’ is getting away with it, why not us?

  9. sonia — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:46 am  

    mind you, of course no doubt they thought their “intervention” was needed and important, moral, who knows? perhaps they regard the 132 people as ‘casualty’ – you know – the end justifies the means and all that CRAP>

    people can be such shits.

  10. sonia — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:49 am  

    musharraf has no right to keep anyone out of any country. he had no right to set up the country as a dictatorship in the first place. this mess is a big mess- and clearly shows how fucked up the situation has become in pakistan.

    p.s. bikhair and rumbold – unfortunately, it seems all too ‘human’ to be ‘inhuman’ – so perhaps we should start re-labelling what it is to be ‘human’ – death and destruction it seems to me. ( justified in different circumstances by different people with different reasons – always though, there appears to be an element of ‘i know whats good for you even if you don’t, and even if that involves your death.

  11. sonia — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:51 am  

    i dont see people who support death as a ‘liberal’ intervention can go around talking about inhumanity though – how the hell do you know how ‘human’ some Iraqi mothers thought the death of their children were? really come on..when it comes to that level, you aint going to give a flying fuck about the reason for your child’s death – YOU are going to think THEY are inhuman.

  12. sonia — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:53 am  

    that – is the unfortunate reality of ‘interventions’ – liberal or not. something can be a ‘liberal intervention’ in theory and the practice of it will depend on the person feeling the shrapnel.

    so the issue is, how do you avoid such ‘inhumanity’ >>>??? you try damn hard.

    and maybe global disarmament might be a (dare i say it) progressive effort?

    oh no we cant have that can we – what would our f***ing nation-states do for a living?

    really shitty this world, yes i thoroughly agree.

  13. Sunny — on 19th October, 2007 at 11:27 am  

    Well, there’s no point blaming Bhutto or Musharraf. The Taliban lot promised bomb attacks if she came back. Presumably they would rather have a dictatorship in place so they can keep going on aboout illegitimate govts funded by the US.

  14. Rumbold — on 19th October, 2007 at 11:57 am  

    Sonia:

    “I dont see people who support death as a ‘liberal’ intervention can go around talking about inhumanity though.”

    I am not sure that this is the right place for a debate, but the difference between liberal interventionists and terrorists is that for the former a civilian death is a tragedy, while for the latter it is a triumph.

    That is all I am going to say on the subject on this thread.

  15. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:02 pm  

    Sunny – I do think both BB and PM were irrresponsible in the arrangements of the former’s arrival in Pakistan.

  16. Sheikh Yassin — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:14 pm  

    I think if Bhutto ever came to power in Pakistan, her government would be both illegitimate, and would be supported by the US.

  17. Fe'reeha Idrees — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:18 pm  

    The Taliban lot promised bomb attacks if she came back. Presumably they would rather have a dictatorship in place so they can keep going on aboout illegitimate govts funded by the US.

    It may be interesting to know that the Taliban was supported and given legitamcy during Benazir Bhutto;s government, I doubt the Taliban could be behind these attacks, unless the reason was only the crackpot mentality of not letting a woman rule Pakistan.

  18. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:21 pm  

    I’m just mad at the fact that as usual it’s ordinary people that are dying because of corrupt “leaders’” political agendas. Oh and yes of course it was news on like page 5 of the metro..not saying that’s a quality newspaper, but it does highlight that terrorist killings only matter when it’s America or Britain

  19. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:21 pm  

    Yet another example of why religion has to be extricated from politics. The resurgence of religious fundamenatlism and the violence associated with it is a reminder of its incopatability with a civilised society.

  20. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:37 pm  

    zubair.. religion is an excuse in some cases..it’s used as a tool to black mail the masses…

  21. Kesara — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:40 pm  

    Oh and yes of course it was news on like page 5 of the metro..not saying that’s a quality newspaper, but it does highlight that terrorist killings only matter when it’s America or Britain

    It is headlining on BBC & CNN…they’re just not too keen to call it a terrorist attack. LoL @ reading the Metro for news.

    I’m just mad at the fact that as usual it’s ordinary people that are dying because of corrupt “leaders’” political agendas.

    Spare a thought for the men/women who assembled and detonated those explosives? No terrorist schmuck – no boom boom.

  22. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:41 pm  

    >>where’s that lying shit of a husband of hers..

    he’s in dubai, according to the BBC AN. He was on earlier and blames the government.

  23. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:43 pm  

    >>@ reading the Metro for news.

    oi..i quite like the metro (given that i started off reading the Lite due to circumstances beyond my cotnrol)! they had a pic of Bhutto. i mean why not one of the carnage the bomb left. how about a photo of the suicide bomber instead?

  24. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 12:56 pm  

    Kesara…plz re read what i said after the metro comment…also most ppl don’t read the guardian, independent or any of the broadsheets but rather the Sun, Daily Mail etc…and if you live in London, then yes, the Metro, london lite etc. I was making a point on wat the average jo would be reading in London on their way to work…nothing more nothing less..let’s see what is on the front page of Lite etc this evening…
    as for the ppl that did this, i’d rather not spare a thought for them. Murdering innocent ppl as a tactic of warfare whether by individuals or governments is in my opinion, wrong, unethical, cruel and stinks of hypocrisy…

  25. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:01 pm  

    it can be classed as Liberal Interventionism though.

  26. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:03 pm  

    Sofi yes I know…and I don’t always agree with it..and i did say a direct tactic…ie carpet bombing..suicide bombing…

  27. Jakey — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:18 pm  

    The Daughter Of The East should have seen something like this coming. Musharraf did warn Bhuto about a possible suicide attack but Bhutto scoffed it off with “I do not believe that any true Muslim would attack me because I am a woman and Islam forbids attacks against women. Secondly Islam forbids suicide.” Time for a reality check Benazir. Pakistan is a mess.

    She is reviled by Pakistan’s conservative religious forces and those who want her to face corruption charges. She’s just a pawn in the hands of the West to introduce some democracy in Pakistan and let Musharraf continue as president.

    Benazir, I wish you good luck because you’re going to need it!

  28. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:18 pm  

    Presumably, Just shortly after each of the 2 suicide bombers died, two angels despached by Allah swooped up their spirits from the bloody carnage of Pakistan’s 9/11 and transported them up to heaven where 72 virgins awaaited ther arrival.
    Make no mistake about the significance of this event in the world’s second confessional state-it marks the beginning of a new chapter in Pakistan’s long history of instability

  29. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:23 pm  

    Zubair..boy aren’t you Mr doom and gloom…do you wear a mask? And I’m sure you’ve been reading the terrorist handbook for all your information…it’s a best seller don’t you know…

  30. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:24 pm  

    and if you think this is pakistan’s 9/11 you really do need to read a bit more mate

  31. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:32 pm  

    I reckon Zubair is on the very same deluded medication that those he speaks about take.

  32. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 1:53 pm  

    The bombing of Benazir Bhutto’s motorcade in Karachi signals a new level of integration of the politcal arena of Afghanistan and Pakistan. If, as now seems likely, the attack is traced back to the “Pakistani” Taliban of South Waziristan and al-Qaida, it will constitute a strike at the center of the Pakistani political process by groups based on the frontier who are part of both the transnational Afghan-Pakistani Taliban movement and the transnational global al-Qaida movement.

  33. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 2:16 pm  

    oh here we go

  34. lost — on 19th October, 2007 at 2:24 pm  

    I watched the NDTV interview of Benezir with Barkha, it was interesting as she confessed that there were forces in Pakistan who would try to assasinate her. But, she said that she was ready to take that challenge. From a womens view point I admire the lady for her courage in a country steeped with partriachalism, radicalism and dictartorialism.

  35. Sunny — on 19th October, 2007 at 3:20 pm  

    Well, she had 200,000 or so people lining the streets – she’s not exactly at loss for some support, as Fe’reeha says above.

    Benazir should be allowed to contest the elections. Either way, the only culprits are the suicide bombers here. Blaming Musharraf is also a non-starter since he stationed around 20,000 police. It’s impossible to guarantee nothing won’t happen, c’mon!

  36. Sofia — on 19th October, 2007 at 3:30 pm  

    My point was that they knew of the death threats and therefore should have done something less high profile. Leadership responsibility has to play its part as well as terrorist culpability.

  37. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 4:18 pm  

    Dear James,
    If the creator of us all is indeed omnipotent then he would have had the power to prevent these outrages, he wouldn’t need to appeal to the better parts of our human all too human natures. As long as morality is predicated on our ability to “hear” God and not on our human capacity for human reason such outrages will continue as the recent suicide bombings all too clearly show

  38. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 4:23 pm  

    i’m inclined to agree with Sofia on this. she is reported to have said “she vows to restore democracy to the people in pakistan and her return is for her people only etc etc” yawn, yet she exposed those very same people to the extreme factions. why was her entourage proceeding so slowly down those streets? surely there were smarter ways of getting back into the country. but no, she had to make a public show of it. abit of ego massaging and for people to sit up and say “wow she really has so much support behind her” more than anything. in fact, she actually gave those extreme nincompoops a whole month to prepare for yesterday’s incidence.

    no, she and the government must take some responsibility. of course the extreme factions will – and possibly go further and boast about it -but since by their very undiplomatic, extremee, nature, that would hardly be of any use at the moment.

  39. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 4:26 pm  

    zubair, you are worryingly aligning yourself to those dogmatic extreme nincompoops!

    >>As long as morality is predicated on our ability to “hear” God and not on our human capacity for human reason such outrages will continue as the recent suicide bombings all too clearly show

    “human reasoning” is by its very nature inherent in one’s nature. the recent suicide bomblings show there are deluded, mentally unstable, people in this world. but theyre just puppets. the real masters are those who are funding their causes.

  40. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 4:43 pm  

    Dear sofi,
    Its a dangerous fallacy to conveniently explain away evil using mental illness or mental instability. There seems to be an almost myopic inability amongst a large cross section of the Asian community and elsewhere to entertain the idea that religion might be a key factor in explaining such behaviour we’ve just witnessed in Karachi.
    I am somewhat perplexed by your suggestion that I am somehow “aligning” myself with “those dogmatic extreme nincompoops” by my highlighting and criticisng the religious logic which the “nincompoops” used to morally justify their actions.

  41. El Cid — on 19th October, 2007 at 4:45 pm  

    commiserations. terrible tragedy

    on a lighter note, what’s all this nonsense about the metro?
    It’s a london paper which is given freely to commuters to while away the time on stuffed tubes. it’s not a proper newspaper, let alone a national paper.
    it’s meant to be very basic, unlike it’s sister paper The Standard which you have to pay 50 pence for.
    what you expect?
    you want proper news? then shell out some plata and get a quality broadsheet.

  42. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 5:07 pm  

    im quite impressed with the metro. for a freebie it covers most of the news coverred on one of the bbc’s radio stations! i wish they could cut down on the coverage given to spears, hilton, winehouse, moss and her ex’s etc though.

  43. sonia — on 19th October, 2007 at 5:13 pm  

    Rumbold: I was hardly ‘debating’ – rather pointing out what is my observation.

    To make it crystal clear: I was simply pointing out – in the context of your ‘inhumanity’ comment, that – in my opinion – any person whose child/loved one was murdered, would be inclined, emotionally, to view whoever was responsible, as ‘inhuman’. Regardless of any moral or theoretical justification that may accompany said murderer’s actions – which may well reflect- in some other people’s eyes, a triumph of some abstract principle or other.

    That was simply my point, I am surprised you did not get it, perhaps you were being defensive of your support for intervention X or Y – which frankly I care very little about – your support one way or the other. I was not arguing about the theoretical principles, I was responding to your comments of ‘inhumanity’ – which is an emotional response, as far as I can see.

    Again, I was pointing out, that just because – in some situation or other – you – or anyone else – may feel some actions are triumph of some good wonderful principle, it doesn’t mean that some distraught mother isn’t thinking – what a fucking inhuman situation-this is.

    So my comment, was about personal experience, not some debate about the ‘difference’ of various interventions. Emotional distress on the part of the victim’s family, or victim, is the same – regardless of political point-scoring.

    I thought this comment was pertinent – if not, Sunny can feel free to delete this comment. As far as I can see, those lucky to be able to talk about chaotic situations that affect other people, perhaps need to think about the emotional experience of being in such chaotic situations – beyond their simple left/right or whatever political inclinations they have. And that – all chaotic situations – regardless of justification – have many things in common. This kind of emotional distress that I am talking about – is one of them.

  44. Sofi — on 19th October, 2007 at 5:28 pm  

    >>Its a dangerous fallacy to conveniently explain away evil using mental illness or mental instability.

    so you wouldnt class the bombers as “…deluded, mentally unstable..” ?

    >>I am somewhat perplexed by your suggestion that I am somehow “aligning” myself with “those dogmatic extreme nincompoops” by my highlighting and criticisng the religious logic which the “nincompoops” used to morally justify their actions.

    my point being you appeared to be robotically (just like those guys claims to be doing it for their religion – you claim religion is the sole blame) saying the same thing over and over again. hence my comparison to those guys. apologies if it caused any offence.

    sonia: i thought your comments to rumbold were completely called for. quite frankly, i dont understand how rumbold can class this as inhuman and not see how those who carried out such attacks would be thinking the same thing rumbold did on the war on iraq. double standards?

  45. douglas clark — on 19th October, 2007 at 5:39 pm  

    Sonia,

    I agree with much of what you have to say. One man’s liberal intervention is another families dead child.

    What is required, I think, is a far greater emphasis on resolving human conflict without resort to war or terror. That is the challenge that we seem unable to face. Almost as if, as a species, we only have the fight / flight options.

    If that is so, then our much vaunted ‘intelligence’ is a complete waste of brain space. Monkeys and the like seem to be able to resolve conflict better than we can.

    For fucks sake, can we not do better than this?

    I have no answer, but I think you have the right question.

  46. douglas clark — on 19th October, 2007 at 6:08 pm  

    Just to take that arguement forward a little. I used to be quite happy to believe that ‘This Britain’ was a place of equality under the law. And then we discover that our government considers allowing rendition through our airports is A-OK, until they’re found out. We discover, on this site, in the last week, that the Foreign Office has a dual policy on supporting Britons abroad, which is undeclared racism. We find spin defeating evidence when it comes to Al Gores’ An Inconvenient Truth. We find folk that think they know better than statisticians how many folk have died, for the sake of a Liberal intervention, in Iraq.

    I get very, very tired of the lies and deceit that float around as if they were of equal validity to truth. It is like Ying and Yang, sure Truth contains lies and Lies contain truth, but it is as if we have lost the ability to distiguish between what is right and what is wrong.

    It is our judgement that is being called into question.

  47. Leila — on 19th October, 2007 at 6:50 pm  

    This bombing, as all other ones, is inhuman and a tragedy! I just got CHOCKED when I saw this video about the bombing and the number of people who got hurt: http://www.weshow.com/us/p/19993/blast_targets_former_pm_benazir_bhutto.
    Is just scaring and impressing…

  48. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 7:14 pm  

    James,
    The problem with this line of argument
    ["why would god whose greatest GIFT to ALL mankind in their individual time spans on earth is FREEWILL stop/prevent an atrocity that is/was committed entirely of an individuals freewill!!!] is that it is vacuous. The issue remains, and your response fails to answer it, Why a loving omnipotent God would allow such evil to occur notwithstanding your assertion that its because God doesn’t want to interfere with man’s free will (this is the vacuous bit of your argument). Of course their’s the precedent of God playing around with Abraham to test his free will, but this at best should be taken metaphorically as should all religious texts which purport to be authored by some supernatural entity.
    Its when suicide bombers take literally the truth of these texts that politically irrational behaviour results.

  49. Don — on 19th October, 2007 at 8:53 pm  

    Presumably god prioritised the free will of the killers over that of the murdered?

    But he tortures them later, so that’s all right.

  50. zubair — on 19th October, 2007 at 10:19 pm  

    James,
    Indeed there is a deep mystery to existence but this is entirely compatable with a scientific worldview as you yourself eloquently put it in your account of science’s delving into the wonder of the universe.
    The trouble is that as soon as this sense of mystery is reductively conceived in terms of a deity this sense of awe gets expressed as empty rituals or adheherence to empty rituals.
    So your right in one sense(yes mysticism is valid) but dangerously wrong in another(rituals can only be metaphors not true knowledge). Don’t mistake the finger pointing at the moon for the moon itself.

  51. James O'Neill — on 20th October, 2007 at 8:51 am  

    Hi Zubair.
    i should imagine that the word mysticism in some way comes from the word mystery, and that is all life is A Mystery! that we have to solve in whatever part we can in our individual time here.

    Science has its place in explaining god/allah/universal creator because behind everything in existence is a physical scientific law of existence and action and reaction,,, the universe and all that is in it is physical in motion,,,, but there is also the spiritual side as this universe is merely preparation for the next level of existence,,, and when we go to the next level we go as individuals,,, and that is the crux of the issue/problem! we are individuals,,, we cannot take our accumulated wealth and imaginary power with us when we go, we stand in the presance of god/allah/the universal creator and the simple explanation of that meeting is we are shown the effects of our previous existence on the universe,,, we are shown the harm and the good we have brought about and ALL its follow on effects on others and society as a whole.

    i can say these things because i have had individual experiances that show this to be true,,, i cannot prove it and my ego is not so demanding that i ram it down people throats (never works) but it is interesting to talk about it and hope that people think about it and see that science and god/allah the universal creator can be compatible and that religion and politicised religion and god/allah/the universal creator can be at times for the individual not the best way. (when corrupted by lust for power/control)
    Sheep always have an Alpha sheep that the others follow,,, the other sheep let the alpha sheep make all the decisions while they just eat grass and follow,,, and that is blind faith in religion and politics in a nutshell!
    All The Best
    James
    PS sometimes the fixed explanation of stated fact can be totally discredited by a simple childlike question!
    example ‘The Grand Canyon’
    The simple accepted explanation of how the grand canyon came about is that a mediocre river carved it out over hundreds of thousands of years, that is the scientific version, religion says the world is only 7,000 years old.
    But ask yourself – Where is the delta? where are all those billions and billions of cubic earth and rock?
    my thoughts and belief is – that this earth in its existence sometimes has cataclysmic events that totally change the world,,,, mankind has a tenuous grip on existence and it/we/individuals should think about how a split second in time could remove us in the blink of an eye,,, And would the universe miss us or even notice that we have gone?

  52. James O'Neill — on 20th October, 2007 at 9:26 am  

    Hi Douglas
    You Said – We find folk that think they know better than statisticians how many folk have died, for the sake of a Liberal intervention, in Iraq…..

    That ties in with what i said in a previous post,,,
    It is Ironic how people can individualise pain but not use their pain as a link/window into the pain of others and look at the bigger pain picture/issue even if they bear some responsibility for it.

    politicians exist because people vote!
    religions exist because people go to the places of worship!

    If you visit this You Tube connection you will see the pain of the widows of Blackwater mercenaries/security personal showing their pain, and politicians saying that they feel their pain,,, and one widow ask WHERE IS YOUR OUTRAGE?
    (AND NOW IRONICALLY recently Blackwater personnel openly and indiscriminately slaughter ordinary people on the street and the US public do not feel the pain,,,, they are more embarrassed that this issue of mercenaries killing innocent people and children existing is now out in the open, even though the evidence of it happening many times has been there for years)

    And all those political liberals and right wing hawks who push this war on terror have absolutely NO OUTRAGE whatsoever regarding the slaughter of innocent babies and children,,, Muslims as a whole do not have a COLLECTIVE OUTRAGE regarding the Muslim militants who use children now as suicide bombers and use them as mules and cover and kill them indiscriminately as they go about their murderous efforts to control the people en-masse.

    visit this you tube link and witness NO OUTRAGE in any way shape or form for all those others/children/babies just pain for SELF!

    it is an interesting clip/insight.
    ( sorry for some reason the blog has rejected my post as spam rejecting the link but you can go to post 37 and link to the clip )

    James

  53. Fouad — on 20th October, 2007 at 9:55 am  

    First Explaining the October 18th Karachi Crowd that gathered under the PPP banner

    People of Pakistan love Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto whose name is a magnet for ALL WHO WANT TO RESIST INJUSTICE, LIBERATE THE PEOPLE FROM A SOCIO- ECONOMIC WEB OF EXPLOITATION AND HUMILIATION AND FIGHT THE BLOODY FRAUD OF LIBERALISM VERSUS EXTREMISM CIRCUS which the minions of Pakistan’s elitist state supported by a mercenary military and intelligence establishment are playing to deceive the international community(Where they want to attain certain foreign policy goals vis a vis the Americans and the western Europe) and maintain a rapine, exploitative socio-economic status-quo in the country. Benazir NEEDS NOT BE MISTAKEN, SHE SHALL HAVE TO DELIVER ON THE BHUTTO’S ‘HOPE AND SLOGAN’ of freedoms, justice, a dignified and prosperous life for the men and women on the streets and an egalitarian society in order to be VINDICATED IN THE PEOPLE’S COURT. Almost 90% of the people going to welcome her from the NWFP explained that they were GOING THERE TO SEE ZULFIQAR ALI BHUTTO REINCARNATED to rid the country of the fraud of WAR ON TERRORISM. Coz here we ALL KNOW WHO ACTUALLY ARE THE TERRORISTS. THEY ARE NONE OTHER THAN THE QS AND FUNCTIONALS AND FAZLUR REHMANS AND PATRIOTS AND GENERALS. BAIT ULLAH Mehsood—a gangster not worth even a bullet, late Abdullah Mehsood alias Gudday (lame!) —- are just the symptoms of the much deep running malaise. The real brunt of this fraudulent circus of war on terrorism being played by Pakistan’s rich classes is being borne by the soldiers of Pakistan army whose uncounted and forgotten by the Pakistani state and civil society alike ——–MEDIA HAS SIMPLY CLOSED ITS EYES TO THE CARNAGE- dead bodies lie rotting in NORTH WAZIRISTAN. 0.1 million people have left the region and are now refugees in their own country. 1000 others have died over the past month of Ramadan.
    People went to Karachi to welcome Benazir coz they heard the name of Bhutto which means end to injustice, freedom, prosperity and hope in the lexicon of Pakistani politics. Benazir has promised them A HELL LOT if SHE FAILS TO DELIVER ON THE EXPECTATIONS she would be thrown into the dustbin of history in months. Whether she can deliver on the hopes she has raised is a question that is going to decide her career in the days to come.

    The Bomb blast
    Abdullah Mehsood or the Waziristan militants ARE LEAST INTERSTED IN BENAZIR when they are busy fighting the terror war game. ALL THE SOURCES HERE SAY THE MILITANTS NEVER issued the statement of sending out suicide bombers to kill Benazir. The threat was issued by the MILITARY AND INTELLIGENCE SUPERIORS who wanted to harass Benazir and SHOW (READ DECIEVE) THE AMERICANS HOW INSANE ARE THE PAKISTANI MILITANTS. When the Pakistani establishment ALLOWED BENAZIR TO RETURN they had calculated that she would ONLY GET A SO SO type of small to medium reception. Once they saw the REAL FORCE OF DEAD BHUTTO DIRECTING PAKISTAN’S DESTINY from his grave they panicked and got unnerved and then they went for the bomb blast which was a VERY STUPID, VERY INHUMAN ATTEMPT TO TIDE THE FLOOD WHICH IS GOING TO BRING THE REGIME DOWN. IF PUNJAB TOO FOLLOWED KARCHI’S LEAD IN WELCOMING Benazir the current establishment has NO CHANCE of survival EVEN UNTIL THE ELECTIONS DAYS. The bomb blasts were an insane attempt to stop that.

    Fouad

  54. douglas clark — on 20th October, 2007 at 10:14 am  

    zubair @ 48,

    Well said.

  55. Derius — on 20th October, 2007 at 4:04 pm  

    I don’t believe it’s a coincidence that this despicable act has occured within a month of this statement being released by Osama bin Laden, regarding Pakistan.

    http://www.jihadunspun.com/intheatre_internal.php?article=109033&list=/home.php

    Although this is mainly aimed at Musharraf, there is a clear underlying message that any obstacle must be removed which prevents the Islamists from realising their dream. Benazir Bhutto is considered one of those obstacles. Therefore, I cannot agree, as suggested above, that Musharraf is behind the attacks.

    “Its when suicide bombers take literally the truth of these texts that politically irrational behaviour results.”

    Well said, Zubair. I believe the link I’ve provided demonstrates this.

  56. James O'Neill — on 20th October, 2007 at 10:23 pm  

    Hi Derius.
    At the end of any day can you really believe any statement that ‘supposedly’ came from Osama bin Laden!!!

    the truth about events like this suicide bombing are now so clouded in deceit and double deceit you really cannot believe anything that is presented to you through sources controlled by those in power.

    i will give you the best example of a lie peddled to the masses,,,, world trade centre building 7 FELL DOWN on September 11th 2001…..

    Watch it come down on the Internet!!!

    If it fell down as they say then i am Shirley Temple!!!

    It was a controlled demolition that required many months of planning and weeks of physical preparation…..

    The events of 9/11 and events and conflicts since have made many international Jewish figures and many Arabian peninsula Arabs and many American conglomerate corporate figures even more wealthy than they could have ever imagined.

    And all that comes from just watching World Trade Centre Building 7 come down and realising that the explanation for how it came down was a big concocted lie!!!!

    Always trust the evidence of your own eyes.

    Just watch it and tell me – Am i right (was it demolished) Or – Am i Shirley Temple (it fell down)

    All The Best
    James

  57. zubair — on 21st October, 2007 at 12:51 am  

    James,
    If politics and the vicissitudes of human knowledge were as simplistic as “always trust the evidence of your eyes” then the deep philosophical and political problems of life would have been solved a long time ago and there would be no need for rational thinking or enquiry.
    But then that’s one of the problem’s with fundamentalists-they oscillate between the certainties of sense data (to be read here as paranoic conspiracy theories)and the infallibilty of texts or messages which they’ve received from some supernatural being, usually a patriarchal male with a long beard. But, James were you not the same person who earlier in this blog was recommending that in these times of moral chaos we listen to God for guidance? It seems to me that there is a close relationship between the paranoic symptoms of those who are all too quick to believe in conspiracy theories and their extreme readiness to believe in literalist interpretations of the word of God, that is they are flip sides of the same lazy and backward reluctance to think critically about the difficult issues facing the world today.

  58. Sam — on 21st October, 2007 at 8:10 am  

    This attack reminds me of the Tamil Tigers.

  59. Derius — on 21st October, 2007 at 9:47 am  

    James,

    Thank you for your comments.

    The statement I linked is posted on an Islamist website. Whether the message actually came from Osama bin Laden himself is not of great importance, as it still shows the ideology that drives them (unless you believe that the website is run by “international Jewish figures” to discredit the Islamists).

    If you have any evidence to show that Al-Qaeda did not issue that statement, then please present it. Unfortunately, until you do, I cannot agree with you on this.

    I also don’t want to discuss 9/11 here, as that’s going way off topic!

  60. James O'Neill — on 21st October, 2007 at 4:02 pm  

    Hi Zubair.

    Zubair……But, James were you not the same person who earlier in this blog was recommending that in these times of moral chaos we listen to God for guidance? It seems to me that there is a close relationship between the paranoiac symptoms of those who are all too quick to believe in conspiracy theories and their extreme readiness to believe in literalism interpretations of the word of God, that is they are flip sides of the same lazy and backward reluctance to think critically about the difficult issues facing the world today.

    Hi Zubair it is interesting that to describe who you think i am you use the words paranoiac/conspiracy theorist and then judge me/imply that i am lazy and backward thinking (No Offense Taken!)
    And then you mock me for having said in a previous post (Where Have All My Post GONE???) for saying that god is there to guide us through these confusing and hostile times.
    god IS THERE for the individuals who look for guidance, if the individual gives it a go,,,, and as god knows that we must live in this world then god has no issue/problem with a person looking at World Trade Centre Building 7 come down and realising that the politicians have lied as to HOW it came down!

    As i said Zubair i am either correct – IT WAS DEMOLISHED
    or i am Shirley Temple and it fell down.

    why would god want me to not believe what my eyes show me???

    just go on the Internet and watch it come down,,,, it is not just Americans who have been deceived regarding this IT IS THE WHOLE WORLD!!!
    it induced triumphalism in Muslims convincing the young gullible that a war with Christians/Americans/The West is desirable and winnable,,,, we are all losers regarding this whole sham excuse for conflict!!!!

    IT IS EASY TO PUT ME DOWN Zubair but shouldn’t you look at World Trade Centre Building 7 come down and then tell me your opinion on just that,,, Not the towers or the pentagon attacks!!!! they are a distraction in THIS exchange of VIEWS,,,,,, if you want a good reference point to see WTCB7 come down Google the film – 9/11 Ripple Effect.
    the religions and the politicians of the world know that 9/11 is not what it seems but it suits all of them to remain quiet in their positions of power and privilege as to lose their power etc would mean they are like flotsam in the storm like the ordinary people of the world.

    BELOW is a pasted post that i made on another site some months back after some Muslims gloated in reply to a post i had made,,,, it is a challenge to Muslims to look for the TRUTH of 9/11 as i consider Muslims to be victims of the 9/11 insurance scam as much as i do the Americans.
    James

    In the past few days a site that i posted on has led to me receiving a
    couple of emails from Muslims laughing and gloating over 9/11 saying how
    great Allah was in allowing Muslims to bring about 9/11 etc etc etc.

    I thought that my reply to them may be of interest to you,,, any Muslims
    on this site who are not identifiable by their profiles can reply if
    they do so in a proper manner.

    HERE IS MY REPLY TO THEM.

    I suggest that you watch the film/video 9/11 Ripple Effect

    Americans are of their own freewill trying to get to the TRUTH of what happened on that day.
    Muslims seem to be revelling and rejoicing in the
    statement Holy Muslim martyrs killed all those people on 9/11 when all the evidence points to it all being a conspiracy by people in power to bring about the conflict over oil in Iraq and Iran and to subjugate
    Afghanistan to get to the oil and gas in Kazakhstan.

    It is obvious to all that certain American interest have profited by this to the tune of Billions of dollars but so have the Saudi and Kuwaiti royal families and all those around them, in fact they have made more money. The bush family and the Saudi and Kuwaiti royal family’s and Bin Laden family’s are business partners and work together. A broken Iraq and subjugated Iran profits Saudi Arabia financially and also makes Saudi Arabia Top Dog in the middle east and in the Muslim world as a whole. Top Dog Rules.- Sunni Over Shia’s

    Americans try to find out the truth and Muslims dance on the graves as Muslim children and baby’s die in their thousands in Iraq some by the actions of US forces and many by the actions of Muslim On Muslim.

    The fact that many Americans are challenging their government shows they have freedom of speech and thought and action, the fact that Muslims
    blindly accept what they are told shows they have no freedom of thought,,,, What They Are Told IS What They Believe. Puppets without strings.

    Politics and the politicised religions are not able to hide anything from god, and god stepped back and allowed 9/11 knowing that those in power in America and those in power in the Muslim world would bring
    about this conflict of their own god given gift of freewill.

    I will only reply to those who have watched the video or listened to the interview as it is pointless spending my time trying to talk with people
    who do not have enquiring minds so that they can look for the truth.

    Gloaters and Grave Dancers will be ignored!!!

    James
    (Zubair – I never got a single reply,,, The Gloaters and Grave dancers failed to rise to the challenge/truth!!!)

  61. Don — on 21st October, 2007 at 4:52 pm  

    James,

    I’m just a commenter here, but I really don’t think you’ve found the right site.

    Nothing personal, but we tend not to do that kind of stuff here. There are places that do, and I wish you luck in finding them.

  62. Sunny — on 21st October, 2007 at 5:16 pm  

    when all the evidence points to it all being a conspiracy by people in power to bring about the conflict over oil in Iraq and Iran and to subjugate

    Oh jeez… here we go again.

  63. James O'Neill — on 21st October, 2007 at 6:26 pm  

    Hi Don & Sunny.

    It is linked to the chaos in Pakistan,,,, bomb goes off kills hundreds,,,, conveniently it is Osama Bin Laden!!!
    YES here we go again.
    It is repetitive i know!
    The Pakistani army puts in more orders for US arms and equipment based on this new threat,,, the same old companies make more money and it is all done on credit at the expense of the American people.

    I am not going on about 9/11 The Big Conspiracy, i am saying watch a building come down,,, if you decide it was demolished then you can detach yourself from it all and then explore the spiritual side of life and why we are here,,, and examine the spiritual futility of the way the power of those who bring about these events is misused rather than be a part of the BIG GAME!
    when all these killers and organisers of killing stand before The Universal Creator – They stand bare of all they had here in this life but they take with them the debt for the accumulated pain they cause in their lifetimes!

    All these young Islamic fighters and suicide bombers are all CAUGHT UP in The Big Game! as are the young American soldiers who see the military as a way out of poverty and a future collage education IF they SURVIVE the conflict. (where that applies)
    As are the Colombian and Chilien blackwater security guys fighting for $40 a day whilst their American security Guards earn $1000 a day for the same job,,, but blackwater stiil bills the Iraqi government the full amount as if they were Americans,,, its all a big game for those who pull the strings,,, suggesting i move on is rather petty.
    Karachi or New York its all the same,, politicians lying and the politicised religions exploiting it!!!
    Shirley Temple

  64. sonia — on 22nd October, 2007 at 1:41 pm  

    45. Douglas, absolutely. you are a man after my own heart.

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