Birmingham riots update


by Sunny
29th October, 2005 at 8:16 pm    

West Midlands police have made more arrests in connection with Isiah Young-Sam’s murder.

A further two men have been arrested on suspicion of murder and a serious assault. The men aged 24 and 23 both from Birmingham were arrested yesterday (Fri 28 Oct). The three men arrested previously aged 22, 22 and 25 remain in police custody for further detention.

In total five men have now been arrested in connection with the stabbing and a serious assault in Lozells.

This weekend the police have 600 officers patrolling the area to make sure no more violence breaks out, and the pirate radio station which broadcasted the rumour of the young girl being raped has voluntarily shut down.

On Wednesday evening I was invited to a panel discussion, along with a Ligali representatitve, on the Pakistani channel PTV Prime. You can hear the show from here.

Meanwhile Ligali says Asians were posing as Africans to write racist comments that could be published by the media. Yeah sure.

However, some media outlets refuse to try and defuse the tension, preferring instead to regurgitate rumours and keep talking about boycotting Asian shops. This is the editorial from The Voice newspaper.

It’s time to vote with our money

The news that a 14-year-old girl was allegedly raped by 19 Asian men has sent shockwaves through the black community in Birmingham and nationwide.

While it is always our policy to nurture good relationships and promote racial harmony with other communities, minority or otherwise, there are times when it is necessary for us to first unite and fight against any injustice perpetrated against our own community.

If it is indeed the case that a blatant and brutal criminal act has been perpetrated against one of ours we should not be blind, deaf and dumb to it. Justice needs to be served. Therefore we urge anyone who knows the victim to come forward to enable this to happen.

It’s time to wake up and smell the coffee. We need to respect, support and empower our community in the first instance. We should not tolerate disrespect, regardless of whether we need to buy that lottery ticket, that curry, or that hair product.

For those of you who’ve written in to complain about being treated with disrespect and suspicion whenever you enter certain Asian-owned or run shops, we ask why then do you continue to give your patronage to these shops?

They rely and depend on us for the success of their businesses and blindly we continue to spend our hard-earned bucks in shops where we are treated in a
derogatory manner. It’s time to reassess our priorities as a community and to send a clear message to those who would dare that we will not tolerate this type of violation in the community.

Yeah, great one guys. Because only Asians are guilty of racism.

In fact the newspaper’s news stories are much worse, with the front page headline aggressively asserting: “Gang of 19 Rape Teen”. Who cares about the facts when there is an axe to grind?


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  1. Indigo Jo Blogs

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  1. pecan — on 29th October, 2005 at 8:19 pm  

    they need to grow up, talk about not supporting unity!!!

  2. jamal — on 29th October, 2005 at 8:45 pm  

    Instead of perpetuating the problems and lies, the Voice should be highlighting that the reaction was the wrong one, particularly in light of the fact that the “rape” was unsubstantiated and later found to be unproven.

    This perspective must be accepted in order to avoid similar occurances in the future.

    Though its not all the fault of the blacks involved. The Asians involved in the violence should have stayed at home rather then line the streets taunting the blacks. But then I suppose it was neccessary to defend their shops. Nevertheless, if the police had acted sooner then this “neccissity” may have been overridden.

  3. jamal — on 29th October, 2005 at 8:47 pm  

    Furthermore, the likes of Ligali and the Voice should be widely highlighted as instigators which have in fact led to the further downfall of the black community in birmingham, due to their negative advice and influence.

  4. Kulvinder — on 29th October, 2005 at 11:40 pm  

    I don’t think getting into an ‘internet war’ with ligali or any organisation is benefitial to anyone. The problems seem to have died down, let it be.

  5. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 12:28 am  

    I haven’t read any of the BME press this week, what has the Asian press being saying about this?

  6. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 12:40 am  
  7. j0nz — on 30th October, 2005 at 1:19 am  

    Cohen is spot on again. And Pickled got mention I see…

  8. Al-Hack — on 30th October, 2005 at 1:22 am  

    Sharp? I’m the only sharp writer around here! I deserve a medal dammit!

  9. douglas — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:16 am  

    Sunny,

    The guy from Ligali was a really clever demagogue. He reduced that debate to a trans cultural level, when the real debate needs to be about determining whether or not a rape happened at all. If, amd I repeat if, there is substance behind the rumour, then someone is guilty and the Courts will deal with it. The idea that comunalist politics will solve it, whilst that idiot is spouting unsubstantiated bullshit in an aggressive and fantastical way is completely wrong. If people from any community, Black, Asian, Chinese, White start believing their own demagogues and do not trust the state to investigate we are heading down a long dark tunnel. I, for one, believe in due process. It is an important concept, and is something a lot more people should understand rather than turning to riot.

    douglas

  10. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:33 am  

    I nearly cracked up laughing when he started with the whole one minute silence thing; that guy thinks he’s the next Martin Luther King for sure!

  11. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:41 am  

    Darcus Howe has an article in the New Stateman regarding Brum: http://www.newstatesman.com/200510310010

  12. Al-Hack — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:53 am  

    How has the Voice, supposedly a respectable paper, made the jump, like Ligali, from a rape of an innocent girl (if it happened) to the “need to buy that lottery ticket, that curry, or that hair product.”

    What planet are these people on?? Are all Asians now supposed to be like that? It just gets worse and worse.

  13. Rohin — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:27 am  

    Oooh we’re in the Guardian. Ironically, I’m not sharp, but I have written for a magazine called Sharp and I’m frequently called blunt. Anyway. Yes very disappointing to hear this sort of guff from The Voice, I always had a higher opinion of them. Well, hardly surprising as I recall Ligali’s own website saying that The Voice were guilty of racism, so it must be true.

    I agree with Kulvinder, most people have calmed down and hopefully most’ve seen the facts for themselves, so let’s not re-open the whole can of worms. But still sad to hear what’s been in The Voice – and I believe it’s a widely-read paper.

  14. Yusuf Smith — on 30th October, 2005 at 6:05 am  

    Yes very disappointing to hear this sort of guff from The Voice, I always had a higher opinion of them.

    I remember coverage of the Voice in the Guardian many years ago which took issue with its claim of being the “best” black paper – they said it was like saying the Windsors are Britain’s best royal family. The black Sun is what one of their interviewees called it. Then as now, the issue was the paper’s sensationalism about racism.

  15. douglas — on 30th October, 2005 at 8:50 am  

    Sunny,

    Having now slept on it, it strikes me that the responsibility for justifying an extraordinary claim lies with the people making it. Ligali, or more appropriately the African community in Birmingham have a responsibility to produce the victim. By which I mean take her to the Police. Their failure to do that is the real failure in an incendiary situation. They should put up or shut up. The Stephen lawrence case that Ligali referred to caused a considerable change in Police attitudes. If they are concerned for the woman, or child’s, welfare, they should be ensuring that the due process of the state is brought in to find the perpetrators. Modern forensic science should be able to tell whether or not there is any truth in this whole story.

    douglas

  16. dn — on 30th October, 2005 at 11:17 am  

    They shouldnt be moaning about asian killers this, that. The men reacted because of all the lies blacks were spreading.

  17. Disgust — on 30th October, 2005 at 11:40 am  

    All of the posts here fill me with disgust, particularly given the enormous bandwidth devoted to the false rumour in the media. Whether the rumour tuned out to be a hoax or not, an innocent man was murdered by a bunch of thugs. And instead of discussing the murder, you ignore this and keep on hammering about the false rumour. There are endless discussions in and out the media concerning the false rumour, yet still you managed to devote this thread to it, and ignore the racist murder.

    Rest in peace, Isiah Young-Sam

  18. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 1:50 pm  

    dn

    You are conflating the isssues of the rumour, riots and the racist murder. I am amazed you seek to defend these racist bastards who require no jusitification to murder an innocent man because of his race.
    I think you may be Ashvin under another pseudonym.
    Again you are a racist cunt.

    Disgust

    If the accusation of a gang-rape inside an asian shop
    turns out be untrue then it is as Nick Cohen suggested
    it is tantamount to a modern day blood libel, which often lead to pogroms against Jews by Christians.
    Should we ignore media organisations and the demagogues who perpetuated this (if it turns out be) myth?

  19. The Don — on 30th October, 2005 at 1:53 pm  

    ‘The men reacted because of all the lies blacks were spreading. ‘

    Reacted? By murdering an innocent passer by? That is not a spontaneous reaction to anything, it the act of a violent gang. You don’t get ten of your mates together and murder a stranger because of outrage or a grievance, you do it because you are already inclined to violence and any excuse – or none – is good enough.

  20. Sunny — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:19 pm  

    I don’t agreee with the “reacted” rubbish either. You don’t kill a man walking innocently by with his brother just because of some rumours spread by people. The two are not in the same league. A racist murder is a racist murder, and the Asian gang who did it need to be locked away permanently for being such cold blooded killers.

    Disgust – Please don’t try and sit on a moral high-horse either. If you are disgusted by the comments, then you clearly have been selectively reading. We paid tribute to Isiah’s death and later I also wrote later saying that Asians need to accept there was a racist murder by an Asian gang.

    That does not detract from two other facts:
    1) A rumour spread about a rape that still has not yet been proven, nearly 10 days after they first came to light. Ligali and others have admitted that the rumours were around uptil a few weeks before the protests actually started. So how long has this girl been hiding? Over 2 weeks now.

    2) A blame mentality that has accused all Asians of racism and instigated a boycott of all Asian businesses when not all of us are to blame for the rape or the murder.

    You need to get off that high-horse before a sensible discussion on this issue can take place.

  21. fresh — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:44 pm  

    Pleased so see the Nick Cohen article has been picked up here as well.

    This is Nick returning to form.

    As for the point raised about his other pet agendas mentioned above (somewhere) – in his analysis they all link up as part of the segregation issue.

  22. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:44 pm  

    “The black Sun is what one of their interviewees called it”

    It aint quite that bad but yeah it’s long being going downhill. I rarely read these days because it’s so fecking tabloid…

  23. Black boy — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:47 pm  

    Like I said earlier, we need to stop the fighting and unite with our Asian bredthren and sisthren. It’s the only way to go forward. I would also note that NOT ALL Blacks accuse Asians of racism.

  24. pecann — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:56 pm  

    @disgust you need to get off your high horse immediatley. You need to look at these 2 points

    1. the black community fabricated a lie in order to start mayhem and attack asians
    2. black community is boycotting asian stores because they accuse us of racism

    now tell me, can you deny point 1 and where exactly is the evidence for point 2. Anwser this for me

  25. fresh — on 30th October, 2005 at 2:58 pm  

    Its clear there are huge numbers of people across the communities who are being held to ransom by events beyond their control and sometimes even comprehension.

    I can see that there are going to be worse allegations made or myths created to keep their ‘target’ audiences onside. Yes you can consider a significant element of this as a fight for audience (readership) numbers.

    I would like to see a common online forum created for both (if that’s the correct perspective) communities to discuss and share experiences.

    All racists of course to be severely dealt with – public humiliation usually works. [Of course not on the basis of look what your people do/done/did ....]

    We should then invite people from the various boards to air their grievances – and better still identify the misunderstandings.

    Even I can’t stand the thought that this might be ‘love-in’ God forbid. It needs to be a robust exchange of views.

  26. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:00 pm  

    Black Boy

    I agree except with the fighting part. That is fighting (more in a metaphorical than suggesting bloody warfare) should be taking place between racists and anti-racists irrespective of colour.

  27. pecann — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:03 pm  

    @black boy
    for Asians and blacks to unite YOU need to first take a good look at what blacks did and still are doing. First they came up with a rumour which turned out to be a lie. Now they’re talking about the murder, but the LIES are all of a sudden forgotten? How can you expect from us to unite with you, when Blacks never admitted they lied. And on top of all this they accuse us of racism.

  28. Sunny — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:04 pm  

    Pecan – Let’s not use a broad brush either. Not everyone from the black community started that lie, some organisations did.

    They may have been acting, they feel, in a justified manner by raising the issue about a possible raped girl. That is understandable. I don’t agree about the boycott, and I don’t agree that every single black person as pointing fingers at the Asian businesses.

    In fact the Eastern Eye editorial (an Asian paper for those who don’t know) is as lame as the Voice editorial.

    I will publish it below.

  29. pecan — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:05 pm  

    yo whos jackin my name?lol

  30. Sunny — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:05 pm  

    From Eastern Eye this week.

    ASIANS have claimed it was jealousy that motivated their black neighbours to target them in riots in Birmingham over the weekend.

    Hard-working Asians in Lozells told Eastern Eye that they would not be driven out of business despite threats of violence and looting by black gangs.

    The rioting began after rumour spread that a 14-year-old Afro-Caribbean girl had been assaulted by up to 19 men at an Asian-run hair products shop in Wellington Road. The police have been unable to substantiate the allegations, repeatedly aired on black pirate-radio stations last week.

    But Asians say Blacks used it as an excuse to vent their jealousy at the relative business success of the Asian community in Birmingham.

    Now the fatal stabbing of 22-year-old Isiah Young-Sam and the shooting of Aaron James, 18, has further fuelled racism between rival groups.

    Ahmed Singh has owned Naura Textiles in Villa Road, for 11 years. Mr Singh said: “Youngsters in this area, mainly from the Afro-Caribbean community, need money and they are targeting Asian businessman because they think we have lots of it. We have some but nobody in this area is very rich. I will not close down because of this.”

    Neither will the owners of Babu Textiles in Lozells Road, despite a downturn in trade since the rioting.

    An employee there who wants to remain anonymous due to fears of a revenge attack, said: “Most of our customers are Muslim women and they are too scared to come out because of the fighting. Business is very quiet here.

    “Jealousy is definitely the problem. The Afro-Caribbean community are degrading themselves and it is affecting everybody.”

    Someone else who wants to remain anonymous is the owner of nearby Chohan Shoes. He said: “The people who spread the rumours are responsible for the riots. There is no proof of their claims.

    “I think it is jealousy that has driven them to do this. Maybe they think they can get something back by rioting.

    “The Asian community has made it without any grants from the government and the Afro-Caribbean community should do the same.

    “I have owned my shop for more than 25 years and will continue to do so.”

    The lack of an official complaint to the police about the rape has added to the anger.

    Indir Singh Sohal, owner of Sohal Drapers, said: “I have been based here for more than 10 years and in that time, tension between the two communities has risen.

    “I think the Afro-Caribbean community are jealous of us because we have many businesses here.

    “Some of their youngsters have been very stupid.” There are about 15,000 South Asians living in Lozells, split equally between Indians and Pakistanis, with a small Bengali community. This compares to 5,000 black people, most of whom are Caribbean.

    Yet, Birmingham Council figures show the unemployment rate among the Black groups is between 15 per cent and 22 per cent, compared to 10 per cent of Indians.

    A further split can be seen in exam results. The number of black Caribbean schoolchildren gaining five A*- C grades at GCSE level in Lozells was just 23 per cent in 2004 and 41 per cent this year. The 2005 figure for Indians is 66 per cent and 46 per cent for Pakistanis.

    Local councillor Gurdial Singh Atwal said the difference fuels resentment. He owns an architecture business in neighbouring Handsworth.

    Mr Atwal said: “Representatives from both communities must unite and stand shoulder to shoulder with each other.

    “The jealousy that does exist within the Afro-Caribbean community is unfair.

    “They should not be punishing Asians who through their own hard work, have made a success of their businesses.”

    National black newspaper The Voice even called on Lozells’ Afro-Caribbean shoppers to boycott all Asian shops in light of the allegation.

    This hysteria has angered Saku Shah, of Multi Foods, a grocery shop located on the edge of Lozells.

    Ms Shah said: “I feel the entire Asian community is getting picked on because it has been claimed this one girl was attacked. That is very unfair.

    “Nothing has improved since Saturday. There is still a lot tension and bad feeling. I have not considered closing the store but everybody here does feel intimidated. We are all worried about what may still happen.”

    West Midlands police say 80 criminal acts were reported becaue of the riots and 35 people were taken to hospital.

  31. pecan — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:06 pm  

    i am the original pecan, one “n”

  32. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:07 pm  

    Pecan

    Highlight those responsible but do not use the same brush to tar the whole of the “Black Community” in an analogous fashion to the methods used by “The Voice” and Ligali.

  33. pecan — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:09 pm  

    Bevan, that comment was by pecann, with two “nn” im the other one just so u know

  34. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:11 pm  

    I aplogise pecan!

    That pecann is a bounder

  35. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:14 pm  

    sorry mate I’ll change my name

  36. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:20 pm  

    Sunny , what’s wrong with that article

  37. pecan — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:27 pm  

    no need to apologise Bevan, its all good!

  38. Sunny — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:29 pm  

    Navigator – again its pointing fingers. Some Asians in the local area may feel that way, but it doesn’t mean all Asians are obsessed by this idea of ‘jealousy’. It is as bad as the Voice saying that all Asians are racist towards Africans.

  39. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:29 pm  

    That article sounds very truthful to me

  40. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:41 pm  

    Be honest Sunny, what other motive do you see? If you look at for example statistics, statistics has proven that Asians do better at school and jobs. If you were black wouldn’t you be jealous of that? I’m being honest here, know I would.

  41. Sunny — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:46 pm  

    Well, if we really want to be splitting hairs, Pakistanis and Bangladeshis do as bad as Africans in school. So for those Pakistanis to then turn around and talk of “jealousy” is absurd.

  42. Black boy — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:51 pm  

    Navigator- You act like we’re all uneducated, pitiful chumps. And the jealousy thing is getting waaaay out of hand here. I never heard of “blacks being jealous of asians” untill the riots and the aftermath. So maybe there are poor blacks who are envious of asians who are doing better. Wake up navigator! It’s a human trade, people envy people who are more succesful in life. Stop sounding like there are no succesful blacks around, it’s starting to irritate me big time.

    And I still think we should unite, whether you like it or not you’re gonna hold my hand now navigator(jokes)

  43. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 3:55 pm  

    More stats at

    http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=461

    Black men and Bangladeshi/Pakistani women are the least likeliest male/females do have a degree. (8/7%)

    “Pakistanis and Bangladeshis were the most likely to be unqualified. Nearly half (48 per cent) of Bangladeshi women and 40 per cent of Bangladeshi men had no qualifications. Among Pakistanis, 40 per cent of women and 28 per cent of men had no qualifications”

    Navigator, when you gloat about Asian success, you are referring solely to British Indians and Chinese only aren’t you?

  44. Col. Mustafa — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:00 pm  

    Bangladeshis and thier restaurants.
    hehehe

  45. Antiflow — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:02 pm  

    Not all of them came up with the rumour, alot in Birmingham choose to believe it regardless, the same way alot choose to believe that one of the lads was shot by armed police. Who started that other rumour? It’s normally down to one person.

    I’d like to believe that this Birmingham thing is just that because I see no concrete evidence that anyone else outside of the place really cares all that much. I resent the people who are trying to make this a nationwide issue also, they’re being selfish and want other people to be uncomfortable and live in areas of racial tension as well. Ligali obviously isn’t helping matters., they are pretty much doing the BNP’s work for them. Wait till the next local elections around the country and see the fruits of their labours. It won’t be pretty reading.

    As for Afro-Caribbeans being resentful of Asian shop owners, well I live in an all white area and most of the small shops there have Asian owners also. *Shrugs* Few people are that bothered about who they buy the things they need off, very few indeed.

    And if that area of Birmingham is 60% Pakistani and the rest either Indian, Afrio-Caribbean and British then I would expect them to have most of the shops anyway. To me that is a distraction away from the real problem. Which is Xenophobia on all sides involved.

    I don’t expect to see a bunch of youths runnning shops anyway.

    All blacks shouldn’t have admit they lied because not all blacks around the country were involved. I don’t expect Afro-Americans to say sorry for what Somalians have done, and I don’t expect Somalians to say sorry for Afro-American actions.

    Blanketing people with the term blacks, whites or even Asians doesn’t really help matters. The only thing it is does help is those who call themselves Asian, Black, and white extremists or who people call racist to think look at those Blacks and Asians, etc, etc. Doing that only makes the job all that more easier, especially for the media.

    Personally I’d rather narrow it down to “Brummies” and even then it’s not worth negating your individual identity over something that OTHER people’s have contributed to.

    If it’s going to be like then there may as well only be one person of every race on the planet slagging each other off.

    People are too quick to group together and become the collective idiot instead of the individual with their own views and attitudes about life, which should be based on personal experience for the most part.

    Personally I’m completely selfish in these matters and I come first before any race, I’m quite sure that somebody from any race would want to screw me over in one fashion or another given the chance.

  46. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:14 pm  

    @black boy
    whatever!

    @bevan kieran
    I’m not gloating, I’m just stating the facts. That OVERALL Asians still do better. I mean sure you have people from africa who do better in school than jamaicans, but if you compare all Asians together with all the blacks together, Asians still do better.

  47. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:31 pm  

    Navigator, its simply not true to say that overall Asians do better, it’s denial, face the truth that you have to break down the stats and you’ll see many things both communities share which goes to show that the real problem here is bigger than a few idiots in each communities.

  48. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:40 pm  

    You might protect them by saying blacks aren’t jealous, what other motive was there then? Please tell me? And I’m not some crazy idiot who’s all imagining it, there are alot of Asians in our community who feel the same way. Did you read the article? And ofcourse some Asians are going to deny it, because they’re scared of retaliation. Here is a quote of an Asian who actually lives there:

    “Jealousy is definitely the problem. The Afro-Caribbean community are degrading themselves and it is affecting everybody”

  49. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:45 pm  

    I think it’s unfair to our community to just close your eyes and think theres no problem between Asian and blacks. How else can we fix this, if we can’t even face the facts. I and alot of Asians with me, feel that blacks resent us because of the facts that MOST(not all !) Asians are economically doing better.

  50. leon — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:53 pm  

    I agree there are problems but I don’t provoking them or denying the reasons behind them helps.

  51. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:56 pm  

    “Indir Singh Sohal, owner of Sohal Drapers, said: “I have been based here for more than 10 years and in that time, tension between the two communities has risen.

    “I think the Afro-Caribbean community are jealous of us because we have many businesses here.

    “Some of their youngsters have been very stupid.” There are about 15,000 South Asians living in Lozells, split equally between Indians and Pakistanis, with a small Bengali community. This compares to 5,000 black people, most of whom are Caribbean.

    Yet, Birmingham Council figures show the unemployment rate among the Black groups is between 15 per cent and 22 per cent, compared to 10 per cent of Indians.”

  52. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 4:59 pm  

    “Local councillor Gurdial Singh Atwal said the difference fuels resentment. He owns an architecture business in neighbouring Handsworth.

    The jealousy that does exist within the Afro-Caribbean community is unfair.

    “They should not be punishing Asians who through their own hard work, have made a success of their businesses.”

  53. Sunny — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:01 pm  

    Navigator – you are beginning to annoy me. You say don’t blame Asians for the actions of a few, but you’re blaming all African Carribeans for the rumour mongering of a few.

    The Asian community is as diverse as the black community – get used to it. Now – enough of your mud-sligning, I’m getting pissed off with it. This is not a place for Asian or white or black supremacists. If you want to behave like the BNP, because that is what you are doing, then go to their website. Your comments are so similar to BNP comments that you really need to look at what you’re saying again.

  54. Al-Hack — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:02 pm  

    All these newbies to PP coming from a village in panjab or something? WTF?

  55. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:03 pm  

    I thought we were debatting. Does that mean everyone has to have the same view?

  56. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:05 pm  

    So I guess every Asian who admits there’s a tension, will be labelled as racist/bnp now

  57. Al-Hack — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:18 pm  

    Hey there’s tension between some idiot Sikhs and Muslims too – are we all bigots now?

  58. dna — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:24 pm  

    All these newbies to PP coming from a village in panjab or something? WTF?

    LOL!!

  59. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:25 pm  

    Ashvin, dn, pecann and Navigator do come across as people with VERY similar racist opinions. Is he the P.P equivalent of Benji at Harry’s Place.

  60. navigator — on 30th October, 2005 at 5:50 pm  

    Anwser this for me, why close your eyes and mouth for injust? Why is that “the right thing to do”?

  61. El Cid — on 30th October, 2005 at 8:28 pm  

    As a Londoner looking from afar I am accustomed to a greater degree of racial harmony than that exhibited in Brum of late (No, I’m not being naive. I went to school on the Broadwater Farm and, as we all know, the good stuff doesn’t tend to get reported). But I was genuinely shocked when I heard the news since I had regarded Brum in a different light to the deeply segregated towns further up north. I have two observations for you: 1) I’m sure you don’t mean to be but some of the comments come across as a little blase about the murder of Isiah. It is also very noticeable that the racist nature of the murder has not been reported by the press (not national anyway, Nick Cohen aside). 2) Do you think British Pakistani culture is inherently racist? Let’s put aside all that religious rubbish about infidels and believers because other religions have that too of course. But British Pakistanis aren’t exactly famous for their friendliness and ability to mix. After all, genetics show British Pakistanis are among the most in-bred communities in the world. That is, they tend to marry in the family, usually with cousins but also uncles and nieces. Am I right? So how does exactly make for a brighter racial future?
    Yes, I am white, but a second-generation immigrant nonetheless.

  62. BevanKieran — on 30th October, 2005 at 10:55 pm  

    Racist murders, when they are heavily reported, tend to be “white-on black”. There are other murders of black and asian which are neglected. Racist murders of white youths such as Gavin Hopley and Ross Parker have not recieved much press attention. If you google these names, the lack of media attention is indicated by the number of nutty far-right websites which appear early on bearing their names.

    Least attention is if you are unluckily enough not to be a african, asian or white(anglo-saxon) victim of racist crime. Stelios Economou was pushed onto train tracks and died after confronting a racist who was harrassing two black girls on the train. On google, this great soul is hardly mentioned.

    I think insular cultures which promote “in” marriage and neglect “out” marriage are commensurately a racist culture. Whether the boundary is based on race or religion does’nt make too much difference. Inbreeding genes are symptomatic of a racist culture not the other way around.

  63. Barbara Meinhoff — on 31st October, 2005 at 12:40 am  

    Re:
    From Eastern Eye this week.

    ASIANS have claimed it was jealousy that motivated their black neighbours to target them in riots in Birmingham over the weekend.

    Isn’t Asian Eye owned by the same company that owns The Voice? Wasn’t The Voice one of the papers that was urging a boycott of Asian owned shops? Publishing group doing rather well out of this aren’t they?

    Nick Cohen article that bigs up PP:
    http://observer.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,6903,1604791,00.html

  64. Sunny — on 31st October, 2005 at 2:15 am  

    Barbara – Eastern Eye is owned by Ethnic Media Group, who own New Nation too, but not the Voice. EMG were trying to buy the Voice, but it got bought recently by the Jamaican Gleaner Group.

    NN hasn’t gone as mad as The Voice this week.

  65. Gooch — on 31st October, 2005 at 4:52 am  

    I live in New York and although we’ve not yet had widespread disturbances here between black Americans and Asian immigrants, the same underlying tensions exist. Newly-arrived Asian immigrants (which include Koreans and Chinese) as well as the more established Asian communities are generally prospering, while blacks continue to lag behind; and many remain trapped in poverty, drug abuse and criminality. Black resentment of Asians is always bubbling under the surface, and I fear the day that some incident occurs which will release these hatreds into violence.

  66. doh — on 31st October, 2005 at 10:04 am  

    Why don’t blacks open more shops and businesses?

  67. leon — on 31st October, 2005 at 1:02 pm  

    Blink covering the condemnation of The Voice: http://www.blink.org.uk/pdescription.asp?key=9836&grp=1&cat=197

  68. doh — on 31st October, 2005 at 2:04 pm  

    Why don’t blacks open more shops and businesses?

  69. Bahdresh — on 31st October, 2005 at 2:35 pm  

    I don’t know doh, maybe they don’t feel like opening businesses because it’s very hard work. It takes alot of hard work, and skills to open up a business you know.

  70. Amir — on 31st October, 2005 at 5:13 pm  

    Finally some sanity! I am glad the website suptrax has finally admitted that the whole rape allegation was a lie based on jealousy and is now calling for peace. However the question now remaoins is it too little too late? What evils have these men let out of Pandora’s box?

  71. Amir — on 31st October, 2005 at 5:16 pm  

    Read their statement on thier home page a vast imporvement on the confrontational statements they posted peviously

    http://www.supatrax.co.uk/home.htm

  72. no way — on 31st October, 2005 at 6:31 pm  

    first, their are blacks buisness, but it tends to be specific, in London majority of internet cafes is owned by Somalis, PR, events, on-line buisness, design and technology is blacks niche, asians manily medical, shops and so forth.Chinease……..chinease takeaway, british.urm…….Pubs! Their is a niche for everyone
    simple as

    beside who wants to get up at 4.00am sell crisps and get home at 11.00pm…….no thanks!

  73. little nicky — on 31st October, 2005 at 6:42 pm  

    Let’s be honest here, it’s no real secret that for many years Asians have never been especially fond of Blacks. As far as the boycott goes, seriously, is it THAT out of order to think twice about who you chose to support with your money? Never mind retribution for any supposed wall of silence, I know several Asians who have been told by their parents they would get their hands chopped off if they ever stooped so low as to bring home a kala (please nobody pretend that would be a rare reaction), in the face of that would it be unjust to no longer offer patronage of the business of a person with that mentality?

    Of course the problem is that not all Asians are racist and so a boycott would affect innocent parties, though that said, I wouldn’t be surprised if some of you boycott Israeli goods, undoubtedly innocents become victim of that too. I guess such things are unavoidable with boycotts.

    Navigator although I know you are very unlikely to ever accept anything close to reason I wanna point out where your logic fails you anyway. Bengalis and Pakistanis in this country are, in general, no more educated, gainfully employed or wealthy than their Black counterparts. In fact they are often less so. Now that the minority of the Asian group Indians do well doesn’t detract from the fact that Pakistanis and Bengalis are not flourishing (well obviously it does to you but that’s because you clearly only believe what suits your preconcieved ideas)

    If there are 9 paupers and 1 millionaire living on a street then loudly proclaiming that the average income on that particular road is 100,000 is not quite telling the whole story is it?

  74. Bahdresh — on 1st November, 2005 at 7:47 am  

    whatever they say now it’s too late for apologies! we will never forgive them and llook at them the same again!

  75. leon — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:40 am  

    Bahdresh you’re an idiot.

  76. El Cid — on 1st November, 2005 at 6:27 pm  

    “beside who wants to get up at 4.00am sell crisps and get home at 11.00pm…….no thanks!”
    Ha ha. That was funny “no way”.
    But seriously. If you’re NOT going to do that, maybe you could use the time to learn how to spell and to get a proper grasp of the world’s fourth biggest economy that’s rooted in reality.

  77. navigator — on 1st November, 2005 at 8:52 pm  

    hahaha no way is a funny gal.

    But yes like EL cid said Asians have the world’s fourth biggest economy. Why don’t you analyze africa/jamaica ect. , I would love to hear your outcome :D

  78. Al-Hack — on 1st November, 2005 at 8:57 pm  

    They have the fourth biggest economy only because they breed like rabbits. Nothing to be proud of.

  79. navigator — on 1st November, 2005 at 9:03 pm  

    Al-Hack you’re Asian right?

  80. Al-Hack — on 1st November, 2005 at 9:19 pm  

    Why yes, I s’pose I am.

  81. biouxx — on 1st November, 2005 at 9:38 pm  

    navigator I think you’re right, I take everything I said back. I always liked Asian guys!

  82. navigator — on 1st November, 2005 at 9:47 pm  

    ahhh really?? I’m glad you take all your words back , and I defintely like you too :D

  83. biouxx — on 1st November, 2005 at 9:48 pm  

    I don’t want to fight with Asians anymore, I want to marry one.

  84. biouxx — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:04 pm  

    I’m glad you changed, we can discuss this in private :D

  85. navigator — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:05 pm  

    hehehe JUST KIDDING ..OK I won’t go off-topic again. It was just my little fantasy

  86. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:28 pm  

    I went on the Ligali site a few days back, made no lies about the fact that I was an asian female, was met with a lot of hostility, “go back to your asian forums”, blah blah blah. I wasn’t disrespectful in any manner, my points were valid.

    Why do Ligali have the right to use offensive terminology yet the term “black” causes major offence?

    Why did Ligali post a threat to ALL asians (they all work in Spar dontcha know – words of Toyin Agbetu, Founder & Head of Social and Education Policy, something about “done with talk and no action”)?

    Why they posted a thread about white women and felt perfectly justified in referring to them (whites in general actually) as blue?

    Why was I personally threatened by a member called BlackJett (“you should fear me but not for the reasons you think”)?

    Why-after banging my head on the wall at their indifference- did they ban me for posting a thread about censorship? It was a selection of remarks I found highly offensive and deserved to be challenged.

    Now, I visit pickled politics once in a while and have found the editor to be on the ball. It seems anything deemed even slightly xenophobic is deleted. And quite rightly so.

    In which case, I have to ask this question.

    Who the hell is policing Ligali? Toyin the Tw*t?

    Before anyone jumps to edit that, he is. If someone’s doing a good job, they deserve to be told. If someone’s a Tw*t its my right to say it.

    I have no rights to access the forum so its not just my user name thats been deleted. If the link is still active, feel free to have a look:

    http://www.ligali.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=17&t=404&s=79947d2c620f24dd6bdcf76bf86506e5

    Down with Ligali !!!

  87. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:44 pm  

    Just heard the beginning of the news clip…Toyin, Toyin, Toyin…You twat.

    One of the young men who died was called Isiah Young-Sam not Isiah Young-Brown…or am I missing something?

  88. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:48 pm  

    Navigator, stop that and you can keep on dreaming(where is the “evil smiley” when you need one).

    NorahJones

    Where were you when Asians were(and I quote) “bigging up the asian who raped the n*****r bitch” ?( this thread on a Asian site got deleted btw).

    Where are you when Asians are calling “Blacks” “apes”, “ugly”, “lazy” and other dispicable names on Asian websites?

    I guess you’re busy recording your new album..?

  89. no way — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:53 pm  

    Norah

    first you was not consistent in your arguments, you got angry when people mentioned little undesirables among the asian community ( hey it exists everywhere) YET you had nothing to say when asians like Krypto was insulting Africans.

    If you are against racsim fair enough, just be consistent and show your anger equally among racist africans AND asians.

    but i was not expecting anyone to get banned.

    @bioux

    hmmmm

    come here……..i thought you said you are faithful to kunjufu
    naughty

  90. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:54 pm  

    Lol Biouxx, such witty intellect.

    So you get a couple nobs spouting shite and you hold me responsible? If I’d have been there believe me, I wouldn’t have stood for it. Were they not deleted?

    Ligali-you’re a regular aren’t you- paint ALL asians with the same brush. It aint so much Pro-African but anti-EVERONE else.

  91. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 10:58 pm  

    @No way
    Again, if I’d seen this Krypto dude I would have made my argument clear. Did I at any point exhibit any anti-African sentiment?

    “little undesirables among the asian community” – if anybody had pointed out at any time that they were referring to a minority I would have agreed. But it was a generalisation on ALL asians, ALL whites. No?

  92. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:00 pm  

    Take for instance the thread I’d posted where I asked for asian and white terminology to be replaced with African, just to see how it looked from the other side. What response did I get?

    LNP – Ligali Nationalist Party. Down with Racism. Down with Ligali.

  93. no way — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:10 pm  

    as i said Norah, I did not believe anyone should’ave been banned, not you or jetblack.

    yes their is generalization………heck how many generalisation do we hear in the media about blacks, as long as it does not step into violence or preventing someone from getting a job, then their should be no real concern.

  94. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:14 pm  

    JettBlack got banned? Well, thats some consolation. I knew I would get reprimanded in some way for that post. I was just so frustrated. But I still thought I was abiding by the constitution and kinda doing their work for them in a way.

    “heck how many generalisation do we hear in the media about blacks, as long as it does not step into violence or preventing someone from getting a job, then their should be no real concern” AGREED

  95. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:17 pm  

    No way, lol I didn’t write that NO WAY, you know that right?

    Anyway NorahJones, I don’t hold you responsible, but as you want websites down who have members who hold racist views, I suggest you visit Asian sites aswell.

    Here are a few non-deleted quotes I found at http://www.paklinks.com

    “Dark skin is not the problem-its the plate lip and the butter hair which really makes Kaliya hideously ugly”

    “95% of blacks are uneducated. Its not there fault, they are just dim.”

    “judge by the way most of them talk.

    Seriously though, 95% was obviously a gimick, but they do tend to be more dim then other races.

    Add to that the fact that they are criminally ugly, and you must thank God that sports exist to give them a purpose in this world.”

    “I guess he was also “criminally ugly” and “dim” because he was black. Too bad they didn’t invent basketball back then.”

    I have a rating for the 5 ethnic groups.

    Black (ugliest)

    We have stated about blacks:

    1) This applies to non Muslims blacks only

    2) They are our equal as humans, they are just ugly.

  96. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:21 pm  

    Biouxx, whats the thread called, can’t find it?
    I’m sorry, I didn’t realise.
    My point however, is why stoop to the same level?

  97. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:26 pm  

    For example the thread “would you date a black girl”

    http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=147661&highlight=blacks+ugly

  98. no way — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:26 pm  

    Norah, jetblack did not get banned, but i am saying personally no one should get banned unless you cross the line of decency.

  99. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:27 pm  

    You see? Where’s the decency in anything he came out with?

    Thanks Bioux. Gis a minute

  100. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:28 pm  

    She even.

  101. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:32 pm  

    The guy actually begins with :
    “Just wanted to see what the people here made of the common Asian view of blacks-that is that they are ugly.”

  102. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:32 pm  

    BlackJett: Yes i’m extremely jealous of the “HAIR FARMERS” scalping the corpses of the 60,000 plus dead in Pakistan to sell to various hair shops.Now that’s the personfication of enterprise and morality,something we should all emulate.

    Fresh: The specific allegation Jett Black is making is that hair is being removed (‘farmed’) from dead victims of the earthquake.
    Is it not disgusting to be alleging such a thing?
    JettBlack: “JetBlack gets banned!………..what for speaking the truth.”
    Fresh: Is it the truth he his speaking?

    Fresh: Rather than quaking (poor use of words given the circumstances), would you agree that you have no evidence for your statement?
    JettBlack: The choice of words was intentional.
    Once again it seems people expect me to do their homework for them,this is not going to happen.
    What I would suggest to you is that you acquaint yourself with alternative news outlets,which are available to everyone.
    But what can I expect from someone who posts an article by a White,Jewish writer from the Observer? as if it were some sort of Gospel from up high?????
    Imbecile.

    JettBlack: Oh by the way i’m sure it’s also NOT TRUE that the poorest woman in India are selling their new born babies to foreigners, DAILY ,for 6-10 rupees.

    JettBlack: if you know YOUR history you will know that Ghandi was one of the biggest racists to ever walk the Earth

    JettBlack: Yes,you should fear me,but not for the reasons you think.

    JettBlack: One Zionist is the same as the next as far as i’m concerned.

    LAST BUT NOT LEAST, MY FAVOURITE:

    Toyin: To any Asians. This is an announcement . If I find out this is to be true then tell all your ‘spars’ in London working in the same chain to be ready for a little q+a visit.
    I done with talk and no action.

  103. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:33 pm  

    They’re all as bad as each other.

  104. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:35 pm  

    After all this, JettBlack is alive and kicking. I get banned for pointing out the filth (small sample of the bigger picture).

  105. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:35 pm  

    Oh, and another quote from http://www.paklink.com :

    “Believe me, when you work and live with black people, you discover that 10% are genuine, and the other 90% are up! All they like doing is around, ‘lay da seed rude bwoy’ and being ! But the goods one, they’re soooooo much different! And then we have Asians who act and look like blacks, sing the tunez and even chat their lingo! And even worse still, their are more Asian girls with black guyz now than ever b4, and its getting to the point where Asians girls are indistinguishable from black girls!!! Jamaicans are the worst of all Black ppl, and their corruption is spreading like wildfire!!!!!!!”

  106. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:38 pm  

    Bang out of order.

  107. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:40 pm  

    No “Down with paklink” is there?

  108. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:41 pm  

    I’ll report it to the Internet Watch Foundation. More to the point, what are you going to do about Ligali?

    Very little I fear.

  109. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:43 pm  

    By the way, no way, you know I did not write that right?

  110. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:44 pm  

    In fact, what are you going to do about Paklink? I wasn’t even aware they existed. I only found out about Ligali through this site. How’d you discover Paklink? Don’t you think you shoulda got the ball rolling?

  111. BevanKieran — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:50 pm  

    bioux

    Down with paklink, down with Ligali. It is important to keep tabs on website which promote prejudice of other cultures.

  112. bioux — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:55 pm  

    Why don’t you get the ball rolling. You weren’t even aware of the “common Asian view” on “Blacks”. I think you can do your monitoring job better.

  113. NorahJones — on 1st November, 2005 at 11:55 pm  

    Hear Hear BevanKeiran

  114. bioux — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:01 am  

    I live in Holland and I wasn’t even aware of western Asians/Pakistani’s disgust with “Blacks”(there aren’t alot of Asians/Pakistani’s in Holland). But you sure do learn alot on the internet.

  115. Sunny — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:09 am  

    The people from PAlinks are a bunch of inbred idiots anyway. There is racism everywhere, I’m not going to deny it. In fact someone is writing an article for me, to be published on Pickled Politics, about Asian racism.

    We should be open and confident enough to admit our mistakes and our faults and try to find commonalities. There is no point pointing at the scum and tarring everyone with the same brush.

  116. BevanKieran — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:10 am  

    Bioux

    Don’t sit on you high horse. Most civil people accept that their is prejudice within their community. Many people find it easy to bellyache about racism directed towards them. Why didn’t you confront BICRE with his racism on Ligali thread I alluded to on the other thread. Don’t complain about racism if you are not prepared to confront when the racist is of the same colour/ethnicity.

  117. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:13 am  

    I think the media is evil. I live in Birmingham. My university campus is in Perry Barr/Lozells. I had a “sociology of the media” lecture today in which we discussed what was going on.

    “Blacks”, Asians, Whites sitting together, asking where all the trouble is seeing as we’re not aware of any.

    Whatever the media and organisations such as Ligali are propagating is largely untrue. The media say it was asians that murdered Isiah Young-Sam. Word on the street was that it was “Blacks”.

    The policeman that got shot? A girl in my class is the sister in law of the policeman. He was shot by a BB gun.

    I walk 200 yards from the bus stop to my campus. People look at each other suspiciously. They are afraid. But are there mass riots and “rivers of blood”?

    Er, sorry folks, no.

  118. bioux — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:14 am  

    Well I commented on the BLINK forums, I didn’t even read BICRE’s respond, since we found out that BICRE is a troll who’s trying to inflame discussions. I already pmed the moderators about it.

  119. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:16 am  

    “Why don’t you get the ball rolling. You weren’t even aware of the “common Asian view” on “Blacks”. I think you can do your monitoring job better. ”

    @Bioux
    Why must you taint every comment with sarcasm? I am serious about the points I’m raising. Rather than do your bit in conjunction with us you poke funny at it. Not good Bioux.

  120. BevanKieran — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:18 am  

    Fair enough. You are really beautiful by the way.

  121. Sunny — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:18 am  

    Isiah was killed by Asians Norah – the police charged them today. I’ll be publishing something about this tonight or tomorrow. I hope the bastards get about 30 years each. A heartless murder like that does not deserve sympathy.

  122. bioux — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:18 am  

    ahhh thanks

  123. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:18 am  

    Totally agree with BevanKieran. You’re very one-sided Bioux. I express my disgust at tw*ts like Paklink, where’s yours at JettBlack? You’re very selective aren’t you?

  124. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:20 am  

    Sunny, I don’t agree with the word on the “street”. Quite frankly, I don’t know what to believe.

  125. BevanKieran — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:32 am  

    People should emphasise the therapeutic qualities of being anti-racist. A group of people on the train mocked the train driver’s Indian accent. I told them to shut up. They did. It felt good.

    There are two sides to racism on the internet. On the one hand racist can operate under pseudonyms allowing them space to air their filth. Conversely people should feel enabled to confront it in the safety of their study.

    Bioux. You are too good for Ligali.

  126. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:35 am  

    I got banned from Ligali… It made me angry but I felt good!

    At least I wasn’t met with indifference!

  127. Sunny — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:42 am  

    People should emphasise the therapeutic qualities of being anti-racist.

    You’re feeling the love BK… ;)

    There are def. therapeutic qualities to be anti-racist, anti-bigoted and generally not hating people :D

  128. bioux — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:43 am  

    You know… I appreciate you for saying that, but I don’t want to give up hope on Ligali. I’ve read what Ligali is about as an organization. They organize gatherings a couple of times a month, and I would love to go, but unfortunaly I don’t live in the U.K. It’s really important for me to have a connection(internet, real life) with Africans who aspire the same goals, I’m sure you do with Asians.

    So far, you’ve been reading the forums right, and I think Ligali is more than the few comments you read on the forums.

  129. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:49 am  

    The constitution Bioux, on paper, is brilliant.

    However, I believe its a good ideology created to mask the sinister truth. That sample of comments above were not deleted.

    Furthermore:

    “Admin: @Complainant

    The report a post facility is not an alarm bell for those who find robust or challenging comments unsettling. The purpose of these forums is to debate. If you disagree with a person’s viewpoint then counter argue it or leave the thread. Also note that we will never ban an African poster on the basis of a single complaint that does not violate our Africentric ethos.”

    Single complaint right? I gave them over 20.

    Who got banned?

    Hmmm. Is it the africentric ethos to speak disrespectfully of Asians and Whites? Is that being Pro-African?

  130. BevanKieran — on 2nd November, 2005 at 1:36 am  

    “I’m sure you do with Asians”

    Bioux

    Saying no on “Asian” website might sound a little trite.
    (Though having seen this website for a few weeks its liberal and pluralistic outlook would not necessarily be done jusitice by the above label. Similar to describing zinc chloride (P.P) and beryllium fluoride (Ligali) as two ionic compounds wouldn’t be inaccurate. The increased size of the chloride ion leads greater bond bending and an increase in IRO in ZnCl2, deviating away from the ionic archetype of BeF2) ..but I don’t.

    My family are too mixed for me to be chest-beatingly “Asian, Hindu blah..blah”. Though the addition of a Dutch African would be really welcome.

  131. BevanKieran — on 2nd November, 2005 at 1:38 am  

    Whoops “wouldn’t” is would.

  132. bioux — on 2nd November, 2005 at 9:28 am  

    aww sweet, I hope you’re not trying to make up for what those people said about “blacks” on the internet , because I’m not affected by that any more. I’m totally over that, and I also realize every group of people, race is prejudiced somehow.

    Hmm I tried to google beryllium fluoride..it still didn’t make sense to me(I bet it’s bad though). Talk to me about law, not chemics! lol
    You sound really kind(and smart), but I guess I can’t change the fact that you’ve already made your mind up on Ligali.

  133. BevanKIeran — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:33 pm  

    Bioux

    If you are ever in London I will explain the fascinating world
    of chemistry (tiny parts of it anyway), over dinner perhaps?

  134. El Cid — on 2nd November, 2005 at 12:52 pm  

    Ahem. Sorry to intrude.
    I know that this was said quite a while back BUT the world’s fourth-biggest economy is actually the UK!!
    Tut tut. You got to laugh!!

  135. black boy — on 2nd November, 2005 at 4:13 pm  

    Is it me or…is it gettin’ hot in here lol

  136. Bahdresh — on 2nd November, 2005 at 5:14 pm  

    Bioux. The damage has been done to our community. What is your community(the black community) going to do about it? A black website said the rape was a lie, but it’s too late and the damage has been done. And don’t change the subject please.

  137. bioux — on 2nd November, 2005 at 6:45 pm  

    BevanKieran

    My personal tutor! You’re so friendly. I’ll keep you in my mind whenever I’m going to visit London.

    Bahdresh, How can you hold the whole African community responsible?

  138. no way — on 2nd November, 2005 at 7:27 pm  

    my heck is this thread still going!

    Bioux………sis tell them how it is.

    Bevan…..)))kiss teet(((, forget this internet flirtation going on about *Dutch African*………LOL

    funny I was reading Sunnys thread on Two moslems killed by french police.

    majority of Asians were saying that *this is not about the two moslems being chased by police, but about the build up of discrimination, hence why they rioted*

    ahem

    so why when blacks say * this is not about the rape, but instead the disrespect we get in asians shop thats why we boycotted/riot*

    somehow a see a little contradiction in pickle land.

  139. Al-Hack — on 2nd November, 2005 at 7:35 pm  

    He also said he does not approve of rioting. Besides, in France they are angry about police treatment, and I believe the same happened in LA?
    In B’ham it was about targetting another community which had done nothing wrong. So please, don’t get caught up in comparisons

  140. navigator — on 2nd November, 2005 at 9:57 pm  

    What is going on here! bioux! Don’t you realise you will be dumped by bevankieran the moment you say something politically incorrect? He is the gestappo of political correctness! I’m a very different type of guy, by the way :D

  141. NorahJones — on 2nd November, 2005 at 11:04 pm  

    Bioux: Bahdresh, How can you hold the whole African community responsible?

    What, like you held me responsible for not picking up on Paklink?

    Gimme a break!

  142. BevanKieran — on 3rd November, 2005 at 12:26 am  

    “gestappo of political correctness” !!

    I admit I may have gone a little over the top in previous comments though “muscular liberalism” is nothing to be ashamed of. Sad as this may be, and it is very sad, is that anyone who shows the slightest interest in chemistry, and from Holland, and really hot, is exempt from my ire.

  143. bioux — on 3rd November, 2005 at 8:29 am  

    I wasn’t exempt from your ire, you called me greatly diminshed lol ~_0

    NorahJones, holding the whole African community responsible for rumours that has been spread and holding you responsible for the fact that you weren’t aware of Asian racism online(while at the same time you were committed to monitoring an African site), are two different things.

  144. little nicky — on 3rd November, 2005 at 9:45 am  

    Totally agree with BevanKieran. You’re very one-sided Bioux. I express my disgust at tw*ts like Paklink, where’s yours at JettBlack? You’re very selective aren’t you?

    The difference you seem to be missing is tht you come on here complaining about the existence of racist websites, I didn’t really notice bioux do the same (though I may have missed it). Therefore (s)he isn’t a hypocrite for pointing out your inconsistencies while not at the same time leading the anti-ligali protests.

    You set yourself up as the campigner for justice, not bioux

  145. afrikan warrior — on 3rd November, 2005 at 10:56 am  

    bioux

    you naive thing

    9 out of 10 times dinner leads to sex

  146. bioux — on 3rd November, 2005 at 11:48 am  

    lol you wish! That’s a totally false statistic.

  147. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 12:15 pm  

    I first want to say happy diwali everyone :)

    Bioux our very good name and reputation has been damaged. At the moment people think Asians riot, murder and cause trouble. What is the black community going to do about the damage they have caused now that the rape turned out to be a lie?

  148. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 12:23 pm  

    Very strange you like to point out to Asian men who said bad things but you like to flirt with Asian men too.

  149. bioux — on 3rd November, 2005 at 12:37 pm  

    Breaking-news bahdresh an Asian actually did kill a man. And how can you be worried about your precious repuation. Is that your biggest fear?

  150. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 12:56 pm  

    BevanKieran said: Bioux Don’t sit on your high horse

    I think BevanKieran is right about you.

  151. BevanKieran — on 3rd November, 2005 at 2:01 pm  

    Bhadresh, your point is a minor variation of dn’s at
    11:17 a.m, Oct 30th, so I will not repeat my response of
    Oct 30th, 1:50 p.m.

    Bioux

    Aaargh! It was all sweetness and love for a while. Reading my earlier posts to you, shouldn’t it have been downhill all the way? I take it on board and I promise to distribute personal invective solely to the haters(err..possible double-standard but you know what I mean).

    You see,there is an improvement by the hour! Just imagine stretching that out over a much longer time, and a assuming a linear improvement at a sharp gradient, I will be good for you.

  152. little nicky — on 3rd November, 2005 at 3:01 pm  

    BevanKieran said: Bioux Don’t sit on your high horse

    I think BevanKieran is right about you.

    I think that you’d do well to understand what that phrase actually means before you bandy it about so freely. It certainly doesn’t mean “You made a point I wish to ignore” as you appear to think it does

  153. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 3:09 pm  

    I used the phrase because she seem to tihnk that she can accuse Asians of racism and flirt with Asians all at the same time. I’m not jealous of her,because I already have my Asian man. She should be consistent in what she is doing.

  154. no way — on 3rd November, 2005 at 3:49 pm  

    urm, i think you will find that biuox is NOT doing the chasing here.

    whats wrong…….you can’t stomach the fact that *shock horror* an asian male likes a black woman without any hidden agenda/

  155. afrikan warrior — on 3rd November, 2005 at 3:51 pm  

    a linear improvement at a sharp gradient

    Have you no shame! You think people won’t understand the metaphor you just used? So a sista gets you in this state, what’s new.

  156. NorahJones — on 3rd November, 2005 at 3:55 pm  

    Bioux:(while at the same time you were committed to monitoring an African site),

    A RACIST african site. Which happens to be an instigator. Well, whatever, we obviously don’t agree.

  157. NorahJones — on 3rd November, 2005 at 3:57 pm  

    Little Nicky:Therefore (s)he isn’t a hypocrite for pointing out your inconsistencies while not at the same time leading the anti-ligali protests.

    What inconsistencies? That I pointed out every racist remark made, every time it was made? I thought I was quite consistent actually.

    I oppose racism of any kind (asian, african, whatever) and have a list as long as my arm that I’ve reported- off asians, whites and africans

  158. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 4:22 pm  

    No Way I am not not shocked that there is sexual attraction. I see alot of Asian men with black women, not alot of marriages however(I have no idea why they don’t marry them)) but still I am not shocked because of it.

  159. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 4:35 pm  

    BevanKieran said: Your response to this filth (the proceeding comment) bioux, nothing. It is indicative of Ligali as whole, racist filth propagated and unchallenged. A comment like that would be pooh poohed and the origin of the post humiliated.

    I agree with BevanKieran here,Ligali is a very racist site.

  160. Bahdresh — on 3rd November, 2005 at 4:37 pm  

    NoraJones what happened to you at Ligali?

  161. Sunny — on 3rd November, 2005 at 5:07 pm  

    This thread is just getting silly and totally off-topic. I’m closing it.

  162. NorahJones — on 3rd November, 2005 at 5:37 pm  

    Spoilsport!

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