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	<title>Comments on: Guido Fawkes, the full story</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009</link>
	<description>Current affairs for a progressive generation</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 16 Mar 2010 23:42:20 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Lobster Blogster</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55714</link>
		<dc:creator>Lobster Blogster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Feb 2007 19:41:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55714</guid>
		<description>Careless talk costs lives - get busy the corporal is on his way!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Careless talk costs lives &#8211; get busy the corporal is on his way!!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Shock horror: Guido&#39;s a dick - thebadrash.com</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55634</link>
		<dc:creator>Shock horror: Guido&#39;s a dick - thebadrash.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55634</guid>
		<description>[...] This story has been developing somewhat over the last week or so. What happened was that Pickled Politics posted a Guardian article from 1986 which alleged that Paul Staines, AKA Guido Fawkes of the eponymous and higly influential Tory blog, tried to form some sort of &#039;joint action&#039; team between the Federation of Conservative Students and the British National Party. Staines then threatened Pickled Politics and other bloggers who&#039;d carried the story with legal action, suggesting that the man who likes to root around in Labour MPs&#039; histories ought to have some sort of immunity himself. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This story has been developing somewhat over the last week or so. What happened was that Pickled Politics posted a Guardian article from 1986 which alleged that Paul Staines, AKA Guido Fawkes of the eponymous and higly influential Tory blog, tried to form some sort of &#39;joint action&#39; team between the Federation of Conservative Students and the British National Party. Staines then threatened Pickled Politics and other bloggers who&#39;d carried the story with legal action, suggesting that the man who likes to root around in Labour MPs&#39; histories ought to have some sort of immunity himself. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: John Christopher</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55490</link>
		<dc:creator>John Christopher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 18:46:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55490</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve tried to get an angle on this story and for the sake of me, I&#039;m lost. I must be one stupid motherfucker.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve tried to get an angle on this story and for the sake of me, I&#8217;m lost. I must be one stupid motherfucker.</p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55488</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 18:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55488</guid>
		<description>:)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> <img src='http://www.pickledpolitics.com/dablog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Not Saussure</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55484</link>
		<dc:creator>Not Saussure</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 17:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55484</guid>
		<description>I once heard Jo Brand tell a lovely story on the radio about how she was in a comedy club where one of the performers (presumably the late Eric Douglas) was being given a hard time by hecklers in the audience.   He rather rashly said, jokingly, &#039;You can&#039;t treat me like this; don&#039;t you realise I&#039;m Kirk Douglas&#039; son?&#039;.    

One of the hecklers stands up, stretches out his arms and says, &#039;No.  I am Kirk Douglas&#039; son!&#039;   Then another one stands up, stretches out his arms and says ... and another one...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I once heard Jo Brand tell a lovely story on the radio about how she was in a comedy club where one of the performers (presumably the late Eric Douglas) was being given a hard time by hecklers in the audience.   He rather rashly said, jokingly, &#8216;You can&#8217;t treat me like this; don&#8217;t you realise I&#8217;m Kirk Douglas&#8217; son?&#8217;.    </p>
<p>One of the hecklers stands up, stretches out his arms and says, &#8216;No.  I am Kirk Douglas&#8217; son!&#8217;   Then another one stands up, stretches out his arms and says &#8230; and another one&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55481</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 17:11:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55481</guid>
		<description>Did she really? i guess it&#039;s a fitting thing to add under the circumstances, makes it a little less maudlin. It&#039;s  not quite &quot;job done&quot;, seeing as most of them perished, but some considerable consolation. 

Others might see it as pointless heroism. Maybe I&#039;m old-fashioned. As Osama has hinted at, we live in an age where heroism is looked down upon as something reckless, machista, fake, and possibly illegal. Still, there&#039;s nothing quite like it to stir the soul -- as many of our favourite films testify.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did she really? i guess it&#8217;s a fitting thing to add under the circumstances, makes it a little less maudlin. It&#8217;s  not quite &#8220;job done&#8221;, seeing as most of them perished, but some considerable consolation. </p>
<p>Others might see it as pointless heroism. Maybe I&#8217;m old-fashioned. As Osama has hinted at, we live in an age where heroism is looked down upon as something reckless, machista, fake, and possibly illegal. Still, there&#8217;s nothing quite like it to stir the soul &#8212; as many of our favourite films testify.</p>
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		<title>By: Chairwoman</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55479</link>
		<dc:creator>Chairwoman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 16:42:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55479</guid>
		<description>El Cid @ 110.  I&#039;m sure that when I saw Spartacus in the cinema, a very long time ago indeed, after Mrs Spartacus held the baby up, she said something along the lines of &#039;Now die, my love, please die&#039;.  But it&#039;s never in the televised version.

Did I imagine it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>El Cid @ 110.  I&#8217;m sure that when I saw Spartacus in the cinema, a very long time ago indeed, after Mrs Spartacus held the baby up, she said something along the lines of &#8216;Now die, my love, please die&#8217;.  But it&#8217;s never in the televised version.</p>
<p>Did I imagine it?</p>
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		<title>By: Katy Newton</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55477</link>
		<dc:creator>Katy Newton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 16:25:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55477</guid>
		<description>&quot;Your eyes are full of hate.  That&#039;s good.  Hate keeps a man alive.&quot; 

That wasn&#039;t Spartacus, that was Ben Hur.  But it&#039;s the same sort of thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Your eyes are full of hate.  That&#8217;s good.  Hate keeps a man alive.&#8221; </p>
<p>That wasn&#8217;t Spartacus, that was Ben Hur.  But it&#8217;s the same sort of thing.</p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55476</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 16:15:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55476</guid>
		<description>Spatacus -- what a great movie, even if Kubrik refused to put his name to it. It still gives me goosepimples to remember Mrs Spartacus lifting up her baby to the dying, crucified Spartacus at the end: &quot;It&#039;s your son, Spartacus. He&#039;s free.&quot; There&#039;s a tear in my eye now. Only the memory of Michael Thomas in 1989 and of personal family matters do that to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Spatacus &#8212; what a great movie, even if Kubrik refused to put his name to it. It still gives me goosepimples to remember Mrs Spartacus lifting up her baby to the dying, crucified Spartacus at the end: &#8220;It&#8217;s your son, Spartacus. He&#8217;s free.&#8221; There&#8217;s a tear in my eye now. Only the memory of Michael Thomas in 1989 and of personal family matters do that to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Osama Saeed</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55475</link>
		<dc:creator>Osama Saeed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 15:54:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55475</guid>
		<description>Whatever happened to the spirit of Spartacus? :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whatever happened to the spirit of Spartacus? <img src='http://www.pickledpolitics.com/dablog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Sunny</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55472</link>
		<dc:creator>Sunny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 15:17:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55472</guid>
		<description>Because that was in the wider public interest and frankly this is not worth that hassle. Go ahead and publish it if you want to Osama, would love to see how good your lawyers are :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because that was in the wider public interest and frankly this is not worth that hassle. Go ahead and publish it if you want to Osama, would love to see how good your lawyers are <img src='http://www.pickledpolitics.com/dablog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Osama Saeed</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55471</link>
		<dc:creator>Osama Saeed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 14:49:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55471</guid>
		<description>How come everyone was very brave last year in saying they&#039;d take on the govt by publishing the Al-Jazeera memo, but now noone can publish and article about a blogger?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How come everyone was very brave last year in saying they&#8217;d take on the govt by publishing the Al-Jazeera memo, but now noone can publish and article about a blogger?</p>
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		<title>By: Clairwil</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55396</link>
		<dc:creator>Clairwil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:18:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55396</guid>
		<description>John,
I&#039;m aware of the allegations referred to but some of that isn&#039;t mentioned in the 1986 article.The funding thing, financial activities and drug use aren&#039;t mentioned. 

The activities of the FCS were a bit before my time but from what I&#039;ve read over the years they seem to have been as much about winding up left-wing students as anything else. I don&#039;t think his involvement makes him the devil. At worst he&#039;s someone that&#039;s taken reactionary,lefty baiting a bit far. At best (for GF) the article was total bollocks. 

His reaction has made it look like he&#039;s got something to hide. He&#039;d have been better dealing with it on his blog and moving on. Had he done so I doubt anyone would still be talking about it. 

As for the alleged use of illegal drugs -so what? If he did he certainly wasn&#039;t the only young person in the late eighties and early nineties to do so. Let&#039;s remember he is a blogger, not an elected representative.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,<br />
I&#8217;m aware of the allegations referred to but some of that isn&#8217;t mentioned in the 1986 article.The funding thing, financial activities and drug use aren&#8217;t mentioned. </p>
<p>The activities of the FCS were a bit before my time but from what I&#8217;ve read over the years they seem to have been as much about winding up left-wing students as anything else. I don&#8217;t think his involvement makes him the devil. At worst he&#8217;s someone that&#8217;s taken reactionary,lefty baiting a bit far. At best (for GF) the article was total bollocks. </p>
<p>His reaction has made it look like he&#8217;s got something to hide. He&#8217;d have been better dealing with it on his blog and moving on. Had he done so I doubt anyone would still be talking about it. </p>
<p>As for the alleged use of illegal drugs -so what? If he did he certainly wasn&#8217;t the only young person in the late eighties and early nineties to do so. Let&#8217;s remember he is a blogger, not an elected representative.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55393</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Feb 2007 11:45:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55393</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;&quot;In my opinion the whole thing is a non-story. It’s his reaction that’s made it interesting. Though I suspect that has more to do with ‘blogwars’ than the story itself.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Just consider a few things:
(1) It shows he was hanging out in extreme right-wing circles in his student days, and with organisations which had dubious sources of international funding. 

[edited out]

For someone who spends his time digging dirt on other people this is almost a gold-mine!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;In my opinion the whole thing is a non-story. It’s his reaction that’s made it interesting. Though I suspect that has more to do with ‘blogwars’ than the story itself.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Just consider a few things:<br />
(1) It shows he was hanging out in extreme right-wing circles in his student days, and with organisations which had dubious sources of international funding. </p>
<p>[edited out]</p>
<p>For someone who spends his time digging dirt on other people this is almost a gold-mine!</p>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55391</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Feb 2007 11:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55391</guid>
		<description>You quote Justin&#039;s &quot;it&#039;s not libel if it&#039;s provable&quot;.

My understanding (IANAL) is that that&#039;s not quite right, and in certain circumstances a true (and provable) fact can still be defamatory due to inference. I think the example I once heard was &quot;X celebrity was seen leaving Y rehab clinic&quot;. It&#039;s true, but there&#039;s no proof there that they were actually there for treatment. But people could infer that simply from that line. My memory&#039;s a bit fuzzy on this now, it&#039;s been about 8 years since I was looking at libel laws.

While not the same as this scenario, it could (highly tenuously) be made into a similar situation. I shaln&#039;t expand for obvious reasons.

All in all though, I hate libel laws. I&#039;d much rather see all libel laws scrapped with a right of reply enshrined in law. And this is the kind of thing you were trying to offer to GF, who duly turned it down. While I can understand his reasons why, it really really makes him a total hypocrit. Shame, I used to enjoy his blog.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You quote Justin&#8217;s &#8220;it&#8217;s not libel if it&#8217;s provable&#8221;.</p>
<p>My understanding (IANAL) is that that&#8217;s not quite right, and in certain circumstances a true (and provable) fact can still be defamatory due to inference. I think the example I once heard was &#8220;X celebrity was seen leaving Y rehab clinic&#8221;. It&#8217;s true, but there&#8217;s no proof there that they were actually there for treatment. But people could infer that simply from that line. My memory&#8217;s a bit fuzzy on this now, it&#8217;s been about 8 years since I was looking at libel laws.</p>
<p>While not the same as this scenario, it could (highly tenuously) be made into a similar situation. I shaln&#8217;t expand for obvious reasons.</p>
<p>All in all though, I hate libel laws. I&#8217;d much rather see all libel laws scrapped with a right of reply enshrined in law. And this is the kind of thing you were trying to offer to GF, who duly turned it down. While I can understand his reasons why, it really really makes him a total hypocrit. Shame, I used to enjoy his blog.</p>
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		<title>By: El Cid</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55386</link>
		<dc:creator>El Cid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:54:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55386</guid>
		<description>Katherine,
Thank you for the clarification</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Katherine,<br />
Thank you for the clarification</p>
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		<title>By: douglas clark</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55371</link>
		<dc:creator>douglas clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Feb 2007 01:01:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55371</guid>
		<description>Clairwill,

I have been thinking for a while about the moment the lawyers would see the blogosphere as lucrative.

I suppose it was inevitable that letters would be sent, etc. They must have exhausted the &#039;whiplash&#039; scam.

We police ourselves pretty well. We don&#039;t need lawyers. But lawyers need money. So the obnoxious get their way.

It&#039;s not the free exchange of ideas I thought I was signing up to. Thanks for being brave, btw.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clairwill,</p>
<p>I have been thinking for a while about the moment the lawyers would see the blogosphere as lucrative.</p>
<p>I suppose it was inevitable that letters would be sent, etc. They must have exhausted the &#8216;whiplash&#8217; scam.</p>
<p>We police ourselves pretty well. We don&#8217;t need lawyers. But lawyers need money. So the obnoxious get their way.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not the free exchange of ideas I thought I was signing up to. Thanks for being brave, btw.</p>
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		<title>By: Clairwil</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-3#comment-55366</link>
		<dc:creator>Clairwil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Feb 2007 00:26:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55366</guid>
		<description>In my opinion the whole thing is a non-story. It&#039;s his reaction that&#039;s made it interesting. Though I suspect that has more to do with &#039;blogwars&#039; than the story itself.

It&#039;s a shame because he&#039;s rather distracted attention from his fine work on Labour corruption.

The silly billy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my opinion the whole thing is a non-story. It&#8217;s his reaction that&#8217;s made it interesting. Though I suspect that has more to do with &#8216;blogwars&#8217; than the story itself.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a shame because he&#8217;s rather distracted attention from his fine work on Labour corruption.</p>
<p>The silly billy.</p>
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		<title>By: Rab Trenator</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-2#comment-55363</link>
		<dc:creator>Rab Trenator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55363</guid>
		<description>I just found a copy of The Guardian original article. 
I still cannot see what all the fuss is about, to be honest. Young people do stupid things and Staines is no different. A normal person would just be upfront about it, come clean and then move on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just found a copy of The Guardian original article.<br />
I still cannot see what all the fuss is about, to be honest. Young people do stupid things and Staines is no different. A normal person would just be upfront about it, come clean and then move on.</p>
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		<title>By: douglas clark</title>
		<link>http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009/comment-page-2#comment-55362</link>
		<dc:creator>douglas clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:52:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pickledpolitics.com/archives/1009#comment-55362</guid>
		<description>vt Daz,

Ego good, Id less so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego,_super-ego,_and_id</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>vt Daz,</p>
<p>Ego good, Id less so.</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego,_super-ego,_and_id" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego,_super-ego,_and_id</a></p>
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